Running with the Apple Training app

[NME42]

Interesting - to be honest I haven't really figured out what to do with the power data - looks nice and all, but not really used it so far

I am not using it either. Was just curious why the data went so berzerk.

Was doing some power based training with Stryd a while ago but in the end for someone living in a mostly flat area, this concept is not worth it. Especially when ones brain is entirely working on a pace metric.

But found it interesting as my bike training is based on power and there it is immensely useful to train by power, know your FTP and stuff.

 

[Jana_CZ]

Surprise, two years after AW had added running power to the metrics, Strava finally started syncing it.

Cadence data is still missing though... maybe in two more years 🙃

 

[xDKP]

Surprise, two years after AW had added running power to the metrics, Strava finally started syncing it.

Cadence data is still missing though... maybe in two more years 🙃

View attachment 2428145

Nice (primarily for the puple show-off maps) - Mine doesn't have it from the mornings run though? Did you do anything in particular?

 

[Jana_CZ]

Nice (primarily for the puple show-off maps) - Mine doesn't have it from the mornings run though? Did you do anything in particular?

Umm no - just synced the run as usually and it has appeared in the run.

Perhaps check whether you have the latest Strava update (which I assume you do, ... just double checking 🙂), and that you've allowed all data to be shared to Strava (somewhere in Health). I recall doing the latter some time ago when someone in the Strava forum mentioned they saw a prompt to allow power data; I didn't get that prompt, so I uninstalled and reinstalled Strava back then, and again granted access to all running data. So maybe it's it..?

 

[NME42]

Found this App on a thread in Reddit.

WatchFit allows to create structured workouts on the iPhone and sync it to the Apple Watch:

https://apps.apple.com/de/app/workout-p ... 6464086175

So in case you don't want to use a full fledged platform like TrainingPeaks or Final Surge, this may be a good thing.
Browsed through the app and it looks good. Subscription price of 10$ a year seems fair and there is also an option to buy a lifetime license. You can try it free for thee days.

 

[NME42]

Did anyone try out turn-by-turn navigation with the Apple Maps app on watchOS 11 yet?

 

[NME42]

I tried navigating with the Apple Maps app today and have to say that it is quite good. Not as good as Footpath, but good enough for me.

The app is running separate from the Training App which is ok. Was running with the Training App in the foreground and approx. 40m before each turn, the Maps App came forward and notified me via Taptic Engine. Very good. As soon as I took the turn, the Training App was back in foreground.

Map material is not as good as Footpath or WorkoutDoors. No idea when Apple will deliver these Topo maps to Europe. But not to overstate the map material was good enough for my run today which was in forest, on small paths and also on roads.

Only downturn is that you can not import an existing route via GPX. Creating the route though in MacOS, iOS or iPadOS is quite easy.

Battery usage was absolutely ok.

Overall: good stuff, nice job. Still leaves room for developers like Footpath but still is a feature that is usable.

 

[rbart]

There are "some" apps to use Apple Maps inside workout app, import GPX, work in offline mode if you want ...
But no turn by turn ....

 

[quarq]

I watched this, this morning:

and the presenter, Nick Harris Fry is claiming the Apple Watch using the native Workout app lags when showing current pace. That is, at the start of a split the Apple Watch reports pacing incorrectly. However, as the split progresses, it slowly corrects itself to show the same split pace as a Garmin. Fry, also claims that YouRace and Workoutdoors does not have this issue. Thus the assumption is that it's software.

I have to be honest, I haver never witnessed this before.. Has anyone else experienced this ?

 

[NME42]

I have to be honest, I haver never witnessed this before.. Has anyone else experienced this ?

No, have not seen this.
But the question is what „Current Pace“ really means. It always is some kind of rolling average.
Maybe Apple clears averages at split markers making it slightly unstable until the rolling average interval is filled again?
I will look at this the next runs.

 

[quarq]

No, have not seen this.
But the question is what „Current Pace“ really means. It always is some kind of rolling average.
Maybe Apple clears averages at split markers making it slightly unstable until the rolling average interval is filled again?
I will look at this the next runs.

Ya, Harris-Fry is claiming his pace did not change and that his Garmin (and 3rd party apps on the Apple Watch) are all reporting the same pace.. But yet on his Apple Watch, using the stock app, his pace first shows slower and then gradually increases to be correct.. And, that at the end of the km, it reports a correct total amount for that split.
The issue is that following this "incorrect pace", you'd over-correct and then run too fast.
I don't own a Garmin. I use an Ultra V1 and I own the first Gen Apple Watch SE.. I fear the GPS hardware on the SE isn't going to make for a credible test.. But if others could test out this complaint, I'd be curious what your findings are.

 

[xDKP]

Surprise, two years after AW had added running power to the metrics, Strava finally started syncing it.

Cadence data is still missing though... maybe in two more years 🙃

View attachment 2428145

This is weird - have the newest app and have just uploaded a run yesterday (Massive PR in Berlin Marathon 🔥🇩🇪💥) and still no power sync

 

[dallison13]

Surprise, two years after AW had added running power to the metrics, Strava finally started syncing it.

Cadence data is still missing though... maybe in two more years 🙃

View attachment 2428145

I don't think this is accurate. I think Strava is estimating your power. There is no toggle in Strava / Apple Health to pull that data.
For example, Healthfit, the app I use, pulls ALL the data from a cycling ride and puts all the data into Strava, including Power, Cadence, etc.

 

[xDKP]

I tried navigating with the Apple Maps app today and have to say that it is quite good. Not as good as Footpath, but good enough for me.

The app is running separate from the Training App which is ok. Was running with the Training App in the foreground and approx. 40m before each turn, the Maps App came forward and notified me via Taptic Engine. Very good. As soon as I took the turn, the Training App was back in foreground.

Map material is not as good as Footpath or WorkoutDoors. No idea when Apple will deliver these Topo maps to Europe. But not to overstate the map material was good enough for my run today which was in forest, on small paths and also on roads.

Only downturn is that you can not import an existing route via GPX. Creating the route though in MacOS, iOS or iPadOS is quite easy.

Battery usage was absolutely ok.

Overall: good stuff, nice job. Still leaves room for developers like Footpath but still is a feature that is usable.

Have not tried it yet but trail season is upon us now that my racing season just ended - and what a glorious ending it was.

Will look forward to see if Apple can deliver some of the functionality

 

[dallison13]

This is weird - have the newest app and have just uploaded a run yesterday (Massive PR in Berlin Marathon 🔥🇩🇪💥) and still no power sync View attachment 2430780

This is a run, and I don't think that Strava pulls power data from Apple Watches natively. I think you would need to use Healthfit or another app to get that data in there.

 

[NME42]

@xDKP congratulations on your fabolous marathon result! Be proud of yourself, you have every reason to do so. Well done!

 

[rbart]

I watched this, this morning:

and the presenter, Nick Harris Fry is claiming the Apple Watch using the native Workout app lags when showing current pace. That is, at the start of a split the Apple Watch reports pacing incorrectly. However, as the split progresses, it slowly corrects itself to show the same split pace as a Garmin. Fry, also claims that YouRace and Workoutdoors does not have this issue. Thus the assumption is that it's software.

I have to be honest, I haver never witnessed this before.. Has anyone else experienced this ?

I imagine Apple does another smoothing over the smoothing.
I can't tell for other, but in YouRace, current speed/pace is based on Apple calibrated speed, which relies mainly on pedometer + apple magic formulae with GPS.
Apple smoothes a lot of things to make maps nicer, charts nicer ...
Apple is always thinking about casual users who want to have easy to understand data and clean views.

 

[PatrickNSF]

This is weird - have the newest app and have just uploaded a run yesterday (Massive PR in Berlin Marathon 🔥🇩🇪💥) and still no power sync

I don’t pay attention to power anymore, but I wanted to congratulate you on a fantastic race! I‘ve run Berlin twice, and that stretch between the Brandenburg Gate and the finish seems to go on forever.

 

[Jana_CZ]

I don't think this is accurate. I think Strava is estimating your power. There is no toggle in Strava / Apple Health to pull that data.
For example, Healthfit, the app I use, pulls ALL the data from a cycling ride and puts all the data into Strava, including Power, Cadence, etc.

Sorry for the late response - this is from that same run, if it was an estimate, the purple graph wouldn't match the one from the Fitness app, would it?

 

[Jana_CZ]

This is weird - have the newest app and have just uploaded a run yesterday (Massive PR in Berlin Marathon 🔥🇩🇪💥) and still no power sync

Ok I'm puzzled. What are we doing differently? I sync activities manually (once I'm done with an exercise, strava notifies me that a new workout is ready for import, so I tap that queued workout to complete the import), could that possibly be the difference? Otherwise - nothing special (that I'd be aware of). 😐

(won't really have a chance for further testing / reverse engineering in the nearest future, I'm down with covid 😣 so no useful power measurements to play with any time soon...)

...and, admired your Berlin PR already at Strava but congrats also here of course 👍😃

 

[xDKP]

Ok I'm puzzled. What are we doing differently? I sync activities manually (once I'm done with an exercise, strava notifies me that a new workout is ready for import, so I tap that queued workout to complete the import), could that possibly be the difference? Otherwise - nothing special (that I'd be aware of). 😐

(won't really have a chance for further testing / reverse engineering in the nearest future, I'm down with covid 😣 so no useful power measurements to play with any time soon...)

...and, admired your Berlin PR already at Strava but congrats also here of course 👍😃

I do the same thing - manually press import - no data sync of power. Weird but okay for now

Thanks again - appreciated.

 

[Jana_CZ]

Ya, Harris-Fry is claiming his pace did not change and that his Garmin (and 3rd party apps on the Apple Watch) are all reporting the same pace.. But yet on his Apple Watch, using the stock app, his pace first shows slower and then gradually increases to be correct.. And, that at the end of the km, it reports a correct total amount for that split.
The issue is that following this "incorrect pace", you'd over-correct and then run too fast.
I don't own a Garmin. I use an Ultra V1 and I own the first Gen Apple Watch SE.. I fear the GPS hardware on the SE isn't going to make for a credible test.. But if others could test out this complaint, I'd be curious what your findings are.

I haven't seen this myself but, to be fair, mainly because I usually go out too fast before "settling in" the right pace. So even if this behavior was there, I wouldn't see it.

But, I had a chance to run with a pro pacer last week (10k on a track), he wasn't using pace to run steadily, but was timing each 100 m to make sure he's not too slow nor too fast. He was using a garmin, so it wasn't specifically because of this discussed issue with AW; rather a general pacing strategy. And, because I knew that I won't be able to keep up the whole 10k (as the target was about a minute less than my current ability), I've set up a narrow pace range & alerts to help me once the human pacer leaves me behind. I must say that as long as I kept running with the paced group, the "current pace" wouldn't fluctuate almost at all, just as expected when passing slower runners and such, and definitely didn't follow the pattern described earlier in this thread. I did have the track detection on though, so it could have helped to calculate the current pace more accurately.

 

[PeytonT123]

Apologies if this has been addressed but I just got a Series 10 and noticed on my runs, after I complete each mile, it shows me the Average Pace....not the pace/time for the mile I just completed. Does anyone know how to change this?

 

[NME42]

Apologies if this has been addressed but I just got a Series 10 and noticed on my runs, after I complete each mile, it shows me the Average Pace....not the pace/time for the mile I just completed. Does anyone know how to change this?

Are you sure about the average pace?
I can check tomorrow but I am quite sure the lap alert shows pace for the last lap.

 

[xDKP]

Are you sure about the average pace?
I can check tomorrow but I am quite sure the lap alert shows pace for the last lap.

Mine definitely shows the just finished kilometer time and not average - 100% sure. It even says so under the workout app and Split alerts where mine is set to 1,00 km (you can select what you want)