Got a tip for us?
Let us know
Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
Returned M1. Won’t Beta test this
- Thread starter FilmIndustryGuy
- Start date
- Sort by reaction score
To those that are making the claim that "these chips aren't new" and that "they've been in use since the original iPad ten years ago". you're missing one VERY critical point: They're new to the Mac.
M1 is not A14, nor is it A14X, nor is it A14Z, nor is it A13, A12, A12X, A12Z, or any earlier Apple SoC. M1 is a brand new SoC, which, for the Mac, makes it a brand new chip on a brand new processor architecture.
If you're trying to deny that this is a Rev A product, you're wrong.
This is different from typical Rev A products in that pretty much every other component that ISN'T the logic board is the same as on the previous Intel versions of these Macs (with the replacement of the fan on the Air with a heat-spreader and with the replacement of removable RAM and some chassis differences on the mini being the only serious exceptions). The main logic boards are the main difference here. So, you're not likely going to get (a) bad batteries, (b) bad power supplies, and (c) bad displays (in the case of the Air and the 2-port 13" Pro). But as far as everything on the logic board is concerned, this is a Rev A product.
That said, not every Rev A Apple product sucks. I had the first Intel iMac and didn't have any problem with it until my internal hard drive failed some four years into my owning it. But it's still a Rev A product, and it's the first of a whole new architecture for the Mac, complete with brand new conventions (as well as the end of some long standing old ones [there is no SMC to reset anymore]). As others have said, I wouldn't worry about M1 Air reliability until we start seeing 100 page threads devoted to issues. Certainly, I'm way more comfortable with the idea of owning this Air than I was its most direct predecessor.
M1 is not A14, nor is it A14X, nor is it A14Z, nor is it A13, A12, A12X, A12Z, or any earlier Apple SoC. M1 is a brand new SoC, which, for the Mac, makes it a brand new chip on a brand new processor architecture.
If you're trying to deny that this is a Rev A product, you're wrong.
This is different from typical Rev A products in that pretty much every other component that ISN'T the logic board is the same as on the previous Intel versions of these Macs (with the replacement of the fan on the Air with a heat-spreader and with the replacement of removable RAM and some chassis differences on the mini being the only serious exceptions). The main logic boards are the main difference here. So, you're not likely going to get (a) bad batteries, (b) bad power supplies, and (c) bad displays (in the case of the Air and the 2-port 13" Pro). But as far as everything on the logic board is concerned, this is a Rev A product.
That said, not every Rev A Apple product sucks. I had the first Intel iMac and didn't have any problem with it until my internal hard drive failed some four years into my owning it. But it's still a Rev A product, and it's the first of a whole new architecture for the Mac, complete with brand new conventions (as well as the end of some long standing old ones [there is no SMC to reset anymore]). As others have said, I wouldn't worry about M1 Air reliability until we start seeing 100 page threads devoted to issues. Certainly, I'm way more comfortable with the idea of owning this Air than I was its most direct predecessor.
CLUE!
I went on Amazon to look at reviews of this new Air. Someone said theirs went out also after plugging it into a 3rd party box for power. Now that I think about it, I plugged mine into a RavPower 65 watt box using an Anker 100 watt USB cable which was certified for Macs. The power box is a 2 port USB-C and 2 port USB-A 65 total watts power. after 10 min plugged, it would no longer power on. The thing is this isnt the first time I plugged it to this power brick. I also plugged all my other Macs and devices to it with no issues. Could it be that something is up with the USBC/Thunderbolt controller on these Macs? Im assuming everyone is using an Apple brick to power these Macs. this is just a clue. I'm not trying to spread misinformation. Just connecting some dots. wonder what would happen if everyone tested this by using another adapter and not Apple's. I never expected my post to generate so much heat and debates. I liked the MacBook but you guys should test yours now with the longer return window. Mine was at 25% battery when I hooked it up for 10 min. Again, im just trying to save everyone the hassle if indeed there is some 3rd party adapter issue with the Air.
I went on Amazon to look at reviews of this new Air. Someone said theirs went out also after plugging it into a 3rd party box for power. Now that I think about it, I plugged mine into a RavPower 65 watt box using an Anker 100 watt USB cable which was certified for Macs. The power box is a 2 port USB-C and 2 port USB-A 65 total watts power. after 10 min plugged, it would no longer power on. The thing is this isnt the first time I plugged it to this power brick. I also plugged all my other Macs and devices to it with no issues. Could it be that something is up with the USBC/Thunderbolt controller on these Macs? Im assuming everyone is using an Apple brick to power these Macs. this is just a clue. I'm not trying to spread misinformation. Just connecting some dots. wonder what would happen if everyone tested this by using another adapter and not Apple's. I never expected my post to generate so much heat and debates. I liked the MacBook but you guys should test yours now with the longer return window. Mine was at 25% battery when I hooked it up for 10 min. Again, im just trying to save everyone the hassle if indeed there is some 3rd party adapter issue with the Air.
It's possible. Seems odd if it's certified to work with Macs. Though, I'd always be safe and make sure the power adapter you're working with (if not Apple's) or Thunderbolt/USB-C Dock is Mac compatible first. Though, typically, big name brand docks (like the ones from Lenovo, Dell, or HP) have no issue with Macs.
I never use the stock power brick. I just use whatever USB-C charger I have around. Most of my home wall outlets have USB-C and I simply use those. The MBA will only pull 41W max regardless of charger capacity.
Logic boards fried due to faulty USB-C/Thunderbolt cables, chargers and docks are quite a known issue. Unfortunately, it happens also with certified USB-C products and it's not limited to MacBooks; I've heard of Dell laptops fried like that. It's not exactly "common" but not unheard of.
I know a guy whose M1 MacBook got fried with original charger passed through third party hub.
I know a guy whose M1 MacBook got fried with original charger passed through third party hub.
Last edited:
Yeah. With USB-C, I think it's very important to stay with OEM items as some imitations with lower QA/QC standards have slipped into the supply chains. I also think running power through a hub is asking for trouble unless it's commercial-grade.
Your assumption is that is not higher than 90c. So you went this entire thread making claims about things without knowing based on random hunches?
I am pretty sure I saw some review where the M1 was at 90c+ for extended duration in bench mark. If I remember which one I’ll post a link to the video.
Last edited:
Apple support doesn’t use language like “fried” or “toast”, in my experience using Apple products for the last 17 years. That’s pretty much OP’s colloquialism.
Your whole premise is. A greater than zero percentage of people will get a DOA device or one that dies prematurely. A few anecdotes of dead M1 machines doesn't suggest any systemic design flaws.
The failure curve for computers is a "U" shape, with most failures occurring at either the start of their life with the curve then picking back up again after five years.
OP seems to have a history of making bold, dramatic and/or alarmist posts with little to nothing backing up their claims.
Not surprised at all from his original post. Because he had a failure, the sky is falling, and we're all beta testers. ?
On what basis would you make that assumption?
Lots of folks are coming to M1 systems from previous USBC powered macbooks - using whatever existing power supply/setup they already had. There are many posts in this forum of people using their with USBC displays providing power to the laptop. Fair number of folks using stuff like a Caldigit TS3+ docks as well.
Me? I've not even taken my M1 MBP's brick and cable out of the box. It's been powered either via my Caldigit TS3+, from a Lenovo USBC dock(*), from a CableMatters 60W PD supply, or from a Lenovo 65W USBC power supply connected through a passthru HDMI/USBC hub.
Seems you just had a system that went tango-uniform in the first few days of ownership. It happens. No need for an external cause.
(*) FWIW while the Lenovo dock will power the system, an external monitor connected to it does not work. Apparently a known issue with the Lenovo docks - doesn't work with Intel macbooks either.
Well boys. I’m leaving my own post. Too dramatic in here.
No, I'm saying the opposite, actually...
That the chip is allowed to reach 90+C for a while before throttling may contribute to higher failure point.
You do understand the context of what you're quoting, I hope?
I'm not claiming anything with regards to how many M1 machines may fail. I'm simply saying that excessive heat may be a contributing factor. If you disagree, then please feel free to explain why that is "hyperbole".
We assumed that heat could hurt the 12" Macbook, and any 14nm+++mbp...not to mention the 27" imac with the 295MX...so like butterfly keyboards if heat was an big issue that would be a main topic, all over the news
Again, 12" Macbook intel cpu heat 99C under full load,nothing after 3 generations....the arm macbook air is around 10degrees cooler....its a big thing
Can't believe because 1 user came and told us this issue with a lemon...this is becoming a big thing.
Lets make it a BIG thing when we hear a lot more users complaining...because if its an big issue we will hear about it like the others in the past
Again, 12" Macbook intel cpu heat 99C under full load,nothing after 3 generations....the arm macbook air is around 10degrees cooler....its a big thing
Can't believe because 1 user came and told us this issue with a lemon...this is becoming a big thing.
Lets make it a BIG thing when we hear a lot more users complaining...because if its an big issue we will hear about it like the others in the past
Well, the OP is not the only one. We have had... more than 1 report, let's say. I won't try to post them again, but it seems at least that "some" M1 MacBooks are failing due to "some mysterious" reason.
The chip in the 12" MacBook was rated for 100C T junction, by the way...
Intel® Core™ m3-7Y32 Processor (4M Cache, up to 3.00 GHz) Product Specifications
Intel® Core™ m3-7Y32 Processor (4M Cache, up to 3.00 GHz) quick reference guide including specifications, features, pricing, compatibility, design documentation, ordering codes, spec codes and more.
We don't have this T junction number for M1.
Also, just to make it clear because I think people keep misunderstanding me: I am not claiming heat is a problem with all M1 computers. It may or may not be a contributing factor to the failure of these M1 machines reported.
Are you suggesting the chip/SOC design engineers didn't set the thermal safeguards correctly?
That you don't think the M1 cpu's won't throttle (or shut down) if approaching the maximum design specification? - just like pretty much any other modern processor?
I'm curious what leads you to think this.
You claimed only the MacBook Air is allowed to reach 90c and the MacBook Pro isn’t.
That is simply not true the MacBook Pro will sit at 93c with the fans spinning without throttling.
There is 0 evidence that the OP’s failure was heat related.
You are not only speculating on the M1’s Tjunction is but also making claims about what temperatures are dangerous in the Air when the Pro also hits the same temps
Well, no. I think we know M1 throttles when it has reached 90+C for a good amount of time (I'm guessing 10 minutes is the current estimate?). So we know Apple engineers did set thermal safeguards properly.
I'm simply saying that perhaps they were a bit "optimistic" with regards to the thermal endurance of the chip.
Since most everything is on the chip now, I think excess heat may contribute to one of those components failing prematurely in these isolated incidences.
If you'd recall, we had this craziness just a short while ago:
If your MacBook Pro overheats, you might be charging it from the wrong side
There’s a right and a wrong way to charge your MacBook Pro. If you’re charging it from the left, you’re doing it wrong.
www.cultofmac.com
So maybe, just... maybe: the Thunderbolt/USB 4.0 controller on these chips may be failing due to excess heat. The other components may soldier on just fine. I can at least concede that Apple has had 10 years of experience dealing with the CPU and GPU cores. But the Thunderbolt/USB 4.0 controller is definitely a "first" for them.
No, I'm not claiming the Pro doesn't reach that. I'm saying the Pro revs its fan up at around 45C and the fan is practically at max when temps reach beyond 70C. I have an M1 Pro so I can tell what temperature it's running at under full load. It's not 90C with my current use, but I know full well it can still reach 90C given the right conditions (just wrap it in a blanket?). The fan just makes it much harder for that to happen under normal use.
And the OP originally wrote this:
So I'm going off of what he said at the time.
Is there anything suggesting a (statistically significant) difference in "infant mortality" rates of the M1 systems vs prior models? We're working with a sample size of what, four reports maybe?
As I don't wish to be unkind, I'll just say that I'd recommend against taking the OP's word choices literally.
Stuff like this would be for sure covered under warranty in The Netherlands. However, Im thinking of ordering AppleCare regardless of the standard warrently. What is I drop this M1 MacBook Pro lol...
Yeah, but I'm not saying "this is a universal problem with every single M1 computer that has been created, and will ever be created".
I think that's the disconnect that we keep running into here... people keep assuming that I'm stating this to be some universal problem that affects everyone.
That's not what I'm saying.
Again, all I'm saying, up to this point, is still just this: "I think heat is a contributing factor in the failures we are seeing in these 4 cases".
Also, I didn't know anything about the OP, so the best I could do at the beginning of this thread was to take him on his words. Pages later, people still question me about this.