The Next MacBook Pro Update

[zioxide]

> Flash and HDD for storage. Put the OS on a 4/8/16 GB flashdrive, and have Apps install there, and put most everything but a GB of the latest working docs on the HDD. That way instant boot. Faster processing. Better battery life.

Probably not yet. Flash memory still has a limited read/write cycle compared to hard drives. Maybe in 2 years.

> GPS. It will happen one day. A portable unit for use with all Apple BT enabled devices (iPhone) would be pretty popular with Google Map users.

Maybe.

> HDMI out replaces DVI out. Pretty much going to happen if Bluray is enabled.

Not going to happen. If you want to connect to HDMI, get a DVI to HDMI cable. HDMI and DVI are pin compatible, and both support HDCP. So you don't need an HDMI port to have blu-ray.

> Dedicated H264 processor. To take the heavy lifting off the CPUs for video.

Possible, but with CPU power increasing it might not be necessary.

> Small external screen - for widgets, reminders etc when sleeping.

Doubtful.

> Even higher screen resolution 1920x1080 for 15" screens with the coming of Leopard and screen independence.

They'll probably have a 1680x1050 option within the next 2 updates, but no 1900x1200 for a while.

> New keyboard along the lines of the MB. Still backlit.

Probable, but that's going to suck :/

> Better battery life.

> Lighter

This is almost always probable with new technology.

> 10-12" model - superlight model

maybe.

> 512MB graphics card option

This will come eventually, maybe next summer.

> New magnetic or re-engineered lid clasp

probably.

> iMac like high gloss and tougher glass screen

glass would add a shitton of weight and would be fragile. Plus the professionals who buy Macbook Pros don't want a glossy screen.

I'll add: case redesign to add a user serviceable hard drive.


Basically here's whats going to happen.

The Mobile Penryn chip (which is a 45nm die shrink of the current core microarchitecture) is supposed to come out in early 2008. This will be added in a simple update sometime around January or February.

The next significant update will be when Intel launches the Montevina centrino mobile platform in the 2nd quarter of 2008. This will be included in a Macbook Pro revision sometime during the Summer 2008.

Here's what's not going to happen:

Intel Core 2 Extreme (2.6/2.8 GHz): These things just use too much power and generate too much heat. You'd have awful battery life.

nVidia 8700/8800m: MBP has never had a top of the line card and these wouldnt offer enough of a performance increase to merit the huge hit in battery life. The next graphics card update will be when they get Montevina in Summer 08 (similar to the SR this year). They'll probably have 9600m GT.

 

[casw1000]

I am also going to be buying a MBP probably the 15" as I would like the LED screen and if it was of higher resolution great.

My wish list and the most important one is an eSata port that we could boot from. I have seen today a 2.5" eSata portable drive and that would be just handy to boot Vista when I need compatibility with a windoz client network.

Sure more speed would be nice, but having played on a MB @ 2.16 today I found it to be nippy, so I am guessing that the 2.4 would be quite fast already.

Better graphics would be nice, I will not be able to replace this laptop for a good couple of years and therefore I would like to use this as a good all round machine and yes that includes some lesiure time as well.

So to recap my wishes for an updated MBP

Higher Res Display
eSata bootable
HDMI
HD/BD rom.

I am tempted in some ways to go cheap for now and just get a refurb macbook, but seeing that my company is giving me some funds towards this purchase as it will be used for work, I don't want to miss out on getting a high end super slick MBP laptop.

Just my thoughts.
-casw1000

 

[Inconsequential]

I want:

200Gb 7200RPM for less than the £100/150 they want to upgrade to the 160Gb 7200RPM.

8700M in 17 inch and the 2.6Ghz T7800.

Then im sorted for buying the 17 Inch MBP when it comes out

 

[colto]

Probably not yet. Flash memory still has a limited read/write cycle compared to hard drives. Maybe in 2 years.



Maybe.



Not going to happen. If you want to connect to HDMI, get a DVI to HDMI cable. HDMI and DVI are pin compatible, and both support HDCP. So you don't need an HDMI port to have blu-ray.



Possible, but with CPU power increasing it might not be necessary.



Doubtful.



They'll probably have a 1680x1050 option within the next 2 updates, but no 1900x1200 for a while.



Probable, but that's going to suck :/


This is almost always probable with new technology.



maybe.



This will come eventually, maybe next summer.


probably.


glass would add a shitton of weight and would be fragile. Plus the professionals who buy Macbook Pros don't want a glossy screen.

I'll add: case redesign to add a user serviceable hard drive.


Basically here's whats going to happen.

The Mobile Penryn chip (which is a 45nm die shrink of the current core microarchitecture) is supposed to come out in early 2008. This will be added in a simple update sometime around January or February.

The next significant update will be when Intel launches the Montevina centrino mobile platform in the 2nd quarter of 2008. This will be included in a Macbook Pro revision sometime during the Summer 2008.

Here's what's not going to happen:

Intel Core 2 Extreme (2.6/2.8 GHz): These things just use too much power and generate too much heat. You'd have awful battery life.

nVidia 8700/8800m: MBP has never had a top of the line card and these wouldnt offer enough of a performance increase to merit the huge hit in battery life. The next graphics card update will be when they get Montevina in Summer 08 (similar to the SR this year). They'll probably have 9600m GT.

Wow. I actually agreed with every single thing you said.....and that's rare.

 

[colto]

Hmm I have read a couple rumors about the strong possibility of a black MacBook Pro. I guess it would make sense as the black MacBook sells well and Apple has a current trend towards silver and black. Could this be the new higher end 15"? I don't know if this will be new 15", but I do know that the MBP looks sexy as hell in black.

 

[Taylor C]

I think anodized aluminum looks a hell of a lot better than black. >.>

 

[colto]

I think anodized aluminum looks a hell of a lot better than black. >.>

Well that's just a mock-up so I have no idea how Apple might do it. I would assume black aluminum but who knows. But I think it's about time the MBP gets some kind of new design.

 

[CalBoy]

But I think it's about time the MBP gets some kind of new design.

Why? It still looks good. There's no need to change it if still looks atractive, sleek, and modern. Once the look begins to look like its a bit long in the tooth, a change is necessary.

 

[colto]

Why? It still looks good. There's no need to change it if still looks atractive, sleek, and modern. Once the look begins to look like its a bit long in the tooth, a change is necessary.

While it is sleek, I have never thought that the silver looked that great and I can't say it looks modern because it has had the same damn design for so long. Sure laptop design aren't going to change that much, but at least a new color or something. It's not that big of a deal I guess but I just hate aluminum...

 

[japasneezemonk]

I agree that the MBP needs a magnetic latch and a few other small design changes. However, it still looks good and modern. It also helps the resale value of older Powerbooks and MBP's. A good comparasion would be the older Eames Aluminium Chair (Circa 1958). Good design usually undergoes very simple continuous development. I'm happy.

 

[CalBoy]

While it is sleek, I have never thought that the silver looked that great and I can't say it looks modern because it has had the same damn design for so long. Sure laptop design aren't going to change that much, but at least a new color or something. It's not that big of a deal I guess but I just hate aluminum...

Well, I guess that's where we diverge. I love silver. However, I personally don't think that whether or not a design is "new" determines whether or not it's design is modern. For example, my 4th Gen iPod still looks more modern to me than a brown Zune.

 

[colto]

Well, I guess that's where we diverge. I love silver. However, I personally don't think that whether or not a design is "new" determines whether or not it's design is modern. For example, my 4th Gen iPod still looks more modern to me than a brown Zune.

Haha yeah personal preferences I guess. I had a friend who bought a Zune. One day whenever he was complaining to me about how nobody else had a Zune to share songs with him I just turned to him, looked him in the eye, and said "Welcome to the social" and we both busted up laughing. Always thought Zune would suck and I'm glad I didn't buy one. But back on topic..... Macbook Pros.....they rock.

 

[colto]

Just got my iPod Touch today making it my first Apple product ever. Definitely plan on getting a nice shiny SR MBP +1 revision when it comes out though.

 

[cervaro]

User upgradeable hard drives are a must. It took me 5 minutes to upgrade the hard drive in an old Toshiba laptop a few months back! (two screws, remove small cover on bottom of machine, swap drive)

Support for HD video in terms of removing load from the processor could mean a return to ATI as with the iMacs, in the form of a mobile Radeon 2xxx series graphics chip if it exists? If PC manufacturers can stick HD-DVD and Bluray in their laptops, then Apple can, but that would currently mean aligning themselves totally with one format. Then again, I seem to recall Apple backed Bluray, so they could stick a BR drive in the MBP and offer HD-DVD as an external option at a later date, or switch to a combo drive when they appear.

Higher resolution 15" screens might make me think twice about a 17", but I ultimately think that 17" will be my final option.

I seriously think they could take 20% off the price across the board too. Might make the MBP a more tempting option towards potential switchers compared to a PC laptop given the Bootcamp or Parallels option. Doubt it'd hurt Apple that much in the pocket.

 

[CalBoy]

User upgradeable hard drives are a must. It took me 5 minutes to upgrade the hard drive in an old Toshiba laptop a few months back! (two screws, remove small cover on bottom of machine, swap drive)

Agreed. This is one advantage the macbook has over the pro.

I seriously think they could take 20% off the price across the board too. Might make the MBP a more tempting option towards potential switchers compared to a PC laptop given the Bootcamp or Parallels option. Doubt it'd hurt Apple that much in the pocket.

That would really cut into Apple's bottom line(I assume you mean the 20% would apply to all macbook/macbook pro models right?). Think about it:

Base macbook: $1100==>$880
Mid macbook: $1300==>$1040
Blackbook: $1500==>$1200
Base mbp: $2000==>$1600
Mid mbp: $2500==>$2000
17" mbp: $2800==>$2240

Now, these number are a flat 20%; I'm sure the price points would be more consumer friendly (ie, $1040 would be rounded to either $1050 or $1100). These numbers also look nice to us as consuemrs, but they would destroy profitability on a lot of models (esspecially on the base mbp and the mid macbook).

Now, if you meant only the pro models, then I can say that won't happen for sure. There's no way a $100 difference would be enough to differentiate between the Blackbook and the base mbp.

 

[cervaro]

Well I was thinking MBP specifically. In the UK you could have the following pricing structure with a 20% discount:

15" 2.2GHz - £1299 (£1039 -> £999 or $2000)
15" 2.4GHz - £1599 (£1279 -> £1299 or $2600)
17" 2.4GHz - £1799 (£1439 -> £1449 or $2900)

So given the overinflated UK pricing Apple apply to UK products compared to the USA, a 20% discount on the MBP, and maybe 10% on the MB range isn't so unreasonable to wish for. If Apple can tempt a potential PC laptop buyer over to the MBP, there's all the follow-up purchases that gives them more money, e.g. software, peripherals, maybe the odd iPod, iPhone, etc.

So with a 20% discount in the UK, we'd only be paying around the same that US buyers do. About time that strong exchange rate worked in our favour for once. After all, the MBP and every other Apple machine seems to originate from the same Chinese factory these days, so why shouldn't we have global pricing.

 

[CalBoy]

Well I was thinking MBP specifically. In the UK you could have the following pricing structure with a 20% discount:

15" 2.2GHz - £1299 (£1039 -> £999 or $2000)
15" 2.4GHz - £1599 (£1279 -> £1299 or $2600)
17" 2.4GHz - £1799 (£1439 -> £1449 or $2900)

So given the overinflated UK pricing Apple apply to UK products compared to the USA, a 20% discount on the MBP, and maybe 10% on the MB range isn't so unreasonable to wish for. If Apple can tempt a potential PC laptop buyer over to the MBP, there's all the follow-up purchases that gives them more money, e.g. software, peripherals, maybe the odd iPod, iPhone, etc.

So with a 20% discount in the UK, we'd only be paying around the same that US buyers do. About time that strong exchange rate worked in our favour for once. After all, the MBP and every other Apple machine seems to originate from the same Chinese factory these days, so why shouldn't we have global pricing.

Wait, don't UK prices include VAT? UK prices aren't inflated as much as you think they are. Nearly 300 pounds gets knocked off without the VAT (according to Apple's site). Remember, in the US, sales tax is never included in the price. I think with that, you can see that it's not as bad as you thought. Granted, it's a little more than what it is in the US, but that's because there are certain costs associated with doing business in another country that's using a different currency, and because Europe is generally more expensive than the US in things like land.

PS: I didn't know you meant GBP, I assumed you were talking about USD

 

[colto]

So it appears that I was (probably)right about the Penryn processors and the January release date. It's good to hear a few more credible(yet still speculative) sources.

http://9to5mac.com/Apple-event-kinda-ho-kinda-hum-2345666778

https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/357846/

Thoughts? Comments?

 

[Inconsequential]

So it appears that I was (probably)right about the Penryn processors and the January release date. It's good to hear a few more credible(yet still speculative) sources.

http://9to5mac.com/Apple-event-kinda-ho-kinda-hum-2345666778

https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/357846/

Thoughts? Comments?

I really hope its before then!

Im waiting till the end of Oct for 10.5, but I ain't waiting till Jan...

Could buy it then sell it...


Grrrrrrr

Hate the way technology moves so dam quick

 

[reflex]

> Flash and HDD for storage. Put the OS on a 4/8/16 GB flashdrive, and have Apps install there, and put most everything but a GB of the latest working docs on the HDD. That way instant boot. Faster processing. Better battery life.

For me it would have to be at least 32GB for an "OS and apps" drive. My Applications folder isn't very big (4GB), but the Library folder alone is already 10GB.

 

[jdechko]

...snip...

I'll agree with you on most everything you said, but I want to add a couple of comments of my own.

1) RE: SSD, a 16GB drive just won't cut it. The base installs right now are in the neighborhood of 10-15GB. FCS and LS8 are large programs themselves (50+ GB each). Add in a 30GB bootcamp partition and you're quickly low on space. So Apple would need to include another HD as well, and there just isn't room in the current cases. In addidtion HP is charging another $1000 to BTO a 64GB SSD in their business line. I'm thinking at least 2 years for the 256GB SSDs to come down enough to be put into mainstream machines.

2) RE: dedicated H264 decoder, you are correct in that the increase in processor speeds will assist in decoding HD video, however, the 8600m already helps out a lot due to the PureVideo2 engine:

The 8500/8600 family introduces the PureVideo2 engine. PureVideo2 improves upon PureVideo by adding more decoding-assistance for VC-1 and H264. With the 8500/8600, NVIDIA claims PCs with slow CPUs can play HD-DVD and Blu-ray without skipping frames.

Also, regarding the availability of the chips, 15 of the Penryn chips will be out in November, 20 more in January. Link

I think the following are highly likely:
Penryn speed bump - 2.6/2.8 at the top end
Larger Hard Drives (including 250/5400 and 200/7200 drives)
17" goes LED (both resolutions)
15" gets new resolution (maybe 1680x1050)

Filed under possible:
BR or HD DVD drive option

Support for HD video in terms of removing load from the processor could mean a return to ATI as with the iMacs, in the form of a mobile Radeon 2xxx series graphics chip if it exists? If PC manufacturers can stick HD-DVD and Bluray in their laptops, then Apple can, but that would currently mean aligning themselves totally with one format. Then again, I seem to recall Apple backed Bluray, so they could stick a BR drive in the MBP and offer HD-DVD as an external option at a later date, or switch to a combo drive when they appear.

For the first part, see what I wrote about the 8XXX series GPU's - the nVidia GPU's can handle VC-1 and H.264 decoding already. Also, it's not so much aligning themselves with one format (though I suspect it is part of the reason), as it is finding a drive manufacturer whose drives can fit into Apple's designs. Apple doesn't mind cutting of certain kinds of technology. Apple was (one of) the first to drop PS/2 support for keyboards and mice, driving mass USB adoption. Apple was (one of) the first to include Firewire in its computers. Apple was (one of) the first to drop the 3.5" floppy disk in favor of CD burning, and (one of) the first to include DVD burners in its computers.

Anyway, The PC manufacturers that you mention (Sony, HP, Dell, etc) all use tray loading optical drives in their machines, as opposed to the (much sexier) slot loading drives on the MBP, iMac, MB, and Mini. The tray loading drives are more ubiquitous and therefore are cheaper (roughly a 200-400 BTO option). The only slot loading BR drive I've seen is for the 17" only and it's $900 retail, and only a 1x drive to boot. That's roughly twice as much to get it on a MBP than it is to get it on a competitor's machine. So until the slot loading drives come down in price and get faster, I don't see Apple putting them in the machines.

 

[cervaro]

I was thinking along the lines of Apple having moved back to ATI with the iMac, therefore it could be logical to think they'd move the MBP back to ATI too. Not really that fussed so long as there's hardware assist for HD decoding.

Shame about the drives. I'd settle for support from Leopard for the HD and Bluray formats, and I could always hook up one of the new LG combo drives externally when they arrive in the meantime so long as Leopard has the requisite software/hardware support built-in?

 

[colto]

I was thinking along the lines of Apple having moved back to ATI with the iMac, therefore it could be logical to think they'd move the MBP back to ATI too. Not really that fussed so long as there's hardware assist for HD decoding.

Shame about the drives. I'd settle for support from Leopard for the HD and Bluray formats, and I could always hook up one of the new LG combo drives externally when they arrive in the meantime so long as Leopard has the requisite software/hardware support built-in?

Ah but then they would lose those that also want to play DX10 games on their Bootcamp vista partitions.

 

[jdechko]

and I could always hook up one of the new LG combo drives externally when they arrive in the meantime so long as Leopard has the requisite software/hardware support built-in?

That and driver support. The Xbox 360 HD-DVD drive works with Vista (and maybe XP), so if Leopard's DVD app has support and there are generic drivers available, you should be good to go.

Ah but then they would lose those that also want to play DX10 games on their Bootcamp vista partitions.

Both the nVidia 8xxx series (as in the MBP) and the ATI 26xx series (as in the iMac) are DX10 capable cards, so I'm not sure what your point is.

To both of you (colto and cervaro), I'm sure Apple chose what chips would run comfortably in each system (MBP and iMac). Both the iMac and MBP use laptop versions of their respective GPUs, but there's a strong possibility that the ATI chips could have been hotter and/or had higher power requirements, making them unsuitable for use in the much thinner/power conscious MBP.

In addition, there is a choice among GPU makers, so Apple doesn't have to stay with one brand (even in a given product line - ie: the Mac Pro with the Quadro, ATI X1900 and the 7300's) and the 12" PB used a GeForce Go5200 while the 15" and 17" used an ATI 9600 Pro with 64/128MB VRAM.

 

[kuebby]

I think anodized aluminum looks a hell of a lot better than black. >.>

I totally agree. The aluminum over whatever the MB is made out of is one of the reasons I went Pro.