Next tuesday the Intel Mac mini will be removed from the Apple Store.
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The new Mac mini is almost certainly coming
- Thread starter GabrieleR
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Yeah - the Mac Mini case is able to support a desktop-class i7 space heater - but not silently. Apple could potentially fit it with whatever M-series processor they liked, but you'd still have considerable fan noise from a Pro or Max chip under load.
I get the impression that Apple have set themselves higher standards for thermal headroom than before (a luxury that they can afford with M1). The Studio Max, for instance, has massive cooling overkill that means the fan rarely goes above idle. (I think Apple have a separate QA problem with "whinegate" on the Studio, but a "good" Studio is only just audible in a dead quiet room - even when it is under a heavy load which would have the fans roaring on any Intel Mac).
Maybe this is because "quiet is good" but it could also be that Apple are trying to reduce the thermal/mechanical stress on the components. The M-series chips are relatively large lumps of silicon (so lots of scope for thermal expansion), with more lumps of silicon soldered on (RAM) and repeatedly heating them from room-temperature to the sort of toasty near-100C temperatures and then blasting them with cold air probably isn't a good thing. (I'm thinking of the GPU problem in the 2011 MacBooks which was partly down to thermal stresses). Just a theory (but it would explain why the Studio fan always runs - so the CPU never gets really hot, rather than Apple making it silent-at-idle and only cut in the fans once things had already started to get hot).
Having the fan run all the time is standard behaviour for many computers, whether the cooling is truly needed or not.
iPads, at least, have a large aluminium back for passive cooling (and iPhones haven't gone to M-series yet). Polycarbonate is going to tend to trap the heat.
The other thing is the power supply - which more or less has to be an external brick on a mobile device but is rather nice to have built-in to a static device (for my money it's one of the plus points of both the Mini and the Apple TV).
Make the Mini too small and you'll have to switch to an external power brick - which you'll have to include as the device has no battery - and will then need a separate rigid enclosure and insulation (more weight and volume) and which the packaging will have to keep separate from the main box (more volume).
The same applies to the Apple TV but it only needs a PSU big enough for an A15. A Mac Mini needs something like 20W for a M2 plus minimum 15W per Thunderbolt port to meet TB4 specifications.
As for co-hosters: they have lots of custom racking designed for the 12-year-old Mac Mini form factor, so they won't appreciate a size change. Also, if you're going to rack a lot of Mac Minis together it's probably better to have fan-driven cooling to physically move the heat away.
That said - the Mac Mini is a 12-year old design designed to hold an optical drive and spinning-rust HD so of course it could probably be made smaller.
It all depends on your design. If you pick low-power parts. a large case, and a lot of large fans, then you can have a cool-running system that is also quiet. The fans are running but they don't make a lot of noise. I have a desktop like that. Historically, though, Apple uses up thermal capacity if they can. This is why I may keep my M1 Pro MacBook Pro for many years as I think that they will use up that headroom, at least until the next shrink.
I never said they'd be loud. I just said they'd be running.
For a desktop like the Mac mini or Mac Studio, I don't really see the need to turn the fan off, ever. In fact, having a fan turning on and off constantly could be more problematic in terms of noise generation than having a fan running all the time at low rpm.
I suppose you could run it at 1 RPM.
I don't think that the fan ever comes on in my M1 Pro MacBook Pro and that has twice the horsepower and maybe the same or less volume.
Your MBP is not a desktop. And the MBP fans are considerably louder than the Mac Studio fans if running fast.
I've used it as a desktop in the past. I've used Intel MBPs as a desktop in the past in clamshell mode too.
I've never heard the fans on my MacBook Pro 16; I've never heard them on my M1 mini either though I can feel the air coming out the back of it.
It would be interesting if you could control the fan speed of the m1 mini below minimum. I suspect that it could run with the fans off.
I'm no expert because I don't own one, but FWIW, according to reviews, the fans in the M1 Max MBPs don’t become annoying unless you’re maxing out the CPU for extended periods. And it’s not anywhere as loud as the Intel models. However, they're still easily audible when stressed. In contrast, the Mac Studios are significantly quieter under the same load.
As for running the MBP in clamshell mode, unless you're stressing it out, clamshell mode in itself doesn't really mean much. The screen is off after all. Hell, back in 2021, I ran a 12" MacBook (16 GB) as a desktop in clamshell mode for an entire month, and the thing didn't skip a beat. It wasn't exactly fast, but as far as I could tell there was no throttling or anything like that whatsoever, and that's an Intel machine that doesn't even have a fan. How? Well, I just run business applications which sometimes can take a moderate amount of RAM, but which don't usually tax the CPU too much, and which don't tax the GPU at all.
P.S. Since I don't use my MacBook for much these days (as much of its functionality has been replaced by my iPad Pro with Smart Keyboard), after my Mac Pro started giving me problems I considered just using the MacBook as a desktop replacement until the M2 / M2 Pro Mac mini came out. However, with its single USB-C port and no separate charging port, it was annoying. So, in November 2021 I bought my 8 GB 2014 Core i5-4278U Mac mini (only $145 plus shipping! and a cheap NVMe SSD upgrade) to tide me over until I bought a new Apple Silicon Mac mini. Considering it's almost November 2022 now, it definitely has earned its keep. Oh and it's also been completely silent this entire time with nearly all of my usage except when I tried playing some HEVC videos. (Those 2014 machines have no hardware HEVC acceleration.)
BTW, in terms of memory, with light business type usage, 8 GB is easily sufficient. With extended light usage I will see some swap, but it's usually only a small amount and it doesn't impact the overall experience. With 24 GB on my iMac, with this type of usage there is never much swap at all though. With heavier business usage and multitasking, 8 GB can become limiting, but again on the 24 GB iMac memory just isn't an issue. As mentioned I also had the experience of running that 16 GB MacBook for a month with the same usage. It's nice to be able to directly compare 8 GB, 16 GB, and 24 GB daily with similar workloads, and it seems 16 GB is probably my sweet spot, but for an AS Mac mini, I may end up getting 24 GB anyway just because. Not sure yet though.
There's nothing that I do that stresses an M1 Pro. I would be fine with the M1 or M2 but I wanted the screen, ports, and additional display capabilities. So no choice as Apple doesn't make something in-between. I think that I'd like a 15 inch Air. I do love the M1 Pro MacBook Pro 16 but it is overkill for my use. It does everything that I need it to easily. The thing is that my workload heavily stressed my 2015 MacBook Pro 15 and that it doesn't even sweat with the same workload on the M1 Pro - is rather amazing.
I'd guess that most people that buy the M1 Pro MacBooks don't need the CPU/GPU on them. If Apple had launched a 15 Air at the same time; a lot of people would have chosen that model. There are times when the weight and size of the 16 is annoying.
Everytime I see this thread on the list I laugh... Not sure why, but it's kinda funny.
The Mac mini crowd is a very vocal one! Now… where is my ****ing M2 Pro mini?
I used to have entire days where my old PowerBook G4 was in clamshell. Same with the iBook G3 I had until it finally had the graphics card failure (literally A MONTH after the repair program ended).
It's such a funny thread because it was just a random person saying "New Mac Mini might be coming!" back in 2013 but it ended up being adopted as the unofficial "Mac Mini release speculation thread".
I haven't yet owned a Mac Mini but these days it's looking like the next Mac for me. I have two ageing MacBook Air machines that are fine for now so I'm in no rush. I was really impressed by the Mac Studio upon release but when I calmed down and compared machines, I acknowledged that most of the Studio's attributes would be wasted on me and my usage. Factoring in the cost of the Studio's 32GB RAM, stock 512GB storage, hefty CPU and GPU difference, and additional ports etc, a more realistic (and affordable), streamlined Mac Studio option ended up, of course, being the Mac Mini. I could even get away with 'just' 256GB storage on the Mini, but with 16GB memory for peace of mind. (More ports would be nice but not essential.)
I have to say that these days I seem to find something unsatisfactory with most Macs when I browse to see what's available. I don't like the notch on the laptops and I'm not wowed by the M2 MacBook Air design generally, nor by the M1 iMac's. The Mac Studio doesn't really fit for me and I was disappointed to learn that the fan was always on. Recent years have spoiled me for silent computing and I wouldn't want to return to any sort of noise while I work. Even the Mac Mini seemed to have its issues with Bluetooth and wifi, while my daily thirteen-inch MacBook Air has suffered from intermittent wake/sleep problems verging on the mildly irritating.
I'd like to return to 'it just works', and hopefully a tweaked Mac Mini will fit that bill sufficiently.
I have to say that these days I seem to find something unsatisfactory with most Macs when I browse to see what's available. I don't like the notch on the laptops and I'm not wowed by the M2 MacBook Air design generally, nor by the M1 iMac's. The Mac Studio doesn't really fit for me and I was disappointed to learn that the fan was always on. Recent years have spoiled me for silent computing and I wouldn't want to return to any sort of noise while I work. Even the Mac Mini seemed to have its issues with Bluetooth and wifi, while my daily thirteen-inch MacBook Air has suffered from intermittent wake/sleep problems verging on the mildly irritating.
I'd like to return to 'it just works', and hopefully a tweaked Mac Mini will fit that bill sufficiently.
The fan would likely be always on for the M2 Mac mini as well. (It is for the M1.) However, it's not audible unless you're really, really close to it.
BTW, the M1 Mac mini has been plagued by monitor compatibility issues. Here's hoping they're solved in version 2.0.
If you could install an old Mac OS (or OS X) then I think the Mac mini 'just works', but the past 3 or 4 OSs have been anything but just working. But that's another topic entirely....
Done a bit of digging on this for anyone else deciding. For music production folks, Music Radar ran some tests on the M1 & M2 Airs that give a clue as to the specific benefits an M2 chip brings to music production.
Logic test
Ableton test
Their conclusion is that M2 is roughly an 8% difference in performance for audio production. And if you were being rational about the price difference, a 24GB/1TB config is 28% more in price for that 8% jump. But I think using the actual numbers is quite interesting. They could frame it as £449/$449 for 1.5 seconds faster loading time, 0.8 seconds faster render times, 12 extra audio tracks in Ableton and 8 extra tracks in Logic. As you say for a hobby it's hard to justify the uptick. That might be why the review says M1 probably gets the job done and given the price difference is the biggest competition for M2 for producers.
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Not followed lovetodream for a while. Wonder if this means anything.