The No Touch Bar 13 Macbook Version

[benobi]

Got my nTB MacBook Pro yesterday and so far I'm really impressed. I absolutely love the quality of the screen and the sound from the speakers is awesome. Performance seems fine for what I need it for, and I'm really liking the keyboard. It's a little bit noisy but feels really comfortable to type on and I feel like I can type quicker than ever before. Tried working unplugged today and the battery reduced to 60% after about 4 hrs of work, so I'm expecting 10 hrs+. Combine this with the solid, lightweight build and it's pretty much my perfect laptop.

Agree completely with you danf1. Went 13 nTB for the portability and the battery life. As majority of my work has shifted from film editing to writing/directing (with a lot of travel thrown in the mix), this model seemed to have the perfect combination of size/power/battery for me - especially when compared to the touchbar models.

I will say, however, that I have two minor complaints:
1) I recently edited a 30min documentary-pilot on it with Premiere and was a little disappointed with its 4k performance - choppy playback and dropped frames. Looks like I either need to look into Final Cut or work with proxies. However, again, given the limited amount of editing I do these days, I think I can manage the few times I need to.
2) The other issue I had was with the LG 5k monitor. The monitor was beautiful and the MBP had no problem driving all of those pixels. Unfortunately, docking and undocking the monitor would occasionally cause my MBP to completely freeze up and require a hard restart. I don't know if this was caused by the MBP, the drivers, or the LG monitor but it was pretty annoying. I ended up returning the monitor once all the wifi interference news began to break, so I am not sure if this issue has been fixed now or not. I have decided to wait for other USBC monitors to be released (and maybe wait for Apple to release their own given the recent news).

Despite these two issues, I am very very pleased with this model. It has been rock solid without any non-monitor-related bugs or glitches. For me personally, the battery life and physical keys far outweigh the lack of ports and touchID of the tb model. The size, weight and build quality is just awesome.

It really is the powerful retina Macbook Air that a lot of people were clamoring for.

 

[danf1]

Agree completely with you danf1. Went 13 nTB for the portability and the battery life. As majority of my work has shifted from film editing to writing/directing (with a lot of travel thrown in the mix), this model seemed to have the perfect combination of size/power/battery for me - especially when compared to the touchbar models.

I will say, however, that I have two minor complaints:
1) I recently edited a 30min documentary-pilot on it with Premiere and was a little disappointed with its 4k performance - choppy playback and dropped frames. Looks like I either need to look into Final Cut or work with proxies. However, again, given the limited amount of editing I do these days, I think I can manage the few times I need to.
2) The other issue I had was with the LG 5k monitor. The monitor was beautiful and the MBP had no problem driving all of those pixels. Unfortunately, docking and undocking the monitor would occasionally cause my MBP to completely freeze up and require a hard restart. I don't know if this was caused by the MBP, the drivers, or the LG monitor but it was pretty annoying. I ended up returning the monitor once all the wifi interference news began to break, so I am not sure if this issue has been fixed now or not. I have decided to wait for other USBC monitors to be released (and maybe wait for Apple to release their own given the recent news).

Yea it's a great machine and doesn't seem "slow" in any way to me. Some reviews on YouTube said that for 4k editing you really need Final Cut Pro - but guess it might not be worth it for you if you only do a limited amount of editing.

Interesting to know about the LG 5k monitor. I had been thinking about picking up the 4k Ultrafine at some point in the future as I tried it in the Apple Store and was impressed - but might have to research it a bit more.

 

[TheUninvited]

Hello everyone, I've registered to this forum because I'm desperate for help. I'm located in Manila by the way. I have the base model.

Currently it's with an authorized service center here and they've reported that my unit doesn't have any problems. All checks passed, etc. Since then, I'm asking them to do more intensive tests, etc.

My ntbMBP has 2 major problems, the second problem has been occurring for a while now, the first one only occurred recently.

1. Battery discharging while it's completely shut down (not sleeping). Lost 17% in 20 hours (it's draining at roughly .66% an hour), nothing in the logs. BOOT_TIME is preceded by SHUTDOWN_TIME.

2. Random reboots - It happens 0-2 times in a day (around 4-5 hours of usage). I've tried all the resets, SMC, etc. I also did a clean install (without restoring and installing anything), issue persists.

Nothing in the logs too, no kernel panics, etc. The only proof that I have presented to the service center is an excerpt of the system.log, BOOT_TIME isn't preceded by SHUTDOWN_TIME.

Restarts are totally random, sometimes it happens during idle. It also rebooted whilst in safe mode.

Unfortunately I couldn't just demand a replacement here, since I bought this almost 2 months ago and this have started just recently.

Thoughts?

 

[Sanpete]

Hello everyone, I've registered to this forum because I'm desperate for help. I'm located in Manila by the way. I have the base model.

Currently it's with an authorized service center here and they've reported that my unit doesn't have any problems. All checks passed, etc. Since then, I'm asking them to do more intensive tests, etc.

My ntbMBP has 2 major problems, the second problem has been occurring for a while now, the first one only occurred recently.

1. Battery discharging while it's completely shut down (not sleeping). Lost 17% in 20 hours (it's draining at roughly .66% an hour), nothing in the logs. BOOT_TIME is preceded by SHUTDOWN_TIME.

2. Random reboots - It happens 0-2 times in a day (around 4-5 hours of usage). I've tried all the resets, SMC, etc. I also did a clean install (without restoring and installing anything), issue persists.

Nothing in the logs too, no kernel panics, etc. The only proof that I have presented to the service center is an excerpt of the system.log, BOOT_TIME isn't preceded by SHUTDOWN_TIME.

Restarts are totally random, sometimes it happens during idle. It also rebooted whilst in safe mode.

Unfortunately I couldn't just demand a replacement here, since I bought this almost 2 months ago and this have started just recently.

Thoughts?

This has to be a hardware problem. I'd call Apple directly, tell them your authorized service center can't find the problem, and that you need it repaired. I doubt they've tested directly for the first problem, since there's probably no standard test for that, but it would be easy for them to test it by just keeping it for a day and checking the battery levels.

 

[ZapNZs]

This has to be a hardware problem. I'd call Apple directly, tell them your authorized service center can't find the problem, and that you need it repaired. I doubt they've tested directly for the first problem, since there's probably no standard test for that, but it would be easy for them to test it by just keeping it for a day and checking the battery levels.

This.

I agree it sounds like a hardware problem, simply because most of the software and settings causes have been eliminated. If it happens in Safe Mode, then it is likely an individual OS X problem, a systematic OS X problem, or hardware problem. If you fresh reinstall OS X, and it continues to happen, that generally rules out the individual OS X causes, leaving the most likely explanations that this is a systematic OS X bug or a hardware problem (and the latter seems much more probable.)

Apple has some great diagnostic tools, but much like cars, intermittent problems are often exceptionally hard to diagnose and do not always show up on diagnostic tools. For example, MRI can return a clean bill of health on a computer with several types of hardware failings, and VST can return a 'pass' result on a MBP with a failing GPU if the test is not done while the system is symptomatic. It's one of those cases where the absence of evidence is not evidence of absence - but, nonetheless, it can leave the Owner in the unfortunate position of having to provide some sort of evidence of proof of claim.

This may be a pain, but you may want to disable the screen sleep feature, bust out an old iPhone or smartphone, set it up on a stand, and start recording video of the computer until you get a failure. Then edit the video down to a clip showing this failure. It's a pain, but it is proof of your claim, and (while unlikely), could be helpful as a diagnostic tool. Additionally, you could do a time-lapse video to show what happens to the battery when the system is shut down.

Further, you may need to contact Apple corporate directly regarding this issue. However, before doing so, I believe this video evidence will be good to have for documentation and diagnostic purposes. When Apple sees video proof that their system is malfunctioning (and supporting documentation that the root cause could not be identified and repaired), they are likely going to take action because it is both the ethical and the business-smart decision to make (i.e., if they don't fix your issue, they realize that they will likely lose more money in the long run, and Apple wants your business so they should [and likely will] work to rectify the problem.)

 

[TheUninvited]

Thank you for your reply, guys.

Just got a call and told me that I'm getting a replacement unit.

What a relief, really. Hoping that the new one will be perfect, no dead pixels, light bleed etc.

The only downside here is that it might be a refurbished unit.

Locally, the base model costs about USD $1700. It now feels like I paid for a refurb one, oh well at least the problems are gone.

I'll post the findings here (forgot to ask earlier), when I get the details, for future reference.

 

[Sanpete]

Thank you for your reply, guys.

Just got a call and told me that I'm getting a replacement unit.

What a relief, really. Hoping that the new one will be perfect, no dead pixels, light bleed etc.

The only downside here is that it might be a refurbished unit.

Locally, the base model costs about USD $1700. It now feels like I paid for a refurb one, oh well at least the problems are gone.

I'll post the findings here (forgot to ask earlier), when I get the details, for future reference.

I don't know Apple's policy on that, but I'd expect a new one. Refurbs are just as good, though.

 

[TheUninvited]

Just to update on my MBP's issue, (for those who are interested):

From my prior post, my unit did not get replaced, I was misinformed. Instead, they told me the unit was perfectly fine, what a bummer.

I've called Apple, they told me to bring it again to a different service center, fast forward, again, they did not find any problems (of course).

Now, I've requested a call back and a senior rep and a product specialist called me.

The product specialist was really professional (from SG and Australia). To cut the story short, they made an exception so that the logic board (not sure if other parts will be replaced too) will be replaced even though their diagnostics showed nothing.

So, I'm bringing it again to the service center for the 3rd time. The specialist also mentioned that I can also try to request for a replacement in the store where I bought it but I highly doubt it (consumer protection really sucks here locally), since for sure I'll just be advised to bring it to their service center instead, so I'll just settle for a repair and hopefully it'll put an end to this nightmare.

 

[ascender]

After having some time with all of the new MBPs, I've ended up with a 13" non-TouchBar model with 16GB RAM. The battery life is noticeably better than the TB models I've tried and for me gives perfect blend of performance v portability.

 

[LGIR627]

Can anyone tell me if the SSD in the non-touch is any different or slower than the SSD performance of the touch 13"? Thank you.

 

[maflynn]

Can anyone tell me if the SSD in the non-touch is any different or slower than the SSD performance of the touch 13"? Thank you.

I believe its the same as the TB version

 

[Ma2k5]

Can anyone tell me if the SSD in the non-touch is any different or slower than the SSD performance of the touch 13"? Thank you.

It isn't soldered on like the TB variants, which is a positive.

 

[timbals]

I just returned a CTO i7 nTB for a TB model because under heavy load the nTB would get hot very quicky and make a lot of fan noise where the TB model stays silent or at least very quiet in the same conditions. Maybe its obvious as the TB model has two fans but I was disappointed as I prefer function keys. The screen on nTB models seemed to have a colder white balance (confirmed it in an apple store with the display models) and the speakers were better.

Does anyone else experience the same thing with the nTB or was I just unlucky?

 

[intervenient]

Anyone else get coil whine from their nTB? I've never experienced it in any Apple laptop, but I'm getting some today on my new nTB :/

 

[heisenbergg]

I just returned a CTO i7 nTB for a TB model because under heavy load the nTB would get hot very quicky and make a lot of fan noise where the TB model stays silent or at least very quiet in the same conditions. Maybe its obvious as the TB model has two fans but I was disappointed as I prefer function keys. The screen on nTB models seemed to have a colder white balance (confirmed it in an apple store with the display models) and the speakers were better.

Does anyone else experience the same thing with the nTB or was I just unlucky?

I recently purchased the 13" nTB, upgraded the ram to 16gb and SSD to 512gb. It's a beautiful machine and really liking how lightweight it is, however I'm disappointed with the performance.

If I'm doing anything other than web browsing, the machine will get hot and become very noisy from the fan. I was watching football on SkyGo over the weekend and the machine had to work over-time, with the fan blazing!

It's put me in an awkward position now. I've had the machine for 2 weeks, spent somewhere along the lines of £1800 and it's probably the most disappointing macbook I've had so far...

 

[timbals]

I recently purchased the 13" nTB, upgraded the ram to 16gb and SSD to 512gb. It's a beautiful machine and really liking how lightweight it is, however I'm disappointed with the performance.

If I'm doing anything other than web browsing, the machine will get hot and become very noisy from the fan. I was watching football on SkyGo over the weekend and the machine had to work over-time, with the fan blazing!

It's put me in an awkward position now. I've had the machine for 2 weeks, spent somewhere along the lines of £1800 and it's probably the most disappointing macbook I've had so far...

I managed to reproduce the issue with the nTB models in the apple store so I switched to the TB version. It's much much quieter. Battery life is worse though.

 

[heisenbergg]

I managed to reproduce the issue with the nTB models in the apple store so I switched to the TB version. It's much much quieter. Battery life is worse though.

I really don't want a Touchbar though.

I don't get why Apple didn't put 2 fans and more vents in the nTB (i.e. same as the TB). But I guess the same could go for the processor speed...it's probably to push you towards buying the TB model.

 

[thadoggfather]

Anyone else get coil whine from their nTB? I've never experienced it in any Apple laptop, but I'm getting some today on my new nTB :/

My 2016 nTB doesnt have this problem, whatsoever. It’s been so quiet I have never heard anything unless fans are running at sustained like 4000rpm+

But thats a good way to describe what was happening to my 2013 rMBP 13” except it was more like fans running up and down constantly, even on a stock imaged macOS

 

[theitsage]

I've used the late-2016 and mid-2017 nTB MBP. The cooling and noise issues in the mid-2017 is definitely a deal breaker. This is most likely due to the performance increase in the Kabylake CPU. It's very unfortunate because this nTB is my preference over the Touch Bar version.

 

[thadoggfather]

I've used the late-2016 and mid-2017 nTB MBP. The cooling and noise issues in the mid-2017 is definitely a deal breaker. This is most likely due to the performance increase in the Kabylake CPU. It's very unfortunate because this nTB is my preference over the Touch Bar version.

So you too didn’t experience it on late 2016?

Is this really common with 2017’s?

Or common with 2016? Cause that hasn’t been my experience with 2016

Just curious- that would drive me NUTS too

 

[theitsage]

The Late 2016 nTB MBP did not have this cooling and noise issue.

 

[ghanwani]

If I'm doing anything other than web browsing, the machine will get hot and become very noisy from the fan. I was watching football on SkyGo over the weekend and the machine had to work over-time, with the fan blazing!

I have a 2017 nTB MBP with 16GB/512GB. I don't feel the machine getting hot or noisy when watching videos on youtube and at least so far I have been satisfied with performance. Before this I had a max-ed out 2016 TB which I found had some fan noise issues.

Are there any benchmarking apps that would try to run a CPU/graphics intensive process and then record temperature/fan speeds? It would be nice to have something like that...then we would be able to tell if someone has a defective machine.

 

[thadoggfather]

I have a 2017 nTB MBP with 16GB/512GB. I don't feel the machine getting hot or noisy when watching videos on youtube and at least so far I have been satisfied with performance. Before this I had a max-ed out 2016 TB which I found had some fan noise issues.

Are there any benchmarking apps that would try to run a CPU/graphics intensive process and then record temperature/fan speeds? It would be nice to have something like that...then we would be able to tell if someone has a defective machine.

Is it just hit or miss then? Independent of 2016/2017?

 

[Acronyc]

I have been using a nTB 16GB/512GB MBP since early November 2016 and have hardly noticed the fans. Before this I had a 2015 MacBook and feel 90% of the time this is just as quiet. The fans will come on when watching videos every now and then, but when they do it's at a low enough RPM where it's pretty much inaudible. I'm not a heavy YouTube user and the videos I watch are mostly in iTunes or VLC. The only time I've really noticed the fans is if I'm playing a 3D game or when I've done some FCPX editing. Otherwise it hasn't been overly hot or (for a MBP) and no fan noise.

As far as performance, I've been happy with it and don't miss my 2012 15" rMBP at all. My uses aren't super heavy - Internet, email, word processing, some coding and photo editing, and occasional video editing - but I've been very pleased. Still enjoy using this Mac just as much as when I got it.

 

[ghanwani]

Is it just hit or miss then? Independent of 2016/2017?

I don't know. Just that I have not experienced anything out of the ordinary with my 2017 as compared to the 2016's, and this is my 3rd nTB machine because I had 2 defective 2016 nTB machines (other issues, not fan/heat related). I also had a TB model (free upgrade from Apple), but which I wasn't happy with so I returned it (it had a whistling fan).