Rant about the new Mac Mini.

[phoenix-mac-user]

Apple Intelligence is mostly going to suck and not really get used anyway. I have it on but would turn it off if it did anything noticeable to system resources.

They introduced Siri in 2011 and I still scream at her for completely screwing up a basic ask for directions like 8 times a month. She can only find the nearest of any chain. I will tell her to tell me to give me directions to the Best Buy in (suburb of Phoenix) and she will say "One place I see is Best Buy in (nearest location). It has 3 stars and is six point three miles..."

"No Best Buy in....."

This stuff is not Apple's gig and I wish they would acknowledge it.

This is me way too many times for something that has been there for 13 years,

 

[AlaskaMoose]

Nothing the cooling system would notice.

Perhaps you are correct, but the harder the CPU/GPU work plus the larger the SSD, the more internal heat that's generated. According to a lot of people who have or are reviewing the performance to the base M4 Mini and fan noise, the Pro seems to be creating more fan noise when pushed hard than the base Mini. The Pro is being compared to the M1 Studio in the following video, and the Mini performs quite well (receives praise from the video host). But notice how hard the GPU has to work toward the end of the video, and also how noisy the Mini becomes:

 

[XboxEvolved]

I agree it should start at 512GB, especially when a lot of people will likely use it as a media server, but if it had 512GB at $600, that is a pretty good price.

Actually though if you price it against competing products from companies like ASUS and MSI it's price competitive. In fact, the ASUS product at 512GB is also $800, with less ram, and a slower Intel CPU and GPU. So these prices are in line with the industry.

 

[Boyd01]

I agree it should start at 512GB, especially when a lot of people will likely use it as a media server, but if it had 512GB at $600, that is a pretty good price.

I just setup a base 16/256 m4 Mini as a media server. All my media is on a 4tb external ssd, am only using a total of 18gb on the internal disk. That will probably grow with web caches, etc. over time, but 512gb would just be wasted space for me.

Now for me, "media server" just means that it's running the built-in media sharing to feed my two Apple TV's and other devices, so maybe there's some other server software that requires a bigger internal disk? But 512gb sure wouldn't be enough room for my media.

Don't get me wrong - bigger disks for less money is a good thing. But I don't want to pay extra for space I won't use.

 

[mode11]

Perhaps you are correct, but the harder the CPU/GPU work plus the larger the SSD, the more internal heat that's generated.

Yeah, but 95% of the heat will be the CPU / GPU cores.

I agree it should start at 512GB, especially when a lot of people will likely use it as a media server

That use case would benefit little from internal storage. A video library wouldn’t fit in that, so you’d be looking at a multi-TB external drive regardless. And 256GB is fine for just the OS, Plex etc.

Edit - as @Boyd01 already pointed out.

 

[turbineseaplane]

I just think it should start at 512GB as it would make it a more flexible and useful base config for more folks and cost Apple pennies

256 vs 512 is essentially "nothing" cost wise in 2025 at their scale, but it creates a far better base computer experience for more types of users

 

[neomorpheus]

Agreed, cant really “satisfy” a media server user with 512GB. But many that will do such deployments must have storage in the TBs range, so maybe a NAS or external drives. But at the same time, i feel that a Mac Mini with a M4 is way overpowered for such duties.

About the internal heat, remember that regardless of the size, its always 2 NANDS, so i dont think that would increase the heat output to the point of affecting the overall functionality of the cooling system.

 

[turbineseaplane]

But at the same time, i feel that a Mac Mini with a M4 is way overpowered for such duties.

Agreed
No offense to anyone going this route, as I understand the desire to have a Mac of some kind in that role

That said, honestly speaking, using an M4 Mini as a Media Server is using a bazooka to kill a mosquito

I've considered eventually using a Mini for my server needs (currently still on a Xeon box I built in 2016), but if I did it right now, it'd be a stupid good price on a preowned M1 Mini.

 

[Boyd01]

No offense to anyone going this route, as I understand the desire to have a Mac of some kind in that role

That said, honestly speaking, using an M4 Mini as a Media Server is using a bazooka to kill a mosquito

I think you need to look at this from a practical standpoint and not just the specs. Will spare the details, but I needed to replace a failing server running iTunes on Mojave. The 2012 and 2014 Mini's I've used in the past cost $500. The base m4 was $529 on Black Friday sale. Apple was selling these new for $599 and the cheapest refurb was a 8/512 m2 for $589.

You're absolutely right, the specs are way overkill for a media server. But what would you do? Pay more for a less powerful computer just to prove a point? Buy a cheap used Mini? It needs to be a Mac because of my purchases. This is like an appliance for me that sits inside a cabinet silently providing thousands of videos and music for my devices. I don't want to mess with it again for many years. And with the newest Mini, I shouldn't need to.

 

[Cape Dave]

I just think it should start at 512GB as it would make it a more flexible and useful base config for more folks and cost Apple pennies

256 vs 512 is essentially "nothing" cost wise in 2025 at their scale, but it creates a far better base computer experience for more types of users

100% absolute truth! It would not kill Apple to do this. 256GB is passive/aggressive. "here's a nice new computer! But do not put your stuff on it!".

 

[mode11]

100% absolute truth! It would not kill Apple to do this. 256GB is passive/aggressive. "here's a nice new computer! But do not put your stuff on it!".

I expect Apple have crunched the numbers and reckon they make more profit this way (getting people in with the low, low starting price and then up-selling them). Unless the extra profit is significant, however, it would be classier to stop nickel-and-diming their customers this way.

But perhaps that’s what happens when the accountant runs the company.

 

[neomorpheus]

I think you need to look at this from a practical standpoint and not just the specs.

Actually, was thinking, there are possible scenarios, like needing to transcode multiple streams at the same time, in case that the Mini is serving multiple users.

 

[redheeler]

I think you need to look at this from a practical standpoint and not just the specs. Will spare the details, but I needed to replace a failing server running iTunes on Mojave. The 2012 and 2014 Mini's I've used in the past cost $500. The base m4 was $529 on Black Friday sale. Apple was selling these new for $599 and the cheapest refurb was a 8/512 m2 for $589.

You're absolutely right, the specs are way overkill for a media server. But what would you do? Pay more for a less powerful computer just to prove a point? Buy a cheap used Mini? It needs to be a Mac because of my purchases. This is like an appliance for me that sits inside a cabinet silently providing thousands of videos and music for my devices. I don't want to mess with it again for many years. And with the newest Mini, I shouldn't need to.

Old used Mac minis make great servers, and also prolongs their usability – someone's unwanted e-waste is someone else's opportunity for a cheap & reliable server. Although not running MacOS, I have a 2009 Mac mini in use as a server. It's been on the shelf for several years just doing its thing and I never had to touch it. Will likely replace it with a 2012 model sometime soon.

 

[mode11]

Actually, was thinking, there are possible scenarios, like needing to transcode multiple streams at the same time, in case that the Mini is serving multiple users.

Transcoding is largely unnecessary these days. Practically anything can decode h264 / h265 in hardware, and any modern-ish Apple device has loads of ST speed for software decoding (if necessary).

 

[neomorpheus]

Transcoding is largely unnecessary these days. Practically anything can decode h264 / h265 in hardware, and any modern-ish Apple device has loads of ST speed for software decoding (if necessary).

I know, just giving the benefit of the doubt to that scenario, because i keep reading complaints after complaints from Synology NAS owners that are pissed after Synology moved to Ryzen CPUs without IGP, so slower transcoding. You will think that all streams are transcode, according to them.

Assuming a scenario that doesn’t need transcoding and any of apple’s proprietary tech, you could argue that a Pi and a big hard drive would be enough.

 

[mode11]

I know, just giving the benefit of the doubt to that scenario, because i keep reading complaints after complaints from Synology NAS owners that are pissed after Synology moved to Ryzen CPUs without IGP, so slower transcoding. You will think that all streams are transcode, according to them.

Assuming a scenario that doesn’t need transcoding and any of apple’s proprietary tech, you could argue that a Pi and a big hard drive would be enough.

My Synology has an Intel CPU, but I believe the latest DiskStation update removes transcoding. They reckon it’s unnecessary these days and a waste of resources. In any case, I find even a Firestick can play back pretty much anything via Plex or Kodi.

 

[AlaskaMoose]

Yeah, but 95% of the heat will be the CPU / GPU cores.



That use case would benefit little from internal storage. A video library wouldn’t fit in that, so you’d be looking at a multi-TB external drive regardless. And 256GB is fine for just the OS, Plex etc.

Edit - as @Boyd01 already pointed out.

I have no idea if the CPU/GPU create 95% of the heat, but I do now that the SSD gets hot, specially when pushed hard. Every electrical component inside the computer operates in a certain wattage. Total wastage for the base M4 Mini is 65 Watts, which is similar to a energized 65-Watt lightbulb, in relation to current dissipation in heat. The average SSD operating temperature is from 86 to 149 degrees F. External SSDs get hot too, but at least this heat is generated outside of the Mini.

And yes, I do agree with you about the fan taking care of the cooling. The fan can handle it, but noise is increased.

 

[neomorpheus]

My Synology has an Intel CPU, but I believe the latest DiskStation update removes transcoding. They reckon it’s unnecessary these days and a waste of resources. In any case, I find even a Firestick can play back pretty much anything via Plex or Kodi.

Same here, I have a 918+, it has a Celeron CPU which includes an IGP, which does transcoding.via Quick sync.

The Ryzen CPU in the latest Synology they they selected doesn't have an IGP, so no transcoding engine, just brute force transcoding.

 

[mode11]

I have no idea if the CPU/GPU create 95% of the heat, but I do now that the SSD gets hot, specially when pushed hard. Every electrical component inside the computer operates in a certain wattage. Total wastage for the base M4 Mini is 65 Watts, which is similar to a energized 65-Watt lightbulb, in relation to current dissipation in heat. The average SSD operating temperature is from 86 to 149 degrees F. External SSDs get hot too, but at least this heat is generated outside of the Mini.

And yes, I do agree with you about the fan taking care of the cooling. The fan can handle it, but noise is increased.

According to this, the average 2TB SSD consumes about 5W flat out. That’s for a commercial model, including the controller. Don’t know how Apple NAND stick arrangement compares. For reference, 1TB SSDs average around 4W. So nothing to get too concerned about.

 

[neomorpheus]

According to this, the average 2TB SSD consumes about 5W flat out. That’s for a commercial model, including the controller. Don’t know how Apple NAND stick arrangement compares. For reference, 1TB SSDs average around 4W. So nothing to get too concerned about.

they are just grasping at straws to defend the honor of poor and defenseless Apple.

 

[AlaskaMoose]

According to this, the average 2TB SSD consumes about 5W flat out. That’s for a commercial model, including the controller. Don’t know how Apple NAND stick arrangement compares. For reference, 1TB SSDs average around 4W. So nothing to get too concerned about.

Yes, even 4 Watts result in heat dissipation (electrical power dissipates in heat). The heat itself is not only from the SSD's writing, reading, and storing functions, but the rest of the components in the circuit board. The larger the SSD the more heat it generates when operating. If it's at idle (just energized) its power consumption and internal temperature are at a minimum. Plug an external SSD to your Mac, put is through a heavy task of writing or reading, and notice that its temperature gradually increases.

SSD Power Consumption: What to Expect | SuperSSD

It’s a common misconception that SSDs, although devoid of moving parts, consume less power than their mechanical hard drive counterparts. It is not without reason that some of the latest high-end M.2 SSDs using the PCI-Express 5.0 interface often use active cooling to remove excess heat...

www.superssd.com

 

[mode11]

Yes, even 4 Watts result in heat dissipation (electrical power dissipates in heat). The heat itself is not only from the SSD's writing, reading, and storing functions, but the rest of the components in the circuit board. The larger the SSD the more heat it generates when operating. If it's at idle (just energized) its power consumption and internal temperature are at a minimum. Plug an external SSD to your Mac, put is through a heavy task of writing or reading, and notice that its temperature gradually increases.

SSD Power Consumption: What to Expect | SuperSSD

It’s a common misconception that SSDs, although devoid of moving parts, consume less power than their mechanical hard drive counterparts. It is not without reason that some of the latest high-end M.2 SSDs using the PCI-Express 5.0 interface often use active cooling to remove excess heat...

www.superssd.com

Yes, I understand how electricity works. The point is that the e.g. 1W of difference between a 1TB and 2TB SSD (during heavy use) is no reason to avoid large SSDs.

 

[Alameda]

The way i see it:

Base Mac Mini should start with 512gb.

RAM and storage upgrades should be at a maximum, 100 per bump, not the current.

Mac Mini M4 Pro base mode needs a 300 bucks price cut.

I dont understand why Apple doesn’t try to really go for market share and instead it’s complacent in abusing their loyal customers.

Windows is horrible in its current state, Linux Desktop looks like it will never happen.

The current crop of mini pcs might not have a faster cpu, but they have more cores plus way better gpus, with user upgradable ram and storage.

Hell, apple showed us their true colors by going out of their way in making sure that the Mini doesnt have industry standard storage connectors JUST so we cant avoid their insulting prices.

But many of us will never complain, will instead attack the one that does dare call out their bs and will continue buying Macs and defending poor apple and their lack of consideration for our loyalty.

Personally, i will reluctantly buy a base mini, simply because I need to have a Mac in my homelab, but not happy that i cannot buy (in good conscience) the system that i want.

A shame, I feel like the current Mini Pro is paying a nice homage to the legendary SE/30.

Did it occur to you that perhaps the reason why Apple can produce a better OS than Microsoft, a better CPU than Intel, and better hardware than Dell and HP… is precisely because they’re able to operate their business at higher margins?

 

[mattopotamus]

That doesn’t take anything away from my post.

If my suspicions are correct and we have no way to turn AI off, that person will be struggling, memory wise for the next 3 years or so, until the next upgrade.

But selective reading and stuff…

I'll disagree that the 16gb will be pressed in the next 2-3 years (even with the AI "stuff")

 

[redheeler]

Did it occur to you that perhaps the reason why Apple can produce a better OS than Microsoft, a better CPU than Intel, and better hardware than Dell and HP… is precisely because they’re able to operate their business at higher margins?

Apple doesn’t manufacture its own hardware or fabricate its own CPUs. What it does better than anyone else is put together the whole package of software + hardware, and take lessons learned from other devices like the iPhone and apply those to the Mac.