What have you done with an early Intel recently?

[Amethyst1]

Ironically, the mods once warned me that notifying people that I'm going to ignore them can constitute trolling.

I like to think of it this way: if I’m going to ignore someone I’m doing so for a reason and am not going to un-ignore them by notifying them.

Ignore and forget is the lesson I’ve managed to learn over the years. Trolls just aren’t worth it. Don’t even think about what they’re going to do next. Not worth it.

It’s not always that easy to ignore and forget people that make your real life miserable, but here it is.

 

[rin67630]

On that rMBP, which version of iTunes are you running with Mojave?

I am running 12.9.55
Do you know relevant differences to older versions?

 

[B S Magnet]

I am running 12.9.55
Do you know relevant differences to older versions?

Cheers.

Relevant differences are, fundamentally, in two areas, as it pertains to my needs:

1. The general and obvious is the UI/UX: from iTunes 11 onward, the UI/UX of iTunes, as well as the application’s primary mandate, grew more oriented around purchasing content from Apple and not, strictly, around the needs of local archival work — as had been the iTunes mandate dating back to v1.0 (on OS 9 and OS X public beta, in 2000).
2. The other reason: my iTunes archives library, a continuing project with decades of work already put into it (with well over 100 days’ worth of music, if played non-stop and without repeating), lives on the external SSD alongside the content itself. I own several Macs, from PowerPC to Intel. iTunes 10.6.3 is, uniquely, the only version of iTunes to run on everything from OS X 10.5.8 for PowerPC to macOS 10.13.6 on Macs as new as 2018 models (I am, of course, hopeful to find a workaround to extend that to macOS 10.14.6).
   
   iTunes 10.6.3 was always quite remarkable in the sense that it was both backward-compatible and, for a long time, also future-resistant (not quite “future-proof”, but not bad, either). It’s also a stable build and one very forgiving of UI tweaks (via OnyX, TinkerTool, and other means), in ways which become more difficult for subsequent major versions.
3. I did promise two reasons, but this ties in with #2: the DJing software I use on my Mac running Snow Leopard relies on (and is optimized for) iTunes 10.x.

 

[rin67630]

Cheers.

Relevant differences are, fundamentally, in two areas, as it pertains to my needs:

1. The general and obvious is the UI/UX: from iTunes 11 onward, the UI/UX of iTunes, as well as the application’s primary mandate, grew more oriented around purchasing content from Apple and not, strictly, around the needs of local archival work — as had been the iTunes mandate dating back to v1.0 (on OS 9 and OS X public beta, in 2000).
2. The other reason: my iTunes archives library, a continuing project with decades of work already put into it (with well over 100 days’ worth of music, if played non-stop and without repeating), lives on the external SSD alongside the content itself. I own several Macs, from PowerPC to Intel. iTunes 10.6.3 is, uniquely, the only version of iTunes to run on everything from OS X 10.5.8 for PowerPC to macOS 10.13.6 on Macs as new as 2018 models (I am, of course, hopeful to find a workaround to extend that to macOS 10.14.6).
   
   iTunes 10.6.3 was always quite remarkable in the sense that it was both backward-compatible and, for a long time, also future-resistant (not quite “future-proof”, but not bad, either). It’s also a stable build and one very forgiving of UI tweaks (via OnyX, TinkerTool, and other means), in ways which become more difficult for subsequent major versions.
3. I did promise two reasons, but this ties in with #2: the DJing software I use on my Mac running Snow Leopard relies on (and is optimized for) iTunes 10.x.

I was not familiar with the older versions, and -yes- I hate Apples orientation towards subscriptions and discouraging local archiving. Yet the 19.9.55 version still rips CDs and finds the directory and artwork to most CDs. That matters for me and is one of my main reason to stick to Mojave.

As far as I remember, the radio directory of the Snow Leopard times were ways more complete and easy to browse.

The following "Music" from Catalina on is i.m.h.o. a single piece of cr*p.
You can't even listen to a radio stream without an Apple music account popup.

 

[Needleroozer]

And of course, normal service is resumed! Thanks. But it still begs the question: why did the dongle work in the hub but not directly?
🤔

One thing that I’ve found with OS X and USB hubs is that devices plugged into a USB hub don’t seem to have a power limit enforced. So if your Bluetooth dongle is trying to draw more than 100mA (default USB current without negotiations) or 500mA (max USB 2.0 current), that might be the issue at play.
I personally have a keyboard that needs this treatment, so it has a USB hub that is basically permanently attached now…

 

[Tratkazir_the_1st]

Got this things, installed in one of my home Mac Pros

Dual M.2 PCIe SSD Adapter Card - x8 / x16 Dual NVMe or AHCI M.2 SSD to PCI Express 3.0 - M.2 NGFF PC

Enhance workstation performance by adding two PCIe 3.0 M.2 SSDs (NVMe or AHCI) into your desktop computer

www.startech.com

https://www.xpg.com/us/xpg/583?tab=spec - 2 pieces

Checked with Mojave - controller detected as NVMExpress, drives detected too. Transferring Gentoo onto 1 of them, second is for games (in Gentoo) .
BTW - controller installed in upper slot ("x4\RAID"). Speed is not my priority .

 

[rin67630]

Got this things, installed in one of my home Mac Pros

Dual M.2 PCIe SSD Adapter Card - x8 / x16 Dual NVMe or AHCI M.2 SSD to PCI Express 3.0 - M.2 NGFF PC

Enhance workstation performance by adding two PCIe 3.0 M.2 SSDs (NVMe or AHCI) into your desktop computer

www.startech.com

https://www.xpg.com/us/xpg/583?tab=spec - 2 pieces

Checked with Mojave - controller detected as NVMExpress, drives detected too. Transferring Gentoo onto 1 of them, second is for games (in Gentoo) .
BTW - controller installed in upper slot ("x4\RAID"). Speed is not my priority .

What really matters: can you boot and run macOS from them?
Else why a NVMe adapter, if speed is not your concern?

 

[Amethyst1]

What really matters: can you boot and run macOS from them?

They’re running Linux. So that doesn’t matter.

 

[rin67630]

They’re running Linux. So that doesn’t matter.

But can you boot from the NVMe? e.g. are the adapters recognized right at EFI-level?

 

[Amethyst1]

But can you boot from the NVMe? e.g. are the adapters recognized right at EFI-level?

You can hack NVMe support into the 3,1‘s firmware IIRC, 4,1s flashed to 5,1 and 5,1s can do it with the latest firmware. The OP has 5,1s so they’re covered.

 

[ToniCH]

But can you boot from the NVMe? e.g. are the adapters recognized right at EFI-level?

I have the same card but as Lycom brand. I can boot from NVMe in my cMP 5.1.

IMO the only point in using NVMe's with expensive adapter card in cMP is speed.

 

[Tratkazir_the_1st]

can you boot and run macOS from them?

I suppose, it will work. I've got it for Gentoo, transferred it from SATA SSD's.
NVME - for drives count . Previous system had 18 drives (SAS+SATA), MacPro can handle only 6 SATA (I don't use DVD drive). I'm thinking about 2 other NVME adapters, 4 ports each.

 

[Amethyst1]

NVME - for drives count

Can I ask what you’re doing with that much drive space?

 

[Tratkazir_the_1st]

drive space?

There are not so much literally space, because all SATA SSD's ranges from 250 to 500 Gb. One hard drive (WD Raptor 300 Gb) used for pair of classical Mac OS X: Snow Leo, High Sierra & Mojave. NVME SSDs dedicated for Gentoo (I had to buy 1Tb drives because it was size in previous system). Pair of SATA SSDs used for tests with more modern Mac OSes (currently - Monterey & Sonoma, seems that there is no luck with Sonoma because of RX6600 & AVX requirement). One SSD is used by Win11, for experiments (it' Insider Preview build). It's always good to have spare drive for OS you would like to look at (even if we talk about VMs - we have to place their files somewhre, right?)

 

[B S Magnet]

Yah, I need not a reminder: standing up to their guff — hardly lectureworthy, more on par with shartposting — landed me in suspension for a few days. Trolls are tiresome.

---

Coming back to topic on the migration to Mojave:

I installed Catalina on a VM last night, using only a 4GB RAM allocation. It was a slow install, but it worked.

I was amused to learn I was able to boot into its recovery partition, so to disable SIP, by writing an nvram command before reboot (and deleting it afterwards).

View attachment 2347334

This was only a test to compare performance of Signal within the Catalina VM against the same within antiX. Notably, unlike the 1GB RAM set for antiX, I set this up with 4GB. To little surprise, Signal runs worse in the Catalina VM. My Signal test is making an audio note to self. Signal has choppy audio in both, but it’s less severe in antiX. I might change the RAM allocation for antiX and re-test it again when I have some time to do so.


Separately, I tried the macports migration for the new Mojave install. I managed to get to step 3e successfully before I ran into troubles. So I’m rebuilding everything from scratch, which isnt annoying, but it will take a couple of days to get everything reasonably close to everything I had installed previously.

iTunes 10.6.3 in Mojave update! (with a call to invite y’all’s minds on this challenge)

Some progress, but still some work to do:

Initially, I viewed the iTunes binary within 0xED, to assess whether there was an obvious chunk of ASCII-translated code pointing me in the right direction. At first glance, it didn’t appear so, so that’s on hold for now.

Instead, I tried a different idea: in Terminal, as root/su (it was already open), I launched the iTunes binary directly from within /Applications/iTunes/Contents/MacOS/. I expected an immediate termination message within the Terminal window, but not so! The “Terms of Use” screen on first run for iTunes showed up, coupled with a long beach ball delay. At this point, I was worried it would fault and crash.

After a few seconds, the UI freed up and allowed me to click “Accept” on the terms window. Then, the default, empty library displayed (coupled with a Little Snitch alert regarding software signing being changed — no big deal, really).

Take note how the iTunes 10.6.3 icon is still showing a 🚫/prohibited cross-out, implying incompatibility:

What this tells me, I think, is the inability to launch iTunes from clicking its application icon is something Apple added to Mojave to prevent a user from doing just this very thing (perhaps because they really wanted people to just let iTunes 10.x (and possibly even 11.x) go, in lieu of iTunes 12.9.x for Mojave. (I had a feeling this might be the case, as other 32-bit applications do launch, and iTunes should, in theory, be no different).

If so, then this also suggests there is probably a flag or setting within Mojave which can be overridden is disabled to permit the means to launch iTunes 10.6.3 by simply launching from selecting the iTunes icon. This is where I invite y’all to brainstorm this with me.

[When I managed in 2020 to get iTunes 10.6.3 to launch in Mojave, back when I briefly tested Mojave, I don’t remember doing all of this. I remember it being much less roundabout.]

---

As proof of concept, I just opened a random ’80s stream and lo’ Whitney Houston’s and Narada Michael Walden’s anthem from June 1987 was there to greet me:

 

[B S Magnet]

iTunes 10.6.3 in Mojave update! (with a call to invite y’all’s minds on this challenge)

View attachment 2347908

Some progress, but still some work to do:

Initially, I viewed the iTunes binary within 0xED, to assess whether there was an obvious chunk of ASCII-translated code pointing me in the right direction. At first glance, it didn’t appear so, so that’s on hold for now.

Instead, I tried a different idea: in Terminal, as root/su (it was already open), I launched the iTunes binary directly from within /Applications/iTunes/Contents/MacOS/. I expected an immediate termination message within the Terminal window, but not so! The “Terms of Use” screen on first run for iTunes showed up, coupled with a long beach ball delay. At this point, I was worried it would fault and crash.

After a few seconds, the UI freed up and allowed me to click “Accept” on the terms window. Then, the default, empty library displayed (coupled with a Little Snitch alert regarding software signing being changed — no big deal, really).

Take note how the iTunes 10.6.3 icon is still showing a 🚫/prohibited cross-out, implying incompatibility:

View attachment 2347911

What this tells me, I think, is the inability to launch iTunes from clicking its application icon is something Apple added to Mojave to prevent a user from doing just this very thing (perhaps because they really wanted people to just let iTunes 10.x (and possibly even 11.x) go, in lieu of iTunes 12.9.x for Mojave. (I had a feeling this might be the case, as other 32-bit applications do launch, and iTunes should, in theory, be no different).

If so, then this also suggests there is probably a flag or setting within Mojave which can be overridden is disabled to permit the means to launch iTunes 10.6.3 by simply launching from selecting the iTunes icon. This is where I invite y’all to brainstorm this with me.

[When I managed in 2020 to get iTunes 10.6.3 to launch in Mojave, back when I briefly tested Mojave, I don’t remember doing all of this. I remember it being much less roundabout.]

---

As proof of concept, I just opened a random ’80s stream and lo’ Whitney Houston’s and Narada Michael Walden’s anthem from June 1987 was there to greet me:

View attachment 2347912

UPDATE of update!

I sincerely don’t know what I did here. I could launch iTunes from Terminal, but launching via icon kept failing.

On a lark the other day, I had altered the Info.plist within /Contents to spoof 10.6.3 as 12.9.5.5 (the version embedded with the last 10.14.6 update). Given my success with opening iTunes 10.6.3 via Terminal, I decided to, once more, install iTunes 10.6.3 via Pacifist, just as I had previously, but this time, to leave all .plist parameters alone and, in effect, giving the system a clean, fresh install for iTunes 10.6.3. (I had done this previously, just prior to altering the iTunes Info.plist and version.plist files, but to no avail.)

This time, something just worked, as a Jobs-era iTunes ought to:

And with my library volume mounted (which is where my library .itl lives), LOOK WHAT WE HAVE HERE:

The relief I’m feeling right now cannot be overstated. I can now live alongside Mojave in a kind of splendid harmony, give or take. I am also glad to share this in the event another person, sometime later on, finds themselves in this same camp.

All the same, I’m still stumped by what prevented iTunes 10.6.3 from launching successfully beforehand. As far as I can tell, this Pacifist install was no different than the first time.

---

UNRELATED POSTSCRIPT: I haven’t bothered to test this, but apparently one can launch iTunes 12.9.5.5 in Catalina (in lieu of Music.app), by spoofing the Info.plist/version.plist call-outs for the version number, per this script I found (this tack is similar to what I tried above, but to little effect). My understanding was iTunes, all versions, was never written in 64-bit code, but maybe the very last version named as such was one of the first 64-bit iterations to evolve into Music.app. Perhaps someone else here might want to tinker with it.

In addition, there is also a community-built utility which enables the use of older-version Apple applications on High Sierra, on up to Ventura (note: no mention of Sonoma), called Retroactive. This utility allows for the installation of several applications (like Final Cut Pro, iWork ’09, and others), including earlier iTunes versions on later OS builds. Notably, the lowest version this utility will allow the user to select is the installation of iTunes 10.7.

 

[dandeco]

Yesterday I filmed a fursuit vlog talking about Apple announcing the 2012 unibody 13" MacBook Pro is now obsolete, even editing the video on my unibody 13" Pro on iMovie '11 and shooting it on HDV to add to the late 2000s-early 2010s mood!

The editing process:

But I did have to cheat a little, as it turns out iMovie '11 running on Mac OS X El Capitan or greater has problems with adding still photos to your video project. So I exported the video from iMovie in its' full 1080p quality and added the photos I wanted to use on my M1 MacBook Air using the current iMovie, then re-exporting that.
Sorry if I sound a little "off" there; I was kind of feeling uneasy because I was worrying a bit if my mom was becoming a furry as well (i.e. when she knocked on my door like Disney's Big Bad Wolf that morning), hoping it wouldn't become like the climax of the "South Park" Chinpokomon episode...

 

[B S Magnet]

Yesterday I filmed a fursuit vlog talking about Apple announcing the 2012 unibody 13" MacBook Pro is now obsolete, even editing the video on my unibody 13" Pro on iMovie '11 and shooting it on HDV to add to the late 2000s-early 2010s mood!

The editing process:
View attachment 2348598
But I did have to cheat a little, as it turns out iMovie '11 running on Mac OS X El Capitan or greater has problems with adding still photos to your video project. So I exported the video from iMovie in its' full 1080p quality and added the photos I wanted to use on my M1 MacBook Air using the current iMovie, then re-exporting that.
Sorry if I sound a little "off" there; I was kind of feeling uneasy because I was worrying a bit if my mom was becoming a furry as well (i.e. when she knocked on my door like Disney's Big Bad Wolf that morning), hoping it wouldn't become like the climax of the "South Park" Chinpokomon episode...

The biggest sad for Apple nixing even vintage-level support for the mid-2012 13-inch unibody MBP is no longer will Apple-supplied batteries for the 13-inch 2009–12 line, sold 2009–16, be available for purchase. Other parts may, for a time, still be out there for a while to come, but the biggest (and most troublesome) consumable just lost the A-level cells Apple insist Apple-branded batteries to contain.

I sometimes wonder whether Apple have shut out the supply of A-level batteries coming from non-Apple parties, even after a form factor has fallen entirely into “obsolete” status, making it nigh impossible for finding non-Apple-branded Li-Ion/Li-Poly replacements on par with Apple-branded OEM replacements. If this, ultimately, turned out to be found definitively the case in trade practice, then this would be treading headlong into anticompetitive grounds.

We should all pour one out for losing all Apple support for the steadfast unibody Mac. It was a potent, fifteen-year run no other Mac form factor has pulled off (though its direct cousin, the 2010-and-later Mac mini unibody form factor, comes pretty close).

 

[MacFoxG4]

Re-Installed and updated PPCMC 7.2.6 Intel edition on the 2006 MBP under Snow Leopard. I gave up on the Intel edition when I couldn't figure out how to get Python working again and switched to the PPC version with the updated Python from Leopard.sh. Well, since then I discovered another way to update Python, which I already used to update PPCMC 6 on Lion. Basically, I installed MacPorts on the MBP, built Python 3.10, replaced the necessary files inside the PPCMC.app, renamed said files to the ones PPCMC used and voila! However, PPCMC 7.2.6 Intel edition also requires git to be updated, so I built git via MacPorts and replaced the necessary files (no renaming needed this time). What it is confusing is that the error you get in Terminal if you use the stock version of PPCMC 7.2.6 Intel is that you need version 9.0.0 of git, whereas MacPorts lists its version of git as 2.43.1. Anyway, all that updating worked and now I have PPCMC 7.2.6 Intel functioning again.

 

[sdfox7]

We had a major snowstorm yesterday, couldn't go out but decided to refresh my 2006 MacBook2,1. Still in excellent shape for the age. I'm using 10.6.8 since it's more functional than 10.4/10.5.

I'm posting to MacRumors with it right now. Firefox 45 ESR. Extremely fast under Ethernet. Could use a new battery.

Still a pleasure to use.

 

[wicknix]

Firefox 45 ESR.

Ouch. At the very least grab one or both of these browsers.
Basilisk55 / SnowLion
They are newer, will render quite a bit more, and be quite a bit more secure.
Otherwise nice machine. Have one myself dual booting 10.6 and win7.

 

[Tratkazir_the_1st]

Tested a pair of videocards. (GT730 HP-branded & flashed for PowerPC Radeon 1900). EnableGop works with Geforce but no image at all with Radeon . But I heard Windows startup sound (it is selected by default in OC), without picture anyway .

 

[rin67630]

Tested a pair of videocards. (GT730 HP-branded & flashed for PowerPC Radeon 1900). EnableGop works with Geforce but no image at all with Radeon . But I heard Windows startup sound (it is selected by default in OC), without picture anyway .

I can't tell with a MacPro but on a Macbook 2012, booting from GPT with EFI always lead to no picture.
The origin is on the memory handling at EFI level. Booting from MBR with BootCamp (aaargh !) was the only way to get Windows running.

 

[sdfox7]

Ouch. At the very least grab one or both of these browsers.
Basilisk55 / SnowLion
They are newer, will render quite a bit more, and be quite a bit more secure.
Otherwise nice machine. Have one myself dual booting 10.6 and win7.

Thanks, I've downloaded both. Basilisk apparently is on a much newer codebase than SnowLion.

 

[wicknix]

Basilisk apparently is on a much newer codebase than SnowLion.

It is, but it isn't. Don't be fooled by the user agent string as those can be fudged to spoof a browser it isn't. I tried to be realistic with SnowLion's capabilities. They are both based on FF52/55/60/UXP (Pale Moon / Basilisk code), however Basilisk55 has a bunch more new code / back ports added so it will work with more "modern" websites like mastodon and twitch.

Cheers