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The Panther Thread

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The first post of this thread is a WikiPost and can be edited by anyone with the appropiate permissions. Your edits will be public.
AmazingHenry

AmazingHenry

macrumors 65816
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Jul 6, 2015
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Central Michigan
Mac OS X 10.3 Panther

Supported Hardware
  • iMac G3
  • iMac G4
  • iMac G5 (except for models with Ambient Light Sensor)
  • eMac G4 (except for 2005 models)
  • Mac mini G4
  • Power Mac G3 Blue & White
  • Power Mac G4
  • Power Mac G5 (except for 2005 models)
  • Xserve G4
  • Xserve G5
  • iBook G3
  • iBook G4 (except for 2005 models)
  • PowerBook G3 Bronze Keyboard, FireWire
  • PowerBook G4 Titanium
  • PowerBook G4 Aluminum (except for 15- and 17-inch DLSD models)

Minimum RAM
  • 256MB (unofficially runs on 128MB)

Minimum Hard Drive Space / Partition Size
  • 3GB

Release Date
  • October 24, 2003


Apple Software Updates

Web Browsers, FTP et al.

Web Design & Development

Audio & Video

Games
  • Marble Blast Gold 1.5.2
  • Nanosaur II 1.1

Graphics & Design
  • Adobe Creative Suite
  • Adobe Creative Suite 2
    • Adobe Acrobat 7.0 Professional
    • Adobe GoLive CS2 8.0
    • Adobe Illustrator CS2 12.0
    • Adobe InCopy CS2 4.0
    • Adobe InDesign CS2 4.0
    • Adobe Photoshop CS2 9.0
  • Adobe Premiere 6.5
  • Art Director's Toolkit 4.1
  • Blender 2.49b
  • CocoviewX 0.9.5
  • PhotoLine 13.52
  • QuarkXPress 6.5.1
  • Snapz Pro X 2.1.5
  • ToyViewer 4.92 (dead link)

Office & Productivity

Tools & Utilities
 
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Hmm, I read that Firefox 3.0 before alpha 7 actually work on Panther. The builds are available on Mozilla's FTP; anybody care to check those out for the coolness factor? ;)
 
The most modern browser for Panther is the same than for Mac OS 9: Classilla.

It also is more capable than on OS9 just for the Codecs and Quicktime from Panther.

Quicksilver for Panther is an alternative for using spotlight as launcher.

I use shadow killer on Tiger and Leopard when using ATI Rage 128...But Panther UI is faster than Tiger and Leopard UI. With an nvidia 4MX is fast enough on Panther to not use shadow killer. While in Tiger/Leo is a need. Panther do not demands CoreImage cards, and with Quartz cards can fly.

A lot of Digidesign hardware (Digi 001/AudioMedia III) for Protools can only run up to Panther.

Teleport works also on Panther. VLC 0.8 or 0.9 also. CorePlayer don't.

Print Shop 2 from Brodenburg is on Macintosh Garden.

Chicken VNC had a good version for Panther said time ago Erik. I had only success with a version of Apple Remote Desktop.

Final Cut Pro HD 4 and 4.5 worked there. Also Final Cut Express. Logic 6 and 7 IIRC. GarageBand?
 
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G4fanboy said:
The most modern browser for Panther is the same than for Mac OS 9: Classilla.

It also is more capable than on OS9 just for the Codecs and Quicktime from Panther.

Quicksilver for Panther is an alternative for using spotlight as launcher.

I use shadow killer on Tiger and Leopard when using ATI Rage 128...But Panther UI is faster than Tiger and Leopard UI. With an nvidia 4MX is fast enough on Panther to not use shadow killer. While in Tiger/Leo is a need. Panther do not demands CoreImage cards, and with Quartz cards can fly.

A lot of Digidesign hardware (Digi 001/AudioMedia III) for Protools can only run up to Panther.

Teleport works also on Panther. VLC 0.8 or 0.9 also. CorePlayer don't.

Print Shop 2 from Brodenburg is on Macintosh Garden.

Chicken VNC had a good version for Panther said time ago Erik. I had only success with a version of Apple Remote Desktop.

Final Cut Pro HD 4 and 4.5 worked there. Also Final Cut Express. Logic 6 and 7 IIRC. GarageBand?
Click to expand...
Thanks, I'll start updating the post with this information! :)
[doublepost=1495382752][/doublepost]
KawaiiAurora said:
Hmm, I read that Firefox 3.0 before alpha 7 actually work on Panther. The builds are available on Mozilla's FTP; anybody care to check those out for the coolness factor? ;)
Click to expand...
I need to get Panther reinstalled before I try; I think I broke my current install. Thanks!
 
From a designers perspective I will just say the following will run comfortably on Panther:

QuarkXPress 6.5.1
Acrobat 6 Pro
Adobe Illustrator 10
Adobe Photoshop 7
Adobe InDesign 2
Adobe Pagemaker 7
Suitcase X1
Office X/2004

Panther was the absolute most stable version of OS X I have yet encountered. Solid and dependable. It's only fault was that it was boring.
 
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Definitely worth a read also I have to say take it with a grain of salt as all articles of that site but it gives a good overlook what happened around that time.

http://www.sunrisepage.com/computers/osx/osx103.htm
[doublepost=1495384815][/doublepost]I'm happy that you bring that up as I'm looking to install panther on my PowerBook and I wanted to ask for help anyway so please:

Can anyone provide me with a copy (downloadable) of the restore CD for my PowerBook or a retail version of Panther ?

It is the PowerBook G4 A1106. That's the 15" 1.5Ghz modell.
As everymac is stating minimum OS version is X 10.3 7.
I already tried with the DVD version from macintoshgarden but that got me an invalid (?) boot icon after restarting.
I have to say that I had to did that through my MDD with FireWire target disk mode as my DVD drive on the target PowerBook is broken and the burned disc didn't boot with an external FireWire DVD drive.
So I still have to look what version exactly got installed by that downloaded DVD version of Panther as maybe the solution is as simple as updating the install to at least the required X 10.3.7 for the PowerBook.
 
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My Panther is stable mostly, but when I access a GUID IDE NTFS drive it always hangs...even when it recognizes it.

Add to the Adobe Collection Adobe Premiere 6.5.

Digidesign recommend to stay away from updates on Panther for Digi 001-Audiomedia III http://archive.digidesign.com/compato/osx/001/ They recommend to keep 10.3.2 or 10.3.4 but users try to update always. Also they say to keep with quicktime 6.5 instead of 7 for protools users.

It is always better to open DMG on Tiger/Leopard than on Panther, Disk Utility from Panther it is not as pullished.
[doublepost=1495386928][/doublepost]Also, just checked that Classilla + Panther + Youtube works! Classilla run on Classic, but the 3gp file is launched by Quicktime Panther native. It complaints about "Quicktime is missing software required to perform this operation. Unfortunately it is not available on the quicktime server" but it runs in both Normal and HQ quality. It sends 3gp files
 

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philgxxd said:
Can anyone provide me with a copy (downloadable) of the restore CD for my PowerBook or a retail version of Panther ?
Click to expand...
I'm afraid that for that Mac you'll need to purchase gray discs for the model. I found a link but it's for 10.3.0 and you need 10.3.7.
[doublepost=1495389626][/doublepost]I'll be updating the post will the new information, however please remember that you can update it yourself. :)
 
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I keep thinking to make suggestions such as Tuxera NTFS-3G and Perian.

But each time I look them up it turns out that the earliest versions of these solutions came for Tiger!

I upgraded so late to Tiger (2008) I guess I just assumed they'd always been there.
 
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Perian 10.3 makes the Iceweasel cower in fear. https://www.perian.org/iceweasel.html

But ntfsmount.h https://opensource.apple.com/source/ntfs/ntfs-35/ntfs.kextproj/ntfsmount.h.auto.html

Seems from 2003. And that is the root of all later Tuxera NTFS stuff.

I guess Panther needs lots of love from developers to get those modern libraries/dependencies backported there. It is hard enough to backport to Tiger/Leopard. Almost nobody think on the possible Panther users like me tied to an Protools LE PCI OS9/Panther hardware.

About download Panther, seems more complete http://macintoshgarden.org/apps/mac-osx-mac-os-10-ppc

Includes Panther_CD1.toast_.zip (483.15 MB), Panther_CD2.toast_.zip (590.44 MB), Panther_CD3.toast_.zip (192.61 MB), MacOSXUpdateCombo10.3.8.dmg (99.25 MB), and Panther_Xcode_Tools.toast_.zip (580.15 MB)
Jaguar and Panther complete updates (Combo 10.3.9, Java...)
 
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Got Panther installed on my two G3s. Going to install OS9 (for Classilla), 10.3.9 combo, VLC, and OnyX. Any other suggestions? A version of OpenOffice would be nice; I'll have to look into that.
[doublepost=1495403472][/doublepost]Yep, YouTube is working for me! No sound, but I haven't updated to 9.2 yet.
 
What i did was install the "internal" DVD version from macintoshgarden.org and I figured out that it installs only the plain 10.3 so that is why it wouldn't boot after from my Powerbook. I did install the 10.3.9 combo update and it finally booted.
So all is well I think.
Does the FireWire target mode method do any harm when installing an OS when the two machines are different ?
I think it would still be the best to find and do an install with the original restore CD for my PowerBook but I can't find any for sale here in Europe.
I noticed when I restarted my PowerBook it didn't detect at first the Ethernet nor the WiFi adapter but as soon as I entered the network configuration setting a window popped up and asked to add that. But still...
May I'm running into problems later ?
[doublepost=1495460638][/doublepost]I will use that panther install for installing the last protools version that supports mix hardware. 6.4.1 i think as G4fanboy already said.
 
philgxxd said:
Does the FireWire target mode method do any harm when installing an OS when the two machines are different ?
Click to expand...
No.

System specific disks are full installers, they just come with some specific stuff to that system and of course a check to see if you are installing it on that system.

I used TDM from my work G5 in early 2005 to install Panther on one of our G4s as well as my own TiBook (at the time). I believe the disk was 10.3.1, but it was specific to that G5.

Neither the G4 nor the TiBook had any issues booting or running that G5/TDM installation.
 
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Got Panther installed and set up on my two G3 iBooks. This is what I've installed:
Updates (from Macintosh Garden)
OS 9.2
Classilla
VLC
OnyX

I'm really impressed with Panther's performance. It makes my 2 little iBooks really nice machines.

@G4fanboy I was also having the no sound for YouTube problem. Turns out you have to update to QuickTime 7. You get sound, and that error message doesn't how up on launch.

KawaiiAurora said:
Hmm, I read that Firefox 3.0 before alpha 7 actually work on Panther. The builds are available on Mozilla's FTP; anybody care to check those out for the coolness factor? ;)
Click to expand...
Time to try this now that I have Panther installed correctly! :)
[doublepost=1495481960][/doublepost]Oh yeah, I posted this in my PPC projects thread, but I figured it fits here as well.

I am now working on a "Panther Market" as the Leopard and Tiger app stores already exist. It's in the earliest stage now, but it will happen by the end of 2017.

Currently finding apps to put on it. I already have a good list here; thanks everybody!
 
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Protools LE users based on PCI are tied to Quicktime 6.4 or 6.5 or 6.5.1 IIRC.

The update to Quicktime 7 were so problematic for Panther Protools users and Multimedia users that Apple did a "revert back to 6.5 Quicktime" download for those that needed last Panther version for whatever reason.

@AmazingHenry can you make a fork for 2018 based on Quicktime 6.x?

It would be ultimate for the Panther App Shop to include QT 6.4, 6.5.x, QT 7 and the revert back thing.

It would be great if this Wiki includes the limitations on Panther XCode vs Tiger/Leo XCode and/or what libraries/dependencies Panther miss. Let's help developers wanting to port Apps to PowerPC Panther/Tiger/Leo
 
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G4fanboy said:
Protools LE users based on PCI are tied to Quicktime 6.4 or 6.5 or 6.5.1 IIRC.

The update to Quicktime 7 were so problematic for Panther Protools users and Multimedia users that Apple did a "revert back to 6.5 Quicktime" download for those that needed last Panther version for whatever reason.
Click to expand...
I don't use Protools, so it's not a problem for me. However I guess you will have to settle for no sound. :(
G4fanboy said:
@AmazingHenry can you make a fork for 2018 based on Quicktime 6.x?
Click to expand...
Don't exactly understand. Do you mean a fork of the Panther Market, or something to do with QT?
G4fanboy said:
It would be ultimate for the Panther App Shop to include QT 6.4, 6.5.x, QT 7 and the revert back thing.
Click to expand...
Sure! Here's my app list so far:
Picture 2.png

I will likely spend at least a month filling this with new apps. I will add @eyoungren's suggestions as well.
G4fanboy said:
It would be great if this Wiki includes the limitations on Panther XCode vs Tiger/Leo XCode and/or what libraries/dependencies Panther miss. Let's help developers wanting to port Apps to PowerPC Panther/Tiger/Leo
Click to expand...
Great idea! I can't help with this one; I have little experience even with the 10.5 Xcode, let alone Panther.
 
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G4fanboy said:
It would be great if this Wiki includes the limitations on Panther XCode vs Tiger/Leo XCode and/or what libraries/dependencies Panther miss. Let's help developers wanting to port Apps to PowerPC Panther/Tiger/Leo
Click to expand...


Panther -> Tiger Technologies:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mac_OS_X_Tiger#Technologies

Primarily: CoreData, CoreImage, CoreAudio and CoreVideo - these are major frameworks for making a developer's life easier and could be road blocks for backwards compatibility in many apps.


Tiger -> Leopard Technologies:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mac_OS_X_Leopard#Developer_technologies

Leopard is an awesome operating system, with major underlying improvements. My understanding of these developer features are:
  • Objective-C 2.0 - Number one improvement from my point of view. The first official revision to the language which added property syntax, synthesizing accessors (getter/setter methods), dot-notation and fast enumeration.
  • Garbage Collection and the autorelease pool - superseded the requirement to manually manage object reference counts. Not as advanced as modern ARC, but a major improvement over manual memory management.
  • CoreAnimation and OpenGL 2.1 - Major graphic framework improvements. Full support for view layers making GUI animations easy to implement. Some developers went the full-hog and built OpenGL UI's (Delicious Library anyone?).
  • 64-bit Framework support - The first Mac OS to support 64-bit apps on qualified systems (G5s, C2Ds and Xeons)

Despite all these advancements (and then the decade which followed), it's worth remembering that everyone got the job done successfully (or even just adequately) before all of this. So if anyone is developing an app and can live without a certain tech for the sake of compatibility with the older OSes, it's worth either limiting snazzy features or making a special build just for an older OS.

-AphoticD
 
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Whiteout- removes the metal texture from Panther and installs the old pinstripe texture from Jaguar. I found this doing research on Panther since I'm getting an original iMac locally tomorrow.

https://web.archive.org/web/20050205165920/http://www.suicidegirls.com/apps/whiteout (Interesting site to offer this app huh)

This next URL talks about using an app called Metallifizer to complete the demetalling, and includes a screenshot of the results in PDF format. I tried to load the website that had this app in Wayback, but it didn't seem to have it indexed (unsanity.com. EDIT: should have been unsanity.NET).

http://www.splefty.com/blog/computers/macosx/panther/

EDIT: found Metallifizer 1.2 and added it. Post 1 mentions a download for it in this post, but it didn't exist until now (Whiteout was the actual file).

Wayback Machine link- https://web.archive.org/web/20040302061012/http://www.unsanity.net:80/metallifizer-12.dmg
 

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I did cleaning and removed the download link to the OS. Sorry, but the last thing this kind of topic needs is a mod lock due to copyright concerns. :(

However, I've often thought about downgrading my iMac G3's to Panther (from Tiger). Those old workhorses are in need of a "last stand" and I think a Panther/OS9 combo is just what it needs. Previously, I thought of OS 9 only, but...this seems a bit better.
 
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eyoungren said:
From a designers perspective I will just say the following will run comfortably on Panther:

QuarkXPress 6.5.1
Acrobat 6 Pro
Adobe Illustrator 10
Adobe Photoshop 7
Adobe InDesign 2
Adobe Pagemaker 7
Suitcase X1
Office X/2004

Panther was the absolute most stable version of OS X I have yet encountered. Solid and dependable. It's only fault was that it was boring.
Click to expand...

What comes second and third, if I may have your opinion?
[doublepost=1499876961][/doublepost]Why can't we put links to the Macintosh Garden, again? It's all abandonware. Nothing malicious.
 
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z970mp said:
What comes second and third, if I may have your opinion?
[doublepost=1499876961][/doublepost]Why can't we put links to the Macintosh Garden, again? It's all abandonware. Nothing malicious.
Click to expand...

Blame government and their versions of the DMCA. Abandonware should be ok, but I am not a mod, should all of these be claimable:

1. The producer is no longer in business.
2. The software is no longer being made by anyone.
3. There is no outstanding copyright claim to it or revenue stream that still exists from the software.

If all three of those are met, then the link should be all right, but all three would likely need to be met.
 
z970mp said:
What comes second and third, if I may have your opinion?
Click to expand...
Stability wise?

Panther>Leopard>Jaguar

I don't put Tiger on the list because of my issues with it. I know everyone disagrees, but my majority use of Tiger was on a G5 in a mixed PC/Mac environment with a Windows server.

You have to contort Tiger to make it work in that configuration and it's just not stable beyond two or three Finder commands (i.e, do not copy and delete at the same time nor send more than two copy or delete commands simultaneously).
 
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