The Car Thread ... !

[Alameda]

I didn't go by statistics just went by what I see on the news and YouTube and seems it's the often, and by some experience.
More concerned that the batteries when they catch fire, won't go out.

We had a truck carrying a bunch of batteries that turned over on its side on the highway here and they caught fire, and they closed the highway for three days till it went out.as they couldn't put it out.

I worked at a old power plant in CA a few years ago that they went to a huge battery bank if lithium batteries and they catch fire all the time and we had to replace a crap load of them because they are stacked and when I've goes, it catches others on fire.

While we were there, another building had some catch on fire. So I've been around them as well I'm not just shooting from the hip.

There's this stuff called gasoline, and when it catches fire, it doesn't go out either. And they transport it all around the country in massive trucks. Sometimes, these trucks catch on fire and the fires are really big.

So it's ridiculous to say that fire danger is the reason why EV's are bad, because we already drive around in vehicles filled with an explosive, flammable substance. One difference: EV car batteries don't explode. Gasoline, on the other hand, can explode.
From the second half of this year alone:

Colombia fuel tanker inferno kills seven and injures dozens

The accident happened as people tried to siphon fuel from the overturned lorry on the north coast.

www.bbc.com

Tanker truck transporting gasoline catches fire on Highway 20

A tanker truck carrying thousands of litres of gasoline caught fire on Highway 20.

montreal.ctvnews.ca

Fuel Tanker Truck Catches Fire, Closes I-95 in Connecticut

An I-95 overpass sustained serious damage and remains under investigation.

www.roadandtrack.com

Large tanker catches fire in CT, causes massive traffic delays on I-95 | VIDEO

A tanker carrying 8,500 gallons of gasoline caught on fire, causing massive delays in the area.

abc7chicago.com

 

[Vegastouch]

They are ready as they are being used all over the world. It’s just your region isn’t up to speed if it’s true what you claim. They are plenty convenient enough in Europe and we have no issues travelling long distances and charging at home here. I drove 197 miles in ours today, all motorway and no issues whatsoever. It’s sat on my drive now charging and not on fire.

Ready enough for you I guess. Lacking charging stations and speed of the charging and self driving cars have a long way to go , so that's from my liking.
I don't know about the UK but sales are declined here. Not that I care. I'm not in the market.

 

[Vegastouch]

There's this stuff called gasoline, and when it catches fire, it doesn't go out either. And they transport it all around the country in massive trucks. Sometimes, these trucks catch on fire and the fires are really big.

So it's ridiculous to say that fire danger is the reason why EV's are bad, because we already drive around in vehicles filled with an explosive, flammable substance. One difference: EV car batteries don't explode. Gasoline, on the other hand, can explode.
From the second half of this year alone:

Colombia fuel tanker inferno kills seven and injures dozens

The accident happened as people tried to siphon fuel from the overturned lorry on the north coast.

www.bbc.com

Tanker truck transporting gasoline catches fire on Highway 20

A tanker truck carrying thousands of litres of gasoline caught fire on Highway 20.

montreal.ctvnews.ca

Fuel Tanker Truck Catches Fire, Closes I-95 in Connecticut

An I-95 overpass sustained serious damage and remains under investigation.

www.roadandtrack.com

Large tanker catches fire in CT, causes massive traffic delays on I-95 | VIDEO

A tanker carrying 8,500 gallons of gasoline caught on fire, causing massive delays in the area.

abc7chicago.com

So we are comparing gas truck carriers to this now? Lol
Not sure why some of ya are going nuts on this.

The fire thing isn't my only reason and not even my biggest reason. It's just what you are running with.

Enjoy your car. I'm not criticizing. I'm just not interested in them as of yet. Need to evolve more for MY liking, and I think they come up with something as an alternative in the next 5 years. I'm in no hurry

 

[Herdfan]

EV’s aren’t catching fire whilst charging in concerning numbers so not going to spend anytime worrying about that.

Maybe not, but my daughter's apartment complex will not allow them in garages. And this is LA where EV's are everywhere.

 

[jz0309]

Maybe not, but my daughter's apartment complex will not allow them in garages. And this is LA where EV's are everywhere.

and why is that? Do those garages maybe not have electricical outlets and they don't want extension cords laying around? I read on another forum that someone ran an extension cord from their 2nd story apartment to the carport to charge their car and I can certainly appreciate if a HOA is against that ...

This EA charging station is on the lower level of a parking garage, right next to then entry of Ralph's, so it's not a "city code" ...

 

[Alameda]

So we are comparing gas truck carriers to this now? Lol
Not sure why some of ya are going nuts on this.

The fire thing isn't my only reason and not even my biggest reason. It's just what you are running with.

Enjoy your car. I'm not criticizing. I'm just not interested in them as of yet. Need to evolve more for MY liking, and I think they come up with something as an alternative in the next 5 years. I'm in no hurry

No, you claimed that electric cars are bad because they have batteries which can catch on fire and burn. I simply pointed out that this is equally true of cars powered by gasoline. I’ve seen cars catch on fire and burn and people have been burned to death in gas powered cars. Thats all.

As for the technology, we used to buy AA batteries. Today, nearly all battery powered devices use rechargeable technology. Mobile phones and laptops can last 10 hours and longer. Battery technology improves about 7 percent a year, so in about ten years, EV battery’s will cost about half as much and go twice as far. We’ll reach the point where it will make no sense to buy a gas powered car. It’s inevitable.

 

[I7guy]

So we are comparing gas truck carriers to this now? Lol
Not sure why some of ya are going nuts on this.

The fire thing isn't my only reason and not even my biggest reason. It's just what you are running with.

Enjoy your car. I'm not criticizing. I'm just not interested in them as of yet. Need to evolve more for MY liking, and I think they come up with something as an alternative in the next 5 years. I'm in no hurry

This train of thought started when you posted anecdotal examples of Lithium fires ie a truck turned over, etc

 

[Vegastouch]

No, you claimed that electric cars are bad because they have batteries which can catch on fire and burn. I simply pointed out that this is equally true of cars powered by gasoline. I’ve seen cars catch on fire and burn and people have been burned to death in gas powered cars. Thats all.

As for the technology, we used to buy AA batteries. Today, most battery powered devices user rechargeable technology. Mobile phones and laptops can last 10 hours and longer. Battery technology improves about 7 percent a year, so in about ten years, EV battery’s will cost about half as much and go twice as far. We’ll reach the point where it will make no sense to buy a gas powered car. It’s inevitable.

That was not my main reason. But that is part of it and I never said they were bad.
I have other reasons too. I'm just not interested as they are now and what I'd want one for.

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

Ready enough for you I guess. Lacking charging stations and speed of the charging and self driving cars have a long way to go , so that's from my liking.
I don't know about the UK but sales are declined here. Not that I care. I'm not in the market.

Speed of charging? Even a fast charger is 20 mins so not sure how much faster you are expecting?

 

[I7guy]

Ready enough for you I guess. Lacking charging stations and speed of the charging and self driving cars have a long way to go , so that's from my liking.
I don't know about the UK but sales are declined here.

Electric Vehicle Sales and Market Share (US - Q3 2024 Updates)

Automakers are rapidly launching electrified lineups. This page will be updated with the latest EV market share and sales numbers.

caredge.com

That seems not the case.

Not that I care. I'm not in the market.

 

[Alameda]

That was not my main reason. But that is part of it and I never said they were bad.
I have other reasons too. I'm just not interested as they are now and what I'd want one for.

I get that.
Look, my car is gas-powered. It's ten years old. I'm a skilled mechanic and I expect to keep it running another ten years, unless I have a job change which requires a lot more driving. My point is... most of us are only in the market for a car every 3 to 5 years. With each year, the benefits of electric cars get better while the benefits of gas cars don't improve.

I expect in ten years, it won't make sense to buy gas-powered cars anymore. If you want to get some sense of this, take a look at the explosive growth of cheap EV's made in China. It's difficult to see technology changing when you're in the middle of it, but if you imagine EV's having double the range, half the charge time and half the price ten years from now, it gives you some picture of the inevitability of electric cars.

 

[cyb3rdud3]

Maybe not, but my daughter's apartment complex will not allow them in garages. And this is LA where EV's are everywhere.

My apartment complex in the netherlands has just voted to do allow the installation. But, understandably, by a single company, with a minimum takeup, and subsequent ones also has to go to that company such that the installation remains neat, and controlled, and integrated with building controls. Each (underground) parking space will get outlets (if the own pays for it) together with RFID pass for billing identification. The system will be integrated with the building sustainable solar and battery storage system such that when there is a positive in generation the charging will be load balanced and free. In addition to that kind of charging, home storage batteries have also been designed and will be allowed for the batteries. Approvals have been obtained from relevant governemtn authorities.

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

Maybe not, but my daughter's apartment complex will not allow them in garages. And this is LA where EV's are everywhere.

That’s at the owners discretion I suppose and I’ve stayed in an AirBnB with underground EV charging, so it’s not a universal issue. I don’t live in an apartment complex thankfully, those days are long gone so I have the freedom to charge on my own land.

 

[Herdfan]

and why is that? Do those garages maybe not have electricical outlets and they don't want extension cords laying around?

The way the buildings are laid out, the garages are under the units and if a fire were to start in a garage it could engulf the building fairly quickly.

They actually do have 110 outlets, but those outlets are on the complex's dime, not hers. So they also probably don't want people charging cars when they have to pay for it.

 

[cyb3rdud3]

The way the buildings are laid out, the garages are under the units and if a fire were to start in a garage it could engulf the building fairly quickly.

They actually do have 110 outlets, but those outlets are on the complex's dime, not hers. So they also probably don't want people charging cars when they have to pay for it.

Surely, that is a choice? I mean an ICE car is over 60x more likely to burn, and then it could engulf the building fairly quickly as well 🤷‍♂️

Is there not an HOA for the building? If they wanted to, they could put systems in-place to ensure the outlets only get activated by an owner, and charged to the correct account. Many companies offer such installations.

 

[jz0309]

Is there not an HOA for the building? If they wanted to, they could put systems in-place to ensure the outlets only get activated by an owner, and charged to the correct account. Many companies offer such installations.

Sure they could, they just choose not to, their main focus is to make as much money with as little of spending/investment as possible.
Retrofitting an apartment complex would likely cost 100s k$ and the cost would be passed on to the renters or owners, who would be against it…
New construction is a different story

 

[cyb3rdud3]

Sure they could, they just choose not to, their main focus is to make as much money with as little of spending/investment as possible.
Retrofitting an apartment complex would likely cost 100s k$ and the cost would be passed on to the renters or owners, who would be against it…
New construction is a different story

Perhaps I've used HOA wrong, I thought that is an Home Owners Association, or in Dutch a VVE (Vereniging Van Eigenared) who typically hire a thirdparty company to manage the apartment complex on their behalf, and as such have a monthly contribution in a pot of money.

Retrofitting the full solar and battery storage system for the complex I have an appartment in in the Netherlands has a return on investment of about 6 years, would be like 9 years to used a private finance initiative with a third-party company. That would power all lighting, (garage) doors, lifts, in the building and on the grounds.

Having smart chargers (with all infrastructure for cost management and billing) installed would be about EUR4500 per two spaces (a quirk of how the garage is build and walls available with a minimum of 26 owners taking it, so you can split the costs with your neighbours, or like I have two spaces have it covered by yourself). So effectively about double that of a normal home install (4500/2), as for our home in the UK we paid about 1150. But inline with the market in the Netherlands, as the home we are renovating would have a similar price for a dual charger, linked to our home battery storage as well. Subsequent installs are in batches of 10 owners taking it to make it their worthwhile to come out.

That is all retrofitted in a building that is about 30 years old. So not really that expensive, and adds value to the appartment as well, and also to the rental value for those who bought it as an investment (once our home is finished we'll rent it out...).

 

[Herdfan]

Perhaps I've used HOA wrong, I thought that is an Home Owners Association, or in Dutch a VVE (Vereniging Van Eigenared) who typically hire a thirdparty company to manage the apartment complex on their behalf, and as such have a monthly contribution in a pot of money.

In the US most large apartment complexes are self managed by large complex owners. The complex my daughter lives in is owned by a company that has thousands of apartments in major cities all over the US.

A HOA is more for a condo/townhome/SFH in the US. It is a collection of owners and can be self-managed or farmed out to a 3rd party.

 

[cyb3rdud3]

In the US most large apartment complexes are self managed by large complex owners. The complex my daughter lives in is owned by a company that has thousands of apartments in major cities all over the US.

A HOA is more for a condo/townhome/SFH in the US. It is a collection of owners and can be self-managed or farmed out to a 3rd party.

Sounds like they need them for the owners of apartments as well 👍

 

[misterlwc]

EV's are definitely not as reliable as petrol or diesel cars (yet), although there are obvious benefits, the disadvantages outweigh this presently. Therefore from experience I'd advise anyone considering an EV to think twice.

My first car of my own was a handy down from my aunt in 2014, where I was kindly given a high mileage 2004 BMW 318i. I used it for four years, commonly commuting long distances (N.Ireland to Dublin), typical maintenance as expected where things like the timing belt, new springs, oil changes, brake pads, etc; and the A/C never worked that well, however nothing major ever failed. I changed in 2018 after the car was 14 years old with 252,000 miles on the clock. Just to emphasise a 14-year-old petrol car with 252,000 miles, never broke down once.

In 2018, as at this time I was assisting with my family farm after uni, I purchased a Ford Ranger Wildtrak, which I still own to this day in N.Ireland. Touch wood nothing has ever failed, standard services have covered all required maintenance with 76,000 miles on the clock.

Primary based in London now working in tech, yet traveling around a lot with work, with ULEZ and business incentives, I'm leasing an electric car, Mercedes EQB, where my lease started with a new car in February 2024. Since my lease started 10 months ago, I have driven 11,000 miles, shockingly I have broken down twice, once with an overheating issue and the second time with a braking issue, where my brake become soft and unusable. Outside of this I have brought my car back to the dealership two additional times (where it has been drivable), due to a "battery conditioning" fault and software based issues, where I have lost most instruments & car monitoring. In addition I am concerned regarding battery degradation, where when new I could get roughly 280 miles on a charge, now I'm struggling to get 200 miles, 10 months later, yet battery capacity reports it has hardly changed reported by the system. Mercedes reports the car is fine and multiple factors maybe at play here, such as, season of year and driving style; therefore warranty will not cover my lost 80 miles of range and rapidly decreasing.

I love the concept of electric car, especially the drive with the instant torque. The range is more than I'll need any single day and charging overnight at home is easy. However, just the reliability issues, battery capacity and for anyone purchasing, rather than leasing, as of the expense of replacing your battery after a few of years, your car will lose an awful lot of value.

Just a heads up to anyone thinking about going electric, with the title of this thread "The car thread", where we tend to talk about EV's.

 

[daneoni]

I maintain that self-charging hybrids should've been the future not all electric.

Toyota/Lexus had the right idea all along.

 

[Apple fanboy]

I maintain that self-charging hybrids should've been the future not all electric.

Toyota/Lexus had the right idea all along.

Not for me. Petrol free is just a better alternative.

 

[daneoni]

All electric would probably have worked out alot better if Fuel Cell technology became viable.

Currently, with the poor charging infrastructure, high access cost/associated depreciation, mileage lottery, and failure rates. I'm not sold personally.

I'll likely go hybrid first for my next car and hope EVs market is fully fleshed out by the time we're forced to get them

 

[Apple fanboy]

All electric would probably have worked out alot better if Fuel Cell technology became viable.

Currently, with the poor charging infrastructure, high access cost/associated depreciation, mileage lottery, and failure rates. I'm not sold personally.

I'll likely go hybrid first for my next car and hope EVs market is fully fleshed out by the time we're forced to get them

So poor charging infrastructure is very much dependent on where you live. Absolutely no issues in Europe.

Higher costs and depreciation isn’t great. But does mean there are some second hand bargains to be had.

Failure rates are at a much lower rate than hybrids and ICE vehicles so not really sure what you mean by that?

 

[cyb3rdud3]

I maintain that self-charging hybrids should've been the future not all electric.

Toyota/Lexus had the right idea all along.

I’ve got a hybrid (can plug in and self charge) an EV, and three ICE in our household.

I can speak from direct experience when I say it depends on the needs, and wants. 👍