Waiting for the 2020 MBP

[Khaos1]

Of course. Apple used to sell 8GB iOS devices. They used to sell Macs with 4MB of RAM. They do have improve the base spec over time to produce a system that works, they cannot continue with these specs.

That's a world of difference between jumping to 32GB/1TB as a base.

As you purposefully ignoring what I'm saying? My main gripe was about the base storage. I've proposed that Apple goes to a 512 GB base for the regular MBP and 1 TB base for the base upgraded model.

I'm going to leave this conversation here because you're being purposefully obtuse. Judging from the replies, the majority of this thread disagrees with you but you're continuing to defend Apple's decision to keep the same base storage on a $3k laptop over the course of 7-8 years.

 

[Howard2k]

As you purposefully ignoring what I'm saying? My main gripe was about the base storage. I've proposed that Apple goes to a 512 GB base for the regular MBP and 1 TB base for the base upgraded model.

I'm going to leave this conversation here because you're being purposefully obtuse. Judging from the replies, the majority of this thread disagrees with you but you're continuing to defend Apple's decision to keep the same base storage on a $3k laptop over the course of 7-8 years.

I did already explicitly address these points several times. I'm not sure you've actually read my posts.

Yes, Apple do upgrade the base specs over time. Of course they do, they need to keep machines that work.
I addressed that here: #175.

Yes, I'd like to see Apple offer 100TB SSD and 256GB RAM for the same price. Here: #172, here: #170, and here: #168

Yes, I've already address the pricing absurdity too, and no I'm not defending Apple. Right here: #170

Yes, the majority of folks on this forum may disagree. Like you, perhaps they're not reading the posts. But also the majority have little to no real world expertise in marketing and economics.

 

[fokmik]

Stop trolling the members or try insulting them that they don’t know marketing and economics
It seems Apple marketing is making you love to pay the extra bucs for the last year tech
[doublepost=1560351806][/doublepost]I bet you loved Apples 27” Thunderbolt display that even in 2017 was sold for the same price $999 as in 2012

 

[Howard2k]

Stop trolling the members or try insulting them that they don’t know marketing and economics
It seems Apple marketing is making you love to pay the extra bucs for the last year tech
[doublepost=1560351806][/doublepost]I bet you loved Apples 27” Thunderbolt display that even in 2017 was sold for the same price $999 as in 2012

lol, complains about insults that don't exist, throws out insults.

I didn't troll or insult anyone. What are the odds that the majority of users on an Apple forum are professionally employed in a marketing or economics related role? An Apple forum, not a Quicken forum, not an Excel forum, but an Apple forum. You're suggesting that it's insulting to think that the majority are not professionally employed in marketing or economics? You think it's insulting that there would be people on the forum who are coders? Who are creative professionals? Writers? Scientists? Engineers? No, that couldn't possibly make sense. No, the majority are professionally employed in marketing and economics. Yes, that makes complete sense.

I think the Apple 27" display pricing is absurd. Just like I think Apple's SSD rates are absurd. As I already pointed out, and am now pointing out again.

 

[jimmy43]

I think the point Howard2k is making is this - Apple taxes component specs higher than the competition - *regardless* if those specs are offered as upgrades or built into the base spec. Therefore - upping the base spec forces the mark up on people who do not benefit from it.

The point other people on the forum are making is that the base spec itself is well behind the competition in terms of value. Nobody disagrees with this (including Howard2k).

Both points are valid and they do not necessarily contradict each other.

Historically, Apple marketing has tried to optimize such that the base spec is always juuuuuust slightly too weak so users are incentivized to spend a little on upgrades. You can argue this is sound marketing/economics, but you can also argue it stunts creative and technological advancement, where 'unnecessarily beefy' specs can serve to open new fields and developments (e.g. ML). This goes against Apple's own marketing which tries to frame them as the company which is pushing creatives and professionals, when in reality they may be stunting them with these lower than average specs.

 

[fokmik]

Since the 2019 model Apple finally understands the importance of a better thermal paste
So i think the future is bright

 

[Eason85]

https://www.notebookcheck.net/Apple...ple-using-selected-test-samples.423827.0.html

We found that the 6-core model seems to run slower than last year's.

 

[Apathy Overdose]

So nobody here thinks that a brand new MBP is one of the 7 new portable computer models Apple registered recently? Nobody in this thread mentioned it, seems like pretty big (and relevant) news.

https://forums.macrumors.com/thread...d-mac-notebooks-in-eurasian-database.2185723/

 

[sparkie7]

Sept/October the 16-17" MBP. That can drive two Pro display XDR's, maybe even three....

 

[Khaos1]

What chipset would be in a 16 inch MBP if they released it this fall?

They've already upgraded the current MBP's to 9th Gen CPU. Intel 10 nm doesn't look like it's on the horizon at this stage.

I'd be surprised if they release anything else this year.

 

[fokmik]

Sept/October the 16-17" MBP. That can drive two Pro display XDR's, maybe even three....

not a chance to drive 3 xdr 6k displays @60hz

I wonder if this 16" MBP are you talking , was mention by Ming for this year ?

 

[vaugha]

So nobody here thinks that a brand new MBP is one of the 7 new portable computer models Apple registered recently? Nobody in this thread mentioned it, seems like pretty big (and relevant) news.

https://forums.macrumors.com/thread...d-mac-notebooks-in-eurasian-database.2185723/

I don't know why nobody is talking about the big news. It's coming folks. For that, I returned my 2 weeks old 2019 mbp. Gonna save that money and put it towards the 16" mbp w/ oled if it is coming on end of October. If it doesn't, then I will just buy another 2019 mbp at around November time. I wouldn't be surprised if Navi gpus are added to mbps by then as well just like last year w/ Vega. I know a lot of people got pissed over that.

 

[danwells]

I strongly suspect that at least the 16" is among the seven new A numbers that just leaked (Apple uses three different model numbers, and the A number is the most general of the three - M numbers and EMC numbers are both more specific) ...

My best guess is that four of the seven are the 12" MacBook (if it gets the oft-requested cellular modem option, it'll take up four model numbers - WiFi only plus three regional cell variants).

That leaves three machines other than the MacBook - two Pros and something else. I'm on thin ice about what the "something else" might be - my best guess is either a "big MacBook" or an ultra high-end model of the 16" Pro (an OLED display might be a big enough difference to generate its own model number).

Another possibility is that four of the numbers are, in fact, WiFi plus three cell variants of an iPad (which Apple might describe as a "portable personal computer"). That leaves three computers, since there aren't enough numbers for two iPads. Those three would be the 12" MacBook plus the two MBPs.

The 16" would use the same processors as the 15" 2019 model (probably with new GPUs - Navi or 7nm Vega). We still haven't seen 9th Generation i7 processors with less than 45 W TDP, so it's possible there will be a 28 watt 6-core launched by fall, giving a meaningful upgrade to the top-end 13" or 14" model?

 

[sparkie7]

not a chance to drive 3 xdr 6k displays @60hz

I wonder if this 16" MBP are you talking , was mention by Ming for this year ?

I'll settle for 2. As mentioned it's likely one of the new registrations. And if it ain't announced around Sept/Oct then next year.

 

[x-evil-x]

I don't know why nobody is talking about the big news. It's coming folks. For that, I returned my 2 weeks old 2019 mbp. Gonna save that money and put it towards the 16" mbp w/ oled if it is coming on end of October. If it doesn't, then I will just buy another 2019 mbp at around November time. I wouldn't be surprised if Navi gpus are added to mbps by then as well just like last year w/ Vega. I know a lot of people got pissed over that.

I just don’t see them releasing an updated pro machine since they released the 2019 models recently. It would piss off everyone that just bought one. Navi is possibly updated in the current gens But that’s it. I think the new models are just updated for the 12” line maybe some air updates but no pro updates.
I doubt Apple will keep around the 15” model if they have a one inch bigger screen for the 16” and don’t see them releasing a more “pro “16 inch in a slim chassis.
If Apple releases any updated pro machine I’ll be very very surprised.

 

[fokmik]

I'll settle for 2. As mentioned it's likely one of the new registrations. And if it ain't announced around Sept/Oct then next year.

Ming said for late 2019, and in 2021 it will get the miniLED tech from the Xdr display

 

[nameste]

Ming said for late 2019, and in 2021 it will get the miniLED tech from the Xdr display

Can you show where he mentioned late 2019 for 16”?

 

[x-evil-x]

Can you show where he mentioned late 2019 for 16”?

This was also mentioned BEFORE the 2019 MacBook Pro refresh

 

[nameste]

This was also mentioned BEFORE the 2019 MacBook Pro refresh

Ok but afaik the release date postponed to early 2021 for the 16”

 

[SuprUsrStan]

The way I see it, there isn't going to be a better mobile chip than the i9-9980HK until Ice Lake H in 2020. If we see the macbook pro 16" come out sometime in 2020, then sure we'll get the 10 core 7nm CPU but what if Apple releases the computer in 2019?

I see two possibilities for a 2019 release. Both of which are kind of out there but hear me out. With the release of the mac pro and the shift to pro customers, it's likely that the 16" macbook pro is going to be a little more up market than the current macbook pro's. That's why the 16" doesn't necessarily have to be on the same time table as the current 15". Apple can release a 16" new line of macbook pro's without updating the 15" because it's meant as a newer more "pro" line. How does apple achieve more performance in 2019?

1) Apple could release a new much more powerful T3 Co-Processor (mobile afterburner card) that handles much more video editing capabilities capable of doing all of the 4K streams at the same time. Normally this chip will lay dormant unless it's called upon by the software so it'd save power during normal use.

2) Apple could push hard into TB3/4 eGPU land where they could release an external TB3/4 enclosure for their MPX module & afterburner card. Personally, I would be very interested in an apple designed enclosure that is able to take a MPX module, IO card, and an afterburner card. Sure it'd be expensive but apple in house engineering would make sure that the software works properly with the hardware. (current eGPUs sometimes show regressive performance with FCP compared with the vega dGPU)

Heck, I'd be even on board if Apple came out with a proprietary high bandwidth connector for this eGPU dock that gave more than 40GBPS bandwidth. Current eGPU implementations appear to be bandwidth limited in some cases.

 

[vaugha]

Ok but afaik the release date postponed to early 2021 for the 16”

Ya I read that. Oh well, I’m re-ordering a 2019 mbp now. I went all out and ordered a maxed out mbp w/ AppleCare+. 9g after tax in Canadian dollars. Ouch. I hope they really take their time and get it right in 2021.

 

[Apathy Overdose]

Ming didn't say the 16" got postponed to 2021, all he said was that the micro-led display was coming to MBP in 2021. Some people misinterpreted that as the new redesign getting postponed, which is not true, his initial report of redesign in 2019 still stands.

 

[Ener Ji]

What chipset would be in a 16 inch MBP if they released it this fall?

They've already upgraded the current MBP's to 9th Gen CPU. Intel 10 nm doesn't look like it's on the horizon at this stage.

I'd be surprised if they release anything else this year.

10-core Comet Lake is a possibility, IF Intel managed to pull in the timeline. It was originally (via a leak) supposedly scheduled for 2020, but some have been speculating that Intel has accelerated the timeline as a competitive response to AMD's many-core Zen 2 CPUs.

I just don’t see them releasing an updated pro machine since they released the 2019 models recently. It would piss off everyone that just bought one.

<SNIP>

I doubt Apple will keep around the 15” model if they have a one inch bigger screen for the 16” and don’t see them releasing a more “pro “16 inch in a slim chassis.

Why would they do that, when they just rolled out brand new models in June. Doesn't make sense to release a new version for only 3 months.

Releasing a higher-priced new model in the same year the previous line is refreshed is exactly what Apple did in 2012 when they led with the 15" retina MBP as a new "Halo" device just a couple of months after refreshing (for the last time) the unibody MBPs. It shouldn't surprise anyone if history repeats itself this year.

The way I see it, there isn't going to be a better mobile chip than the i9-9980HK until Ice Lake H in 2020. If we see the macbook pro 16" come out sometime in 2020, then sure we'll get the 10 core 7nm CPU but what if Apple releases the computer in 2019?

Rumors and leaked roadmaps suggest no 10nm "H-class" CPU is coming in 2020 nor 2021. Intel may roll out a 10nm "H" CPU in 2022 or try and jump directly to 7nm. In the meantime, another 14nm(+++) CPU is on the roadmap, albeit this time 10-cores.

I see two possibilities for a 2019 release. Both of which are kind of out there but hear me out. With the release of the mac pro and the shift to pro customers, it's likely that the 16" macbook pro is going to be a little more up market than the current macbook pro's. That's why the 16" doesn't necessarily have to be on the same time table as the current 15". Apple can release a 16" new line of macbook pro's without updating the 15" because it's meant as a newer more "pro" line. How does apple achieve more performance in 2019?

1) Apple could release a new much more powerful T3 Co-Processor (mobile afterburner card) that handles much more video editing capabilities capable of doing all of the 4K streams at the same time. Normally this chip will lay dormant unless it's called upon by the software so it'd save power during normal use.

2) Apple could push hard into TB3/4 eGPU land where they could release an external TB3/4 enclosure for their MPX module & afterburner card. Personally, I would be very interested in an apple designed enclosure that is able to take a MPX module, IO card, and an afterburner card. Sure it'd be expensive but apple in house engineering would make sure that the software works properly with the hardware. (current eGPUs sometimes show regressive performance with FCP compared with the vega dGPU)

Heck, I'd be even on board if Apple came out with a proprietary high bandwidth connector for this eGPU dock that gave more than 40GBPS bandwidth. Current eGPU implementations appear to be bandwidth limited in some cases.

Interesting ideas. I'm tempted to bite the bullet and upgrade to a 2019 MBP now as I suspect I might get priced out of the 16" if it launches as a new ultra-high-end device, but I'd be a little upset if a significantly higher performing mobile Navi replaces mobile Vega at the same price this Fall. Choices, choices, and trade-offs... ‍♂️

 

[x-evil-x]

10-core Comet Lake is a possibility, IF Intel managed to pull in the timeline. It was originally (via a leak) supposedly scheduled for 2020, but some have been speculating that Intel has accelerated the timeline as a competitive response to AMD's many-core Zen 2 CPUs.





Releasing a higher-priced new model in the same year the previous line is refreshed is exactly what Apple did in 2012 when they led with the 15" retina MBP as a new "Halo" device just a couple of months after refreshing (for the last time) the unibody MBPs. It shouldn't surprise anyone if history repeats itself this year.



Rumors and leaked roadmaps suggest no 10nm "H-class" CPU is coming in 2020 nor 2021. Intel may roll out a 10nm "H" CPU in 2022 or try and jump directly to 7nm. In the meantime, another 14nm(+++) CPU is on the roadmap, albeit this time 10-cores.



Interesting ideas. I'm tempted to bite the bullet and upgrade to a 2019 MBP now as I suspect I might get priced out of the 16" if it launches as a new ultra-high-end device, but I'd be a little upset if a significantly higher performing mobile Navi replaces mobile Vega at the same price this Fall. Choices, choices, and trade-offs... ‍♂️

Sure if the model is a new higher end model. But do you see them releasing a 1” bigger screen model with small form factor still limiting how much power the machine could get for an extra 6-700$ price at a starting price at 2999? I don’t see how they would expect anybody to buy it with a small spec update maybe including Navi chips but I don’t see how they can offer anything higher than current 15” models to ask for a higher price besides a slightly bigger screen.
I still see apple dropping the 15” model in favor of the 16”. They can fit a 1” bigger screen into the current form factor on the 15” right now if they wanted.
Only way I can see apple having a completely separate model from the 15.4” is to bring back the 17” model.

 

[Loge]

Releasing a higher-priced new model in the same year the previous line is refreshed is exactly what Apple did in 2012 when they led with the 15" retina MBP as a new "Halo" device just a couple of months after refreshing (for the last time) the unibody MBPs. It shouldn't surprise anyone if history repeats itself this year.

No, the 15" retina was announced at the same time (WWDC 2012) as the refresh - the previous refresh was in October 2011. The closest comparison is probably when they released the 17" unibody in early 2009 not long after the 15" one in 2008.

Either way this mythical 16" model is more likely to be 2020 than 2019.