I remember that happening to United one season. They were cruising towards the title then they lost Roy Keane due to injury and they struggled, eventually missing out on the title.
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The 2023-2024 Football Thread
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Naaah. Spin it how you like; Arsenal played 2 league games following Saliba's injury, won both 4-1. Fact is their bottle went after the Anfield game; they then drew to both West Ham and Soton after being in front, and then got thumped by City. You can't blame their lack of form on losing one player; Arsenal bottled it and we all saw it. The fact they're currently doing ok without him, proves that excuse wrong. 9 points dropped in 4 games. Arsenal had enjoyed a good run of luck until the Liverpool game, and then when it came to crunch time, having to show some character, they were found lacking. Which is understandable; young team, lacking experience and guile, they did a lot better than expected. They'll have learned form that this season, and should be more resilient. Title will be a bit more open this year, I reckon.
You mean their bottle went? Clubs with such strong squads don't suddenly fail because one player is out. It can affect them, but the best teams persevere.
The loss of a key player needn't affect you immediately, but, rather, is cumulative.
The longer we were without Saliba, the worse we were (especially in defence) and the greater the effect of his loss on the team.
It is a lazy cliché to jeer "bottled it", when the deeper truth was a lack of strength in depth in the squad (let alone the team), burnout and injury to key players, and the loss - to injury - of an almost irreplaceable player without whom the team were unable to sustain their title challenge.
van der Gaag turned down the Ajax job to stay at United.
Just because a club has a strong squad doesn't mean they don't have an irreplaceable player. Saliba was that guy for Arsenal last season, unquestionably. I don't think them winning their first couple matches after he went down really means all that much.
Even those classic United squads couldn't do without Roy Keane for long.
It's a nice cosy excuse to hide behind, I suppose. If you're an Arsenal fan. But the brutal truth is that the rest of the squad just didn't have the character and experience to maintain the tempo. Plus; a good manager should be able to adapt the team following the loss of a kew player. Arteta is relatively inexperienced, so will have learned lessons for this season. But the truth is; Arsenal had enjoyed two easy wins against lower opposition, then came up agaisnt a Liverpool team which had been poor all season, but were starting to find some energy again. 2-0 up, cruising, and then bang. Points dropped. The same was repeated the next game against West Ham; 2-0 up, cruising, then bang. Points dropped. Then against Soton at home, they went 2-0 down early on, but got a goal back, before succumbing again. THEN they showed some character and fight, but a little too late. Points dropped/a point rescued. They then meekly rolled over against City and got hammered. At this point, they'd thrown away a nice 8-point cushion (ok 5 if you consider City had a GiH), and City were now only 2 points behind with 2 GiHs. They then beat Chelsea at home, and Newcastle away, but then collapsed against Brighton at home and then lost to Forest. And won their season ender 5-0 against Wolves. But yeah; blame Saliba's injury. 🤣
I don't think it's a case of bottling it. Chelsea struggled in games when Lampard was injured. Liverpool struggled in games when Gerrard was injured, United struggled when Rolando was injured and on it goes and goes. Does this mean when a team misses a key player or players they are 'bottling it'? no.
Bottling it is your description, not ours.
Struggling for individual games is one thing; experiencing a dip on form following the loss of a key player is something many teams experience. But Arsenal still managed good results following Saliba's injury; it's just that in the crucial games, they were found to be lacking in character. Pressure got to them and they couldn't cope.
It's a description used by many, many other football fans. This thread isn't representative of the wider football fanbase, in any way. Most ofther football fans I know say Arsenal bottled it. Most ARSENAL fans I know (I live in North London, not far from Highbury, so I probably know more actual Arsenal fans than most people on here) say that they bottled it. So actually, it is 'our' description. You're in the minority, not me.
^That's an Arsenal fan btw...
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You are miss quoting my post. My post referred to United and Roy Keane and you replied with they bottled it question mark and then you go on to find an unrelated United video. If you want to quote me then go find video's about Roy Keane getting injured, not video's about Arsenal.
There is no team in the world that can lose their best players and not struggle. Not just the lose of their ability, but the confidence that comes from playing with that said player.
Better teams have better quality players that they can bring in. However that doesn’t replace exactly like for like.
I would say City’s current wobble was due to the loss of KDB and Rodri. They brought players in that did not give them what they had before.
In contrast other teams can lose their best players (thinking of Spurs and Brighton), and others just step up and carry on as before.
Weird isn’t it?
Better teams have better quality players that they can bring in. However that doesn’t replace exactly like for like.
I would say City’s current wobble was due to the loss of KDB and Rodri. They brought players in that did not give them what they had before.
In contrast other teams can lose their best players (thinking of Spurs and Brighton), and others just step up and carry on as before.
Weird isn’t it?
Ok; so I was responding to this:
This, I took to be more general, and not just referring to Man Utd/Roy Keane. So I'm not 'misquoting' you as you want to imply. The conversation was about Arsenal last season, rather than Man U decades ago.
It was an Arsenal video. Details. The video was to illustrate a point about Arsenal fans saying they'd bottled it. So who's misquoting whom? I'm not 'misquoting' anyone.
Sure. In the case of Arsenal last season, the consensus that they 'bottled it' refers to the way they collapsed in the harder matches, when they needed to win those games. They looked fragile, vulnerable and lacking in character. City, on the other hand, managed to get it together when most needed, and win the games they needed to. They basically turned things round to the tune of ten points; they were effectively five points behind Arsenal (given equal games played and assuming GiH won), to then win by the same margin. The gap could have been even larger, had they not dropped five points in their last two games (they eased off having won the title by that point). A ten game winning streak.
Declan Rice. The best £105M bargain.
Every game he plays.
Making it look like we robbed Hammers.
Every game he plays.
Making it look like we robbed Hammers.
Arsenal need another replacement/upgrade for Jesus who is injured again
like they have done for Partey who they no longer rely on
Onana and Maguire redeem themselves in europe
Bayern cruise and ofc Kane scores.
Madrid win again and Bellingham scores...again. Signing of the summer so far.
like they have done for Partey who they no longer rely on
Onana and Maguire redeem themselves in europe
Bayern cruise and ofc Kane scores.
Madrid win again and Bellingham scores...again. Signing of the summer so far.
Very unfortunate.
Nevertheless, I would say a supplement, rather than a replacement; I'm not sure that an "upgrade" is possible.
Partey is excellent, but, yes, unfortunately, rather injury prone.
As is Tomiyashu, alas.
I did kind of tell you that. The good thing about Declan Rice is he doesn’t miss many games. He can play twice a week and his game doesn’t suffer like some. Very rarely gets injured.
If football fans want to see just how deluded United fans are, just listen to them shouting Maguires name with glee and enthusiasm when he scored the goal. The man has been short of a disaster for United over the past number of years. He has made countless number of errors that has cost United games and is constantly found wanting by opposition players who are faster and more skillful than he is. The club want to offload him but he refuses to go and even with all that having gone on, he scores a goal and many many United fans go wild, calling out his name in support.
Anyone who is a United fan should be ashamed of that. Yes be pleased for the goal but not the way the fans celebrated his name.
Anyone who is a United fan should be ashamed of that. Yes be pleased for the goal but not the way the fans celebrated his name.
There is a lot of money riding on Arsenal buying Ivan Toney in January.
Unfortunately the bet was placed by a gentleman in Brentford! 😀
Interesting to hear the very strong words of the Premier League in wanting the harshest penalty to be awarded to Everton if they are found guilty of flouting financial fair play rules but yet they did not say the same when Man City were found to have done the same (100 rule breaches in total)
found this article on the matter, it includes a statement given by the Premier League. Notice it does not include any of the same wording they used against Everton.
www.tntsports.co.uk
found this article on the matter, it includes a statement given by the Premier League. Notice it does not include any of the same wording they used against Everton.
Manchester City charged with more than 100 financial rule breaches by Premier League - TNT Sports
The statement from the Premier League on the charges against Manchester City came early on Monday morning but there was no information about the potential punis
Ah, now that is a fascinating distinction and one well worth analysing in close detail.Interesting to hear the very strong words of the Premier League in wanting the harshest penalty to be awarded to Everton if they are found guilty of flouting financial fair play rules but yet they did not say the same when Man City were found to have done the same (100 rule breaches in total)
found this article on the matter, it includes a statement given by the Premier League. Notice it does not include any of the same wording they used against Everton.
Manchester City charged with more than 100 financial rule breaches by Premier League - TNT Sports
The statement from the Premier League on the charges against Manchester City came early on Monday morning but there was no information about the potential punis
Hmm. Without getting too political, I think there's been a serious miscalculation by the UK establishment, to certain recent world events. I'm a little conflicted about such scenes as depicted, as I personally believe it's vital to be more reflective and nuanced in your analysis of anything, but I also believe in freedom of speech and expression; football clubs should exist because of their supporters, and that the will of that support should have the choice and freedom to express itself regardless of establishment concerns. Now is not the time to be silent; now, more than ever, is the time to speak out.
City have a LOT more political 'power' than do Everton. Whilst I believe that any club found to transgress rules should be appropriately punished, I very much doubt this will come to much if anything. Large (deferred no doubt) fine, some token 'sanctions' such as a transfer ban (that will inevitably be shortened on appeal), but nothing truly punitive like docking of points/stripping of titles. Money talks...Interesting to hear the very strong words of the Premier League in wanting the harshest penalty to be awarded to Everton if they are found guilty of flouting financial fair play rules but yet they did not say the same when Man City were found to have done the same (100 rule breaches in total)
found this article on the matter, it includes a statement given by the Premier League. Notice it does not include any of the same wording they used against Everton.
Manchester City charged with more than 100 financial rule breaches by Premier League - TNT Sports
The statement from the Premier League on the charges against Manchester City came early on Monday morning but there was no information about the potential punis