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TOMTOM probably going to be better, but....

Rayfire said:
They pulled out the lite version of the North America version of Navigon :rolleyes:

I think a lot of the people here are in the same boat as me, waiting till Aug 14 (or 15) for TomTom
else we'll just settle for Navigon's TBT app. (for US)
Click to expand...

I know I'm definitely in the same boat as you! Hey move over, you're taking up to much space! lol
 
m3coolpix said:
I'm thinking this may be one of the bigger 'hold ups' of the release of their app. Implementing this feature is not a small undertaking. It doesn't scale easily for a world wide install base of iPhone users, without some serious horsepower as the install base grows. It's also got to be somewhat data intensive if it's real time.
Click to expand...

They aren't implementing live traffic data now (like Dash Express) but rather are providing historical traffic data in the decision making process. I doubt that they are going to shift to a live model out of the gate for the iPhone. So, it would only be collecting data and incorporating that information into their historical traffic model. IQRoutes is only available on their highest end models so that limits their collection significantly. I would imagine they're taking the Dash Express model and providing a quarterly historical data update.

I hope they have MapShare, the other feature in the higher-end models. The quote from the TomTom president was that he didn't know if that would be included. I'd find that very useful.
 
avaloncourt said:
They aren't implementing live traffic data now (like Dash Express) but rather are providing historical traffic data in the decision making process. I doubt that they are going to shift to a live model out of the gate for the iPhone. So, it would only be collecting data and incorporating that information into their historical traffic model. IQRoutes is only available on their highest end models so that limits their collection significantly. I would imagine they're taking the Dash Express model and providing a quarterly historical data update.

I hope they have MapShare, the other feature in the higher-end models. The quote from the TomTom president was that he didn't know if that would be included. I'd find that very useful.
Click to expand...

He should know, he is CTO and co-founder :/
 
ct2k7 said:
He should know, he is CTO and co-founder :/
Click to expand...

:confused: What are you talking about and WHO are you talking about? All that was said was IQRoutes was in the iPhone version. That doesn't mean its live. IQRoutes is not a live product, it's historical.

http://www.tomtom.com/page/iq-routes

Millions of TomTom users worldwide voluntarily provide us with anonymous historical speed-data from each of their journeys every time they connect their device to TomTom HOME .
Click to expand...
 
avaloncourt said:
:confused: What are you talking about and WHO are you talking about? All that was said was IQRoutes was in the iPhone version. That doesn't mean its live. IQRoutes is not a live product, it's historical.
Click to expand...

Ah, I was under the impression that Peter-Frans Pauwels (my future xxx) didn't know if IQ Routes would be in the app or not.
 
ct2k7 said:
Ah, I was under the impression that Peter-Frans Pauwels (my future xxx) didn't know if IQ Routes would be in the app or not.
Click to expand...

No, he was quoted by the LA Times in an article about two weeks ago that he didn't know if MapShare was going to be included in the iPhone version. That seems odd. It's a little late in the game to not be sure of the feature set.
 
avaloncourt said:
No, he was quoted by the LA Times in an article about two weeks ago that he didn't know if MapShare was going to be included in the iPhone version. That seems odd. It's a little late in the game to not be sure of the feature set.
Click to expand...

Ah right ok, yeah, I still agree with you :D

Why cant their IS web dev team make a working subsite?
 
ct2k7 said:
From my calculations, TomTom have to get a minimum of $150 from the car kit and software. There will be people who won't get the car kit, so the app price has to account for this.
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Do your calculations suggest any yearly upgrade fee for new maps?
 
BriGuy20 said:
Do your calculations suggest any yearly upgrade fee for new maps?
Click to expand...

They do factor these in, @ $40 for the UK, British Isles Version. Now for NA, $75 :) So yes, yearly upgrade fee. I think they might be waiting on In-app purchases to actually be working.
 
ct2k7 said:
They do factor these in, @ $40 for the UK, British Isles Version. Now for NA, $75 :) So yes, yearly upgrade fee. I think they might be waiting on In-app purchases to actually be working.
Click to expand...

So, $150 for the case + app, and $75 a year for maps?

And do you mean 40 Pounds Sterling for UK?
 
BriGuy20 said:
So, $150 for the case + app, and $75 a year for maps?

And do you mean 40 Pounds Sterling for UK?
Click to expand...

Either way, they've to make $150 per app + car kit. and around $75 for the maps per annum.

Nope, the maps for UK are £23, so that's around $40.
 
BriGuy20 said:
So, $150 for the case + app, and $75 a year for maps??
Click to expand...

If this pricing logic follows, then TomTom is going to sell the software alone in the App Store for less than what Navigon's pricing will be at on August 15th (even below where it currently is?).

I just don't see it happening this way. This would make the 'bundle' break out at $60 for software and $90 for the car kit (or $100 kit, $50 software, you get the idea). Based on TomTom's place in the market, plus the functionality being touted (software and hardware), I don't see their solution as the low price leader, unless they just disregard revenue for market share (even if it's a 'break even' model ROI for a short time).

Right now, there is no way to buy a 'bundle' through the App Store. Software goes through the App Store, and the dock is a separate purchase from a B&M store. AND, the hardware is not yet purchasable at an Apple Store, so it's not convenient.

Two separate purchases for the end user, two separate distribution channels.....doesn't lend itself to a 'low price leader' for either of these products. There are a lot of logistics at play for the TomTom release, IMHO. If they get it such that you can buy the car kit (at a discount vs. buying each piece separately) via the App Store....then you have to take into account it's not a model that Apple completely supports just yet....buying a software app, then shipping a piece of hardware. Or, you have to walk into a B&M store (i. e. Best Buy) and purchase the car kit separately (if you already bought the software). OR, you'd have to buy the software/hardware bundle from a B&M store (maybe a discount this way), and then go to the App Store to download the software and enter some type of code (hidden in the box). I'm not saying all this can't be done. It can...but it takes logistics/time/money. They're releasing 3 separate products here, each of which has to be able to stand on it's own, and be profitable.

Sorry to be so realistic, maybe even pessimistic, but from my 20 years in the manufacturing business....then the past 12 years as a small business owner, I'm just thinking about it from the business/manufacturing side of things.
 
m3coolpix said:
If this pricing logic follows, then TomTom is going to sell the software alone in the App Store for less than what Navigon's pricing will be at on August 15th (even below where it currently is?).

I just don't see it happening this way. This would make the 'bundle' break out at $60 for software and $90 for the car kit (or $100 kit, $50 software, you get the idea). Based on TomTom's place in the market, plus the functionality being touted (software and hardware), I don't see their solution as the low price leader, unless they just disregard revenue for market share (even if it's a 'break even' model ROI for a short time).

Right now, there is no way to buy a 'bundle' through the App Store. Software goes through the App Store, and the dock is a separate purchase from a B&M store. AND, the hardware is not yet purchasable at an Apple Store, so it's not convenient.

Two separate purchases for the end user, two separate distribution channels.....doesn't lend itself to a 'low price leader' for either of these products. There are a lot of logistics at play for the TomTom release, IMHO. If they get it such that you can buy the car kit (at a discount vs. buying each piece separately) via the App Store....then you have to take into account it's not a model that Apple completely supports just yet....buying a software app, then shipping a piece of hardware. Or, you have to walk into a B&M store (i. e. Best Buy) and purchase the car kit separately (if you already bought the software). OR, you'd have to buy the software/hardware bundle from a B&M store (maybe a discount this way), and then go to the App Store to download the software and enter some type of code (hidden in the box). I'm not saying all this can't be done. It can...but it takes logistics/time/money. They're releasing 3 separate products here, each of which has to be able to stand on it's own, and be profitable.

Sorry to be so realistic, maybe even pessimistic, but from my 20 years in the manufacturing business....then the past 12 years as a small business owner, I'm just thinking about it from the business/manufacturing side of things.
Click to expand...

Maybe that's why there's been no update or further word of a release since the keynote in June.
 
m3coolpix said:
Two separate purchases for the end user, two separate distribution channels.....doesn't lend itself to a 'low price leader' for either of these products. There are a lot of logistics at play for the TomTom release, IMHO. If they get it such that you can buy the car kit (at a discount vs. buying each piece separately) via the App Store....then you have to take into account it's not a model that Apple completely supports just yet....buying a software app, then shipping a piece of hardware. Or, you have to walk into a B&M store (i. e. Best Buy) and purchase the car kit separately (if you already bought the software). OR, you'd have to buy the software/hardware bundle from a B&M store (maybe a discount this way), and then go to the App Store to download the software and enter some type of code (hidden in the box). I'm not saying all this can't be done. It can...but it takes logistics/time/money. They're releasing 3 separate products here, each of which has to be able to stand on it's own, and be profitable.
Click to expand...

The article with the quote from the TomTom president say the dock will be available through their regular retail channels as well as "hopefully" (his word) Apple. You'll be able to buy the software-only approach right from iTunes. I think for a bundle the likely approach would be a purchase which places an order through the Apple store for the cradle and then emails you a promotional code for the iTunes store. You enter that in the "code" link on the right of the store and your download of the software begins at no additional cost.

I suppose at the retail store level they could bundle a blister pack with a cradle and card containing a promotional code.

Considering the estimates for the cradle I think a non-sale price of the software would be where Navigon is headed at $99, the cradle itself for $75 or a bundle of both for $150. They're going to penalize people on software cost for not buying the cradle. We already know where the largest competitor is heading with their software price.

This model makes sense to me. I also had my own business for quite a few years and then moved on into management for a b2b wholesaler for a business with $15+ million in annual revenues. I know manufacturer-level pricing and the margins carried on at distributor and retail pricing.

My continued concern here is the TomTom president's use of the word "hopefully" for the cradle being sold through Apple. This tells me there's some issues going on at the TomTom to Apple level perhaps over the iTunes store percentage. It doesn't seem like there would be a problem placing the cradle in the stores themselves since they were the featured GPS application and that was part of the presentation. This seems like a battle of wills about Apple's cut. TomTom probably doesn't want to eat 30% right off the top in "distribution" costs of the app.
 
Taking bets !!! for all of you waiting for Aug 14 for Tom Tom good luck good source told me it won't be out until Sept 3 so pony up and get your Navigon here...or wait and pay the full price:)
 
curly14 said:
Taking bets !!! for all of you waiting for Aug 14 for Tom Tom good luck good source told me it won't be out until Sept 3 so pony up and get your Navigon here...or wait and pay the full price:)
Click to expand...

That's sure pushing the envelope of the definition of summer. :)
 
curly14 said:
Taking bets !!! for all of you waiting for Aug 14 for Tom Tom good luck good source told me it won't be out until Sept 3 so pony up and get your Navigon here...or wait and pay the full price:)
Click to expand...

If you are right, the TomTom might miss out on a lot of customers. I know that I will be very tempted to just get Navigon on August 14th...
 
Which maps will be available?

I'd like to see a cheap Tom Tom app (20$?) with no maps included then you could buy each country separately through the App store directly from the TomTom app.. that'd be sweet.

I need the maps for Spain and Israel !!
 
Is that an actual price or just a guess? Because I just converted it and $187 is too much for me... I can get a pretty nice stand-alone for that.

If the software only is $100 or less I will consider it against Navigon but more than that is just crazy.

This time next year all the competitors will have updated apps that are competitive with TomTom's offering and there are plenty of other music/charging docks. Bluetooth is nice if you don't already have it but if you can't use the mount with a case that is a major con. The only thing that might make the dock worth it is if the gps signal is significantly boosted but even then compared to a stand alone unit, it seems like a rip-off.

Dedicated GPS units might be going the way of the DoDo and if they are the "market leaders" might end up being the last buggy whip makers...
 
I need TomTom so badly! I'm going on vacation tomorrow and now I'm stuck with google earth. :(
 
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