The Car Thread ... !

[D.T.]

@D.T. Will you be heading to the Pebble Beach Concours?

I'm pretty much on the East Coast for the foreseeable future, but keep in mind we have the Amelia Island Concours that's only about 1-1/2 hours away

Fun fact: my company provided web services for Mercedes / the Concours d'Elegance _way_ back starting in '96

 

[Pastormac1usa]

Since the news broke about an offer from as yet unnamed Chinese auto company for FiatChrysler, I'm curious if Google might decide to make an offer. We know Sergio desperately wants to merge w/ somebody but knowing Google/WayMo has existing ties w/ the autonomous car project, would it make sense to buy it outright knowing you have all the production capacity plus human talent and an existing dealer network? Maybe the Agnelli family wants to retain the Fiat side so the Chrysler/Dodge/Jeep brands get spun off to Google. Either way, Google drops 30-40 billion and gets a turnkey auto company they can reshape entirely in their image.

 

[2298754]

Since the news broke about an offer from as yet unnamed Chinese auto company for FiatChrysler, I'm curious if Google might decide to make an offer. We know Sergio desperately wants to merge w/ somebody but knowing Google/WayMo has existing ties w/ the autonomous car project, would it make sense to buy it outright knowing you have all the production capacity plus human talent and an existing dealer network? Maybe the Agnelli family wants to retain the Fiat side so the Chrysler/Dodge/Jeep brands get spun off to Google. Either way, Google drops 30-40 billion and gets a turnkey auto company they can reshape entirely in their image.

It's unfortunate how Jeep has been passed around like a hot potato... despite how successful the company is and how people are willing to lineup around the block to buy their garbage.

The company needs to be sold to someone with deep pockets and stability.

 

[D.T.]

The company needs to be sold to someone with deep pockets and stability.

You mean Jeep, right? Totally agree, they have incredibly strong brand equity. Ford needs to buy them so we can get a 375hp/470lb-ft V6 Ecoboost Wrangler

 

[AustinIllini]

Since the news broke about an offer from as yet unnamed Chinese auto company for FiatChrysler, I'm curious if Google might decide to make an offer. We know Sergio desperately wants to merge w/ somebody but knowing Google/WayMo has existing ties w/ the autonomous car project, would it make sense to buy it outright knowing you have all the production capacity plus human talent and an existing dealer network? Maybe the Agnelli family wants to retain the Fiat side so the Chrysler/Dodge/Jeep brands get spun off to Google. Either way, Google drops 30-40 billion and gets a turnkey auto company they can reshape entirely in their image.

None of the Fiat models offer anything Google would want. They would be paying too much for something they don't need.

 

[2298754]

You mean Jeep, right? Totally agree, they have incredibly strong brand equity. Ford needs to buy them so we can get a 375hp/470lb-ft V6 Ecoboost Wrangler

Yup. Jeep is the only brand of value there. Honestly, Ford, GM, Toyota, or VAG could easily print money with Jeep.

Ecoboost JGCs and Wranglers would be sweet.

 

[AustinIllini]

Yup. Jeep is the only brand of value there. Honestly, Ford, GM, Toyota, or VAG could easily print money with Jeep.

Ecoboost JGCs and Wranglers would be sweet.

Problem is no one wants to buy Dodge. They don't do anything better than Chevy, Ford. A brand like Alfa Romeo would be interesting but FCA botched the debut here with a car that is just too unreliable for real life use.

 

[44267547]

Problem is no one wants to buy Dodge. They don't do anything better than Chevy, Ford. A brand like Alfa Romeo would be interesting but FCA botched the debut here with a car that is just too unreliable for real life use.

I actually looked at purchasing a Charger RT Scat Pack, but decided otherwise for a new Taurus SHO. I had a lot of car enthusiasts (And mechanics) talk me out of buying a Dodge. Genuinely curious, Why do you think no one wants to buy Dodge?

 

[2298754]

I actually looked at purchasing a Charger RT Scat Pack, but decided otherwise for a new Taurus SHO. I had a lot of car enthusiasts (And mechanics) talk me out of buying a Dodge. Genuinely curious, Why do you think no one wants to buy Dodge?

Because Dodge has nothing in their lineup worth mentioning.

Durango? Old
Dart? Gone
Charger? Ancient
Challenger? Ancient
Journey? How is this still being sold in 2017?!

And no, I don't consider a powerful engine in an outdated car noteworthy. (Hellcat, Demon)

 

[44267547]

Because Dodge has nothing in their lineup worth mentioning.

Durango? Old
Dart? Gone
Charger? Ancient
Challenger? Ancient
Journey? How is this still being sold in 2017?!

And no, I don't consider a powerful engine in an outdated car noteworthy. (Hellcat, Demon)

I was all set to order the Scat Pack. And a friend of mine who has been a mechanic/service writer for quite some time, literally talked me out of it (Amongst others). He said the amount of Chargers that come into the shop with suspension and ball joint issues at 35,000-45,000 miles was a joke. Reading reviews online, they were rather lethargic, but no one was complaining about the power though.

I know the Dart had a load of problems with various sensors.

The other thing with Dodge, their base Charger RT interior is rather drab for a starting price of $34,500.

 

[AustinIllini]

I actually looked at purchasing a Charger RT Scat Pack, but decided otherwise for a new Taurus SHO. I had a lot of car enthusiasts (And mechanics) talk me out of buying a Dodge. Genuinely curious, Why do you think no one wants to buy Dodge?

They just don't do any one thing very well. AutoUnion nailed most of it. There are just other brands that do everything Dodge does better.

 

[Pastormac1usa]

If Alphabet buys just the Chrysler/Dodge/Jeep side, they could spin off Jeep. But what I would do would be to completely re-focus the organization towards autonomous vehicles. That means tossing likely 2/3 of the organization to concentrate on the desired outcome. Google wouldn't buy it to maintain the existing business model. They buy it for the engineers, the gov't relations, the supplier network, the dealers, the production plants. IOW, everything they don't have now. Same reason why Apple designs their own A series chips (and likely baseband chipsets dumping both Qualcomm & Intel before long) by acquiring the talent and possibly production in the near future. Google is lusting to build a car. Is it cheaper to buy FCA and all the infrastructure it can offer or build everything from scratch?

 

[0388631]

I can't see why Google/Alphabet would want to buy FCA. It makes little sense on paper. It makes sense if you want to become a manufacturer without investing the capital for startup. I can't see Dodge purists, if such people exist, wanting that. It would slowly become a Tesla competitor. And your car would know what you did in your car and announce it somewhere somehow.

It's unfortunate how Jeep has been passed around like a hot potato... despite how successful the company is and how people are willing to lineup around the block to buy their garbage.

The company needs to be sold to someone with deep pockets and stability.

Think you mean the industry bicycle. Willing to be with anyone for money and fame.

 

[2298754]

He said the amount of Chargers that come into the shop with suspension and ball joint issues at 35,000-45,000 miles was a joke.

I find it amazing how FCA continues to produce unreliable cars off ancient platforms. You'd think all the quality issues would be solved after all these years. (300/Charger/Challenger/JGC/etc)
[doublepost=1502907147][/doublepost]

If Alphabet buys just the Chrysler/Dodge/Jeep side, they could spin off Jeep.

I think there's a lot of issues with Google to make this idea work. For example, Google is not focused enough. Just look at the Motorola acquisition and Google Glass. Then a few years later, they bring out the Pixel line of phones with HTC? Why sell Motorola to Lenovo if you were planning to bring out the Pixel lineup?

And none of the FCA brands have a "techy" image for Google to sell cars from. Tesla would be a better acquisition, or they should be working with another high-end OEM, like Mercedes-Benz, BMW, or Audi. Brands that are at the cutting-edge of automotive technology.

 

[0388631]

If Google did buy Tesla, it would certainly shut the rabid fans of Tesla up.

 

[quagmire]

Bought new wheels for the Camaro. Pick them up next week.

 

[D.T.]

Cars and Coffee August 2017

 

[0388631]

Are my eyes deceiving me or was there a cherry red pre-facelift 4th gen Mustang next to you? Looks like it had semi-slicks on fat tires.

 

[D.T.]

Are my eyes deceiving me or was there a cherry red pre-facelift 4th gen Mustang next to you? Looks like it had semi-slicks on fat tires.

Ha! Yes, 4th gen / SN95, it had huge drag radials, running some kind of transplanted built motor, ol' school carb'ed (unless I'm mixing up cars after-the-fact). The owner was a nice guy, his family showed up and he disappeared pretty much the whole event, so I didn't chat him up much.

There was a full tube frame 4th gen, massive slicks, big motor with a gigantic blower setup, I think I heard it was like 1200 HP.

Speaking of FI, I was surprised at the number of 6th gens with blowers, I'm talking fairly stock looking cars (mostly Perf Package) with TVS/Roush setups, a Whipple, Procharger - that's quite a bit of HP stalking the streets

 

[0388631]

Ha! Yes, 4th gen / SN95, it had huge drag radials, running some kind of transplanted built motor, ol' school carb'ed (unless I'm mixing up cars after-the-fact). The owner was a nice guy, his family showed up and he disappeared pretty much the whole event, so I didn't chat him up much.

There was a full tube frame 4th gen, massive slicks, big motor with a gigantic blower setup, I think I heard it was like 1200 HP.

Speaking of FI, I was surprised at the number of 6th gens with blowers, I'm talking fairly stock looking cars (mostly Perf Package) with TVS/Roush setups, a Whipple, Procharger - that's quite a bit of HP stalking the streets

Yep. Sounds awesome. Sleeper cars are the best cars. They fly under the radar for the most part, too. IIRC Florida didn't use our CARB rules. It's easier to find and use setups without violating state law. It's easy to bypass with some stuff by using a PO box with forwarding service in another state. Small stuff won't be easily seen.

I almost never see old Mustangs on the road. Either they've been bought up by those in the rust belt or they've wound wrapped around a tree. The 4th gens, pre and post lift, are incredibly rare to see. I saw a 4th gen II GT about a month ago while going to Costco. Really clean. White with thick blue striping. Aftermarket headers and exhaust system. CATless, too, I guess.

I posted this a few weeks ago, but it's funny how the upcoming ecoboost will now have more power than a early 2000s GT. Yeesh.

 

[D.T.]

Florida hasn't had emissions checks / vehicle inspections for a long time now, so you can pretty much do whatever you want

 

[0388631]

Florida hasn't had emissions checks / vehicle inspections for a long time now, so you can pretty much do whatever you want

Sounds delightful and frightening at the same time...

 

[A.Goldberg]

You mean Jeep, right? Totally agree, they have incredibly strong brand equity. Ford needs to buy them so we can get a 375hp/470lb-ft V6 Ecoboost Wrangler

Excuse me. It's called an EcoBurst. The new base Wranger is supposed to be paired with a 2.0T 4cyl... not very Wrangler-like if you ask me.

Problem is no one wants to buy Dodge. They don't do anything better than Chevy, Ford. A brand like Alfa Romeo would be interesting but FCA botched the debut here with a car that is just too unreliable for real life use.

Amen. I'm actually convinced FCA moved their pickups from Dodge to Ram, it's own division, just incase they ever decide to give up on their non-truck/Dodge market.

I actually looked at purchasing a Charger RT Scat Pack, but decided otherwise for a new Taurus SHO. I had a lot of car enthusiasts (And mechanics) talk me out of buying a Dodge. Genuinely curious, Why do you think no one wants to buy Dodge?

They've fallen to rock bottom in reliability. My family has owned several Jeeps over the years- in my experience and observation easily preventable widespread issues caused by cheap build quality. Their models are also ancient. They've consistently lagged in interior quality, while other American brands have leaped forward. Styling is subjective, but I think a lot of there design are pretty bad. I will give them credit for UConnect- pretty good as far as infotainment (aside from being atrociously slow to integrate Car Play/Android). I will also credit Jeep for maintaining solid 4wd systems and the herritage of the Wrangler. Lastly, over roughly the past 15 years or so they've usually been good at having powerful engine options. I had an 03 JGC with the 4.7 HO variant V8- 330ft lbs of torque and 0-60 in 6.7 (with variable locking front/rear diffs) - it handled like crap but that's an impressive amount of power for an SUV in 2003.

I find it amazing how FCA continues to produce unreliable cars off ancient platforms. You'd think all the quality issues would be solved after all these years. (300/Charger/Challenger/JGC/etc)
[doublepost=1502907147][/doublepost]

I think there's a lot of issues with Google to make this idea work. For example, Google is not focused enough. Just look at the Motorola acquisition and Google Glass. Then a few years later, they bring out the Pixel line of phones with HTC? Why sell Motorola to Lenovo if you were planning to bring out the Pixel lineup?

And none of the FCA brands have a "techy" image for Google to sell cars from. Tesla would be a better acquisition, or they should be working with another high-end OEM, like Mercedes-Benz, BMW, or Audi. Brands that are at the cutting-edge of automotive technology.

Exactly. I top of it their reliability got markedly worse after they merged with Fiat and they started using Fiat components.

I don't think google would ever buy FCA due to image, unless maybe they got it for super cheap. I could see them buying Tesla if Tesla fails to prove sustainable. But FCA really doesn't have much tech I think they'd be interested in.

 

[44267547]

They've fallen to rock bottom in reliability. My family has owned several Jeeps over the years- in my experience and observation easily preventable widespread issues caused by cheap build quality. Their models are also ancient. They've consistently lagged in interior quality, while other American brands have leaped forward. Styling is subjective, but I think a lot of there design are pretty bad. I will give them credit for UConnect- pretty good as far as infotainment (aside from being atrociously slow to integrate Car Play/Android). I will also credit Jeep for maintaining solid 4wd systems and the herritage of the Wrangler. Lastly, over roughly the past 15 years or so they've usually been good at having powerful engine options. I had an 03 JGC with the 4.7 HO variant V8- 330ft lbs of torque and 0-60 in 6.7 (with variable locking front/rear diffs) - it handled like crap but that's an impressive amount of power for an SUV

Thank you for sharing. It's interesting, because I was all set to purchase the Dodge charger RT through an auction, when one of the owners at the dealership who I trust and know personally, advised me not to purchase Dodge at all. More Specifically, as much as I like the to the 2017 Dodge charger RT, the complaints are valid and match with what I have been reading on the Internet and told in person. Overall, I am pleased I did not choose Dodge and I am fortunate I had someone who has a surmountable experience in the auto industry explain why Dodge is slipping. But I also have heard positive things about U-Connect.

 

[A.Goldberg]

Thank you for sharing. It's interesting, because I was all set to purchase the Dodge charger RT through an auction, when one of the owners at the dealership who I trust and know personally, advised me not to purchase Dodge at all. More Specifically, as much as I like the to the 2017 Dodge charger RT, the complaints are valid and match with what I have been reading on the Internet and told in person. Overall, I am pleased I did not choose Dodge and I am fortunate I had someone who has a surmountable experience in the auto industry explain why Dodge is slipping. But I also have heard positive things about U-Connect.

I guess the Ford Taurus would be a better choice. Either way you look like a police officer though