Waiting for the 2020 MBP

[Falhófnir]

I hope the new Dells will make Apple hurry up with a 10th generation, Wifi 6 update to the 16". I don't want to wait until fall.

Don't think a negligible chip bump and WiFi that's arguably worse than what they have now (no 3x3 yet) will solve Apple's fundamental problem: that their lineup is all wrong. It's boring. You effectively only have two choices, a 13" thin and light or a 16" workstation. It's dictated by meeting sales targets at set price points, not offering an enticing selection of machines. Needs a big shakeup to introduce some interesting machines again. Make the MBA more expensive again, but give it the XPS treatment:

Basic intel legacy Mac
13" MacBook (the current $1,299 Pro with a few compromises - no P3, MacBook Air speed SSD) - $999

Exciting new slim form factor computers with Apple's arm chips
13" MacBook Air (in a 12" MacBook body) - $1,299
15" MacBook Air (in a tiny 14" formfactor) - $1,499

super powerful computers, Intel (or AMD), Arm or some of each
14" MacBook Pro (current $1,799 13" plus mini LED) - $1,899
16" MacBook Pro (plus mini LED) - $2,499

 

[drinkingtea]

Don't think a negligible chip bump and WiFi that's arguably worse than what they have now (no 3x3 yet) will solve Apple's fundamental problem: that their lineup is all wrong. It's boring. You effectively only have two choices, a 13" thin and light or a 16" workstation. It's dictated by meeting sales targets at set price points, not offering an enticing selection of machines. Needs a big shakeup to introduce some interesting machines again. Make the MBA more expensive again, but give it the XPS treatment:

Basic intel legacy Mac
13" MacBook (the current $1,299 Pro with a few compromises - no P3, MacBook Air speed SSD) - $999

Exciting new slim form factor computers with Apple's arm chips
13" MacBook Air (in a 12" MacBook body) - $1,299
15" MacBook Air (in a tiny 14" formfactor) - $1,499

super powerful computers, Intel (or AMD), Arm or some of each
14" MacBook Pro (current $1,799 13" plus mini LED) - $1,899
16" MacBook Pro (plus mini LED) - $2,499

I agree to a certain extent. Having two different Airs and a MacBook makes the line-up too crowded. There should be one Air (a 14-inch), and the two Pros, which can be customized. Three laptops are all that’s needed. Apple needs simplicity again.

 

[N0ddie]

The line up is straightforward really. More so since the "MacBook" was binned.

 

[Ma2k5]

I don't agree with this, if you live near an Apple store. And Apple exchange policy is easier to use as well.

As for the new XPS 15, the grass is not always greener, from this review: https://www.tomsguide.com/reviews/dell-xps-15-2020

"At 13.57 x 9 x 0.7 inches and 4.5 pounds, the new XPS 15 is roughly the same size as the 16-inch MacBook Pro (14.1 x 9.7 x 0.64 inches, 4.3 pounds) despite the latter’s bigger screen."

"The 512GB SSD in Dell’s laptop transferred roughly 5GB of files in 7 seconds on our custom file transfer test, for a transfer rate of 708.9 MBps. That blazes past the Surface Laptop 3’s 256GB SSD (282.7 MBps). But while it’s not an apples-to-apples comparison, the 512GB SSD in the 16-inch MacBook Pro was predictably blistering, turning in a write speed of 2,805 MBps and a read speed of 2,540 on the Blackmagic disk speed test. "

"The XPS 15 ran Shadow of the Tomb Raider at a playable 29 frames per second at 1080p with max settings, just barely edging out the Radeon Pro 5300M in our 16-inch MacBook Pro (27.2 fps)."

The keys have a "soft touch" coating to that will definately wear badly...

And then

"The 16-inch MacBook Pro lasted nearly three hours longer at 10 hours and 55 minutes with its 2072 x 1920 display,"

As I own MBP 16, 13, Air as well as XPS (and other brands) I am aware of the pros and cons of each.

I live near two Apple stores. Unfortunately they don’t offer onsite repair like Dell do.

Also, I’ve yet to experience wearing of the soft touch (oldest XPS is 6 years old).

Not everyone’s experiences are identical. I use both machines, depending on what I’m doing.

 

[C. Robert]

the line up is fine. Go to another competitor‘s website and prepare to be confused and see that the cost is similar.

 

[awesomedeluxe]

Good article about Apple, Intel, and the exclusive 28W chips in the MBP 13:

Intel May Have Reserved Its Top-End 28W Ice Lake CPUs Exclusively For Apple - ExtremeTech

Intel has quietly removed the Core i7-1068G7 from its website as a mainstream part and moved it to a different location. The chip may have just become an Apple-exclusive.

www.extremetech.com

 

[Falhófnir]

I agree to a certain extent. Having two different Airs and a MacBook makes the line-up too crowded. There should be one Air (a 14-inch), and the two Pros, which can be customized. Three laptops are all that’s needed. Apple needs simplicity again.

I just think they need to restructure the lineup so they have more choice available, it would be easy to ditch the base Pro 13", put a proper cooler into the Air and that then has it covered, meaning they could make a different machine to appeal to those that don't want a 13" ultrabook.

Also if it looks a bit familiar that's because it's modelled on the iPad lineup - basic Mac(iPad), slightly better Air (mac/iPad) and best Pro (mac/iPad). I think their current iPad lineup is the best of all their product lines in actually offering a bit of choice - which is ironic when tablet form factors are much more limited/ uniform than notebooks!

The line up is straightforward really. More so since the "MacBook" was binned.

A little too straightforward, despite nominally four models, there's really only two choices. As others have commented, they may have pared things down intentionally before new models arrive.

 

[Dr. Howie Feltersnatch]

Don't think a negligible chip bump and WiFi that's arguably worse than what they have now (no 3x3 yet) will solve Apple's fundamental problem: that their lineup is all wrong. It's boring. You effectively only have two choices, a 13" thin and light or a 16" workstation. It's dictated by meeting sales targets at set price points, not offering an enticing selection of machines. Needs a big shakeup to introduce some interesting machines again. Make the MBA more expensive again, but give it the XPS treatment:

Basic intel legacy Mac
13" MacBook (the current $1,299 Pro with a few compromises - no P3, MacBook Air speed SSD) - $999

Exciting new slim form factor computers with Apple's arm chips
13" MacBook Air (in a 12" MacBook body) - $1,299
15" MacBook Air (in a tiny 14" formfactor) - $1,499

super powerful computers, Intel (or AMD), Arm or some of each
14" MacBook Pro (current $1,799 13" plus mini LED) - $1,899
16" MacBook Pro (plus mini LED) - $2,499

I agree. They need to make the air more powerful and have it replace what the current base MacBook pro 13" does.

Make a 14" inch as a midteir best of both worlds option if you want a powerful machine but still intend to use for everyday use.

Reserve the 16" for people who are true professional users who need a mobile workstation for editing.

 

[gadgetfreaky]

I just think they need to restructure the lineup so they have more choice available,

I agree. And Id really love it if they started by matching Dell with a 17 incher at 4.5 pounds.
Just one more inch and the MBP is back to its former glory in a svelte light weight form factor. I bet apple could do it under 4.

 

[Random_uninteresting_user]

So, if Apple does end up upgrading the MBP base model(s) in June or July, how do you guys think it/ they will differ from the $1800 model?

 

[manuel.s90]

Do you really think they would upgrade them just 1-2 months later? I can't imagine that. So many customers would be outraged.

 

[BenConlin44]

Do you really think they would upgrade them just 1-2 months later? I can't imagine that. So many customers would be outraged.

They wouldn’t update the £1800 model again. That’ll be getting an update in the spring with either ARM or Tiger Lake and a 14” Mini Led Display. The Base 13” Model could get an update in the summer as the update last week was an update to remove the butterfly keyboard as shown by its model registration in January compared to June for every other model that’s been released this year. If the base model does get updated (and it’s a big if) it’ll be interesting to see the performance difference. The base model last year had to wait two years for its update so there’s a big possibility they won’t update it to new processors as it’s meant to be a lower cost Mac. Bear in mind that the base model received its update in July last year for the back to school deal as opposed to May for the higher end models so it could arrive then. Basically if you can wait and see do it but if not both models are still decent laptops

 

[Random_uninteresting_user]

Do you really think they would upgrade them just 1-2 months later? I can't imagine that. So many customers would be outraged.

The base model? I think that's a very real possibility. Apple did it last year - they upgraded the higher end 13" MBP in May and then the base models in July.

 

[manuel.s90]

Oh okay, didn't know that. Good that I didn't order the base 13" then after all.

 

[jercompton]

They wouldn’t update the £1800 model again. That’ll be getting an update in the spring with either ARM or Tiger Lake and a 14” Mini Led Display. The Base 13” Model could get an update in the summer as the update last week was an update to remove the butterfly keyboard as shown by its model registration in January compared to June for every other model that’s been released this year. If the base model does get updated (and it’s a big if) it’ll be interesting to see the performance difference. The base model last year had to wait two years for its update so there’s a big possibility they won’t update it to new processors as it’s meant to be a lower cost Mac. Bear in mind that the base model received its update in July last year for the back to school deal as opposed to May for the higher end models so it could arrive then. Basically if you can wait and see do it but if not both models are still decent laptops

I just bought the 2020 13" 10th gen laptop, when the 14" comes out, ill just do a trade in i'll pay the difference haha. But i really needed a new laptop for work, so had no choice.

 

[BenConlin44]

I just bought the 2020 13" 10th gen laptop, when the 14" comes out, ill just do a trade in i'll pay the difference haha. But i really needed a new laptop for work, so had no choice.

What would the trade in value be for the £1799 model if traded in the now?

 

[garrel]

I just bought the 2020 13" 10th gen laptop, when the 14" comes out, ill just do a trade in i'll pay the difference haha. But i really needed a new laptop for work, so had no choice.

How much do you think they'll value it? I was also interested in doing something like that, but i fear that i end up losing quite a lot. Perhaps did you tried to see the value now in apple site?(of course it would be lower if something new comes out).

 

[jabbr]

You’ll lose hundreds of dollars but will have a new notebook for 9 months +

 

[ascender]

Its the 2 port MBP which is confusing the lineup. Remove that one and it makes much more sense, especially now you can spec up the Air to similar levels.

 

[Falhófnir]

Do you really think they would upgrade them just 1-2 months later? I can't imagine that. So many customers would be outraged.

I don't personally see it, if the original plan was to do it in July what's the point of going to the expense of getting this model out now? There's a cost associated with bringing it to market, would they even make it back in 2 months of sales?

 

[BenConlin44]

I don't personally see it, if the original plan was to do it in July what's the point of going to the expense of getting this model out now? There's a cost associated with bringing it to market, would they even make it back in 2 months of sales?

If they do it like 2017 it could easily be another year before the base model gets a spec bump
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Its the 2 port MBP which is confusing the lineup. Remove that one and it makes much more sense, especially now you can spec up the Air to similar levels.

Just read a report about the possible transition and it said that the original plan was to replace the old air with the 12” MacBook and have that alongside the base pro to have a better lineup however they couldn’t get the performance in that form factor they needed plus the butterfly keybaord

 

[jercompton]

How much do you think they'll value it? I was also interested in doing something like that, but i fear that i end up losing quite a lot. Perhaps did you tried to see the value now in apple site?(of course it would be lower if something new comes out).

I think you would lose a few hundreds, but i got the 10gen i5/32g/1TB and i paid like $2400, so if im going to upgrade in 9+ months, i think the value of the laptop would be pretty high. Well, i hope so. But i dont mind spending the xtra funds. I just really need a laptop for work now, but willing to upgrade to the 14" so i can have that model for 5+ years.

 

[DanMan619]

I think you would lose a few hundreds, but i got the 10gen i5/32g/1TB and i paid like $2400, so if im going to upgrade in 9+ months, i think the value of the laptop would be pretty high. Well, i hope so. But i dont mind spending the xtra funds. I just really need a laptop for work now, but willing to upgrade to the 14" so i can have that model for 5+ years.

I've been considering something similar but with the 16". My 15" MBP from 2013 is doing ok, but it's becoming hard to use at work. If i really wanted to bear with it for a few more months to a year i probably could, but i don't necessarily want to. So part of me was considering get like a base-mid tier 2019 16" MBP (from the refurb store to shave a little off the cost) to get me through the next couple months/the year) and then just trade that in for the 2020 16" MBP or 2021 16" MBP depending on what those end up looking like (whichever one ends up having the Mini-LED screen, WifI 6/6e, hopefully Thunderbolt 4/USB4 and maybe ARM pretty much). I'll probably lose a couple hundred dollars but that may just be the cost of convenience of not having to deal with keeping my 2013 15" MBP on life support for another couple months to a year. Maybe what i save buying from the refurb store might balance out what i'll lose on trade in, or at least make the loss negligible. I've yet to make a decision.

 

[stlow]

That’s my strategy as well. I’m still on my 2011 MBP and I’ve been waiting for years to get a MBP without the Butterfly Keyboard and was really hoping to get a specced out 14 inch MBP and keep it for at least 4-5 years. Now I’m a bit disappointed but I can’t wait any longer.
So my 2020 MBP 10th gen 16GB/1TB arrives on Monday. I bought it on a heavy 13% student discount and I’m hoping that’s enough to cover the resale loss after a year to get the 14“.

 

[Random_uninteresting_user]

I am torn between the 2.0 10th gen. i5 13" and the 2019 16".

My last MBP was a mid-2014 13" and I really liked its portability. Before that I had the old mid-2007 aluminium 15" MBP, which was probably the next-best computer I have ever owned. I loved the screen-size, but I ended up hating the weight of it (that thing was heavy!), which is why I ultimately went with the 13" when time came to replace it.

It's going to be a trade-off in either case, but I am starting to feel a bit tempted by the 16". While it is heavier than the 13", it is far from as heavy as my old 2007 model and therefore seems a bit more manageable and portable.

The main thing discouraing me from the 16" is that small but annoying feeling of buying "old tech," now the 10th generation CPU and the faster RAM is available in the 13".

I gather there hasn't been any specific rumors of a small mid-year refresh of the 16"? So what do you guys think, will we see a mid-year refresh, or will Apple wait with a bigger update until October-November? I figure the whole mini-LED thing is probably not coming until 2021 (and either way, I do not want to be an early adopter of that technology, having witnessed how prone first generation products are to flaws that will be fixed in later generations - I am looking at you, early Retina screens!)