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KaiFiMacFan

Suspended
Apr 28, 2023
322
647
Brooklyn, NY
I enjoyed The Goldfinch, but I didn't like it as much as The Secret History (I think parts of The Goldfinch were repetitive and tedious toward the middle). The Secret History is one of those books that I enjoyed even more on the second reading, and that's always a sign of a good book.

To update this thread: I'm reading The Great Believers by Rebecca Makkai. It tells two stories, set in different times. First, the story of a gay art dealer in Chicago in the midst of the AIDS epidemic, and second the story of one of this art dealer's friends in 2015, as she searches for her missing adult daughter in Paris. Given the subject matter, the book has so far been quite sad, but I also can't put it down.
 

ucfgrad93

macrumors Core
Aug 17, 2007
19,579
10,875
Colorado
It’s part of a 4 year EFM course.

5338d2e75265e2b22caa60102d198dc0.jpg
What does EFM stand for?
 

Clix Pix

macrumors Core
The Secret History is excellent; a dark, compelling, tale and a work well worth reading.
I remember that at the time it was first coming out that all the reviews and readers' comments were very enthusiastic, but I must've been busy at the time and put it off and then unfortunately forgot about it for rather a long while. Next time I am at the library I will check to see if they've got a copy on the shelf and if not I'll put in a hold request for it.
 
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Scepticalscribe

macrumors Haswell
Jul 29, 2008
65,136
47,525
In a coffee shop.
I remember that at the time it was first coming out that all the reviews and readers' comments were very enthusiastic, but I must've been busy at the time and put it off and then unfortunately forgot about it for rather a long while. Next time I am at the library I will check to see if they've got a copy on the shelf and if not I'll put in a hold request for it.

Two other books from that era - which touch on some of these themes - that I also recommend are Marisha Pessl's "Special Topics in Calamity Physics", and Arundhati Roy's "The God of Small Things".
 
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KaliYoni

macrumors 68000
Feb 19, 2016
1,785
3,928
Just picked up at the library a book for which I've been on the waiting list a while, Jennifer Homans' Mr B: George Balanchine's 20th Century. I must say this is a weighty tome in more ways than one -- they used really good, high-quality paper (a rarity these days) for the 768 or so pages and the book really is heavy to physically carry and hold! Flipping through, I can see that it has lots of photos, though this is not in any way a cocktail table book meant for display. In just a quick perusal it is clear that the book contains a lot of what presumably is good, meaty and interesting text. Looking forward to getting into it!

I enjoyed Mr. B, although reading about ballet is inherently lacking for obvious reasons! Homan’s earlier book, Apollo’s Angels, is well worth picking up as well, although I feel it suffers from a slight flatness to the writing that is also present in Mr. B.

A great complement to Mr. B, both in subject (Imperial-trained Russian choreographers, neo-classical ballet) and in time period (Europe and Russia in the early 20th century, post WWII America) is La Nijinska (Garafola). Anybody who thinks Maria Tallchief and Cyd Charisse were great dancers have Bronislava Nijinska to thank!
 
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Clix Pix

macrumors Core
I absolutely agree that reading about ballet, whether it be in a combination biography/historical overview of a time period or a more personal description written by a dancer about his or her life from childhood classes to preprofessional intensive training to life in a ballet company is not at all the same as actually dancing oneself, performing outside of class, and having worked with the classical steps and moves, explored and experienced developing the choreography with a ballet master or mistress and then putting it all to actual use..... I've only had beginning-level ballet classes -- never got to go en pointe -- and that was many, many years ago so now I know and vaguely remember just enough to appreciate it for the art and athletic undertaking it actually is.

I'm almost finished with Mr B and, yes, I had vaguely thought about picking up Apollo's Angels, too, and I have it on my list but am not going to hurry to get into that book just yet, have a few others on the list ahead of it in terms of priority!
 
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yaxomoxay

macrumors 604
Mar 3, 2010
7,439
34,275
Texas
I'll take your word on this.

Especially a word so eloquently and graphically expressed.

In general, I dread - truly dread - the TV or movie adaptation of a text - or book - that I have loved.

Most of them are so dire, so execrable, so uniformly ghastly, - missing the tone, nuance, subtlety, complexity and sheer intelligence, of the original.
Just to give you an idea:
  • They added a female warrior that goes from hill to hill, dressed like Legolas, to shoot arrows at Bernardo Gui (the inquisitor)
  • They made Gui a crazy fanatic with visions and such. The scary thing of Gui is that he was exactly very analytical, intelligent, and a person of his time. He was scary because he believed in the logic of what he was doing.
  • The important discussion about laugher has been reduced to a 5 seconds idiotic scene.
  • They created a totally fictional background story of the unnamed girl (which they named)
  • Worse offense of all: they made Adso and the Unnamed Girl see each other multiple times. They make Adso get out of the monastery to go to the girl. Now, THE most beautiful thing of that story in the book and the movie is that he doesn’t know her name, who she is, and they see each other only once, yet true love remains forever, if not in name (hence the name of the novel).
There’s more but this should give you enough nausea.
 
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Scepticalscribe

macrumors Haswell
Jul 29, 2008
65,136
47,525
In a coffee shop.
Just to give you an idea:
  • They added a female warrior that goes from hill to hill, dressed like Legolas, to shoot arrows at Bernardo Gui (the inquisitor)
  • They made Gui a crazy fanatic with visions and such. The scary thing of Gui is that he was exactly very analytical, intelligent, and a person of his time. He was scary because he believed in the logic of what he was doing.
  • The important discussion about laugher has been reduced to a 5 seconds idiotic scene.
  • They created a totally fictional background story of the unnamed girl (which they named)
  • Worse offense of all: they made Adso and the Unnamed Girl see each other multiple times. They make Adso get out of the monastery to go to the girl. Now, THE most beautiful thing of that story in the book and the movie is that he doesn’t know her name, who she is, and they see each other only once, yet true love remains forever, if not in name (hence the name of the novel).
There’s more but this should give you enough nausea.
You have convinced me to forego this series, don't worry.

And your arguments convince me that subjecting myself to it would achieve nothing other than appal me.

Actually, I hate it when movie or TV producers decide that an already excellent book needs to be "sexed up" (while, what is philosophically important in that story is reduced to platitudes of a couple of seconds) all because they fear that an audience with a limited attention span will not be able to follow the tale, stay focussed, let alone retain an interest, unless it has the clarity and lack of subtlety of a children's story (some of which, in reality, were a lot deeper, darker, and more nuanced than the modern sanitised versions would permit us to see).

In a bizarre way, to my mind, this shows something suggesting a contempt for an audience (and this is one of the reasons I very rarely see a movie; so many of them are too obvious, too unsubtle, too unintelligent in how they choose to tell a story. They disdain complexity and nuance - the proverbial "grey areas" which are what are of interest - and favour sensation, and a blunt approach to narrative).

Now, while I quite liked the movie adaptation of The Name of the Rose, - above all, I liked the fact that many of the actors resembled characters in a 14th-15th C Renaissance painting, in that they weren't improbably good-looking with perfect features and amazing teeth - I deeply disliked the reduction of the important discussion about laughter (that is a key part of the book, philosophically) to next to nothing.

However, as with your totally pertinent remarks about Bernard de Gui - why reduce an antagonist to someone who is merely a maniac and a moron? Chilling, intelligent, informed, analytical antagonists who believe in their cause, coldly, with intelligence and thought are much more unnerving - this is exactly why Clifford Rose's portrayal of Ludwig Kessler in Secret Army was so compelling - another thing I deeply disliked about the movie was the motivation the movie gave to William (that he had been tortured by the Inquisition).

Personally, I thought this totally unnecessary, and, as usual, utterly unsubtle and completely forced. And, it didn't sit with how his character had been written.

For, William didn't need to have been physically threatened and traumatised, as a person, for the story of why he had changed his approach and some of his beliefs - to work as a story.

His growing horror at what he was serving and his dawning awareness of the fact torture didn't always elicit truth - remember that wonderful quote (some centuries later, obviously) from Oliver Cromwell: "I beseech you, in the bowels of Christ, to think it possible you may be mistaken" - was a motive that was more than sufficient. To me, at least.

Psychologically, philosophically, ethically, morally, his motivation in the book, what had driven him to become a more humane and tolerant yet still somewhat sceptical, intelligent - almost wise - cool, and detached man - namely, that he had become disgusted with both himself and his work as an inquisitor - was much more satisfying, much more in keeping with his character, much more credible in terms of driving him to seek truth, (rather than seek revenge) and - candidly - much more believable to the narrative.
 
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txa1265

macrumors 65816
Aug 15, 2002
1,063
346
Corning, NY
You're absolutely not butting in and remember your option is valid as anyone else's on here. Personally I really enjoyed the Secret History but struggled to finish the Goldfinch, but it was quite a while ago so I can't remember what I did and don't like about it. So I'm not going to be much help!

Post your biology books - they sound interesting. Sandeels and commercial fish food?

My wife and I both read The Goldfinch, I really enjoyed it and highly recommend it ... and she found it dry and slow and would definitely would have rated it mediocre. I don't mind differing tastes and opinions so long as there is some reasoning behind them.
 
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Scepticalscribe

macrumors Haswell
Jul 29, 2008
65,136
47,525
In a coffee shop.
I headed into the library earlier today, returning four books, with the intention of picking up two that the online system had advised me were being held for me.

However, when I arrived, it transpired that four further books (that I had requested, waiting months for one or two of them) had been delivered just this very morning....and so, my bulging briefcase (I would have turned up with a rucksack had I realised the harvest of riches that awaited me - some of those books are big, fat, heavy, hard-back, inviting tomes) was......well, bulging, as I trotted to the nearest bus stop (the librarian kindly asking me whether I had far to walk) with a view to heading home.

So, where to start on the (many) books that await me.....
 
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Clix Pix

macrumors Core
I've run into the problem of all of a sudden having more books to pick up than I had expected, plus also being tempted by one or two new titles that were magically sitting on the new Books shelves, too, irresistible..... I have finally learned that even though I might be going into the library to return just three books and to pick up what I think will be three books as well, that it is more than likely I'll come home with more than that, or that the items will be larger and heftier than I had anticipated.

Finally I've gotten myself into the habit of actually regularly using the nice book bag that I bought a few years ago when the library was selling them as a fund-raising activity....it really does help significantly when transporting the items from library to car, then car to house, and back again!

Reading them all is another challenge, indeed, especially when one or more definitely require more time and thoughtful attention than others. I can already see that several of the books I checked out at the same time that I checked out the hefty but fascinating Mr B will need to be renewed, and fortunately I think that won't be a problem, as they're older titles, not new best-sellers. I'm nearly finished with Mr B (no possibility of renewal, as there are other holds on that book) need to stop re-reading certain favorite sections of it, and am thinking I'll be able to return it to the library tomorrow when I am running other errands.
 

Scepticalscribe

macrumors Haswell
Jul 29, 2008
65,136
47,525
In a coffee shop.
I've run into the problem of all of a sudden having more books to pick up than I had expected, plus also being tempted by one or two new titles that were magically sitting on the new Books shelves, too, irresistible..... I have finally learned that even though I might be going into the library to return just three books and to pick up what I think will be three books as well, that it is more than likely I'll come home with more than that, or that the items will be larger and heftier than I had anticipated.

Finally I've gotten myself into the habit of actually regularly using the nice book bag that I bought a few years ago when the library was selling them as a fund-raising activity....it really does help significantly when transporting the items from library to car, then car to house, and back again!

Reading them all is another challenge, indeed, especially when one or more definitely require more time and thoughtful attention than others. I can already see that several of the books I checked out at the same time that I checked out the hefty but fascinating Mr B will need to be renewed, and fortunately I think that won't be a problem, as they're older titles, not new best-sellers. I'm nearly finished with Mr B (no possibility of renewal, as there are other holds on that book) need to stop re-reading certain favorite sections of it, and am thinking I'll be able to return it to the library tomorrow when I am running other errands.

Well, occasionally, I have been greeted by one or two unexpected late arrivals when I headed in to the library to collect the two or three that may have been on hold for me.

However, today, I did not expect to receive four further books, on top of the two I was picking up.

Never mind; I have plenty of reading material, and, along with book shops (bricks'n'mortar bookshops), I must say that I love libraries, - the staff are invariably knowledgeable and enthusiastic - and I love to see people in them, availing of the facilities, and immersing themselves in what is available to read.
 
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pachyderm

macrumors G4
Jan 12, 2008
10,751
5,417
Smyrna, TN
I've run into the problem of all of a sudden having more books to pick up than I had expected, plus also being tempted by one or two new titles that were magically sitting on the new Books shelves, too, irresistible..... I have finally learned that even though I might be going into the library to return just three books and to pick up what I think will be three books as well, that it is more than likely I'll come home with more than that, or that the items will be larger and heftier than I had anticipated.

Finally I've gotten myself into the habit of actually regularly using the nice book bag that I bought a few years ago when the library was selling them as a fund-raising activity....it really does help significantly when transporting the items from library to car, then car to house, and back again!

Reading them all is another challenge, indeed, especially when one or more definitely require more time and thoughtful attention than others. I can already see that several of the books I checked out at the same time that I checked out the hefty but fascinating Mr B will need to be renewed, and fortunately I think that won't be a problem, as they're older titles, not new best-sellers. I'm nearly finished with Mr B (no possibility of renewal, as there are other holds on that book) need to stop re-reading certain favorite sections of it, and am thinking I'll be able to return it to the library tomorrow when I am running other errands.
I've a stack about two feet tall...
 
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