All iPads The iPad will never be a Mac, and the Mac will never be an iPad

[Kahnforever]

have you considered that maybe I don’t want two different f’in lawnmowers in my garage?

Yes. I’m a Product Manager and have to deal
with users and scoping products all the time. It’s difficult and also impossible to please everyone. But if every product was made in a way to please everyone, we’d just be pumping out a lawn mower with wings.

 

[Cirillo Gherardo]

And yet Apple is working on a touchscreen Mac...

A misunderstood rumor if there ever was one.

There is precisely zero chance that any new class of product developed by Apple runs macOS. Zero. It will run iPadOS, or some new OS designed specifically for the device. And new OS will be a limited and tightly controlled OS, just like iPadOS.

 

[Cirillo Gherardo]

You will live to see this false.

You will see things like full desk sized ipads, the insides are essentially the same, the UI will adapt to form factor.

The funny part here is that ”size” is literally the only thing that makes you think any of this is possible let alone inevitable. Truly.

If this conversation was about the iPhone, you wouldn’t be as confident in stating that eventually iPhone will run macOS. What you don’t realize is that it is the same conversation.

 

[Rafterman]

A misunderstood rumor if there ever was one.

There is precisely zero chance that any new class of product developed by Apple runs macOS. Zero. It will run iPadOS, or some new OS designed specifically for the device. And new OS will be a limited and tightly controlled OS, just like iPadOS.

Just like there's no way Apple will ever make a big screen phone or a stylus. 🙄

 

[macfacts]

You have zero evidence to support your assertion that MacOS “would run perfectly fine on iPad Pro…”

You ignore the thermal cooling limits of a device that is thin with its internals sandwiched against the screen.

The Google pixel book is thinner then a MacBook Air, and has no fans and has a Intel processor.

 

[Cirillo Gherardo]

An iPad could offer to switch between iPadOS and MacOS.

No, it could not. Because an iPad is not a Mac. This hypothetical nonsense is just that. And to be honest, it’s completely amateur. It shows a total lack of comprehension of hardware, UI and UX design, product design and positioning, and so much more. The iPad, if it were forced to run macOS, would be the worst Mac in the entire lineup. What a win that would be.

The above I wrote is rather logical, it's just Apple preventing it because they want to sell you two devices.

Nothing about it is logical, and defaulting back to “Apple just wants to sell you” is a ridiculous excuse for why this poor idea doesn’t exist already.

 

[Cirillo Gherardo]

Just like there's no way Apple will ever make a big screen phone or a stylus. 🙄

Nope, not like that at all. It’s really funny the lengths some people here will go in order to try to have a point, any point, at all. Especially when they don’t.

 

[Kahnforever]

You will live to see this false.

You will see things like full desk sized ipads, the insides are essentially the same, the UI will adapt to form factor.

Now this I agree with. This is what I have been saying for years… that Apple should make one operating system that morphs based on device as I have stated in this thread already.

That the new OS needs to usher in a NEW CLASS OF DEVICES. That includes full desk size touchscreen computers; very large screens for monitors that are also touchscreens with unique hinge designs to tilt, pull and pivot these screens; smaller screens for tablets that fold out and get larger; consumer onprem servers; large screen sheets that roll out and can be adhered to any surface like a wall or desk, etc.

I have a 55” touchscreen on a unique hinge: a Samsung Flip. It has stylus input and I use it for work to map things out and diagram things. https://www.samsung.com/ca/business/smart-signage/digital-flipchart/wm-series-lh55wmrwbgcxza/

The device you are referring to, a desk sized iPad… is no longer an iPad. An iPad is a tablet. A tablet is something that is held in the hands and is portable. That is not what a full desk size iPad is. That is a different device with different applications. That’s actually the Microsoft Studio desktop, a device I really like and one I wish Apple was in a position to make. Big screen with an amazing hinge that you can pull and tilt the screen in a way where it’s comfortable to use its touch screen on the desk. The problem with it is that the software is not touch first so touch isn’t a good experience. But stylus input like drawing is good, and a few other things like maps.

 

[Cirillo Gherardo]

You have zero evidence to support your assertion that MacOS “would run perfectly fine on iPad Pro…”

You ignore the thermal cooling limits of a device that is thin with its internals sandwiched against the screen.

Not to mention the minor fact that ALL of this hardware (iPad and Mac alike) are designed from the ground up to run the OS they come with, AND vice versa. These are not interchangeable parts. iPadOS is meticulously designed to work with this type of hardware and has to be tuned a million different ways for it even to be possible. Thermals, battery, and much more are huge constraints on it.

 

[Cirillo Gherardo]

If iPads are so incapable of sustained performance then how does this game, a direct port from desktop, run so well? This is a no-compromises game.

It’s not a direct port, nor is it “no compromises”. There is not a single piece of software running on iPad that is not built with the iPadOS SDK and running within the bounds and restrictions of an iPad app.

 

[Cirillo Gherardo]

Are you able to say that for the new iPad Pros that have a heatsink built into them that terminates in copper on the back logo?

They are no different than any of the last few years worth of iPads in that regard. Not meaningfully different anyway. You are reaching, and not understanding of what you’re reaching for.

 

[namethisfile]

Yeah I vote for two separate OS's as well. Think consoles. Is the PS5 running Windows even tho it has AMD parts? nope. same reason. move on.

 

[Cirillo Gherardo]

The Google pixel book is thinner then a MacBook Air, and has no fans and has a Intel processor.

And is also a complete POS. Not worthy of comparison, even for argument’s sake.

 

[iPadified]

All the reviews I watched were very positive.

By whom? Reviewers are far from representative.

 

[Devyn89]

What the solution is in my opinion is for Apple to create one new operating system that is dynamic: that morphs based on device with specific defined design patterns. UI elements get larger and things go behind defined menu systems on touch, and things get smaller with more shown in a UI on Macs. It would all also be designed around AI from the ground up.

Apple already uses AI throughout the system, they just call it machine learning. AI isn’t new, it’s just a new way to market machine learning. AI isn’t even intelligent, it can just disseminate words and data. It can’t even assess good data from bad. Case in point:

 

[Kahnforever]

Apple already uses AI throughout the system, they just call it machine learning. AI isn’t new, it’s just a new way to market machine learning. AI isn’t even intelligent, it can just disseminate words and data. It can’t even assess good data from bad. Case in point:

No, machine learning is not AI. And Apple hasn’t had AI. Apple has had a dumb assistant and some machine learning that can at best recognize simple patterns.

AI is exactly what it says: artificial intelligence. Modern LLMs like ChatGPT are new. Machine Learning is a framework of rote processing but not understanding. AI understands things and can interpret and create things. Languages, art, movies, reports, Emails, etc.

It’s not even close. The fact that Apple is trying to partner with ChatGPT to bake that into their OSes tells people all they need to know about Apple and AI: they screwed up, and missed the mark and are now playing catch up, needing someone else’s technology because they have nothing of note.

 

[Cirillo Gherardo]

No, machine learning is not AI. And Apple hasn’t had AI. Apple has had a dumb assistant and some machine learning that can at best recognize simple patterns.

AI is exactly what it says: artificial intelligence. Modern LLMs like ChatGPT are new. Machine Learning is a framework of rote processing but not understanding. AI understands things and can interpret and create things. Languages, art, movies, reports, Emails, etc.

It’s not even close. The fact that Apple is trying to partner with ChatGPT to bake that into their OSes tells people all they need to know about Apple and AI: they screwed up, and missed the mark and are now playing catch up, needing someone else’s technology because they have nothing of note.

To be fair, there is a crapload of "AI" being branded as AI today that is not AI at all. Case in point would be Amazon's AI Review Summaries. There is zero "understanding" there at all.

 

[Devyn89]

No, machine learning is not AI. And Apple hasn’t had AI. Apple has had a dumb assistant and some machine learning that can at best recognize simple patterns.

AI is exactly what it says: artificial intelligence. Modern LLMs like ChatGPT are new. Machine Learning is a framework of rote processing but not understanding. AI understands things and can interpret and create things. Languages, art, movies, reports, Emails, etc.

It’s not even close. The fact that Apple is trying to partner with ChatGPT to bake that into their OSes tells people all they need to know about Apple and AI: they screwed up, and missed the mark and are now playing catch up, needing someone else’s technology because they have nothing of note.

If that was true than why is AI telling depressed people to jump off a bridge, or answering a question with no then when you read the answer it’s actually yes. If it was interpreting data it wouldn’t tell depressed people to jump off a bridge. We have zero evidence that Apple is partnering with ChatGPT except rumours. They’re the same thing, it’s all marketing.

 

[Kahnforever]

If that was true than why is AI telling depressed people to jump off a bridge, or answering a question with no then when you read the answer it’s actually yes. If it was interpreting data it wouldn’t tell depressed people to jump off a bridge. We have zero evidence that Apple is partnering with ChatGPT except rumours. They’re the same thing, it’s all marketing.

You cherry pick something out of a Google search result and somehow think that that demonstrates that AI isn’t intelligent? That is totally erroneous and also demonstrates that you lack an understanding of how an LLM works.

And Apple working with ChatGPT or Google is more than just a rumour as it’s been reported in places such as Forbes.

What we do know is this: SIRI sucks and is based on a decade old technology. It’s not AI. Apple spent a bunch of time and money on an electric car project that sucked billions and over a decade of their time… ending in failure. Apple pumped a bunch of its focus on spatial computing with the AVP that nobody needs and nobody is buying. And here we are. They’ve missed the mark.

Apple’s pursuits in AI date back decades: they were a member of an Open Source AI solution back in the 1990s. They have done some of their own work in AI, along with papers written on the subject, some patent activity etc. but nothing like LLMs like ChatGPT. ChatGPT is about 10-15 years ahead of schedule and Microsoft did the right thing by investing in it and baking it into their software universe.

I just created a chatbot using Microsoft’s Copilot studio and spent half a day training it for a large organization that has many departments and a customer service team. A bunch of policy documents, laws and webpages were input into it and after testing it, it literally could do the job of many people at the organization. This is where the world is going, and Apple needs to stop wasting its time on unicorn projects and get back on track.

Apple’s New ChatGPT Deal—Here’s What It Means For iPhone Security

Apple has nearly finalized a deal with ChatGPT maker OpenAI, according to reports. What does that mean for the security, privacy and functionality of your iPhone?

www.forbes.com

 

[namethisfile]

there's probably a reason why apple is late to the AI party.,, because it is fashionable! Dun, Dun, Dun... lol

 

[bcortens]

But why wouldn't it just mean that developers write in a common framework going forward that creates an app that can run under *either* environment. In the iPad case it runs without window gadgets... and in the Mac case, with those gadgets. In both cases they'd work with the same filesystem (iPad would have a simulated or duplicated Home directory and Library structure, etc).

Same app for both environments using the same development framework and libraries would seem the way forward.

Not necessarily, if Mac apps ran on iPad using AppKit they wouldn’t have to be modified to look nice on iPad, they could still be basically unmodified Mac apps that mostly suck to use without a mouse and keyboard. Even if they did bring iPadOS affordances to app kit that still relies on devs to take advantage of those affordances.

 

[Rafterman]

Nope, not like that at all. It’s really funny the lengths some people here will go in order to try to have a point, any point, at all. Especially when they don’t.

It's exactly like that. We don't know what Apple will do in the future, it's foolish to say "never." Even an Apple VP said when asked about touchscreens:

Mac and iPad marketing VP Tom Boger recently responded to a question on the topic by initially appearing to stick to the usual line – but added “I can’t say we never change our mind” …

 

[Kahnforever]

It's exactly like that. We don't know what Apple will do in the future, it's foolish to say "never." Even an Apple VP said when asked about touchscreens:

Mac and iPad marketing VP Tom Boger recently responded to a question on the topic by initially appearing to stick to the usual line – but added “I can’t say we never change our mind” …

It isn’t foolish to say never. A wrist watch will never be an airplane. A crocodile will never be a cloud.

An iPad will never be a Mac and vice versa for the many reasons already mentioned. The future of computing is likely chips implanted in us with a built in AR experience, rollout displays and other crazy stuff that will CHANGE THE FORM FACTOR of computing devices.

 

[Melbourne Park]

Yes. I’m a Product Manager and have to deal
with users and scoping products all the time. It’s difficult and also impossible to please everyone. But if every product was made in a way to please everyone, we’d just be pumping out a lawn mower with wings.

Ah now I see how you have a focus on the hardware.

Fact is that many people have been using iPads as a window to operating Windows, because they want to. It's as simple as that - not a product issue at all. And I think Steven Jobs would not regard a 13" iPad as being an iPad either. It screams that it want to be more than a Pad. But its potential is being hobbled. Apple have even withdrawn software that allowed a simple window to Windows. And I think there are still ways for those who want, to be able to do that. People are now running Windows on phones. God knows why but if they want to do it, then being outside of Apple allows people to do that type of thing. Apple seems totally product and Apple environment income driven.

 

[Melbourne Park]

Friend of mine had dinner with us last night. He's an IT consultant, has been since the late 1970's. He has a cheap as crap Windows PC and on holiday, will have to do two days work. He'll use his barely a brand mobile phone and a keyboard, and use it as a window to a Windows environment. His crappy mobile is four years old and cost one eighth the price of an Apple Pro iPhone. He thinks Apple are robbers. He loves his cheap mobile phone too.

Just a reminder - I am in Australia. He deals with a lot of Chinese and Indian programmers. He reckons the Chinese are great at database work, but have very poor English skills. But that ChatGTP is changing their communication deficiencies. They use it to communicate extremely well now. Indians have no English difficulties. But my friend said that they had some C coding to do, and ChatGTP ran a few pages of perfect code in an instant, and it was perfect. The guys there all realised a huge amount of the type of work they all do at the moment, will be gone. My friend said that inside 5 years that work space will be entirely different. And that there were elements of it that were worrying. It'll be our kids or grand kids issues he said. He's a couple of years from retiring.