Phil Schiller Says 32GB RAM on New MacBook Pro Would Have Required Battery Compromising Design

[thomasbdl]

So, is he saying that for the next few years the MBP will not support 32GB of RAM? It's not that battery technology is moving forward that fast, and I don't see apple making a thicker laptop.

No, he's saying that we'll be able to have 32GB of RAM on a MacBook Pro when they'll be able to get an Intel processor that supports more than 16GB of LowPower RAM, which means we'll get 32GB of RAM on our laptops when Intel wakes the hell up and starts delivering on their roadmap.

 

[Workerbee Redux]

I am so glad you armchair QBs don't work for Apple!

Truth been told, I am happy that hipster lib arts students don't work in my field.

 

[MallardDuck]

Let's say that double the amount of RAM would double the power consumption. Let's see some numbers:
- 0.6 Wh from 28.6 Wh is ~2.1%
- 1.2 Wh from 29.2 Wh is ~4.1%
- The increase of power consumption from 29.2 Wh to 28.6 Wh is, of course, 2.1%
- The MBP is advertised to run for 10 hours on battery, a 2.1% increase in power drain, would mean you will be able to use your MBP on battery just for (28.6 x 10 / 29.2 = ) 9.79 hours = 9h47m, instead of 10h.

Conclusion (based on my roughly estimated numbers):
- could you live up with losing 13 mins of your battery life out of 10 hours for double the memory?
- did they have enough space to add a bigger battery to make up for the 2.1% loss?
/QUOTE]

It is a bigger hit because of the change from low-power DDR to regular DDR. So figure it's a 20% cut at worse - could yo live with 8 hours of battery life? I sure could.

 

[carrrrrlos]

These are not going to sell like they thought they would - so the board of directors will decide to slowly kill-off the product and decicate more resources to iPhones and AppleTV - the two products with built in App Stores.

 

[MallardDuck]

No, he's saying that we'll be able to have 32GB of RAM on a MacBook Pro when they'll be able to get an Intel processor that supports more than 16GB of LowPower RAM, which means we'll get 32GB of RAM on our laptops when Intel wakes the hell up and starts delivering on their roadmap.

Yep, and that probably means that there's no CPU or GPU performance increases on the horizon either because of the fixation on thin.

 

[kyykesko]

No thanks. Do not want a thicker, heavier MBP. Considering their overall customer base, and the goal of maximizing positive user experience for that base, Apple made the correct set of of engineering trades.

For people who really need 32 GB or more memory in a laptop I'm sure there are loads of other manufacturers out there that can handle that, but with corresponding negative consequences in the trade matrix.

This makes so much sense! Thank you for opening my eyes. Finally Mac users have a thin laptop to use where earlier they didn't have that option! It fully makes sense to force all pro users to jump ship so this could happen. If only they had created a thin laptop separately and called it ... let's say "Macbook Air".. but that's never going to happen so thank god they took the pro laptop, made it an useless thin toy so people who can't live without an ultra thin computer they can use to shave their beards because before this they had nothing else to use.

Or maybe "their overall customer base" might realize they already had two separate models that were thin and low powered. There was no reason to make one more. Especially when it means destroying the only viable product line they had left for anyone who needs more power than a pocket calculator.

 

[addictive]

Would be nice if the MBA was thinner and retina...

You just described the Macbook.

 

[Feenician]

These are not going to sell like they thought they would - so the board of directors will decide to slowly kill-off the product and decicate more resources to iPhones and AppleTV - the two products with built in App Stores.

Macs have built in App Stores and have for almost 6 years

 

[0997853]

It is a bigger hit because of the change from low-power DDR to regular DDR. So figure it's a 20% cut at worse - could yo live with 8 hours of battery life? I sure could.

Why do you need to switch to non-LPDDR3? https://www.micron.com/products/dram/lpdram/32Gb#/

 

[MallardDuck]

Truth been told, I am happy that hipster lib arts students don't work in my field.

Well said. We're not armchair quarter-backing. Apple's treating us like veal calves or foie gras ducks: open up, we know what's good for you!

 

[atikalz]

Give me a break, there's at least 4 fingers worth of empty space. Returning the MBP soon for a 2015 model.

And then you get 32 gigs of Ram?

 

[MallardDuck]

Why do you need to switch to non-LPDDR3? https://www.micron.com/products/dram/lpdram/32Gb#/

If I read right, they want LPDDR4, not 3.
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And then you get 32 gigs of Ram?

No, but you get the same performance as the 2016 for $700-800 less money.

 

[cmaier]

You just described the Macbook.

would be nice if the MacBook had a bigger screen and more ports ...

 

[Cartossin]

Give me a break, there's at least 4 fingers worth of empty space. Returning the MBP soon for a 2015 model.

That one can't do 32GB either.

 

[kyykesko]

What I want to know is how many people out there actually need 30 days of standby time? Really, who doesn't use their computer at least once a day, unless you're leaving on an extended vacation, not bringing your MacBook with you (which you would then leave plugged in anyway)?

It's just a spec that Apple promoted, because it was something that most PC laptops couldn't offer. What's really sad is that for lots of people working on laptops, there is little need for long standby time or even battery life, as they sit at the same desk plugged in.

Not many, but you do realize those figures affect all use, not just standby. Would I want a computer with 1/3 of the battery life of the current one? No, not really. I'm not even happy with the current one and this one has 99,5Wh battery. I expected at least the same from the new one, not a 76Wh one. Kind of hard to explain that with the FAA limitations.

Then again, with the keyboard the new "pro" ships I would expect the standby time would be the only number related to battery life I would care about because I wouldn't want to use it anyway.

 

[teejaysplace24]

WHAT PRO USER NEEDS 30 DAYS OF STANDBY?!?!? Are you editing video while trekking through the freaking Sahara? If so, there are iPads and smaller notebooks for the express purpose of providing an insanely portable, ultra low power experience. I'm gonna say that 90% of pro users opt for laptops so they can tote their gear to work and plug it in, then tote it back to their home office/studio AND PLUG IT IN. Sure, sometimes, I work from coffee shops for a few hours or take my lappy to a presentation. But on the rare occasions when I'm doing lengthy design work in one of those locals, I just make certain that in in a place with a power supply available. If you're buying a pro notebook with all the bells and whistles, you are either 1.) So insanely rich that you have literally no idea what you are purchasing and do not care 2.) Someone who NEEDS a pro notebook for their career and well aware of the accompanying tradeoffs. You know what sucks even more than sometimes having to carry a power cord? Constantly having to wait for your computer to render complex images and having your project take 2-3 times longer to complete because of it. I am so sick of Apple stiffing their (stupefyingly loyal) pro users to make products that will look good to teenagers and yuppie ***holes. And it's not even THAT much lighter. Jesus.

 

[atikalz]

If I read right, they want LPDDR4, not 3.
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No, but you get the same performance as the 2016 for $700-800 less money.

I have also ordered the new and the old macbook and from the delivery tomorrow on I will see who makes the game.

 

[0997853]

If I read right, they want LPDDR4, not 3.

Who are they? People want and need more capacity. Since DDR2 there's not much of a difference, no matter what the benchmark-nerd would tell me. It's like you have a supersonic plane (RAM) running at mach 10, while your SSD is a plane running at mach mach 1 and your HDD running at mach 0.2. The system won't see much of an improvement running at mach 10.3.

 

[MallardDuck]

Who are they? People want and need more capacity. Since DDR2 there's not much of a difference, no matter what the benchmark-nerd would tell me. It's like you have a supersonic plane (RAM) running at mach 10, while your SSD is a plane running at mach mach 1 and your HDD running at mach 0.2. The system won't see much of an improvement running at mach 10.3.

They = Apple.

Not disagreeing with the point about LPDDR3 being an option

 

[mkeeley]

Same here - late 2016 Dell XPS 13 comes with 7th generation Intel CPUs, while the new MacBook Pro has the previous generation. 7th generation uses slightly less Watts in "TDP-down" low power mode, but currently has the same restrictions on LPDDR3/DDR4 memory as the 6th generation.

Getting a stable Hackintosh seems challenging - one might even have to replace the WLAN/Bluetooth module, and configuration of a proper wake-up from sleep/standby seems tricky...

Intel i7-6660U (MacBook Pro 13 TB):
http://ark.intel.com/products/91169/Intel-Core-i7-6660U-Processor-4M-Cache-up-to-3_40-GHz

Intel i7-7500U (XPS 13):
https://ark.intel.com/products/95451/Intel-Core-i7-7500U-Processor-4M-Cache-up-to-3_50-GHz-

Hackintosh:
https://www.tonymacx86.com

My desktop hack was a doddle to get up and going and is as easy to update but laptops seem to be a different matter. At least for any that I'd consider buying.

 

[Smeaton1724]

That one can't do 32GB either.

True but I'm presuming the poster will want to save a significant amount of money whilst also getting a machine that is equal in the RAM department, not particularly slower in the CPU and more capable because of ports/might not like adapters/dongles.

 

[kyykesko]

Turns out more memory only affects battery life marginally, practically non-significant as demonstrated recently by Linux Tech Tips:

For in as far as expanding the battery, in their WAN-show, Linus Tech Tips notes that going beyond 100W is not an option as airlines do not allow to travel with batteries with a larger capacity than 100W:

The battery on the 15" is 76Wh. Not even close to 100Wh. 2015 DID come close to it. Now they add some battery saving features - AND SHRINK THE BATTERY so they barely get what the previous one did - in ideal situations. Too bad real life rarely is that.

 

[0997853]

They = Apple.

Not disagreeing with the point about LPDDR3 being an option

Apple thinks all of their users are potatoes.

 

[cppguy]

Or they could have created a thinner Air (for Starbucks surfers) and a thicker Pro (for video editors).

 

[Avenged110]

"which might reduce space for batteries" Hahahaha so they just decided to reduce the size of the batteries anyway and pack some giant air gaps around them. What a clown.