Well, all what I'm saying is that the MacBook Pro with Touch Bar is dying, whatever you like it or not. There is nothing we can do about it. Apple made its mea culpa when it introduced the new MacBook Pro 14"/16", clearly stating that "pro" users preferred the traditional keyboard.
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The M2 MBP makes absolutely no sense
- Thread starter rm5
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So in the end, the power consumption increase will surely be the undoing of the MBA? Also, the whole heat throttling was expected as at idle Apple stated it has an increased 1.3W in consumption. I can already hear the silent screams of all the bashers of the 13" MBP
If the touch bar is make or break for you for some reason, I would get one this cycle. I wouldn't bank on it being around next time they do a range refresh. It couldn't be more obvious that this iteration of the MBP sticks out like a prostitute in a convent in its current configuration, and that its days are numbered. It just does not fit with the design language of the rest of the range, and at some point that design language will be fully harmonised. For example, look at the new MBA.
I would bank on it seeing as Apple has stated it sells very well. Just because it doesn't or will not fit into your world view doesn't mean it won't for others. Have an open mind.
I have an open mind. It's very possible Apple will keep some kind of 13" MBP because from what others have said, outside the UK it sells very well to enterprise users, which probably explains why it's the second-best selling Macbook.
But just look at it: compared to even the new MBA let alone the 14 and 16, it has a dated design, a crap webcam, the worst speakers of any Macbook (granted we haven't heard the M2 MBA), 'probably' the worst screen on any current Macbook except the M1 Air ('probably' because if the 13.6" screen on the M2 MBA is worse with its billion colours and 500 nits, Apple have royally screwed up), and that touchbar. From a design perspective it's a relic from the previous generation of Macbooks. Clearly its days are numbered.
That's what I'm trying to explain since a couple of messages. 🤭
Let's have this discussion:
- Dated design? Why? One could argue the MBA and 14/16 MBPs have the dated design as that design comes from the PowerPC times.
- All Macs have bad webcams. Even the new ones are bad that people make threads on them. Reason why Apple made people's iPhones a webcam and acknowledged such fact
- Specs? Those are mostly dependent on the person needing them.
- Probably? Not a word to be using here. It is or it isn't.
- TouchBar is a matter of taste. Like I said, some people like it some hate it. Apparently it is well liked enough that it keeps selling.
- Relic? If it was updated, I'd be hard pressed to call it that.
I know. Some people are taking it all personally as though we're sitting here slagging off their ancestors. I'm just trying to point out the obviously inevitable. But if I could put an actual time on when it will happen, I'd be Tim Cook.
I would have to fork out another $1000 or so since I would only buy 16GB RAM, 1TB HD.
Would you consider an M1 13"? Deals will be there to be had when the M2 arrives...
I do too; however, people using the 1080p v 720p camera as an excuse are just grasping for straws as both are equally bad. I for one, see them just fine for quick communication and work calls.
1...Ok let's substitute the word dated for the word "not consistent with the current design language"
2...Agreed, but this is the poorest unless Apple have ****ed up t he 1080p webcam on the M2 MBA...we don't know yet
3...Of course.
4...If you mean 'probably' about why it sells 2nd best, feel free to delete the word probably: that will be the reason. As for the other probablies, speculation on my part, granted, because we haven't seen the M2 MBA yet, but we know about the 13 MBP
5...Of course.
6...Relic as in not fitting the current design language.
- Why should it have the current design? Why should all MacBooks have the same design, isn't the whole Apple branding behind "Think Different"?
- We know the 1080p camera is just as bad as the 720p camera. Just look in this same forum and you'll find a multi-page thread about that same issue. Due to Supply Chain simplification, it is quite possible the same camera module on the 14/16 MBP will be found on the MBA. Hence, it'll also be just as bad.
- Agreed
- We have no idea why it has sold as 2nd best. All we know it does and by the looks of things from the benchmarks, it will. Be that due to preferences of buyers, B2B requirements or other. The reason that it sells 2nd best still stands.
- Agreed.
- Again, back to #1
1...That's the way they usually head. Granted it can take them a while: took them 4 years to discontinue the 2012 A1278, but that machine's days were numbered as soon as the first retina Macs appeared. They kept the 'relic' going, because, once again, it was the cheapest MBP and it sold by the bucketload, loads to enterprise, with its awful 1200x800 screen with an appalling viewing angle, tinny speakers, antique (by 2016 standards) processor, spinning plates of rust for storage, 2GB RAM (iirc) and a DVD drive.
2...IMO that's better than the webcam on 13" MPB, be it because of clever processing or a different module, but obviously other opinions are available
4...We'll never know but once I again I suspect it's for no other reason than it is the cheapest Mac with Pro in the name. Outside the UK, enterprise buy them by the bucketload, and one mention of better cooling to stop their knees getting burned and it's an easy upsell to gullible customers whose needs would likely be met by an MBA.
6...As 1.
- That Mac went away as B2B and people realized the beauty of the Retina display. Right now, people are either hating or loving the notch. Also, the DVD was something of gonner.
- Again, just look at this same forum of people complaining how trash the 1080p looks or that it is even on par with the 720p.
- Skipped
- Likely? Again with the assumption phrases. Everyone needs are different. This Mac serves that needs for a specific audience even if you feel differently. Again, have an open mind.
In the UK the MBP and MBA at 512Gb are the exact same cost. For me, it's an utter no-brainer to get the MBP simply because of the touch bar. I mean look at it, it's amazing. I'd pay a £100 premium for it easy, especially with all the 3rd party mods you can get for it. The only thing that's a shame is the slightly bigger screen in the MBA I'd say, I doubt it the MBP needs to be thinner and it certainly barely feels any weight difference to the MBA M1.
(that said, I guess if the MBA had a touchbar then that really would be the ultimate buy)
(that said, I guess if the MBA had a touchbar then that really would be the ultimate buy)
I do have an open mind...we just come to different conclusions. But time I believe will prove me right. And I don't think it will take very long. I'll bet my right arm that there won't be an M4 in this identical form factor, and considering I only have the one arm that's a pretty dangerous bet. I seriously doubt there'll be an M3 version as well, but I can't predict that. Depends how many unsold shells and touchbars Apple have knocking about their factories.
It's still here because it's selling well. It's selling well because it's the cheapest Macbook Pro. The Air still has a lot of stigma, being associated with being an underpowered entry-level Mac that can't pull the skin off rice pudding.
I don't have a degree in marketing but that's pretty logical to me.
For the time that we are in, it makes total sense:
In an alternative timeline, where we weren't having these logistical issues, I can surely imagine Apple just announcing the M2-enabled MacBook Air and leave it at that.
The faux-13-inch MacBook Pro with TouchBar and M2 wouldn't exist in this alternative timeline.
- chip shortages
- inflation
- pandemic
- supply chain issues
In an alternative timeline, where we weren't having these logistical issues, I can surely imagine Apple just announcing the M2-enabled MacBook Air and leave it at that.
The faux-13-inch MacBook Pro with TouchBar and M2 wouldn't exist in this alternative timeline.
Next to 2020 MBA M1 it's right now the only one without a notch. I just bought the MBP M2 after I saw the notch in person.
Menubar use more lines than usual, means it waste space and I don't like it. Usable lines for apps are not that much like tech specs provides. Also horizontal menubar space is reduced.
Notch would be ok for phones ... a bit, but please no notch on a Laptop. iPad Pro includes a webcam without a notch and it's from 2018.
Then there is Touch Bar. Never had one. But I found more use cases and fun with the Touch Bar thanks to BetterTouchTool app than to stare at the notch and think about how much space it wastes.
All other features (120hz, MagSafe, more ports ...) are relative and for most of them I don't care. My external display also just shows 60hz, where I spend also some hours a day.
Menubar use more lines than usual, means it waste space and I don't like it. Usable lines for apps are not that much like tech specs provides. Also horizontal menubar space is reduced.
Notch would be ok for phones ... a bit, but please no notch on a Laptop. iPad Pro includes a webcam without a notch and it's from 2018.
Then there is Touch Bar. Never had one. But I found more use cases and fun with the Touch Bar thanks to BetterTouchTool app than to stare at the notch and think about how much space it wastes.
All other features (120hz, MagSafe, more ports ...) are relative and for most of them I don't care. My external display also just shows 60hz, where I spend also some hours a day.