Other Should the EU force Apple to adopt a universal charger?

[lkalliance]

Absolutely go to a universal charge connector. Much better for the consumer in the long run

This might be a tenuous point, but I think this may be good for CONSUMERS (that is, specifically people who are purchasing a product): you can take the question of what kind of port completely off the table as far as the purchasing decision goes. This is a short-run benefit.

However it will not be good for USERS: it will prevent the adoption of new, better tech as it comes along. That's the long-run problem.

By these definitions, virtually all consumers become users. They get a short-run benefit but it's a long-run drawback.

I wonder if this even matters to Apple. I don't know anything, this is not a rumor or anything like that...but is Apple working towards removing the port altogether, and going all-in on wireless charging, data transfer, audio and video? If they are, then implementation of the law would have to be pretty quick, perhaps, for it to make a difference.

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

This might be a tenuous point, but I think this may be good for CONSUMERS (that is, specifically people who are purchasing a product): you can take the question of what kind of port completely off the table as far as the purchasing decision goes. This is a short-run benefit.

However it will not be good for USERS: it will prevent the adoption of new, better tech as it comes along. That's the long-run problem.

By these definitions, virtually all consumers become users. They get a short-run benefit but it's a long-run drawback.

I wonder if this even matters to Apple. I don't know anything, this is not a rumor or anything like that...but is Apple working towards removing the port altogether, and going all-in on wireless charging, data transfer, audio and video? If they are, then implementation of the law would have to be pretty quick, perhaps, for it to make a difference.

Surely if better tech comes along and the industry is drawn towards it, all manufacturers will adopt it?

 

[iObama]

The more I read some of the arguments that people have posted in favor of the EU forcing the USB-C standard, the more I'm actually finding myself beginning to agree. I enjoy when people use good analogies and not knee-jerk, hyperbolic analogies. Some very good food for thought.

Same! This thread has been interesting.

 

[lkalliance]

Surely if better tech comes along and the industry is drawn towards it, all manufacturers will adopt it?

Here's where I think we (or, I) need clarification. Is the law specific to USB-C? If it is, then what the manufacturers wish to adopt is moot; it will have to be the government that alters the law. If the law generic ("All devices must use the same...") then there has to be agreement among all the manufacturers. I'm not sure which one will be tougher.

From Apple's standpoint, I think they are concerned about maintaining the ability to use technologies bespoke to their devices. That's something that makes Apple devices work as well as they do: it's Apple's software on Apple's hardware, so they can fine-tune each of those things to work very well together. That's a competitive advantage they will be unwilling to give up easily. That will make agreement among the manufacturers very tough, I think.

EDIT: Not just a competitive advantage, but a fundamental part of Apple's design technique.

 

[CTHarrryH]

Not that I really like the change - it will be OK - just cost money and create waste. My bigger problem is the USB-C end for the charger vs. the USB-A. "Everywhere" I go they have usb-a ends to plug into for either viewing stuff or charging (Gym, Airport, work areas, etc). I guess adding converter cables or ? will be part of the purchase stuff

 

[Drosera]

The more I read some of the arguments that people have posted in favor of the EU forcing the USB-C standard, the more I'm actually finding myself beginning to agree. I enjoy when people use good analogies and not knee-jerk, hyperbolic analogies. Some very good food for thought.

Poll does allow you to change your vote, if so inclined!

 

[Bethanie21]

I think I’m the only one who couldn’t care less about USB-C on iPhones. I like having different chargers for different devices, it means you’re not hammering the same charger.

 

[parseckadet]

Think it makes sense. Also, I keep hearing people say “what if this law had been passed when micro usb was a thing, we’d be stuck with that”. But that’s not right, because the proposal has clauses designed to update the standards to keep pace with new tech. So had this been passed years ago, we would have just had new standards and been in the same usb c world we’re in today, but everyone would have had to comply with those standards the whole time.

Surely if better tech comes along and the industry is drawn towards it, all manufacturers will adopt it?

These two posts perfectly illustrate why the e-waste argument just doesn't hold water for me. So you're telling me that you're ok with generating a bunch of e-waste today by mandating Apple to change to USB-C, thus causing millions of people to toss out all of the Lightning based equipment they currently own. The argument being that once that's done we'll all be in this utopia where everyone will be on the same connector and there will be no further need for a switch from one standard to another, thus avoiding e-waste in the future. YET, in the next breath, you're essentially saying "Oh, well if something better comes along the standard will be updated to allow the new thing." Well then we're right back at the point where we're generating a bunch of e-waste because everyone is switching from one connector to another one.

Also, let me ask this. Of those on the anti e-waste train, how many of you own MagSafe chargers? Are you arguing Apple should be forced to give up that? It's a proprietary charger after all. If you're argument is that Apple should be forced to adopt USB-C in the name of reducing e-waste, then you should also be arguing to kill off MagSafe.

Look, I'm against having a proprietary connector just for the sake of having it and lining the pockets of a corporation on the sale of things to connect the things as much as the next person. There are plenty of reasons to advocate for the adoption of USB-C. But I don't think prevention of e-waste is one of them.

I honestly think the entire discussion is moot because the wireless charging ship has sailed and is leaving the harbor. We'll see a portless iPhone in either 2022 or 2023. I connected my iPhone to my computer for the first time in over a year last week, and that was just to create a backup incase something went wrong during the transfer to my new phone. I don't anticipate connecting to my computer for at least another year now, perhaps longer.

 

[usagora]

The poll is flawed because the questions are biasing people to answer "yes". There's a big difference between saying companies "should" adopt a universal charger and saying companies should be "forced" by the government to use a certain charger. I sure hope a majority here aren't actually ok with such ridiculous government overreach. If so, then yikes!

Yes - companies should adopt a universal charger such as USB-C​

No - companies should be allowed to use whatever charger they like​

 

[internetrando]

The poll is flawed because the questions are biasing people to answer "yes". There's a big difference between saying companies "should" adopt a universal charger and saying companies should be "forced" by the government to use a certain charger. I sure hope a majority here aren't actually ok with such ridiculous government overreach. If so, then yikes!

I cannot agree with your statement enough. This is governmental overreach, and a clear abuse of power.

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

These two posts perfectly illustrate why the e-waste argument just doesn't hold water for me. So you're telling me that you're ok with generating a bunch of e-waste today by mandating Apple to change to USB-C, thus causing millions of people to toss out all of the Lightning based equipment they currently own. The argument being that once that's done we'll all be in this utopia where everyone will be on the same connector and there will be no further need for a switch from one standard to another, thus avoiding e-waste in the future. YET, in the next breath, you're essentially saying "Oh, well if something better comes along the standard will be updated to allow the new thing." Well then we're right back at the point where we're generating a bunch of e-waste because everyone is switching from one connector to another one.

Also, let me ask this. Of those on the anti e-waste train, how many of you own MagSafe chargers? Are you arguing Apple should be forced to give up that? It's a proprietary charger after all. If you're argument is that Apple should be forced to adopt USB-C in the name of reducing e-waste, then you should also be arguing to kill off MagSafe.

Look, I'm against having a proprietary connector just for the sake of having it and lining the pockets of a corporation on the sale of things to connect the things as much as the next person. There are plenty of reasons to advocate for the adoption of USB-C. But I don't think prevention of e-waste is one of them.

I honestly think the entire discussion is moot because the wireless charging ship has sailed and is leaving the harbor. We'll see a portless iPhone in either 2022 or 2023. I connected my iPhone to my computer for the first time in over a year last week, and that was just to create a backup incase something went wrong during the transfer to my new phone. I don't anticipate connecting to my computer for at least another year now, perhaps longer.

From a personal point of view I am more frustrated with the fact if I take my iPhone, iPad and Apple Watch away with me, I have 3 independent chargers, one for each. It would be nice when travelling to have one charger that suits at least the phone and tablet. At home my iPhones for the past 4 years have used a cheap wireless charger. Not invested in MagSafe and likely never will be as it’s simply not needed for my use case. I don’t care if my iPhone fixes to a charger via a magnet of if it fast charges as I have 8 hours for it to charge every 24 anyway. I wouldn’t give a toss if MagSafe died a death tomorrow in all honesty as it doesn’t affect me one iota.

If a better form of charging comes along then yes I’d support the industry adapting to it. We change our mobile phones far too often as it is so it would be hypocritical to suggest I am totally against waste of any sort and have never and will never hold that stance. I personally think wireless charging is the most common form anyway and cables are often used when travelling or when something goes seriously wrong with the phone and needs direct cable access. More people should just get a wireless charger and keep it like many of us do for many years IMO.

 

[pmiles]

Lest we forget... the one's paying for such forced oversight is the consumers... the mega corporations always pass the cost down to you. Always.

So cheer for a universal adapter all you want, but in the end, you will have paid twice as much for it because it was forced upon them.

Government has never done anything that didn't cost the tax payers money.

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

Lest we forget... the one's paying for such forced oversight is the consumers... the mega corporations always pass the cost down to you. Always.

So cheer for a universal adapter all you want, but in the end, you will have paid twice as much for it because it was forced upon them.

Government has never done anything that didn't cost the tax payers money.

That’s true. We are also paying massive mark ups on our mobile phones too for the greater good of private companies like Apple to record multi billion pound profits annually. All the while we enjoy their products while they use legal loopholes to avoid corporation taxes through countries like Luxembourg lol. I won’t scream too much over chargers and ignore the bigger picture though

 

[Feyl]

Absolutely not.

 

[parseckadet]

From a personal point of view I am more frustrated with the fact if I take my iPhone, iPad and Apple Watch away with me, I have 3 independent chargers, one for each. It would be nice when travelling to have one charger that suits at least the phone and tablet.

Regarding this issue specifically, there are plenty of solutions already. The most obvious being the MafSafe Duo to charge the phone and watch. It's connector is USB-C. Combine that with a single wall wart with at least 2 USB-C ports and the iPad's cable and you have your all-in-one solution. Or use the charger that came with the iPad and charge it during the day and the other two at night.

 

[Mr. Jenkins]

I’ve read a little about this recently. Why exactly did this become a policy issue? I don’t quite see this as the most important thing (or even in the top 100 of important things) that politicians should be focused on. Why did this become a thing?

 

[pshufd]

There are probably ten billion lightening cables out there. We have probably twenty of them in our household. Perhaps Apple could ship a cable with a Y-connector so that you could charge with USB-C or Lightening.

I have a Garmin Smartwatch. It uses a completely proprietary charging cable and I'd say that it works well. It's nothing like Lightening or USB-C. The charging port has to withstand years of sweat, chlorine and salt water and I assume that Garmin has tested their cables.

 

[pshufd]

I’ve read a little about this recently. Why exactly did this become a policy issue? I don’t quite see this as the most important thing (or even in the top of 100 of important things) that politicians should be focused on. Why did this become a thing?

I guess it's popular to harass and bash US companies in some other countries.

 

[nebo1ss]

Unfortunately when it comes to doing things that benefit mankind in the long run then Governments have to get involved. We are seeing it with replacing vehicles that use Fossil fuels with Electric ones. With light bulbs and many other areas. Getting rid of coal fired power station as an example was a move in the right direction. Or wait the US still think these are a good idea.

 

[pshufd]

Unfortunately when it comes to doing things that benefit mankind in the long run then Governments have to get involved. We are seeing it with replacing vehicles that use Fossil fuels with Electric ones. With light bulbs and many other areas. Getting rid of coal fired power station as an example was a move in the right direction. Or wait the US still think these are a good idea.

I see energy shortages around the world in the news today.

Especially electricity shortages in China where they make a lot of the world's electronic devices. It doesn't work if there's no planning.

I imagine China will go back to coal.

 

[nebo1ss]

There are probably ten billion lightening cables out there. We have probably twenty of them in our household. Perhaps Apple could ship a cable with a Y-connector so that you could charge with USB-C or Lightening.

I have a Garmin Smartwatch. It uses a completely proprietary charging cable and I'd say that it works well. It's nothing like Lightening or USB-C. The charging port has to withstand years of sweat, chlorine and salt water and I assume that Garmin has tested their cables.

What possible reason could Apple have to go USB C on the IPAD and MacBook but not on the phone.

 

[Quu]

Something to keep in mind is the EU, US and other countries around the world all have rules and regulations around other things. Take spectrum for example.

2.4GHz, 5GHz, 60GHz - All regulated for consumer use and spectrum outside of that is bided out to specific companies and governmental bodies for specific uses like Satelite use, telephone use, GPS etc

Has it stifled innovation? Perhaps it has a little bit but it has also created an even playing field and made sure spectrum is utilised to its full potential without rogue entites barging their way into a spectrum and affecting other peoples usage.

WiFi is a great example of what happens when you give a regulated space to consumer use and the industry collectively agrees on a set of interoperable protocols so they can all use the spectrum effectively.

I feel the same will happen with USB-C. Eventually if a new connector becomes available that is incompatible the manufacturers will create a consortium to agree together on its use then apply to the EU and other countries to have it become a new universal connector and the old connector (USB-C in this case) will become depreciated from a specific date set in the future.

I mean it doesn't have to be difficult. Apples argument that it will limit innovation is really not true. They themselves have used the same lightning connector since 2012. This connector is still USB2 on the iPhone 13 Pro. It has not seen a single lick of innovation since they launched it beyond faster charging speeds but that's literally just pumping more juice.

Real innovation would have been adding USB 3.0 to it on the phones like all the other phones have. Did you know you can plug your phone (android) into a PC and use it like an external hard drive at 100MB/s+ speeds? - This is interesting innovation, doing something unique and pushing the standard forward.

Apple is only interested in keeping their MFI program going that licenses Lightning connectors and cables. They make hundreds of millions off this certification program and they would lose it all if they started to use USB-C on the iPhone. That's the real reason they are against a unified connector.

And honestly I'm surprised that 45% of respondents to the poll here think having a universal connector that literally is better than Lightning and has been for years hope it doesn't happen and that companies aren't told to use a universal standard. It's mind boggling really.

 

[pshufd]

What possible reason could Apple have to go USB C on the IPAD and MacBook but not on the phone.

No clue.

But people need phones more than they need tablets. I got the iPhone 13 mini but didn't upgrade to the iPad mini 6. They did put USB-C in the iPad mini 6 but I guess I can wait another generation before I'm forced to buy a bunch of USB-C cables.

 

[pshufd]

And honestly I'm surprised that 45% of respondents to the poll here think having a universal connector that literally is better than Lightning and has been for years hope it doesn't happen and that companies aren't told to use a universal standard. It's mind boggling really.

Do you want to buy back all of my legacy cables? I'll sell you my 30-pin connectors too.

 

[Quu]

Do you want to buy back all of my legacy cables? I'll sell you my 30-pin connectors too.

Honestly if you're buying a new Apple device you can probably afford a few cables, they're not cheap devices. This is like eating a family sized pizza and thinking you'll drink a diet coke to watch your weight.