MP All Models PCIe SSDs - NVMe & AHCI

[naught@home]

A month ago I was given an old Mac Pro 5,1 (mid 2010). From what I could determine from the serial number it started out its' life with a quad 2.8GHz processor, but when I booted it up I found that it was running a 6-core X5690 CPU. And it had all the HD bays filled with 1TB WD Caviar Black drives. So I/O was definitely a bottleneck. After reading this thread from beginning to end a couple of times I bought a Samsung 970 EVO and an Ableconn PEXM2-130 Dual PCIe NVMe M.2 SSDs Carrier Adapter Card.
After adding the blade to the card I placed it in PCIe slot 2, formatted the 970 EVO and after installing Mojave it booted up without problem.

I went from around 80 MB/s read and writes with the original boot drive to this with the 970 EVO.

To say that I'm pleased with the outcome is an egregious understatement.

Before NVMe this old cheesegrater had a hard time getting off the ground, but for more than three weeks now it's been flying. So here's a 'thumbs up' for the Ableconn card. It's been working with nary a hiccup for me.

 

[trifero]

A month ago I was given an old Mac Pro 5,1 (mid 2010). From what I could determine from the serial number it started out its' life with a quad 2.8GHz processor, but when I booted it up I found that it was running a 6-core X5690 CPU. And it had all the HD bays filled with 1TB WD Caviar Black drives. So I/O was definitely a bottleneck. After reading this thread from beginning to end a couple of times I bought a Samsung 970 EVO and an Ableconn PEXM2-130 Dual PCIe NVMe M.2 SSDs Carrier Adapter Card.
After adding the blade to the card I placed it in PCIe slot 2, formatted the 970 EVO and after installing Mojave it booted up without problem.

I went from around 80 MB/s read and writes with the original boot drive to this with the 970 EVO.
View attachment 1657672

To say that I'm pleased with the outcome is an egregious understatement.

Before NVMe this old cheesegrater had a hard time getting off the ground, but for more than three weeks now it's been flying. So here's a 'thumbs up' for the Ableconn card. It's been working with nary a hiccup for me.

Nice numbers.

 

[msh]

A month ago I was given an old Mac Pro 5,1 (mid 2010). From what I could determine from the serial number it started out its' life with a quad 2.8GHz processor, but when I booted it up I found that it was running a 6-core X5690 CPU. And it had all the HD bays filled with 1TB WD Caviar Black drives. So I/O was definitely a bottleneck. After reading this thread from beginning to end a couple of times I bought a Samsung 970 EVO and an Ableconn PEXM2-130 Dual PCIe NVMe M.2 SSDs Carrier Adapter Card.
After adding the blade to the card I placed it in PCIe slot 2, formatted the 970 EVO and after installing Mojave it booted up without problem.

I went from around 80 MB/s read and writes with the original boot drive to this with the 970 EVO.
View attachment 1657672

To say that I'm pleased with the outcome is an egregious understatement.

Before NVMe this old cheesegrater had a hard time getting off the ground, but for more than three weeks now it's been flying. So here's a 'thumbs up' for the Ableconn card. It's been working with nary a hiccup for me.

Nice, but I notice that card doesn't come with any heatsinks for the blades. I would be a bit worried about that.

 

[naught@home]

Nice, but I notice that card doesn't come with any heatsinks for the blades. I would be a bit worried about that.

Heat was a concern for me as well so I attached a passive copper heatsink to the blade. Before I put the heatsink on the blade idle temperature was about 45C and, when pushed, spiked as high as 58C according to iStat Menus. After I installed the heatsink, idle temps dropped to 37C and when I push it I can't get the blade to run any hotter than 50C. According to Samsung the maximum operational temp for the 970 EVO is 75C. I'll keep monitoring the temps, but right now I'm no longer too worried about it.

 

[SteveZee]

It is really helpful to have signature of poster with listing of computer and equipment being used. Is a consideration, kindly.

I thought i was very complete regarding the issue at hand?

 

[SteveZee]

Heat was a concern for me as well so I attached a passive copper heatsink to the blade. Before I put the heatsink on the blade idle temperature was about 45C and, when pushed, spiked as high as 58C according to iStat Menus. After I installed the heatsink, idle temps dropped to 37C and when I push it I can't get the blade to run any hotter than 50C. According to Samsung the maximum operational temp for the 970 EVO is 75C. I'll keep monitoring the temps, but right now I'm no longer too worried about it.

The PCIe adapter card comes with some rubbery heat sink thing. Being on the Rumors "favored" list, i thought it had been vetted as successful. Kindly tell me more about the copper heat sink attachment?

 

[naught@home]

The PCIe adapter card comes with some rubbery heat sink thing. Being on the Rumors "favored" list, i thought it had been vetted as successful. Kindly tell me more about the copper heat sink attachment?

This is the copper heatsink kit I ordered from Amazon. I bought two because at some point I will get another blade for the second slot. It consists of the copper heatsink, the 'rubbery heatsink thingie' and some small silicon (it appears to me) bands to wrap around the copper heatsink/'rubber thingie'/blade sandwich. The rubber thingie appears to be some kind of semi-solid heat conductive gel pad. The pad has some stick to it and I didn't really think the bands were necessary, but I put them on anyway.

I didn't see the Ableconn card on the list, but two people in this thread (IIRC) reported installing the card. One said it worked fine and the other said they couldn't get it to work, but reading related posts I got the impression that there was nothing wrong with the card and that it was really his/her PCIe Slot 2 that was borked and/or the blade they selected was incompatible with the card. So I took a chance on the Ableconn card and it has surpassed my wildest expectations.

 

[SteveZee]

"This is the copper heatsink kit"

How come this is any better? Doesn't it just collect heat?
Would there have to be wind to make a notable improvement?

iStat allows us to crank up the wind speed in there.
I dont know anything about doing that: wise? effective? burn something else out (fans)? etc

 

[naught@home]

How come this is any better? Doesn't it just collect heat?
Would there have to be wind to make a notable improvement?

Yes, exactly right. The heatsink collects the heat. That's the point. Better to have a hot heatsink than a hot SSD blade.

The pad between the heatsink and the blade is thermally conductive. The pad acts in much the same way as thermal paste between a CPU and its' heatsink. The pad (or the paste) draws the heat from the heat source (the blade or CPU) and transfers it to the heatsink. The heat from the heatsink is dissipated into the surrounding air and the expansion slot fan in particular (and all the fans in general) push/pull the hot air out of the Mac Pros' grille to the outside. The efficiency of the heat dissipation is greatly enhanced by exposing as much of the heatsink surface as possible to the surrounding air, hence the grooves that have been machined into the surface of the heatsink. A solid copper slab of the same size wouldn't be nearly as thermally efficient for heat dissipation because far less of its' surface would be exposed to the surrounding air.

My knowledge of thermal dynamics is basic and rudimentary at best. If anyone has a more succinct explanation or if I'm mistaken on any point please feel free to correct me.

 

[SteveZee]

Yes, exactly right. The heatsink collects the heat. That's the point. Better to have a hot heatsink than a hot SSD blade.

hmm, i already have that sponge pad on. That's what I'm worried is not so effective. Does the copper go on top of that? Seems like adding that would also shrink the air space between neighboring PCIe slots which are already a bit tight.

 

[majus]

I currently use a SSD7101A-1 card and am wondering if it will still work with the new ARM machines when one finally arrives which has expansion slots, providing physical size is compatible.

 

[tsialex]

I currently use a SSD7101A-1 card and am wondering if it will still work with the new ARM machines when one finally arrives which has expansion slots, providing physical size is compatible.

No, for HighPoint cards, at least firmware updates for the cards will be required to be ARM compatible. Current card firmwares (the OptionROM), drivers and the WEBGUI are all AMD64 code.

 

[bsbeamer]

Had to inquire for a client and FWIW I've been told from several Thunderbolt storage companies that they do not expect their products to be 100% supported on M1 machines at release. They are completely unsure if it will take an update in Big Sur to make them work, or if it is an actual hardware issue that will prevent. They're waiting for hands-on units.

Seems the products that use USB3/USB-C 10Gbps are fine. If you're testing M1 machines, would have USB-C adapters on standby.

 

[joevt]

No, for HighPoint cards, at least firmware updates for the cards will be required to be ARM compatible. Current card firmwares (the OptionROM), drivers and the WEBGUI are all AMD64 code.

The non-RAID functionality should work though, right?

Is there a standard for ARM PCIe ROMs? I suppose EFI byte code is an option but people say ARM Macs don't use EFI - they say it uses iBoot, whatever that is...

I expect standards like NVMe and SATA and USB to work.

 

[tsialex]

The non-RAID functionality should work though, right?

Is there a standard for ARM PCIe ROMs? I suppose EFI byte code is an option but people say ARM Macs don't use EFI - they say it uses iBoot, whatever that is...

I expect standards like NVMe and SATA and USB to work.

Dumb adapters will work fine, but cards that have configuration and management firmware via OptionROM like the various flavours of SSD7xxx won't work with Macs with Apple Silicon SOCs.

Cards that depend just on the switch initialisation by the Mac firmware and don't have any OptionROM, like some entry level ASM2824 model, will probably work too, at least for independent blades.

ARM Macs don't have EFI at all, iBoot replaced it, now that the M1 Macs are arriving early next week, Apple will probably open the documentation for everyone and we will know more about how cards that need OptionROMs will be supported.

Btw, @bsbeamer commented here today that companies that offer TB3 products are waiting the first M1 Macs to see if support is possible, seems no one knows for sure at this moment what will work.

I don't know much about ARM PCIe ROMs, but I know that are two major and very distinct competing standards.

 

[joevt]

I don't know much about ARM PCIe ROMs, but I know that are two major and very distinct competing standards.

Four types of images in a PCIe option rom:
"BIOS"
"Open Firmware"
"Hewlett-Packard PA RISC"
"EFI"

EFI has these types:
"IA-32"
"Itanium processor type"
"EFI Byte Code (EBC)"
"X64"
"ARM"
"ARM 64-bit"

The ARM and EBC options can be used for ARM computers that use EFI but that does not include the M1 Macs which use iBoot instead of EFI. Probably Apple won't allow option roms. Either the driver exists in the firmware, or you need to wait for macOS to boot.

 

[tsialex]

Four types of images in a PCIe option rom:
"BIOS"
"Open Firmware"
"Hewlett-Packard PA RISC"
"EFI"

EFI has these types:
"IA-32"
"Itanium processor type"
"EFI Byte Code (EBC)"
"X64"
"ARM"
"ARM 64-bit"

The ARM and EBC options can be used for ARM computers that use EFI but that does not include the M1 Macs which use iBoot instead of EFI. Probably Apple won't allow option roms. Either the driver exists in the firmware, or you need to wait for macOS to boot.

I was thinking about U-Boot drivers and the ARM UEFI implementation on the Juno platform, SBBR/ESBBR/EBBR/UBBR, but this is not applicable to M1 Macs at all.

Btw, I think that Apple will probably kill OptionROMs too, don't make much sense to support it at all.

 

[bsbeamer]

Would not assume ANYTHING with M1 until it is tested and confirmed. That also does not mean M1A/M1X/M1Pro/M2/M3 would play by the same rules and hardware constraints as M1. Maybe (hopefully) Apple will add support to the hardware over time instead of this limited first generation, first release product. Guessing it was already made and part of the dog and pony show to brag about capabilities.

One could have assumed full TB3/eGPU support since M1 supports "Thunderbolt" and GPU drivers are clearly baked into the OS, but that is not the case as has been disclosed publicly. The TB storage question is also confusing and maybe even alarming. This would not be normal Thunderbolt if that is the case.

Also have to wonder if there will eventually be a total fork in OS for ARM OS and Intel OS builds sooner than expected. All can be called "Big Sur" or whatever name is next, but if ARM/M1 versions have TB-lite, and it is hardware limited in functionality, and M1 machines cannot even access GPU drivers in the OS, something is clearly very different.

It is likely by design, but this is an entirely new set of rules for developers to figure out. Not exactly the "press two buttons and you have a universal app" approach as was sold in the Keynote, but the majority here expected that.

 

[ondioline]

One could have assumed full TB3/eGPU support since M1 supports "Thunderbolt" and GPU drivers are clearly baked into the OS

Not quite, the AMD driver kexts were not compiled for arm64e. Whether or not that will remain the case is anyones guess, but that is the actual reason eGPU doesn't work atm.

 

[Macschrauber]

Someone has tested a Corsair MP400 with 4 TB?

3D QLC Nand

PS5012-12S Controller

MP400 4TB NVMe PCIe M.2 SSD

The CORSAIR MP400 Gen3 PCIe x4 NVMe M.2 SSD delivers up to 3,400MB/s sequential read and up to 3,000MB/s sequential write speeds,* utilizing high-capacity 3D QLC NAND memory. * Performance and endurance vary by capacity.

www.corsair.com

 

[Ben1l]

does anyone know if the OWC accelsior is working ok with Big Sur?

 

[AndreeOnline]

I currently use a SSD7101A-1 card and am wondering if it will still work with the new ARM machines when one finally arrives which has expansion slots, providing physical size is compatible.

How's your experience with that card? I'm considering it.

I've got an old SSUBX that has served me well for years but has had to suffer a bunch of MacOS upgrade installs and over time there are a lot of little apps and mods that I should get rid of.

I'd like to run one slot of the card as boot and RAID the other 3 for media.

I'm wondering if a clean install to a modern blade in this card could breathe some new life into my Mac Pro. The SSUBX with its 1400-1500 MB/s is fairly snappy. I know sequential reads/writes are much higher on today's NVMes, but what about general computing and latency?

Regardless of performance, I still think a single card with 4 slots and flexible configuration options seems nice.

 

[teiki arii]

Hello everybody,
Just my experience.

I bought a Crucial P2 CT1000P2SSD8 SSD 1To (3D NAND, NVMe, PCIe, M.2) to be used by PCIe port via Glotrends adapter in a Mac Pro 5.1 2009. But the glotrends PCIE NVME Card Adapter with Heatsink for Key-M M.2 SSD (PA09-HS) is subsequently proved to be unstable. I finally opted for Aqua Computer S kryoM.2 Interface adapter - M.2 - M.2 Card - PCIe 3.0 x4.
Choose the "one heatsink" configuration at 35 € and not the "two heatsinks" version at 45 € (in France). It is more prominent than the Glotrends and less easy to place in PCIe slot # 2 with a Radeon RX580 in PCIe slot # 1. I used Patafix paste so as to maintain distance and for the card fan not touching PCIe NVMe SSD adapter.
Another solution: place the Aqua Computer S kryoM.2 PCIe NVMe SSD card in slot # 1 and the RX580 video card in slot # 2 (without changing performance) but then you lose the possibility of using slot # 3. Operates as expected at temperatures ranging from 28 ° C to 39 ° C for an average of 35 ° C. Runs around 1450MB / s for both read and write.
At least, the package comes with two layers of thermal paste. One of 1.8mm and the other of 1mm. The thickest should be placed between the PCB and the SSD (under the SSD). The thinnest should be placed between the heatsink and the SSD (on the SSD). In this way, everything matches: the two thermal pastes are in contact with the SSD, the printed circuit and the radiator fixed by four screws.

My configuration: Mac Pro 2009 (4.1-> 5.1 since 2011), W3680 (2011) downgraded to X5675 (2018) then X5680 (2020) 56GoRAM (3x16Go + 1x8Go):

- PCI slot # 1 Sapphire 112650520G AMD Radeon RX580 8GB 1366Mhz PCI Express tweaked concerning the voltage,
- PCI slot # 2 Crucial P2 CT1000P2SSD8 SSD 1TB NVMe PCIe Gen3 X4 M.2 Mojave Boot on Aqua Computer S kryoM.2 Interface adapter - M.2 - M.2 Card - PCIe 3.0 x4 (W1450 / R1450 MB / S ),
- PCI slot # 3 MSATA Samsung 860 EVO 2To (2x1To) Raid0 (W700 / R700 MB / S) & MSATA Samsung 850 EVO RAID0 1To (2x500Go W700 / R700 MB / S) on Addonics Quad mSATA PCIe SSD AD4MSPX2-A (x4 Msata SSD),
- PCI slot # 4 Inatek 4x USB 3.0 PCI Express card,
- Crucial SSD SATA 500GB Mojave Boot backup optical bay,
- SATA III 4x4TB SATA HD Western Green bays.

Thank you very much to you for good advices. Best regards.

 

[WarthogARJ]

Hi,
VERY nice collection of threads here: REALLY helpful people.

Does anyone have any experience with the Startech x 8 Dual M.2 PCIe Adaptor? (Product ID: PEX8M2E2).
Startech Dual PCIe Adaptor
It is supposed to have the ASM2824 chip.
And Startech says it will work on Win, OSx and Linux.

I want to use two NVMe SSD's on my MacPro 2010: and want one to boot from.

It takes 2 x M.2 SSD's.
It's at quite a good price on Amazon.UK (£160), which is strangely enough a bit less than the Startech Canada price ($330/£190).

Cooling wise, there is only a small heatsink for the chip: no fan.
So I'd add a fan for the SSD's, as well as heatsinks for them (and power it off off the PSU).

Mr. Google tells me (Amazon.com review comment) that a guy has it working on his MacPro 2019.
And the datasheet on the Starch website seems to say it should work.
It specifically says bifurfaction not required (presumably not required from the motherboard).

I looked at the device list on this thread, and it's not mentioned.
Plus I searched this thread for any references: closest was about a different Startech product.

So it seems worth a try, unless someone knows anything?

I've had mixed luck with Startech products, from very good to very bad.
But buying off Amazon is pretty safe if it doesn't work properly.

Thanks!
Alan
Sheffield

 

[smallwonder]

Hi,
VERY nice collection of threads here: REALLY helpful people.

Does anyone have any experience with the Startech x 8 Dual M.2 PCIe Adaptor? (Product ID: PEX8M2E2).
Startech Dual PCIe Adaptor
It is supposed to have the ASM2824 chip.
And Startech says it will work on Win, OSx and Linux.

I want to use two NVMe SSD's on my MacPro 2010: and want one to boot from.

It takes 2 x M.2 SSD's.
It's at quite a good price on Amazon.UK (£160), which is strangely enough a bit less than the Startech Canada price ($330/£190).

Cooling wise, there is only a small heatsink for the chip: no fan.
So I'd add a fan for the SSD's, as well as heatsinks for them (and power it off off the PSU).

Mr. Google tells me (Amazon.com review comment) that a guy has it working on his MacPro 2019.
And the datasheet on the Starch website seems to say it should work.
It specifically says bifurfaction not required (presumably not required from the motherboard).
View attachment 1680800

I looked at the device list on this thread, and it's not mentioned.
Plus I searched this thread for any references: closest was about a different Startech product.

So it seems worth a try, unless someone knows anything?

I've had mixed luck with Startech products, from very good to very bad.
But buying off Amazon is pretty safe if it doesn't work properly.

Thanks!
Alan
Sheffield

that looks just like the Ableconn PEXM2-130 or the Lycom DT-130. I wouldn't be surprised if they're the same card. Someone at the top of this page mentioned they installed the Ableconn and had great results.