The Car Thread ... !

[Matz]

Smart choice with the brake upgrades, especially with assisting in managing all the additional power, I think it’s almost a necessary upgrade when you’re boosting out of stock, (Plus, I don’t know what the condition of your original brakes were prior to boosting). There are a lot of competitive breaking solutions to Brembo, as they are very expensive As you mentioned . Just to service the four piston Brembos on the Scat is $1100 with Parts/labor. (That was a direct quote from my local Dodge when were discussing Maintenance intervals.)

I usually upgrade all the brakes on my cars, (unless of course they don’t include some type of performance option when I purchase it.) Speaking of, The SHO Bridgestone tires/brakes/rotors are being installed on Monday to replace the stock units!

One of the downsides of having an AWD Charger is that certain categories of performance parts - notably brake calipers, suspension components, and to some extent, exhaust systems - are in limited supply.

Stop Tech, for example, doesn't make large brake calipers for the AWD. Apparently the front calipers are mounted differently than on the RWD, and since there are comparatively few AWD Chargers out there, it's not economical to produce them. So when it comes to my car, Brembo doesn't have any meaningful competition.

I knew that going it, as this is my second AWD R/T. Fortunately, I like the car pretty much as is, now that it has some decent power, so I'm not feeling the need to change the suspension or other major systems.

That said, based on past experience modding other vehicles, I expect an appreciable improvement in braking performance with the route I'm going. We will see how it turns out. The brake and gauge install is scheduled for June 2, which is sooner than I expected.

I'm sure you'll really enjoy that new SHO with the new tires and brakes!
Personally, I think the SHO is one of the very best looking sedans on the road today.

 

[D.T.]

@Matz

Here's the thing: if you can stand on your brakes and engage the ABS, you're getting as much braking as the tires will allow. Tires stop the car, brakes stop the wheels.

Like this:

*Stage 3 Motorpsorts Ceramic brake kit/13.8” slotted/drilled rotors

... is really just a cosmetic upgrade. Ceramic pads aren't even as good from a performance standpoint as semi-metallic, they make less dust, work across a decent range of temps, but if you're looking for more extreme, high heat use, even StopTech will sell you something else. Same for slotted/drilled rotors, like a very well known, high performance brake supplier says:

Cross-drilled brake rotors look undeniably cool peeking out from behind a set of flashy wheels, and they keep your brakes the same way – cool. In the early days of racing, drilled rotors were an effective way of venting the layer of gas and dust that inevitably builds up between asbestos brake pads and the rotor under repeated, hard braking. However, as technology and brake pad materials have progressed, outgassing has become less and less of an issue. These days, while they still look great and perform well, the drill holes are more for aesthetic reasons than anything else.

Can't argue they look pretty cool. If you go with a more exotic 2-piece rotor you get some improvement in terms of heat isolation between the disc/friction component and the mount/hub, but you're looking at about $1200 per end, if they're even made for your vehicle. Someone will do an upgrade and claim "better braking", but they're probably just feeling a slightly different bite, or different cold vs. hot pad characteristics (and certainly, holes don't stop you any quicker one time).

Of course, there's ceramic pads which are just a simple pad difference vs. CCB (carbon ceramic brakes), the latter are insanely high performance with a price tag to match (~$8K on some Porsche models)

A full replacement system is tricky too, as unless it's a full front and rear, specifically designed for your application, with consideration for bias, the factory brake volume, etc., you can wind up with worse performance. I had a $4K AP 6-piston system on my Supra, wound up using a different brand for the rear, a different master cylinder, a manual bias valve to set things up correctly, it was semi-ridiculous.

Mostly, brake upgrades are for use where you're trying to mitigate fade because of heat, repetitive use, so on your street car, see my opening remark, you're probably not going to stop any shorter, and if you're not stopping 50 times from 140MPH, you're probably not going to encounter any heat related issues.

When I used to track pretty regularly, I'd stick on a set of cheap NAPA brand rotors, just called them a consumable for the weekend - some nasty Hawk pads that made a mess, but when up to operating temps were awesome - made sure I had some decent brake cooling, usually something supplemental to the OEM design (you can get really creative with metal dryer duct and wire ... ), and always upgraded the fluid to some high performance Motul (or whatever brand), flushed before the event, and sometimes after the first day (of a two day event).

Brakes are a component that's largely misunderstood.

 

[bunnspecial]

Brakes are a component that's largely misunderstood.

You articulated better what I wanted to type up and say.

The short answer is that as long as your brakes can dissipate the heat generated properly, which essentially any modern system can, braking is controlled more by tire grip and the suspension than the friction surfaces themselves. The suspension part-to me-is probably the most overlooked one but also the single biggest reason why braking performance has improved across the board as it can minimize weight transfer during braking and help you actually brake with all 4 wheels as opposed to just the front two.

I've driven cars where I was familiar with the stock set-up, but where the owner threw brake upgrades at them. Often, the "upgrade" is something like a big 6 pot Brembo on the front, which like you said is a great cosmetic upgrade since it gives you a big fancy looking red caliper. At their best, most upgraded brakes stopped the car the same, and at their worst they actually would brake worse and even be a bit "squirrely"(under heavy braking) thanks to the front/rear bias now being messed up.

In general, I'm of the mind to just use good quality friction material, make sure everything is in good shape, and run with it. There's really no beating the physics of the fact that if you can make your ABS pulse or lock your wheels on dry roads, your brakes are good enough. Even the much maligned drum brakes, if properly sized, can do this(their big issue is that they dissipate heat so poorly that they may not stop completely before fading).

 

[Matz]

@Matz

Here's the thing: if you can stand on your brakes and engage the ABS, you're getting as much braking as the tires will allow. Tires stop the car, brakes stop the wheels.

Like this:



... is really just a cosmetic upgrade. Ceramic pads aren't even as good from a performance standpoint as semi-metallic, they make less dust, work across a decent range of temps, but if you're looking for more extreme, high heat use, even StopTech will sell you something else. Same for slotted/drilled rotors, like a very well known, high performance brake supplier says:




Can't argue they look pretty cool. If you go with a more exotic 2-piece rotor you get some improvement in terms of heat isolation between the disc/friction component and the mount/hub, but you're looking at about $1200 per end, if they're even made for your vehicle. Someone will do an upgrade and claim "better braking", but they're probably just feeling a slightly different bite, or different cold vs. hot pad characteristics (and certainly, holes don't stop you any quicker one time).

Of course, there's ceramic pads which are just a simple pad difference vs. CCB (carbon ceramic brakes), the latter are insanely high performance with a price tag to match (~$8K on some Porsche models)

A full replacement system is tricky too, as unless it's a full front and rear, specifically designed for your application, with consideration for bias, the factory brake volume, etc., you can wind up with worse performance. I had a $4K AP 6-piston system on my Supra, wound up using a different brand for the rear, a different master cylinder, a manual bias valve to set things up correctly, it was semi-ridiculous.

Mostly, brake upgrades are for use where you're trying to mitigate fade because of heat, repetitive use, so on your street car, see my opening remark, you're probably not going to stop any shorter, and if you're not stopping 50 times from 140MPH, you're probably not going to encounter any heat related issues.

When I used to track pretty regularly, I'd stick on a set of cheap NAPA brand rotors, just called them a consumable for the weekend - some nasty Hawk pads that made a mess, but when up to operating temps were awesome - made sure I had some decent brake cooling, usually something supplemental to the OEM design (you can get really creative with metal dryer duct and wire ... ), and always upgraded the fluid to some high performance Motul (or whatever brand), flushed before the event, and sometimes after the first day (of a two day event).

Brakes are a component that's largely misunderstood.

Interesting. The rotors they've specced for my car are, I believe, slotted and vented; not sure that means drilled.

If I'm correctly reading what you and @bunnspecial are saying, the money I'm about to pay to have the brakes done is wasted.


Ouch.

 

[bunnspecial]

Interesting. The rotors they've specced for my car are, I believe, slotted and vented; not sure that means drilled.

If I'm correctly reading what you and @bunnspecial are saying, the money I'm about to pay to have the brakes done is wasted.


Ouch.

If you like the cosmetics and aren't going to change the brake bias, go for it.

Otherwise, not only is it wasted, but may actually harm braking performance in summary.

BTW, many people will mistake "better" braking performance for the fact that bigger/stronger brakes will feel a lot more "grabby" with less pedal travel. That can give the perception of the car stopping better, but at the end of the day, as @D.T. and I both said, once ABS starts to modulate(or the wheels lock in the absence of ABS) provided that the front/rear bias is correctly matched to the weight transfer the suspension will allow, you really can't do any better.

 

[44267547]

One of the downsides of having an AWD Charger is that certain categories of performance parts - notably brake calipers, suspension components, and to some extent, exhaust systems - are in limited supply.

Stop Tech, for example, doesn't make large brake calipers for the AWD. Apparently the front calipers are mounted differently than on the RWD, and since there are comparatively few AWD Chargers out there, it's not economical to produce them. So when it comes to my car, Brembo doesn't have any meaningful competition.

I knew that going it, as this is my second AWD R/T. Fortunately, I like the car pretty much as is, now that it has some decent power, so I'm not feeling the need to change the suspension or other major systems.

My biggest gripe with Brembo brakes, is the squealing. So last year late in the summer of 2019, I noticed I was getting some light squealing at low braking speeds around 10 to 15 mph, I didn’t think really think anything of it. And then I noticed it kept progressing braking at 20x25 mph. So I went to my Dodge dealer, and they cleaned and lubricated the slides, Which completely eliminated the squealing. Something else I know they recommend they could do if the squealing return, is remove the pads and ‘skiff’ them, and that generally will remove the squealing as well. But after some simple research, it seems Brembos have a lengthy tendency of squealing in general, some set ups are probably more noticeable than others. Mine was minimal, but I couldn’t tolerate it, at least it was addressed and hasn’t returned.

I think part of that problem too, during the winter months, and then you have moisture that tends to settle in on the brakes from hot/cold variations, which I assume has something to do with it.

I'm sure you'll really enjoy that new SHO with the new tires and brakes!
Personally, I think the SHO is one of the very best looking sedans on the road today.

Can’t wait. I’ll have it ready in just over another week. Still working on the Cosmetic upgrades with the ceramic on the paint/wheels, the tint is almost done. I might swing by the shop this week for a ‘sneaky Peek’ 😁, I have to make sure they’re allowing customers given the pandemic, I think I’ll just go in ‘after hours‘, as I know the owner.

@bunnspecial

I definitely agree thats my perception is that the brakes are far ‘grippier’ and the sensitivity is heightened in terms of having the car react quicker in terms of slowing down With less ‘pedal travel’. At least that’s been my experience with Brembos in general versus having to push harder on the brake pedal with ‘stock brakes.’

Just as another example, I’ve driven the ‘Standard‘ Taurus for work, and then driven/owned the SHO performance pack with my 2017 white platinum metallic, and the difference in braking was substantial. It wasn’t even a comparison, and This is coming from someone who tracked my 2017 SHO, where there’s no way I would consider using stock brakes that come on the standard Taurus for example.

Also, your whole ‘aesthetic comment‘, That certainly does not apply to everyone, which includes myself, (But yes, it does enhance the look). As a matter fact, I had the option of the calipers painted To match the car color scheme for an additional $450, and I declined. I want the larger brakes simply for the performance aspect, and I think once you have experience with performance brakes in terms of how it feels/reaction, you really don’t want anything less than that when you own a performance car in general. Just my take.

 

[Matz]

If you like the cosmetics and aren't going to change the brake bias, go for it.

Otherwise, not only is it wasted, but may actually harm braking performance in summary.

BTW, many people will mistake "better" braking performance for the fact that bigger/stronger brakes will feel a lot more "grabby" with less pedal travel. That can give the perception of the car stopping better, but at the end of the day, as @D.T. and I both said, once ABS starts to modulate(or the wheels lock in the absence of ABS) provided that the front/rear bias is correctly matched to the weight transfer the suspension will allow, you really can't do any better.

Don't know if the bias is changed, since it will be on the front and rear.

I do like the cosmetics, but not sure if I like that enough to justify spending that kind of money, at the moment.

It concerns me that I am relying on the speed shop's guidance on this matter, as they suggested this as a reasonable improvement, short of new and larger calipers. What I am hearing now runs counter to that advice. I suppose I'll have to talk it over with them. It will be interesting to hear what they have to say. Unfortunately, some of the parts are special order and therefore nonrefundable.

Ah well, not the first time my parade has been rained on.

If that's in fact what is going on here.

 

[bunnspecial]

Bottom line-you can "feel" that the brakes are better all you want, but the physics don't lie that you can only stop as well as your tires will let you.

Again, if you can activate ABS on dry pavement and can do it without brake fade under your driving conditions, you are fine even if the pedal "feels" more responsive.

If you are routinely getting your brakes hot enough to experience fade, either look at ways to dissipate heat better(whether that's using physically larger disks with more thermal inertia or getting better airflow to them) or look at friction materials like ceramic that are less resistant to fade.

Some cars do have inadequate brakes from the factory, but that really won't be the case for a performance car made in the last ~20 or more years.

Also, any car of a given class stops better now than it did 20+ years ago. Many cars also in that period have gone to physically larger brakes and/or gone to 4-wheel disks and other improvements. Tires are also better than they ever have been, both in terms of tread design and rubber compound. The other big thing-and I keep hammering on this because it's important-is that suspension has improved by leaps and bounds and most cars now don't "dive" anywhere near as much as they did in the past-this keeps more weight on the rear wheels and lets them do actual useful braking work(many older cars just kept enough rear braking force to keep the car in a straight line-more than that was wasted).

Unfortunately, a lot of people-including shops that otherwise are excellent-really don't have a good understanding of physics and what's involved in stopping. The "grabbier" pedal also makes people FEEL like they're stopping better even when they're not.

 

[D.T.]

It wasn’t even a comparison, and This is coming from someone who tracked my 2017 SHO, where there’s no way I would consider using stock brakes that come on the standard Taurus for example.

Oh yeah? Neat, what tracks? What clubs?

I've run:

Sebring
Roebling
Road Atlanta
CMP
Summit Point
[the former] Moroso

With NASA, SAFE, BMWCCA, PCA, Chin MoSpo ...


Keep in mind, you're talking about two different cars, with two different weights / weight distribution, different tires, in different sizes.

Interesting. The rotors they've specced for my car are, I believe, slotted and vented; not sure that means drilled.

If I'm correctly reading what you and @bunnspecial are saying, the money I'm about to pay to have the brakes done is wasted.

I mean, they won't be worse, they'll look good, you've got fresh brakes (make sure to break them in correctly), I wouldn't say a waste, just not to expect any notable braking performance.

 

[Matz]

I mean, they won't be worse, they'll look good, you've got fresh brakes (make sure to break them in correctly), I wouldn't say a waste, just not to expect any notable braking performance.

So, after the parade stopped (so to speak), I did a bit of looking online, and some credible sources in fact corroborate what you and bunn are saying. Funny thing is, I usually do some research before making a purchase like this. Especially like this. But no, this time I went with what the shop recommended plus what I thought I knew.

Guess I needed to pay more tuition.

A short while ago I was talking with a friend of mine, and bemoaning the fact that I have probably spent money that I didn't need to. He said yeah, maybe, but also said the same thing you did, about having fresh brakes and all. And, as it turns out, the current rotors have a bit of pulsation, and have had it since I got the car 20K miles ago. It now has 42K on the odometer, so new brakes aren't a total waste, I suppose.

And yes, I expect they'll look good. That alone is good for a few extra HP, right?

 

[44267547]

I won’t definitely won’t claim to know more than Bunnspecial over brakes or anything drivetrain related, Just from owning a number of sports cars over the years, the difference in terms of how it feels/responds to braking with a ‘performance package‘ has made a difference from my experience substantially where I wouldn’t consider anything less on my sports cars. I almost look at performance brakes like an amenity, once you have certain luxury/performance features, and then you have a vehicle without it, it really takes away the experience almost as a downgrade.

Example=Look at it like having HID headlights, which give you a brighter/wider throw down the road -v.s.- your Standard halogen bulb, [it’s almost barbaric using a standard halogen once you’re adjusted to HID headlights.] That’s how I view braking with ‘performance features‘ in mind , Which also leads me to actually take advantage of a higher performance brake at the track (Which isn’t often due to my colder seasons). But for the average ‘car enthusiast’, most probably don’t track their vehicle and they probably also don’t venture what the cost will be in terms of servicing brakes.

In the end, I realize there’s a lot of intricate detail about brakes that is beyond my understanding...but I don’t care. What I want is exactly what the ‘higher-end’ brakes deliver, which is part of the reason it instills confidence in terms of how you drive your vehicle. I think it’s all mutually exclusive, but question how ‘the average Sports car’ with a Performance car actually puts those brakes to the test versus just your ‘typical daily driving‘. Then again, I really don’t daily drive my sports cars, they’re my ‘fun toys‘ for my off days for spirited road driving (Abiding by traffic laws/ordinances of course) or at the track (Where I can let loose safely without restrictions ).

 

[bunnspecial]

I won’t definitely won’t claim to know more than Bunnspecial over brakes or anything drivetrain related, Just from owning a number of sports cars over the years, the difference in terms of how it feels/responds to braking with a ‘performance package‘ has made a difference from my experience substantially where I wouldn’t consider anything less on my sports cars.

To be perfectly clear also, if you're buying a manufacturer supplied "Performance Package" that includes upgraded brakes along with other things(different/larger wheels and tires along with tweaked suspension) you likely WILL see improved braking performance. I won't discount that for a second, especially again if the brakes are done by someone who has far more access to both how it all was designed and can make educated changes that the rest of us are, at best, guessing at.

Also, I won't deny that things definitely feel a lot more reassuring when you're on a spirited drive, need some braking power, and get a lot of it from a small amount of pedal push. It CAN be alarming to have to bury your foot when you really need to stop even if the end result is the same as from using big 4 or 6 pot Brembos that jerk you around.

I've also been a bit soured by driving some cars with really, really badly done brake upgrades to the point where they were dangerous. A lot of this comes up in classic cars, which I know are a different beast when it comes to braking since even with the fanciest hydraulics you throw at them they will never stop as well as a Camry . On one hand, I've driven cars where someone tossed a big set of disks in the rears that would lock up the rear wheels with moderate application while the fronts could still take a lot more, and make a dangerous situation since the car would skid in situations where a stock set-up would have safely brought the car to a stop in half the distance without breaking a sweat. On the other end of that, I've driven cars that came with 4 wheel drums that had 2 or 4 wheel disk conversions without changing the master cylinder. That one can be really scary since often times a stock 4-wheel drum M/C doesn't push enough fluid to fully apply the disks. If it does, the pedal effort required is a WHOLE lot higher and it can make a relatively easy braking car without any assist be almost impossible to push(BTW, small disks on light cars can actually feel great without assist, but as weight and/or brake size starts going up assist basically becomes mandatory).

 

[circatee]

Honestly, from time to time, reading some of the posts about cars, I realize how little I know about cars. And, I own a Performance Pack car.

Go figure...

 

[44267547]

Honestly, from time to time, reading some of the posts about cars, I realize how little I know about cars. And, I own a Performance Pack car.

Go figure...

You learn as you go. Most of what I’ve learned, has been from someone visually explaining it to me from either ‘under the hood’ or in person per se. If you gave me a diagram to follow, I’m more of a visual hands-on learner-approach versus from someone studying a blueprint/directional literature.

If I had the time and the Mechanic had the patience, I could sit in the shop for hours soaking in detail about how ‘something works‘ or ‘post modified Performance aspects‘.

BTW, aren’t you a member on Mustang6G forum? I believe I have come across your posts on their. [Similar username?]

 

[bunnspecial]

So, small little side-bar on the MG:

I stopped by the shop today and talked to the mechanic who had actually worked on it the other day. His report was that he was seeing fuel washing in the cylinder with low compression, which of course means it's PROBABLY a carb issue(I don't know what else would cause it), and of course oil starvation from fuel washing can kill rings. It was present in both cylinders 1 and 2, which makes sense as both are fed off the same carb, but I'm a bit stumped as to why 2 was a lot worse than 1. In any case, his opinion-contingent on pulling the head and looking-was that we could probably get away with hone+rings provided that it hadn't scored, so I really, really hope that's the case.

I had asked them on Friday though to humor me and adjust the valves since I hadn't done it in a while. They hadn't had a chance yet, so the owner said "I know you do it a bit differently than I do and that John Twist taught you how to do it-do you want to go back there and do it yourself?" Needless to say I did, and although it wasn't a crazy difference in how he normally does it he was glad to see my way. It is certainly a strange feeling to have a shop hand you tools out of their drawer and let you go at something on your own car, though

I did things the "old fashioned way" with a 1/2" ring spanner for the locknuts and a big fat flathead screwdriver for the adjusters, but after I'd done it my way he also handed me a Snap-On V-21A valve adjustment tool, which I'd seen but never used. After playing with it for a minute...I'm going to be headed to Ebay to get one

 

[circatee]

Nicely spotted. Yep, that's me.
And, I am like you, too. I love the hands on approach. I perform much better.

You learn as you go. Most of what I’ve learned, has been from someone visually explaining it to me from either ‘under the hood’ or in person per se. If you gave me a diagram to follow, I’m more of a visual hands-on learner-approach versus from someone studying a blueprint/directional literature.

If I had the time and the Mechanic had the patience, I could sit in the shop for hours soaking in detail about how ‘something works‘ or ‘post modified Performance aspects‘.

BTW, aren’t you a member on Mustang6G forum? I believe I have come across your posts on their. [Similar username?]

 

[Bug-Creator]

The short answer is that as long as your brakes can dissipate the heat generated properly, which essentially any modern system can, braking is controlled more by tire grip and the suspension than the friction surfaces themselves.

That might be true for legal speeds elsewhere, but "throw the anchor" while traveling at >200kph with good tires on a well paved and dry piece of Autobahn and most stock brakes will be the limiting factor

 

[D.T.]

That might be true for legal speeds elsewhere, but "throw the anchor" while traveling at >200kph with good tires on a well paved and dry piece of Autobahn and most stock brakes will be the limiting factor

Nah, I've done it much faster than that at several tracks, tires are usually still the limiting factor on modern systems - certainly moderately "performance oriented" setups - as long as heat isn't an issue.

Now, coming down from around 19X MPH at a mile run event? Yeah, it felt like the brakes were never going to stop the car

 

[circatee]

In my 2018 Mustang GT, I am thinking about upgrading my Dash Cam. From a Garmin 55, to the 56.

 

[bunnspecial]

Unfortunately, had to let this one go after not really having time to do anything with it.

It's going to a good home with the know-how and motivation to get it back on the road.

BTW, they also took a bunch of spare MG parts I needed to move(my MG mechanic is taking it in trade for work). I guess I'm just proving how weak I am-I had a spare short block sitting there, which is in the ballpark of 350lbs. I never try to move one without a hoist, but I watched the two guys who came for the car reach down and grab the that engine like it was nothing...

Also, getting it on the dolly was...fun...the rear brakes are out completely(fronts work great) and the shift linkage decided to pop loose again while we were moving it around. I climbed under it and stuck it in neutral by the lever on the side of the transmission, but with the front wheels on the dolly and no good way to get it in park or put the handbrake on, it was a bit iffy once the front wheels were on the ramps. We shoved it up the ramp but couldn't get the wheels into the cradle. My cheap plastic wheel chocks weren't up to the job, so we ended improvising chocks with jack stands(that's the scrapes on the pavement) and also two of us standing behind and pushing forward while one guy backed the truck/dolly up. All done, though, it was loaded and gone, and I can concentrate on getting the MG in tip top shape.

 

[44267547]

In my 2018 Mustang GT, I am thinking about upgrading my Dash Cam. From a Garmin 55, to the 56.

I don’t have an experience with Garmins, but I do with the Vantrue Pro [On Amazon for $200). The ‘24 hour parking mode’ and ‘enhanced night vision‘ are two must have features that are crucial. I’m not sure what Garmins features are specific, but take a look at Vantrue if that’s something that would interest you/in your price range. (It’s worth mentioning, it supports up to 256 GB of storage, I have never felt the need for any more.)

Vantrue N2 Pro Uber Dual Dash Cam Dual 1920x1080P Infrared Night Vision Front and Inside Dash Camera, 2.5K 2560x1440P Single Front, 310° Car Camera, 24hr Parking Mode, Motion Sensor, Support 256GB max https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0742J69SQ/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_i_NPHXEbST7866K

 

[D.T.]

In my 2018 Mustang GT, I am thinking about upgrading my Dash Cam. From a Garmin 55, to the 56.

I've been researching them on and off for months, my issue is owning a convertible. Makes it so much easier to snatch, and I leave my top down 99% of the time (and didn't want to have to deal with disconnecting it all the time).

Anyway, the NextBase brand is the one that comes up all the time, several pretty reputable review sites (like WireCutter, TechRadar) rank it #1 (sometimes 1 and 2 for two different models). I mean, Garmin is almost always in the Top 5 too, just figured if you were looking to change/upgrade, you might consider a different brand.

Unfortunately, had to let this one go after not really having time to do anything with it.

It's going to a good home with the know-how and motivation to get it back on the road.

Yeah, makes sense, and with a car that's more than just a box to go from A to B, it's always an extra bit of an emotional bummer ...

 

[Apple fanboy]

I've been researching them on and off for months, my issue is owning a convertible. Makes it so much easier to snatch, and I leave my top down 99% of the time (and didn't want to have to deal with disconnecting it all the time).

Anyway, the NextBase brand is the one that comes up all the time, several pretty reputable review sites (like WireCutter, TechRadar) rank it #1 (sometimes 1 and 2 for two different models). I mean, Garmin is almost always in the Top 5 too, just figured if you were looking to change/upgrade, you might consider a different brand.




Yeah, makes sense, and with a car that's more than just a box to go from A to B, it's always an extra bit of an emotional bummer ...

Pretty happy with my BlackVue dashcams. Went with front and rear set as it’s the only way to be covered in an accident.

 

[Matz]

A couple of days ago I let a friend of mine, that helped talk me into having the supercharger installed, drive my Charger. He has a Golf wagon which he's been modding for a few months, including a larger turbo and a tune. It's now quicker than most V8s.

So he was very interested in how my car would drive, and, after warming it up for a few miles, he punched it from a dead stop.

The expression on his face when the car dug in and launched in awd was priceless. His jaw dropped and he said "holy s*** that's ferocious!"

Never heard that term applied to any car I've owned. I like it.

 

[D.T.]

Pretty happy with my BlackVue dashcams. Went with front and rear set as it’s the only way to be covered in an accident.

That was actually where I started, lots of folks using them on a couple of car sites I frequent - I actually like the physical design a little better vs. the NextBase - the latter are almost like GoPros, and (as you obv. know), the BlackVue are like cylinders, that seem like they'd tuck up and be out of view a little better (in terms of a would be thief seeing it ...)

One guy I saw made like a custom extension, so like the black plastic box where the lights, switches, etc., mount on the front part of the roof, so his is completely hidden. Pretty slick.