In respect to there being bridgeboards available, yes. However, last time I checked even Apple was abandoning FW on their new machines.
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This is not a "Pro" machine.
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In respect to there being bridgeboards available, yes. However, last time I checked even Apple was abandoning FW on their new machines.
It's not a philosophic discussion it either will or won't work there is not much maybe.
A discussion being civilized is not something this poster finds positive.
Welcome to the interwebs !
Same goes for the other threads related to the topic .
Oh, and your argument has been made and discussed here on the MP forum too, in the past few days .
This is probably the greatest statement ever.
I thought PCIe 3.0 2x was 2GBps--the same as TB 2.0. Is that incorrect?
Also, I like how you say TB is going to be the end of PCIe and in the very next paragraph point out one of the pitfalls: that external boxes for internal components is not economical or elegant.
How about just having more PCIe slots? As PCIe storage becomes more available, so will demand for more PCIe slots. There are already LGA 2011 mobos available with 6 PCIe slots (four 16x, one 8x, one 1x). Being as how TB drives aren't even widely available yet, doesn't this make TB obsolete right out of the gate?
Here's a scenario: my PC Mobo has only 3 PCIe slots and one has my GPU. I want two very fast SSD hard drives (either SSD over TB or PCIe). Do I either A) pay $400 and get a motherboard with 6 slots or B) Buy a motherboard with Two TB ports so I can pay a ridiculous premium to buy two SSD over TB (do these even exist yet?) requiring their own enclosure and $50 in wiring, and space on my desk.
Thunderbolt on the mac side of things might putter along for a while, just like firewire did. PCs have already established a better solution.
What if Apple had continued to make a competitive Mac Pro after 2008 and sold more units? How many PCIe expansion card makers would have written drivers?
Also, if TB being more heavily pushed by Apple were going to force the market to create more TB devices, wouldn't we see more of that now? On average, TB peripherals cost twice what other options do, and we're not even on TB2 yet!
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My current workstation has 7 PCI-E 3.0 slots and I still have a Netstor PCI-E 3.0 Expansion chassis attached to it. I'd buy a 10 slot board if they made them.
Welcome to the interwebs !
Same goes for the other threads related to the topic .
Oh, and your argument has been made and discussed here on the MP forum too, in the past few days .
I wasn't making an argument just on observation
Philosophic or not, people can still discuss the pro/cons and change their opinion on how to weigh them....
So, you'd either have it not be negative, or you find it irrelevent. Good to know your opinion, but board rules are board rules. If its civil and on topic, it can theoretically exist forever. The two people can switch which words they use to describe the same opposing points ad infinitum, that doesn't mean they should or have to stop.
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You were suggesting people stop discussing it. Though you didn't literially say that, its not hard to read between those lines...
I agree, nut IMHO this has turned into my junk is bigger than yours which is fine and all that but doesn't sway opinion
Board rules are what they are and Mods are who they are..but people are at their finest when offended/threatened. A softer touch by the mods and fist by the users would be refreshing.
This is a phenomenally myopic viewpoint. No one has any idea what 'real-world' performance is going to be (assuming you choose to ignore the Devs that used it at WWDC) or exactly what workflow changes are going to be required. Stop pretending you do. Have you seen the Thunderbolt roadmap past 2013? Please share with the rest of us so we can also feel the appropriate level of outrage.
Plenty of users decried Apple for the IBM/Intel switch, then again with the death of Rosetta. Not only has OS X rolled on, but it's grown. Apple has always pushed computing paradigms. Monolithic chassis-based computing is over. Been to a datacenter lately? How many racks are full of 12U servers vs 1U blades? How many of those blades are running single-instances vs VMWare or something else using hypervisor?
No one is forcing you to use TB. Vote with your wallet.
I totally get why you are upset. Apple's ever tightening eco-system is threatening your livelihood.
Yeah, something has to end the chain. The firewire adapter, the monitor, the external storage, a variety of other devices; they all end the chain. In my case, the chain-end is the monitor, which I've already got. Therefore, any device with only a single Thunderpants port is a no-go.
In the context of the upcoming Mac Pro, I guess there's more scope for single-port devices since the machine itself has six ports.
i wish i knew the reason
i'd love to have my gas,electric, and sewer all running through the same line.
i wish i knew the reason
i'd love to have my gas,electric, and sewer all running through the same line.
You could but then due to the bandwidth limitations you'd have to turn the electric off to use the toilet which you've now placed outside your home in an enclosure.
Outhouses are the future!
i wish i knew the reason
i'd love to have my gas,electric, and sewer all running through the same line.
What if we called this new Gas/sewer/whatever line the "Firepoo" pipe. You might be able to daisy chain some of the simpler things like your TV, but many high bandwidth items would each require their own firepoo pipe. What if instead of having a single specialized pipe, you had to have one for each toilet/stove/television as a single Firepoo pipe didn't have the capacity to deal with more than one flush/appliance at a time? Imagine a throughput problem with the toilet by running two of them through a switch, two people in the same household couldn't eat Mexican food the same day! At the same time, each firepoo pipe would cost $25 per foot and you would have to have a "Controller" at the end of each Firepoo pipe which would cost hundreds of dollars, regardless of what you plug in, this as opposed to having a single controller supporting multiple appliances.
Wouldn't it be better to have specialized pipes and wires going from your house to the larger networks of water/sewer/data/Gas pipes on the curb?
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Too late.
The Kool-Aid Squad / Apple Shills have already given these boards a good splattering.
oh.. you mean like it is now?
i have a macpro and two mbps.. at times, all three are at my desk at once.. there are two monitors.. a portable hd and another drive.
the front of the macpro has a fw400, 800, and usb cable hanging out of the front.. the monitors have their lame dvi connectors.. there's another monitor cord laying about with a minidisplayport converter on it.. two printers at times so those weird usbs are laying around.. plus a box of cords/cables/wires- half of which i don't know whereTf the came from but i still have to dig through there on occasion..
the mess part- whatever, i can deal with that.. but when it comes time to take a monitor from the macpro and put it on a laptop or hooking everything up for renders -or- pretty much changing anything (go under desk and behind mp etc).. it sucks.
if there's one cable that can do all of this stuff? are you kidding me-- how is that not a good thing?? put all the
is it a cost thing? because in a productivity sense, having that type of ease and ability to change one's workstation is way worth whatever premium is being paid (and i think most people here are sensationalizing the costs of thunderbolt) but i'd, without a doubt pay a few hundred dollars right now to have one connector that works on all my stuff..
i really don't even get how someone could argue against that.
So your are EXCITED to replace all of those peripherals for new TB ones that do the same things? While simultaneously adding even more TB cables and housings for the things moved from inside the MP case to the outside? Hopefully for Apple there are lots more "consumers" out there ready to ante up and re-buy all the stuff they already have.
Ultimately all of our opinions mean naught, will be all about whether the market goes for it. Maybe the Cube would have succeeded if Apple had dropped the G4 tower when introduced. Carrot and stick.
i can't tell if you're arguing against what i said or if you're just going out on some tangent because you don't want to see (for whatever reason?) that having a unified connector for all your stuff is highly desirable in a reconfigurable working environment
he's saying the New Mac Pro will have even more cables as it requires more of the computer outside of the case. If you think you have cable problems now, imagine when your sound card, optical drive, platter drives are outside the case.
As far as your current cable mess, how is that aided by having thunderbolt at all? Are you going to throw your mouse, keyboard, and printer away? Are you going to get a thunderbolt monitor? Do thunderbolt monitors have fewer cables than DVI all of a sudden?
This whole argument is ridiculous. I'm sorry that the connectivtity of the current formfactor is confusing or bewildering for you. Maybe you can just throw your whole desktop away and buy a MacBook Air?
Since when is a workstation supposed to be modular? I dunno about you but after all the time I put into to making a workstation the way I want it and routing and tucking, hiding cables...the last thing I want is to break pieces off and constantly reconfigure stuff.
If you constantly unplug your monitors from your tower and hook them up to you laptop, you should get a better tower or just get rid of it altogether.
If you constantly unplug your monitors from your tower and hook them up to you laptop, you should get a better tower or just get rid of it altogether.
Perhaps they raised shill pay after WWDC
. I don't know why I find that concept so funny. It's probably all the allergy medicine.I suspect a lot of it comes from people who haven't used one. It's a smaller market with strong margins, so typically companies will try to appeal to the widest possible range of workstation buyers. Otherwise it's a niche of an already small market. I would expect those that also use a laptop would only potentially transfer storage some storage between the two.