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Would a USB+MDP->HDMI adapter solve the issue since it can do uncompressed audio across the USB?

The playback software would have to know how to deal with the hardware, I suspect. I don't know if Plex or XBMC (the two that efficiently play h.264, VC-1 and MPEG-2 Blu-ray video) could utilize such a device, and I'm certain they won't send HD audio to it in their current builds.

given the information that dual 2.5ghz is easily enough to decode h.264 @ 1080p (IF ENCODED CORRECTLY).

The current Minis can handle any Blu-ray video straight from the rip without issue. The problem is the HD audio. (Some BBC productions use an unusual VC-1 scheme, sometimes with 1080i, that are problematic for any Mac.)

Well he says he does no transcoding as he wants true hd but he puts that huge file into a mkv...

I don't even know if mkv containers can take True-HD or DTS-HD. The m2ts and ts containers can. At any rate, if HD audio is essential, no OS X computer is adequate since there is no software that can pass it through the displayport ATM.

Thought about trying windows? The drivers for hardware acceleration of video are far more mature.

Video really isn't the problem, the audio is. My recollection of Power DVD for Blu-ray playback under Windows is that it only plays Blu-ray off of the disc, not from a file or ISO? (Power DVD abides by Blu-ray licensing terms.) If so, then you must have an HDMI port for the passthrough of the HD audio to your receiver or TV for decoding by hardware. If you rip those files, I suspect you're stuck with the same problem with XBMC for playback under Windows. Perhaps you can provide some clarification since my experience is limited with Windows.
 
No chance, mate. I asked specifically about it's HTPC capabilities, and 1080p .MKVs.

Maybe the people 'advising' me were out of their depth.


Now that I've downloaded these new Plex binaries, how do I implement them? I double-clicked on the file that hit my desktop, and it opened the Terminal.

Mkv is only a container, so you clearly werent specific enough, especially considering that pretty much any pirated movie youll find using it are encoded using h264 whitch you mini will play fine.
 
i also thought you can transcode and not loose any of the so called true hd he talks about and why not renencode audio so it can be played with out any reciever and such
 
so cave man your basicly saying if he does not transcode then any blu ray rip will have that issue in any mac

The only Macs that have the potential for passthrough of HD audio are those with the post-9400m chipsets (all current Macs sans Mini and probably Mac Pro). That would have to go through the (mini)DisplayPorts of those Macs and there is currently no software that I'm aware of that can do that. I am hopeful that will be remedied sooner rather than later (i.e., Plex and XMBC updates), but we're not there yet. Passthrough is great because it requires very little action of the cpu - it just has to send a digital signal out; the responsibility for decoding that HD audio is with the receiver (which must have True-HD and DTS-HD decoding hardware). Thus, the computer only has to handle the video (and subtitles if we ever get there).
 
Ballis;

I've said already that the specific questions that I asked escape me now, but that I am satisfied that I would have described my process accurately. You've cherry-picked one of my sentences and, from that, attempted to extrapolate something. Unsuccessfully.


Pachang;

For, "if encoded correctly", read, "provided you re-encode to bring it within the Mini's operating parameters". That kind of advice would have been useful when I was shopping for the Mini, but it comes rather too late here.

And I've already answered that question about the encoding of the .MKV.


Aegelward;

Yeah, Windows doesn't do any better with it. Thanks for the idea, all the same.


Cave Man;

You seem like the kinda guy I needed to talk to four months ago...! :)

That's interesting, that the HD audio would be causing the problem. I'll take your word for it.

I'm sure you understand, mate, that I'm not going to remux 4TB of Blu-ray to render it playable on the Mini, when my C-200 can pass-through HD audio. That said, if there's ever a time when I need to watch something and my C-200's f**ked, knowing that I can process that individual file with only audio loss (the weaker limb of my setup) then watch it on my Mini is pleasing, and useful.

Thank you.
 
Im simply saying that if you cant explain what you wanna achieve in correct terms, you cant expect guidance that will satisfy you.

Im pretty sure you can find 1080p content encoded in formats that will have lot of boxes struggle. Does that make them unsuitable as htpc's? Maybe for some. If you wanna play pirated 1080 x264 content downloaded off the internet, the mac mini you have will do more than just fine.

Its all about finding a box that caters your needs. But claiming the mini is insufficiant as htpc altogether is just stupid, and so is expressing ones anger over bad advise when you clearly have trouble explaining your needs.
 
That's unlikely to work with straight Blu-ray rips because most of those h.264 encodes do not use the h.264 decoding scheme of Apple's API.
He clearly stated it improved his performance on at least one of the things he tested.
 
He clearly stated it improved his performance on at least one of the things he tested.

Not from a Blu-ray rip. The Apple API for h.264 hardware decoding is for mkv, mov or m4v containers, not m2ts or ts containers because they have not been incorporated into Plex (yet). If it were getting passed to the gpu, then the improvement wouldn't be slightly better - it would have been substantially better. It's either passed off to the gpu, or it's not.
 
Not from a Blu-ray rip. The Apple API for h.264 hardware decoding is for mkv, mov or m4v containers, not m2ts or ts containers because they have not been incorporated into Plex (yet).

Not sure I understand what you mean here, but m2ts gets hw acceleration in XBMC now so while Plex could have some limitation, its not a limitation of the api.
 
Ballis;
I'm sure you understand, mate, that I'm not going to remux 4TB of Blu-ray to render it playable on the Mini, when my C-200 can pass-through HD audio.

Just read through the thread. I'm no pro with media but what cave man is saying seems logical. So that we know, without doubt, that the audio is causing the problem, could you test it with one of your files?

The question i have, which has been mentioned but i don't think answered, is where are these files stored? Obviously you've got a lot of data here, you mentioned 4TB, is it safe to presume your not storing these locally on the Mini? I think you'd struggle with anything other than FW800 or gigabit ethernet, although i haven't crunched any numbers.
 
Just read through the thread. I'm no pro with media but what cave man is saying seems logical. So that we know, without doubt, that the audio is causing the problem, could you test it with one of your files?

The question i have, which has been mentioned but i don't think answered, is where are these files stored? Obviously you've got a lot of data here, you mentioned 4TB, is it safe to presume your not storing these locally on the Mini? I think you'd struggle with anything other than FW800 or gigabit ethernet, although i haven't crunched any numbers.

Hd audio will play as 5.1 on the 9400 minis if spdif is used. Dont know what the 2010 minis will achieve. Using plex or xbmc that is. Other players might behave differently. These apps will also play most h264 blurays on the 9400 minis. The reason I say most is because the api doesnt handle interlaced sources nor some odd profiles. The same setup will play all 1080p scene releases. It will however struggle with high bitrate mpg2 or vc1. Apple might change this as the 9400 should also be able to decode these formats if support is added in the api
 
Im simply saying that if you cant explain what you wanna achieve in correct terms, you cant expect guidance that will satisfy you.

Im pretty sure you can find 1080p content encoded in formats that will have lot of boxes struggle. Does that make them unsuitable as htpc's? Maybe for some. If you wanna play pirated 1080 x264 content downloaded off the internet, the mac mini you have will do more than just fine.

Its all about finding a box that caters your needs. But claiming the mini is insufficiant as htpc altogether is just stupid, and so is expressing ones anger over bad advise when you clearly have trouble explaining your needs.

What you're "simply saying", you're saying too simply. You're disregarding (or perhaps missing...) the substance of what I said to you; I will have explained myself very coherently several months ago, because I know a lot about the subject matter, and I understand the dangers of making assumptions. This point I've made already, at least twice. My antagonists in this thread might save themselves some time, effort and embarrassment by reading, with their eyes and minds open, what I've posted already before challenging me.

The one area in which we have agreement is that "it's all about finding a box that caters [for] your needs". Absolutely. Sadly, without owning a Mac Mini already I was largely at the mercy of Mac Mini owners to answer, faithfully and accurately, my questions about the capabilities of the device as an HTPC. And I stand here to tell you, in no uncertain terms, that it's not as good as certain people make-out.

I return to another point that I made, earlier; Blu-ray is five years old, now. You can buy Blu-ray players for $99, and consider that a proportion of that cost covers disc-transport, laser and profit margin; I'd be surprised if the decoder costs more than $25. It's not an unreasonable expectation that something costing $799, that calls itself an HTPC, should have equal HD capabilities. In fact, I'd say it's pretty damned unreasonable, in the other direction. This is not future-technology; it's common-as-muck, and the Mini can't cope with it.


And please don't call my behaviour "stupid". That's a personal attack, which is something I've not resorted to. Perhaps it represents that you're running out of debating ammunition, and thus resorting to verbal abuse.

Not from a Blu-ray rip. The Apple API for h.264 hardware decoding is for mkv, mov or m4v containers, not m2ts or ts containers because they have not been incorporated into Plex (yet). If it were getting passed to the gpu, then the improvement wouldn't be slightly better - it would have been substantially better. It's either passed off to the gpu, or it's not.

It was an .MKV that I was testing. And it was substantially better (as in, watchable, versus completely unwatchable), but it was still a bit skippy. And the playback stopped for a couple of seconds after about ten minutes of continuous playback.

The streams in the .MKV were previously in an .M2TS, as you correctly observed.

Just read through the thread. I'm no pro with media but what cave man is saying seems logical. So that we know, without doubt, that the audio is causing the problem, could you test it with one of your files?

The question i have, which has been mentioned but i don't think answered, is where are these files stored? Obviously you've got a lot of data here, you mentioned 4TB, is it safe to presume your not storing these locally on the Mini? I think you'd struggle with anything other than FW800 or gigabit ethernet, although i haven't crunched any numbers.

Sure. I'll knock-out the HD audio then report back.


It's stored on a USB drive, connected to a USB 2.0 socket. USB 2.0 is perfectly adequate for HD playback; I've been doing it for a couple of years with media streamers. It can truck, I think, a maximum of 25MBps; most Blu-rays don't demand more than 50Mbps, and an "Mb" is one eighth of an "MB".
 
What you're "simply saying", you're saying too simply. You're disregarding (or perhaps missing...) the substance of what I said to you; I will have explained myself very coherently several months ago, because I know a lot about the subject matter, and I understand the dangers of making assumptions. This point I've made already, at least twice. My antagonists in this thread might save themselves some time, effort and embarrassment by reading, with their eyes and minds open, what I've posted already before challenging me.
If that really is the case, which I find hard to believe, whoever you asked must have misinterpreted you, or lack your understanding of the matter : thats where you should direct your anger, not ranting off here.

I return to another point that I made, earlier; Blu-ray is five years old, now. You can buy Blu-ray players for $99, and consider that a proportion of that cost covers disc-transport, laser and profit margin; I'd be surprised if the decoder costs more than $25. It's not an unreasonable expectation that something costing $799, that calls itself an HTPC, should have equal HD capabilities. In fact, I'd say it's pretty damned unreasonable, in the other direction. This is not future-technology; it's common-as-muck, and the Mini can't cope with it.
Get your facts straight. The mac mini has never been advertised as a HTPC. The fact that alot of people successfully use it as one does not change that fact. Once again, If its not for you, choose something else. The alternatives are plenty.


And please don't call my behaviour "stupid". That's a personal attack, which is something I've not resorted to. Perhaps it represents that you're running out of debating ammunition, and thus resorting to verbal abuse.
Im sorry, there was no need for that.
 
What about that do you find hard to believe? I Beta-test media streamers, so I'm very familiar with the vocabulary and the pitfalls of assuming that "one man's 1080p" is another's.

The reason I'm "ranting off here" (come off it... how much "ranting" am I actually doing...?), is because I opened a thread in this part of the forum asking questions, and the people browsing the threads over those few days gave me crap advice. This seems like an ideal means of replying, and providing a check to the either;

a). ignorance, or
b). deliberate bias...

... that I was on the receiving-end of. Personally, I think it was probably a bit of both. And no, I am not going to actively "rant off" at any individuals by name, because that would be unnecessarily personal.


With regard to it not being marketed an as HTPC, it was one of the functions that the Apple Store salesman listed to me before I bought it. True, the machine doesn't "call itself an HTPC", but I'm sure you've used that shorthand yourself; a plastic box can't really "call itself" anything.

And as for advising me to buy something else... I've already bought one! As I said to another poster; advice of this candour and clarity would've been welcome back in February, but it was nowhere to be seen.


And thanks for the apology. Hopefully we can continue this on a more civil basis.



EDIT: Actually, there's something I've written there that doesn't accurately express how I feel.

I don't regret buying the Mini. It's a convenient little computer, and it runs pretty well... but if someone were to come to this forum for advice, then buy a Mini specifically as an HTPC, he/she might be disappointed with it. Me? I'm not that disappointed. Frankly, if the C-200 were more reliable, I'd never have had the need to use the Mini in that way, anyway (but that's a whole other "rant"...!).


Maybe we could all agree that, when we see a poster opening a thread called, "Is the Mac Mini a good HTPC?", we take the trouble to ask the person exactly what they want to use it for, rather than simply saying "yes". Because, if someone who does know what to ask gets bad advice, what chance do the civilians have...?!
 
Sure. I'll knock-out the HD audio then report back.


It's stored on a USB drive, connected to a USB 2.0 socket. USB 2.0 is perfectly adequate for HD playback; I've been doing it for a couple of years with media streamers. It can truck, I think, a maximum of 25MBps; most Blu-rays don't demand more than 50Mbps, and an "Mb" is one eighth of an "MB".

I think you can get a little more than that over USB, so for arguments sake lets call it 30MBps. Obviously to work this out your best writing it down somewhere, i chose to type it in here so at this time i am unaware of the outcome.

Some of your files are 40GB.

How long is a film, 2 hours for arguments sake?

Ok, lets convert to bits per second.

30MBps = 240Mbps (30 * 8)
40GB = 320 000 000 000bits (40 * 1bn * 8)
2 hours = 7200second (2 * 60 * 60)

so 320000000000/7200 = 44 444 444.44rec bps
Shall we call it 44 000 000bps?

or

44Mbps -> 5.5MBps

So it would appear you are correct.

Though i do wonder, if your mini us under heavy load because of the HD audio, are you getting anywhere near the advertised burst speed? Maybe as a test you could play a file which is stored locally?

I don't regret buying the Mini. It's a convenient little computer, and it runs pretty well... but if someone were to come to this forum for advice, then buy a Mini specifically as an HTPC, he/she might be disappointed with it. Me? I'm not that disappointed. Frankly, if the C-200 were more reliable, I'd never have had the need to use the Mini in that way, anyway (but that's a whole other "rant"...!).

Maybe we could all agree that, when we see a poster opening a thread called, "Is the Mac Mini a good HTPC?", we take the trouble to ask the person exactly what they want to use it for, rather than simply saying "yes". Because, if someone who does know what to ask gets bad advice, what chance do the civilians have...?!

I think it is right to point out that your needs are at the far end of the scale, and for a 'normal' 12GB MKV the mini will do just fine. Now i am not saying that you were not presented with misleading advice, i haven't seen the other threads you speak of so i am in no position to judge, just that your needs are not the same as an 'average' HTPC user.
 
Not sure I understand what you mean here, but m2ts gets hw acceleration in XBMC now so while Plex could have some limitation, its not a limitation of the api.

The m2ts container is not "officially" supported by the API as I understand it. It requires a bit of tweaking (which the XBMC folks may have done by now - I use Plex). The 4.1 profile can be done, but the 5.1 cannot. I tried several of my Blu-ray rips (m2ts containers from AnyDVD HD) with the h.264-accelerated Plex a few weeks ago and none of them got to use the 9400m on my MacBook Air (my Mini is a 2 gHz GMA950). I'll give XBMC a try - is there a special build for it?

Hd audio will play as 5.1 on the 9400 minis if spdif is used. Dont know what the 2010 minis will achieve. Using plex or xbmc that is.

The problem is (with Plex, anyway) that the Mini (and MacBook Air) just doesn't have the muscle to extract the AC3 or DTS cores from the HD audio on the fly, while also decoding the video. That's why we're hoping for a workaround for handing off the video (h.264, anyway) to the gpu so the cpu only has to take care of the audio extraction.

Some of your files are 40GB. How long is a film, 2 hours for arguments sake? Ok, lets convert to bits per second.

Those straight Blu-ray rips are going to have several audio tracks in all likelihood. Also a few presentation streams. I'm sure they're not all read during playback.
 
Use VLC or Movist. No problems running a 1080p on my June 09 MBP or my Aug 06 MBP for that matter.

It depends on the bitrate. Transcoded/bitrate reduced MKVs will playback fine. However raw blu-ray rips (i.e. where the MKV for a two hour movie is over 15 GB in size) most definitely won't playback without hardware acceleration.

I have a 2.54 GHz Late 2008 Macbook Pro which can't play any of the H.264 raw blu-ray MKV I've made. VLC crashes very very quickly with a CPU too slow exception.

THis is definitely the video portion that's slowing things down.

OP, if you install Windows, any Windows and use MPC-HC (media player classic Home Cinema you should be able to playback any raw blu-ray rip). Windows XP onwards support full offload decodinng MPEG-2, VC-1 and H.264 (upto High Profile@L5.1 with 16 reference frames. Blu-ray only uses High Profile@L4.1, however a dual core CPU can't play this back. You need at least a Core 2 Quad on Windows without GPU acceleration and even then all four cores will be almost maxed out).

The container doesn't affect the video codec. H.264 is H.264 irrespective of the container it's it. WHat affects whether it can be played back is the bitrate, profile level/number of reference frames. Apple's API assuming that it offers the equivalent of nvidia's Geforce 9400 VDPAU (Video Decode and Presentation API for UNIX like OSes, nvidia's UNIX equivalent of DXVA) should be able to playback any progressive blurry disc.

THe 9400 chips supports full offload/bitstream/Variable Length Decode of two simultaneous H.264 (up to High Profil@L5.1 60 Mbps with 16 ref frames)/VC-1/MPEG-2 streams. If you install Windows XP/Vista/7(I would go with this) and set up media player classic home cinema with a suitable renderer (VMR9 for XP, EVR custom presenter for Vista/7), you should be able to play back any progressive raw blu-ray rip without any problems using GPU decoding. Also set the MPC-HC Video Codec filter to use DXVA (this is usually enabled by default) under internal filters.
 
What about that do you find hard to believe? I Beta-test media streamers, so I'm very familiar with the vocabulary and the pitfalls of assuming that "one man's 1080p" is another's.
Well listen, when confronted with the possibility on bad comunication on your part, youre reply is "No chance, mate. I asked specifically about it's HTPC capabilities, and 1080p .MKVs." So maybe that wasnt your exact phrasing, who knows. Its also apparent in this thread that before posting, you didnt enable hw acceleration in plex. That would have solved alot of your problems and clearly something you should realize before ranting off about being cheated by the mac online comunity etc:
http://www.blu-ray.com/movies/search...&action=search

So for 2009-2011 VC-1 does 109 titles and MPEG4-AVC (h.264) does 291 titles for that timeframe.

http://www.blu-ray.com/movies/search...&action=search

MPEG2 only has 13 titles or so released over the years.

That makes it an interesting 3/4 ratio for MPEG4-AVC and 1/4 ratio for VC-1.

The reason I'm "ranting off here" (come off it... how much "ranting" am I actually doing...?), is because I opened a thread in this part of the forum asking questions, and the people browsing the threads over those few days gave me crap advice. This seems like an ideal means of replying, and providing a check to the either;

a). ignorance, or
b). deliberate bias...

... that I was on the receiving-end of. Personally, I think it was probably a bit of both. And no, I am not going to actively "rant off" at any individuals by name, because that would be unnecessarily personal.
Come on... Youre thread is labeled "Rumour-busting: The Mac Mini as an HTPC". Who seems ignorant or biased to you? No personal attack intended, just using your words here. But youre ranting. there is no denying it.

With regard to it not being marketed an as HTPC, it was one of the functions that the Apple Store salesman listed to me before I bought it. True, the machine doesn't "call itself an HTPC", but I'm sure you've used that shorthand yourself; a plastic box can't really "call itself" anything.
Dude, for someone who claims to know ones way around multimediaboxes, I must say your research when doing this purchase was lacking. Surely we can agree the box doesnt call itself anything but from your previous post, an educated guess would be youre claiming Apple markets the mini as an HTPC. They do not. Regardless of what people working at the Applestore say. And for one whos gonna be watching remuxed blurays, why on earth would you choose something without either a bluray drive or hdmi? I think by your description of your usage, the mini is not for you. If your experience with such rigs is what you say it is, you should have gathered as much. Before buying it.

And as for advising me to buy something else... I've already bought one! As I said to another poster; advice of this candour and clarity would've been welcome back in February, but it was nowhere to be seen.
Well tough luck, but again, your research was lacking.

And thanks for the apology. Hopefully we can continue this on a more civil basis.
By all means. I was out of line.
 
the only blu ray player in my whole house is my ps3 and i love it. i also still get dvd's as i want my anime's on dvd so i can rip them for my ipod touch and eventually ipad i also have a netbook that i carry around with me that i have a usb 320 gig hard drive to store anime on. Plus i have a regular laptop. i have had my mini, 1.83 celron laptop, my 2ghz emachine, and my 3ghz dual core amd computers ripping stuff for my ipod all at the same time. now i am not saying for people to do this but i have gone out and got from certain area's the same anime i already own on dvd that somebody has already ripped as i have had issues so i can reencode to the ipod touch.

ps so when i do have issues with my rips like my full metal panic fumoffu i used handbrake on my mini i ended up and i know i choose the right video section for each dvd i ended up with 4 episode 1's when i tried the first dvd so i re ripped and the same thing so i use my windows xp emachine and ripped and it did fine as i used dvd shrink so then i just used my network sharing and ripped them from that emachine and just pointed my macs handbrake program to the share and reencoded back to the emachine to another shared folder and it came out fine so i use all my windows and my mac in tandam to quote gurren laggan episode 22-24 i belive
 
Well listen, when confronted with the possibility on bad comunication on your part, youre reply is "No chance, mate. I asked specifically about it's HTPC capabilities, and 1080p .MKVs." So maybe that wasnt your exact phrasing, who knows. Its also apparent in this thread that before posting, you didnt enable hw acceleration in plex. That would have solved alot of your problems and clearly something you should realize before ranting off about being cheated by the mac online comunity etc:
http://www.blu-ray.com/movies/search...&action=search

So for 2009-2011 VC-1 does 109 titles and MPEG4-AVC (h.264) does 291 titles for that timeframe.

http://www.blu-ray.com/movies/search...&action=search

MPEG2 only has 13 titles or so released over the years.

That makes it an interesting 3/4 ratio for MPEG4-AVC and 1/4 ratio for VC-1.

Come on... Youre thread is labeled "Rumour-busting: The Mac Mini as an HTPC". Who seems ignorant or biased to you? No personal attack intended, just using your words here. But youre ranting. there is no denying it.

Dude, for someone who claims to know ones way around multimediaboxes, I must say your research when doing this purchase was lacking. Surely we can agree the box doesnt call itself anything but from your previous post, an educated guess would be youre claiming Apple markets the mini as an HTPC. They do not. Regardless of what people working at the Applestore say. And for one whos gonna be watching remuxed blurays, why on earth would you choose something without either a bluray drive or hdmi? I think by your description of your usage, the mini is not for you. If your experience with such rigs is what you say it is, you should have gathered as much. Before buying it.

Well tough luck, but again, your research was lacking.

By all means. I was out of line.


Regarding my rebuttal; it was a brief summary of a long and convoluted exchange. Again, please don't try to extrapolate a compelling defence by taking something, said to another poster, out of context.


Regarding not having implemented the latest Plex binaries; given that hardware decoding was implemented in Plex only four weeks ago, and the advice that I was given came four months ago, I don't think it really has anything to do with it. At the time when the advice was given, hardware decoding wasn't available. Thus, it's irrelevant to the matter at hand; that being, inaccurate advice on the HTPC capabilities of the Mac Mini.


As for my use of "ignorance"; the word "ignorant" is a term of technical usage in the English language. It does not mean, "an arsehole"; it means "not knowing". So, by ignorant, I mean that someone has given me advice without knowing enough about it. These people, I'm satisfied, didn't know that they were telling me something incorrectly.

As for "deliberate bias", please don't let's pretend for a moment that this forum isn't a hive of pro-Apple sentiment. The evidence is all around you. I shall lose respect for your position in this debate completely if you pretend otherwise. And the straight-up questions that I asked about HD capability were replied to in the affirmative, when they weren't true.


Neither of the HD media streamers that I own have Blu-ray drives, so that point doesn't hold any water at all. Plus, we know that Apple want Mac consumers to buy proprietary monitors; and we also know that Apple want media hounds to buy the Apple TV. This is why there's no HDMI socket on the Mac Mini. Apple provide an MBP-to-DVI adapter with the Mini, and I bought a DVI-to-HDMI cable to connect it thence to my TV. In no way does it necessarily follow that, because the Mini doesn't have an HDMI socket, it was a lame-brain decision to consider it for HD video-playback.


Returning to the matter of research; what more would you like me to do? I asked specific, pertinent questions of people already using the Mini as an HTPC on this forum, and others. The guy in the shop volunteered that it was suitable. Nvidia had been talking-up the 9400M as being 1080p-capable... sorry, but next to getting my hands on one beforehand (and I know nobody else who's got one), I fail to see what more I could have done.
 
Regarding my rebuttal; it was a brief summary of a long and convoluted exchange. Again, please don't try to extrapolate a compelling defence by taking something, said to another poster, out of context.
Thats not what Im doing either.


Regarding not having implemented the latest Plex binaries; given that hardware decoding was implemented in Plex only four weeks ago, and the advice that I was given came four months ago, I don't think it really has anything to do with it. At the time when the advice was given, hardware decoding wasn't available. Thus, it's irrelevant to the matter at hand; that being, inaccurate advice on the HTPC capabilities of the Mac Mini.
You sir, posted here may 21st, and by then Plex and XBMC both had it implemented for some time. If youre gonna start a thread complaining about the minis limitations as a HTPC, shouldnt you atleast find out what they are first?


As for my use of "ignorance"; the word "ignorant" is a term of technical usage in the English language. It does not mean, "an arsehole"; it means "not knowing". So, by ignorant, I mean that someone has given me advice without knowing enough about it. These people, I'm satisfied, didn't know that they were telling me something incorrectly.
Sure. As ignorant as yourself not knowing Plex will now play aproximately 75% of your BR dumps without breaking a sweat, before posting a topic on the matter.

As for "deliberate bias", please don't let's pretend for a moment that this forum isn't a hive of pro-Apple sentiment. The evidence is all around you. I shall lose respect for your position in this debate completely if you pretend otherwise. And the straight-up questions that I asked about HD capability were replied to in the affirmative, when they weren't true.
Youre right but there are also people with bias towards other brands posting here.


Neither of the HD media streamers that I own have Blu-ray drives, so that point doesn't hold any water at all.
You are refering to the mini as HTPC, not a media streamer, so yea, it kinda does.

Plus, we know that Apple want Mac consumers to buy proprietary monitors; and we also know that Apple want media hounds to buy the Apple TV. This is why there's no HDMI socket on the Mac Mini. Apple provide an MBP-to-DVI adapter with the Mini, and I bought a DVI-to-HDMI cable to connect it thence to my TV. In no way does it necessarily follow that, because the Mini doesn't have an HDMI socket, it was a lame-brain decision to consider it for HD video-playback.
There has been plenty of reasons discussed to why apple doesnt include HDMI. I do not believe the one you mention necessarily is correct. You would think though, that someone whos determined to remux his collection of BluRays would care enough about the audio aswell as the video, to make sure the interface used to deliver it, doesnt impose limitations.

Returning to the matter of research; what more would you like me to do? I asked specific, pertinent questions of people already using the Mini as an HTPC on this forum, and others. The guy in the shop volunteered that it was suitable. Nvidia had been talking-up the 9400M as being 1080p-capable... sorry, but next to getting my hands on one beforehand (and I know nobody else who's got one), I fail to see what more I could have done.
Please link to the posts youre refering to. And aditionally, please enlighten me on how you determined they were authorities on the matter. I would have asked the questions on the xbmc or plex forums instead. The guy in the shop?! Come on...He was in for the sale and would have told you it cooked. Nvidia had been talking?! Who cares? Are you buying from them or from Apple? There were no api released at that time, so you should have known that the only apps able to utilize it were apples own.


And as for rumor-busting. What rumors did you actually bust? Any 9400 mini will now play approximately 75% of all bluray dumps. Its up to apple to decide wether the last 25% will be supported by the api, but the card supports it so it could happen. And I seriously doubt alot of people choose to keep the files the size you do, so really, its a limited problem. It will play all 1080p scene releases, or anything you re-encode yourself, provided that you know what your doing. The interface does put limits on the audio output but as long as you accept DD or DTS 5.1 youll be fine. So while it didnt work out as an HTPC for you, it will work VERY well for most.

In my eyes, you failed at busting any rumors at all. Youre ranting off about being given bad advise but so far, you havent even linked to an example.

But at the very least, you were informed on howto make plex work with hw acceleration, so hopefully that betters youre experience. If you wanna try out xbmc, you will have to use a nightly build, the official has no support as of yet. I find it performing better though. (everything plays on both but xbmc uses even less cpu)
 
dh2005,

I think I get where you are hung up.

Your definition of HTPC: A PC that plays a library raw blu-ray movies put into a different container

Everyone else's definition of HTPC: A PC that plays a library of movie/tv show movie files (either pirated or transcoded from their own material).

For most people's definition of HTPC the mini is perfect.

For yours it's not.

All I can say is that you are probably overestimating the difference in quality between a raw blu-ray disc and a well done h.264 18gb transcode of that disc.
 
Thats not what Im doing either.


You sir, posted here may 21st, and by then Plex and XBMC both had it implemented for some time. If youre gonna start a thread complaining about the minis limitations as a HTPC, shouldnt you atleast find out what they are first?

Sure. As ignorant as yourself not knowing Plex will now play aproximately 75% of your BR dumps without breaking a sweat, before posting a topic on the matter.

Youre right but there are also people with bias towards other brands posting here.

You are refering to the mini as HTPC, not a media streamer, so yea, it kinda does.

There has been plenty of reasons discussed to why apple doesnt include HDMI. I do not believe the one you mention necessarily is correct. You would think though, that someone whos determined to remux his collection of BluRays would care enough about the audio aswell as the video, to make sure the interface used to deliver it, doesnt impose limitations.

Please link to the posts youre refering to. And aditionally, please enlighten me on how you determined they were authorities on the matter. I would have asked the questions on the xbmc or plex forums instead. The guy in the shop?! Come on...He was in for the sale and would have told you it cooked. Nvidia had been talking?! Who cares? Are you buying from them or from Apple? There were no api released at that time, so you should have known that the only apps able to utilize it were apples own.

And as for rumor-busting. What rumors did you actually bust? Any 9400 mini will now play approximately 75% of all bluray dumps. Its up to apple to decide wether the last 25% will be supported by the api, but the card supports it so it could happen. And I seriously doubt alot of people choose to keep the files the size you do, so really, its a limited problem. It will play all 1080p scene releases, or anything you re-encode yourself, provided that you know what your doing. The interface does put limits on the audio output but as long as you accept DD or DTS 5.1 youll be fine. So while it didnt work out as an HTPC for you, it will work VERY well for most.

In my eyes, you failed at busting any rumors at all. Youre ranting off about being given bad advise but so far, you havent even linked to an example.

But at the very least, you were informed on howto make plex work with hw acceleration, so hopefully that betters youre experience. If you wanna try out xbmc, you will have to use a nightly build, the official has no support as of yet. I find it performing better though. (everything plays on both but xbmc uses even less cpu)

Excuse me, but the matter at hand was that I'd been given bad advice back in January and February. Just because the H.264 capabilities of the Mini have improved now, that changes nothing about the quality of the advice that was given back then. It is fortuitous that the advice has become less bad over time, but it was nonetheless pretty pathetic four months ago. I've said once already that, as developments are introduced, the Mini may become useful to me, so it's not like I haven't conceded that the situation has improved, and might do so again... still, when I was asking what the Mini would do (not in the future, but right now), I was not told the whole story.


As for your comments re 75% of Blu-ray dumps; The Men Who Stare at Goats is one such H.264 rip, and it does not run properly. I've said twice before now that it's skippy, and I've said once that the playback froze briefly after ten minutes. To iterate my above point; it's better than it was, but that doesn't mean it's up to true HTPC standard; if your DVD or Blu-ray player stuttered and jammed, would you consider that a decent viewing experience?


If you're suggesting with your comment about other brands that I have a "Pro-Popcorn Hour" agenda, I don't. I realise that the C-200 is flawed (I, of all people, know that...), and I'm not telling Mac owners around the World to buy one. I am, however, telling them that the Mini is not a great HTPC.


In hindsight; yes, I could have asked on the Plex forums. Though, to be honest, I didn't know that they existed. I also didn't know that "there were no api released" - I'm assuming that's some Apple kinda firmware thing, is it? And this was my first Mac, so my knowledge of the landscape was very limited. Coming from my history, if I hear that a video card can do something, I don't immediately know to think, "I wonder if there's an api...?".


As for "rumour-busting"; I've shot to bits that the Mini can do what I was told it could. Certainly, back when I was advised, it couldn't do anything close to it. You'll also notice from my first post that I was asking for someone to show me where I'd gone wrong, if indeed I had done; I wouldn't call that a rant. It's not like I couldn't accept that I'd potentially done any wrong, myself, from the kick-off. And I've been perfectly polite, so it's not like I've been spewing for the sake of it and spoiling for a fight.

And we have ascertained, have we not, that the Mini has limitations that many members of this board don't know about, or understand? I've had to explain two or three times that it's possible, without entering the realms of science-fiction, to watch Blu-ray rips without using Handbrake; likewise, that it's possible for an .MKV to be bigger than 15GB; that it's possible to retain HD audio in anything you rip etc. etc. Many people around here don't know these things. It's likely that people (no disrespect intended...) with this level of knowledge are the ones telling posters, "yeah, sure, the Mini's a great 1080p HTPC", because (again, not wishing to be rude...) they don't really know what they're talking about.


Personally, I think the need to re-encode should be mentioned to any poster asking questions about Blu-ray. It's an essential, time-consuming step that one cannot assume will be universally acceptable.
 
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