Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
Status
The first post of this thread is a WikiPost and can be edited by anyone with the appropiate permissions. Your edits will be public.

TheSynchronizer

macrumors 6502
Dec 2, 2014
443
729
ok SO I tried something new, and so far it seems to have positive results. I added my entire drive as an exclusion to time machine, and in 18 hours kernel_task has only written 44GB total. Thats a dramatic decrease it would have been in the several hundreds by now. Curious for other folks to try it and see what happens.
11 hours later after tweaking this and limiting spotlight search, and using my mac most of today as normal, I am on 44.9 GB written to SSD as i'm typing this before going to sleep.

It might be too early to say, but its potential that this tweak, as well as limiting spotlight search and indexing, and using Microsoft Edge with Sleeping Tabs and The Great Suspender, may have fixed the excessive SSD writes on my M1 Mac.

As of now I'm pleased and going to sleep happy. I wonder if, as I use the system throughout the week, if SSD writes patterns will change (other than doing more intensive tasks, which I dont expect to do).

Regardless, thank you for the tip!
 

Fomalhaut

macrumors 68000
Oct 6, 2020
1,993
1,724
ok I tried something new, and so far it seems to have positive results. I added my entire drive as an exclusion to time machine, and in 18 hours kernel_task has only written 44GB total. Thats a dramatic decrease it would have been in the several hundreds by now. Curious for other folks to try it and see what happens.
Does this also prevent the local snapshots from being written? I have disabled automatic TimeMachine backups in the hope that this will reduce the amount of disk writes during the day. I'm happy to run TM manually once a day or so because all my data is located inside a DropBox folder that is synced automatically (and replicated to OneDrive by another cloud service)
 
Last edited:

wirtandi

macrumors regular
Feb 3, 2021
179
179
I just bought a brand new 16GB M1 a few days ago, checked when I first start it up, written about 400GB already, and I watch it go up like 10GB a min, while I was doing nothing. Mind you that I was consciously not opening up too many apps at once for a few days, I used it like it was System 7, I hit cmd-q all the time.

But then after updated to 11.2.3, everything just gone back to normal, now it just stays at 900GB written pretty much all day long for me.
Great to hear that 11.2.3 helped someone. Anyone else had it fixed after 11.2.3?
 

Makersmike

macrumors newbie
Apr 13, 2010
5
3
I'll add another anecdote into the Safari vs. Edge debate - simply switching my typical browser usage (8-10 tabs, a couple of them YouTube, the rest standard stuff like ESPN) and changing nothing else dropped my swap usage on Activity Monitor from >6Gb to <2Gb.

I don't know what that means or have any method of testing browsing or general computer speed (due to the drop in swap usage), but wanted to share this data point with the community.
 

Fomalhaut

macrumors 68000
Oct 6, 2020
1,993
1,724
I'll add another anecdote into the Safari vs. Edge debate - simply switching my typical browser usage (8-10 tabs, a couple of them YouTube, the rest standard stuff like ESPN) and changing nothing else dropped my swap usage on Activity Monitor from >6Gb to <2Gb.

I don't know what that means or have any method of testing browsing or general computer speed (due to the drop in swap usage), but wanted to share this data point with the community.
Was that switching from Safari to Edge or vice-versa?
 

daverdfw

macrumors member
Aug 23, 2009
74
53
Just an end of day update, I am currently at 314GB written uptime is 1day 8hr. So for me at least, it seems adding my HD to the exclusion list for Time Machine has "fixed" this for me. I also turned Spotlight back on, which accounted for some of the increase, but nothing as dramatic as before.
 

max2331

macrumors newbie
Mar 11, 2021
1
0
ok I tried something new, and so far it seems to have positive results. I added my entire drive as an exclusion to time machine, and in 18 hours kernel_task has only written 44GB total. Thats a dramatic decrease it would have been in the several hundreds by now. Curious for other folks to try it and see what happens.
Sorry for asking, but as I am new to this.....

With excluding your whole drive, you mean your complete Storage drive with the OS on it? If you exclude this, what is left to save in TimeMachine?
 

Quackers

macrumors 68000
Sep 18, 2013
1,938
708
Manchester, UK
Sorry for asking, but as I am new to this.....

With excluding your whole drive, you mean your complete Storage drive with the OS on it? If you exclude this, what is left to save in TimeMachine?
Probably not much but this is likely an experiment to try and find out what's causing massive disk writes for some people.
 

Fomalhaut

macrumors 68000
Oct 6, 2020
1,993
1,724
Just coming up to the end of 2 working days after re-boot, and 515GB written on my 16GB M1 Mini during this time. My swap usage is about 7.5GB and has varied between about 4-8GB during the day.

I disable TimeMachine automatic backups about 10 hours ago, so it will be interesting to see if this helps.
 

Answer_i3

macrumors newbie
Dec 18, 2018
18
4
Sevastopol
Numbers for two weeks:
Data Units Read: 935,171 [478 GB]
Data Units Written: 1,206,676 [617 GB]

So, I don't know why, but there are no insane usage...
 
Last edited:

BacioiuC

macrumors member
May 7, 2020
87
122
Romania
Numbers for two weeks:
Data Units Read: 935,171 [478 GB]
Data Units Written: 1,206,676 [617 GB]

So, I don't kwon why, but there are no insane usage...
That's normal usage indeed. I checked all the macs I have in the house (signature macs + my gf mbpro and work mac mini) and they average around 1TB / month.

We're both "heavy" users, she does a lot of video and image editing for work, I do a lot of 3D and development. So two weeks at around 500GB is spot on.


I still haven't had a problem with SSD writes since I turned off sleep and only charge the M1 Pro when it's off. Sitting at:
Data Units Read: 1,489,900 [762 GB]
Data Units Written: 1,053,381 [539 GB]

after a little bit more than two weeks since I got it.


I've seen the Max Tech video and they mention discord and rosetta 2 causing a lot of writes. Well, Discord is opened up for me constantly while the M1 Pro is powered on. I also use Rosetta with Unity3D, Visual Studio (not VSCode), Basilisk II (System 7 emulation) and my writes are consistent and expected.
 

badsimian

macrumors 6502
Aug 23, 2015
374
200
Since turning off time machine I have gone from 80-100GB TBW written per morning to 3GB...for me anyway Time machine certainly seems to be the culprit. For reference I was using a 2TB time capsule unit. My working pattern has been identical for each morning and this is the only thing I changed.
 

VitoBotta

macrumors 6502a
Dec 2, 2020
888
347
Espoo, Finland
So... after I reinstalled the OS etc, I excluded the OS drive from TimeMachine and left the automatic backups turned on so that it can back up my data on the external drive.

Surprise surprise, I left the computer on, not sleeping, with Amphetamine active because some stuff had to finish like Backblaze inheriting the backup state and Nextcloud syncing. After 11 hours and 13 minutes only 107 GB have been written to the main disk total! That's less than 10 GB per hour which is awesome.

Just one day ago I had 1.5 TB in one day, so this is promising! I did two things at the same time though - reinstalling and excluding the main drive from TM - so not sure which one is helping, but I suspect the TM thing because some of you are seeing improvements that way too.

Sorry for being unclear - the swap usage drop was going from Safari to Edge M1.

I thought Safari would be lighter on resources
 
  • Like
Reactions: Quackers

motoitalia

macrumors member
Mar 7, 2021
37
31
“Apple claims that Safari on ‌‌macOS Big Sur‌‌ is "50% faster on average at loading frequently visited websites than Chrome."

As a non-technical person it just smells like Safari is out there nearly constantly writing your frequently visited websites in the background to gain this speed advantage. For Apple to be so quiet about this issue there must be something like this they don’t want to have to give up being able to boast a claim about.

I’m sure this has or can be debunked but sometimes you have to look at the non-technical and non-measurable areas for answers. Sherlock Holmes said “Once you eliminate the impossible, whatever remains, no matter how improbable, must be the truth.”
 
  • Like
Reactions: Burebista

TheSynchronizer

macrumors 6502
Dec 2, 2014
443
729
As a non-technical person it just smells like Safari is out there nearly constantly writing your frequently visited websites in the background to gain this speed advantage.
In my situation on my M1 Macbook Pro, this is exactly what it was doing. And I observed this all the way back in December after noticing the unusually high SSD writes in Activity Monitor.

I tested Chrome, Edge, Safari, and Safari Technology Preview, with specific browsing use cases to make my comparisons as fair as possible. The memory usage from lowest to highest was clear: Edge, followed by Chrome, followed by both Safaris.

This was observed using Activity Monitor over atleast a couple of days for each because I figured if I was going to switch browser, it would be to the ‘correct’ one so I wouldn’t have to be concerned with it later on.

Safari is simply too greedy with the way it writes parts of any and every website after closure into its ‘Safari Web Content (Cached)’, which was truly causing my M1 to swap like crazy, and SSD writes were up to even 1TB+ after just two days. Yes, the way it caches so aggressively does mean that on slower connections it will appear faster because of said caching, but this seems to be done at the expense of all this caching and consequently SSD lifespan.

Not only this, but ofcourse neither Safari has any ‘Sleeping Tabs’ or tab suspender feature, and there is only one tab suspender on Safari available which in my experience did not improve my SSD writes as the excessive caching was still occurring.

Edge/Chrome on the other hand, both have built in ‘Sleeping Tabs‘ which can be set to save resources after a tab is unused for an x period of time. Effectively it’s like sleeping a background application that is idle - tabs with text input or with media playback are ignored. Additionally, they have much wider selections of extensions available and countless tab suspension extensions. In my case I decided to go with The Great Tab Suspender 7.1.6, and I turned on all the memory saving features in there, and I went 11 hours yesterday with 40 tabs ‘open’ by the end of the day, with only 700MB of swap and 45GB of SSD writes. Additionally I’ve done the Time Machine tweak mentioned here, and I went into spotlight settings and limited indexing of file types I never search for (I only use it as an app launcher), as well as various system folders that I would never need to search anyway.

In my personal situation, it seems my excessive SSD writes are resolved. I’ve gotten to love Edge after switching to LastPass and some other cool extensions like Dark Reader which has changed evening/night browsing for me forever, and the suspending of background tabs is awesome and barely noticeable really as websites load back fast anyway.

That being said I’d still love Apple to address this safari caching/kernel_task/swapping issue, which is likely plaguing countless M1/BigSur users without them even realising, which could lead to premature mac deaths down the line and ultimately loss of reputation (why did you have to solder the SSDs apple :D).
 

pshufd

macrumors G4
Oct 24, 2013
10,149
14,574
New Hampshire
One major reason I don't use Safari is that I use Windows and macOS and sometimes Linux and I want the same supported version on at least Windows and macOS. I had a VM leak issue with all Chromium browsers a year ago; except for Edge. So I used Edge until it was later fixed for the other Chromium browsers.

I'm the first to give Microsoft crap for Internet Explorer but that was a long time ago. I still prefer Firefox to everything else but sometimes a browser doesn't work on a page. I would much prefer that we have more than two browser engines (Chromium and Firefox) but that's the way the world has gone.
 

Argon_

macrumors 6502
Nov 18, 2020
425
256
One major reason I don't use Safari is that I use Windows and macOS and sometimes Linux and I want the same supported version on at least Windows and macOS. I had a VM leak issue with all Chromium browsers a year ago; except for Edge. So I used Edge until it was later fixed for the other Chromium browsers.

I'm the first to give Microsoft crap for Internet Explorer but that was a long time ago. I still prefer Firefox to everything else but sometimes a browser doesn't work on a page. I would much prefer that we have more than two browser engines (Chromium and Firefox) but that's the way the world has gone.
I use Brave for chromium support. I also prefer it for mobile devices, due to the built in adblocker.
 

Argon_

macrumors 6502
Nov 18, 2020
425
256
Brave is my second. Edge third. On mobile, I have Brave as the default. I love that iOS and iPadOS allow something other than Safari now.
I ditched Chrome after the whole keystone debacle. Absolutely appalling that Google made adware that required terminal commands to remove, even after uninstalling the app.
 

Fishrrman

macrumors Penryn
Feb 20, 2009
29,243
13,317
Folks, I mentioned this during an earlier post...

Has anyone (who is experiencing abnormally-high disk writing) tried TURNING OFF VIRTUAL MEMORY DISK SWAPPING?

This is not hard to do (at least not hard on an Intel-based Mac, I don't own an m-series Mac).

I suggest someone try it, run that way for a day or two or three, and then observe disk activity.

"Going back" to the status quo is easy, if no improvement is noted.

Screen Shot 2021-03-12 at 10.42.06 AM.jpg
 

VitoBotta

macrumors 6502a
Dec 2, 2020
888
347
Espoo, Finland
Folks, I mentioned this during an earlier post...

Has anyone (who is experiencing abnormally-high disk writing) tried TURNING OFF VIRTUAL MEMORY DISK SWAPPING?

This is not hard to do (at least not hard on an Intel-based Mac, I don't own an m-series Mac).

I suggest someone try it, run that way for a day or two or three, and then observe disk activity.

"Going back" to the status quo is easy, if no improvement is noted.

That's risky IMO.
 
  • Like
Reactions: gank41

TheSynchronizer

macrumors 6502
Dec 2, 2014
443
729
Folks, I mentioned this during an earlier post...

Has anyone (who is experiencing abnormally-high disk writing) tried TURNING OFF VIRTUAL MEMORY DISK SWAPPING?

This is not hard to do (at least not hard on an Intel-based Mac, I don't own an m-series Mac).

I suggest someone try it, run that way for a day or two or three, and then observe disk activity.

"Going back" to the status quo is easy, if no improvement is noted.

View attachment 1742764
swapping in itself isn’t the issue. it’s excessive unnecessary swapping that leads to problematic amounts of data written to the ssd.

swapping has been around for many years now, and it’s a vital part of a well functioning system and macos has almost always used it, and used it well. turning off swapping completely will lead to system hangs and other issues so it’s a flawed solution.

excessive ssd writes on macos have not been common in the past, despite swap always being an enabled feature. therefore there are new bugs that have appeared that need to be fixed, to prevent unnecessary swapping as is being observed.

however, temporarily i guess people could try turning off swapping while waiting for apples fix.
 
Register on MacRumors! This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.