Terrible response times on the new MacBook pro 2021,can u feel it in daily usage ?

[Sanpete]

Afaik there had never been 90-100ms réponse times.worse there has been was 55-60 lol
Thanks for the links man

60Hz = a frame each 17ms.

Edit: Oh, I see what you're referring to. I don't think that 16" 92ms measurement from NotebookCheck is accurate (and they've marked their measurements with question marks). The similar 14" screen was measured by them at 40ms for the same thing, which is more in line with the other measurements.

 

[Love-hate 🍏 relationship]

It's a little noticeable but it isn't even remotely as bad as my 2019 16", so if you're ok with that screen you'll love this one. I can honestly barely stand to use my 2019 anymore, and it always bothered me, this is a huge improvement at least. My 2014 15" is noticeably better than both of them response wise though (but certainly not image quality wise!)

I played a few hours of Metro Exodus, Dusk, Inside, and Cuphead and I would say while it's not gaming monitor levels of response time it's fine for games, it's similar to my 4K Dell IPS non-gaming monitor. There is certainly room for improvement in future models though.

I have attached a video of my own terminal recorded using an iPhone 13 pro at at 240FPS slow mo, this is from a 16" M1 Pro with ProMotion active.

View attachment 1912579

View attachment 1912580

Thanks.id say the first looks worse am i right ? That's the 2019's i believe
It surely isn't fitted for gaming ,and macs never were anyway .my question was just whether this can be annoying for regular usage ,when scrolling ,moving etc.
And also whether it does ruin the 120hz smoothness experience by adding ghosting,trailing ,blur etc.

 

[figbash]

Thanks.id say the first looks worse am i right ? That's the 2019's i believe
It surely isn't fitted for gaming ,and macs never were anyway .my question was just whether this can be annoying for regular usage ,when scrolling ,moving etc.
And also whether it does ruin the 120hz smoothness experience by adding ghosting,trailing ,blur etc.

Well I'm just saying I don't personally think it's too annoying, but it's noticeable if you look for it. I got used to it quite fast myself but YMMV, I do kind of think people are exaggerating as is usual for new expensive devices, as I can't stand smeary screens and I think this one is acceptable.

I didn't cut the non slow motion part out of the start of my video, and that's obviously more indicative of actual usage than the slow motion.

The 120 feels great and it's super apparent when it's not working (safari is still broken ). The response definitely doesn't ruin it for me... It's certainly the best MacBook screen thus far, I would never go back to a previous model.

 

[Love-hate 🍏 relationship]

Well I'm just saying I don't personally think it's too annoying, but it's noticeable if you look for it. I got used to it quite fast myself but YMMV, I do kind of think people are exaggerating as is usual for new expensive devices, as I can't stand smeary screens and I think this one is acceptable.

I didn't cut the non slow motion part out of the start of my video, and that's obviously more indicative of actual usage than the slow motion.

The 120 feels great and it's super apparent when it's not working (safari is still broken ). The response definitely doesn't ruin it for me... It's certainly the best MacBook screen thus far, I would never go back to a previous model.

If u usually can't stand smeary displays but are fine with this one,then I'm relieved.

Ye safari and any browser work at 60hz...

Ofc it's good and better,the question is,how much better is it ) enjoy your new mbp bud

 

[fa8362]

I'm not counting myself in knowledgeable people,but those who know about displays and how they work surely get more bothered by such defects and problems.

Who is bothered by the display on a TOOL?? It's as good as or better than necessary.

 

[cababah]

Who is bothered by the display on a TOOL?? It's as good as or better than necessary.

On a premium product such as this with a "Pro" moniker...people rightfully have high expectations.

 

[Love-hate 🍏 relationship]

Who is bothered by the display on a TOOL?? It's as good as or better than necessary.

I hear the argument and I accept it

However I think you should accept others people view,which is that one may want to enjoy what apple calls "the best display on any laptop"

Also whether u want it or not,many bought it for its screen(over the M1 for example),because of its crazy HDR capabilities

 

[Sanpete]

Afaik there had never been 90-100ms réponse times.worse there has been was 55-60 lol
Thanks for the links man

Edited my response to this above. Think I missed your point the first time.

 

[joelypolly]

I think it might be an issue with the 16" only. On the 14 inch my testing shows only about 1 frame of blur on a black background and 2 frames on the green background on 120hz.

 

[Love-hate 🍏 relationship]

I think it might be an issue with the 16" only. On the 14 inch my testing shows only about 1 frame of blur on a black background and 2 frames on the green background on 120hz.

This,this is definitely interesting
Have u tested both the 14 and 16 or?

 

[Love-hate 🍏 relationship]

60Hz = a frame each 17ms.

Edit: Oh, I see what you're referring to. I don't think that 16" 92ms measurement from NotebookCheck is accurate (and they've marked their measurements with question marks). The similar 14" screen was measured by them at 40ms for the same thing, which is more in line with the other measurements.

I hadn't answered because I wasn't confident enough as to what u meant hahaha

Have you checked the video linked in the link I linked (I'm very heavy )

Not the short video that's in there,but the thorough review that's been linked by andrei.f

There,it shows about the same results -nay worse-,at about 100ms response times ..hence I don't think notebookcheck was wrong.

 

[metapunk2077fail]

It's a little noticeable but it isn't even remotely as bad as my 2019 16", so if you're ok with that screen you'll love this one. I can honestly barely stand to use my 2019 anymore, and it always bothered me, this is a huge improvement at least. My 2014 15" is noticeably better than both of them response wise though (but certainly not image quality wise!)

I played a few hours of Metro Exodus, Dusk, Inside, and Cuphead and I would say while it's not gaming monitor levels of response time it's fine for games, it's similar to my 4K Dell IPS non-gaming monitor. There is certainly room for improvement in future models though.

I have attached a video of my own terminal recorded using an iPhone 13 pro at at 240FPS slow mo, this is from a 16" M1 Pro with ProMotion active.

View attachment 1912579

Just scroll up and down at the normal speed that you would do in real use and not slow motion. There's no point moving things around in a circle. There's no use case for that. If I shake my hand in front of my face it has blur and ghosting, but shaking my hand in front of my face is pointless because it has no purpose.

 

[Sanpete]

Have you checked the video linked in the link I linked (I'm very heavy )

Not the short video that's in there,but the thorough review that's been linked by andrei.f

There,it shows about the same results -nay worse-,at about 100ms response times ..hence I don't think notebookcheck was wrong.

He talks about it that, but then uses a figure of 20-40ms when comparing to others. In his UFO comparison, it doesn't look much worse than the 17ms model. (The 2ms one is bizarre, with a trail of ghosts, but sharper ones.) Hard to see why the 16" would be over twice as slow as the 14" for the same thing, in any case, so something odd is going on.

 

[figbash]

Just scroll up and down at the normal speed that you would do in real use and not slow motion. There's no point moving things around in a circle. There's no use case for that. If I shake my hand in front of my face it has blur and ghosting, but shaking my hand in front of my face is pointless because it has no purpose.

I was just showing my machine compared to the above twitter video where he's doing the same thing. I can make a regular scrolling video if you are asking for one?

 

[querulous]

i think if you have any doubt you should check out the laptop at a store. i found it unacceptably bad and returned my laptop

try reading text while scrolling or watching sports highlights on youtube. it makes it REALLY apparent. if you don't feel the display is bad after that then you'll probably be okay with it

 

[ipodlover77]

Ah this explains why I felt as though the screens on the iPhone 13 Pro and the MacBook were so different even though they were both 120hz. I tried the UFO test many times and for some reason the 60hz and 120hz look almost the same to me on the laptop.
I'm not bothered but this explains why I didn't feel the "super smoothness" of the display even though its double the refresh rate of the old laptops.
That being said, I still absolutely love this laptop.

edit:
except the battery life. the 14 base compared to the macbook pro m1 seems terrible and a downgrade.

 

[bill-p]

I tried the UFO test many times and for some reason the 60hz and 120hz look almost the same to me on the laptop.

It should look exactly the same. 120Hz is not a guarantee under MacOS Monterey right now. Many apps still go to 60Hz or lower. Safari in particular doesn't support 120Hz. If you tried the UFO test on that, 60Hz and 120Hz should be exactly the same.

 

[ipodlover77]

It should look exactly the same. 120Hz is not a guarantee under MacOS Monterey right now. Many apps still go to 60Hz or lower. Safari in particular doesn't support 120Hz. If you tried the UFO test on that, 60Hz and 120Hz should be exactly the same.

Oh thats a bummer. Is there any 120hz test at all that can be done to verify the refresh rate or is everyone SOL for the time being?

 

[SpotOnT]

If you are used to the response time on an Apple display, this screen is pretty much the same. At least I don't notice any difference between the new MBP and previous generations. Should the response time have been improved, considering the 120 hz refresh rate, ya probably. But no, I don't think it looks any worse.

Everything I have read lists the response time for the new MPB in the 40-60 ms range, which is on par with previous generations. Not sure what is up with that one 90 ms value for the 16"....something there sounds off to me.

Edit: I tend to get very dizzy with blurry screens. For example I have had to return the new iPad Mini due to the jelly scroll. I have had no problems with the 16" MBP under everyday use (scrolling through text, moving windows around, rotating model objects etc).

 

[bill-p]

Oh thats a bummer. Is there any 120hz test at all that can be done to verify the refresh rate or is everyone SOL for the time being?

Nope. It's oversight from the MacOS team since I bet they haven't gotten used to dealing with variable refresh rates in MacOS yet.

Also... doesn't that bring into question any test that's done to determine "response time"? Even when we know Apple does extra backlight and gamma processing for Extended Dynamic Range and this cannot be turned off? I don't believe there's zero overhead for EDR.

If response time is this big of an issue as all these people are making it out to be, then 30Hz and 60Hz and 120Hz should feel exactly the same on these new MacBooks because the response time of the new display is slower than all of those refresh rates.

But... honestly, it doesn't, does it? Setting the display to 30Hz, 60Hz and ProMotion (hopefully 120Hz) actually makes a massive difference. I know it does to me. Not sure about anyone else.

 

[metapunk2077fail]

The 16" Intel really did have bad smearing but not the 16" M1. This is as good as it gets at this budget with Micro LED for now and overall it's superb.

Use some historical context and understand what the limits are right now in 2021.

 

[Love-hate 🍏 relationship]

Nope. It's oversight from the MacOS team since I bet they haven't gotten used to dealing with variable refresh rates in MacOS yet.

Also... doesn't that bring into question any test that's done to determine "response time"? Even when we know Apple does extra backlight and gamma processing for Extended Dynamic Range and this cannot be turned off? I don't believe there's zero overhead for EDR.

View attachment 1912928

If response time is this big of an issue as all these people are making it out to be, then 30Hz and 60Hz and 120Hz should feel exactly the same on these new MacBooks because the response time of the new display is slower than all of those refresh rates.

But... honestly, it doesn't, does it? Setting the display to 30Hz, 60Hz and ProMotion (hopefully 120Hz) actually makes a massive difference. I know it does to me. Not sure about anyone else.

Nah.if the refresh rate is bad ,it doesn't mean you won't feel the 120hz.
On previous mbp16 2019,u also had bad responses times,albeit not as bad,yet setting the display to a lower RR in monitor setting,you could feel the lack of smoothness

I have no doubt 120hz is smoother than previous macs, especially if you compate it to previous gen's macs.
Compared to windows laptops at 120hz it may indeed be less smooth , especially in gaming (but who plays on Mac anyway )

BUT, there is other things that just "pure smoothness" in a display.typically you should divide the RR by the response times (or the other way around,just woke up And very tired lol)

What I mean is that if you double the refresg rate,you should make the response times faster by double (technically,I think)

Because otherwise,while it'll still be smooth,you'll end up getting blur and ghosting even .smooth but perhaps too "smoothen" if you see what I mean

 

[Love-hate 🍏 relationship]

The 16" Intel really did have bad smearing but not the 16" M1. This is as good as it gets at this budget with Micro LED for now and overall it's superb.

Use some historical context and understand what the limits are right now in 2021.

Limits in 2021 for ips ? I know them
Limits for mini-led,not sure,tho I think monitors (LG 32" gaming monitor,Samsung G9) and TVs have much faster response times
And anyway,no one here is asking for gaming-like responses.only not 60 to 100mns which is ridiculous

Samsung G9(which isn't considered as having the fastest RR btw)

 

[Newfiejudd]

Anyone who has used a fast response high refresh rate display will see the difference. The faster the response the more "fluid" or smooth high speed movement looks. When I compare this display to my fast response screen the difference is very noticeable. Play a high FPS game and it's a blur fest on the M1, vs the faster response time display. Otherwise I don't noticed it, but playing a fast paced FPS game it's painfully evident.

 

[Love-hate 🍏 relationship]

Anyone who has used a fast response high refresh rate display will see the difference. The faster the response the more "fluid" or smooth high speed movement looks. When I compare this display to my fast response screen the difference is very noticeable. Play a high FPS game and it's a blur fest on the M1, vs the faster response time display. Otherwise I don't noticed it, but playing a fast paced FPS game it's painfully evident.

As long as you don't notice it in regular usage ,even when fast scrolling pages,documents,web pages ,then I'd say it's ok
Macs were never made for gaming ,and probably never will be