What if Google kept it's apps and services exclusive like Apple?

[The-Real-Deal82]

Nope you said...







So show me then....... What does usage mean? And how would you measure it? Sales are still sales...in your hand means usage.......



I am sure there are some Android devices that never get to the internet. I am sure they are IOS devices that don't get to the internet too....no matter what the price difference is.....

You obviously missed my earlier post discussing mobile internet traffic which is what this line of discussion is related to. Usage, Internet and mobile services usage. I wasn't referring to just turning a phone on because that has little relevance to this discussion. We are debating whether or not Google could make apps like gmail, hangouts, chrome, maps exclusive. The millions of users who buy the lowest end android phones and use them without connecting to the Internet may be be adding to the marketshare, but if they are not contributing to the usage of mobile services, I don't see how that ties in here?

 

[jamezr]

You obviously missed my earlier post discussing mobile internet traffic which is what this line of discussion is related to. Usage, Internet and mobile services usage. I wasn't referring to just turning a phone on because that has little relevance to this discussion. We are debating whether or not Google could make apps like gmail, hangouts, chrome, maps exclusive. The millions of users who buy the lowest end android phones and use them without connecting to the Internet may be be adding to the marketshare, but if they are not contributing to the usage of mobile services, I don't see how that ties in here?

Where did you come up with that number? How do you know?
Are there IOS devices that do not connect to the internet? Do you have usage breakdowns on all these services by OS platform? Do you have stats to show what IOS usage of these services are?
If Google did only allow Android devices to use their services...it would be a mistake. Why narrow your audience? Why not make great services available to everyone? Apple does this with iTunes. Some of their iTunes customers are Windows users. Making iTunes for Windows helps Apple. Making Google services available to everyone helps Google.
Sorry if i missed your point at first. But I think i got it now.....

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

What if Google kept it's apps and services exclusive like Apple?

I am sure there are some Android devices that never get to the internet. I am sure there are IOS devices that don't get to the internet too....no matter what the price difference is.....

Would you honestly expect it to be a similar number though? More iPhones are sold on contract than off so it's a reasonable assumption to suggest they are used as smartphones rather than as dumb devices. The cost also comes into play because it's a lot of money to pay for a phone not to use it on the Internet. If you compare that to how many Android devices at the lower end that are bought by the older generations and used as dumb devices on pay as you go tariffs and I would be willing to bet the figure is much higher. I know a few people in my family alone in that very position. It is not definitive proof in this instance but my earlier post discusses the relevant stats concerning Internet traffic in any case.

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Where did you come up with that number? How do you know?
Are there IOS devices that do not connect to the internet? Do you have usage breakdowns on all these services by OS platform? Do you have stats to show what IOS usage of these services are?

Ok the 10 Android devices that were sold previously that were not considered flagship phones... Come on now let's not get silly over proving how many Android devices at the lower end that sell, we know full well it has a significant marketshare in itself. If you want stats for the rest, use a 'Google' search as that is not my point to back up.

All we know is both Apple and Android have around 44% of the overall global mobile internet traffic. I don't think that figure is anything to be sniffed at. It doesn't take a genius to work out that if Apple shares such a stat, it means only a third of Android devices sold are regular users of the Internet when compared to marketshare . Would you not agree?

 

[jamezr]

Would you honestly expect it to be a similar number though? More iPhones are sold on contract than off so it's a reasonable assumption to suggest they are used as smartphones rather than as dumb devices. The cost also comes into play because it's a lot of money to pay for a phone not to use it on the Internet. If you compare that to how many Android devices at the lower end that are bought by the older generations and used as dumb devices on pay as you go tariffs and I would be willing to bet the figure is much higher. I know a few people in my family alone in that very position. It is not definitive proof in this instance but my earlier post discusses the relevant stats concerning Internet traffic in any case.

I see your point....but it takes some big leaps to get there.
My mother is 76.......i bought her an IP5..nice for her. Easy to use.....she loves it. She never will connect to the internet with that phone. I have niece that is learning disabled.......her parents bought her an iPad mini....they load software and games that are targeted to her disability. She will never connect to the internet with it.....in fact wifi is disabled on that ipad.
So should i make the same assumptions you have?

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

What if Google kept it's apps and services exclusive like Apple?

I see your point....but it takes some big leaps to get there.

My mother is 76.......i bought her an IP5..nice for her. Easy to use.....she loves it. She never will connect to the internet with that phone. I have niece that is learning disabled.......her parents bought her an iPad mini....they load software and games that are targeted to her disability. She will never connect to the internet with it.....in fact wifi is disabled on that ipad.

So should i make the same assumptions you have?

So why is it then that Android has 3 times as much marketshare as iOS devices but accounts for the same percentage of global mobile internet traffic? I think my assumption carries a little more weight when compared to this rather significant statistic.

Of course there will be iOS users too who use their devices as dumb phones but is it not glaringly obvious it is significantly more predominant within the wider Android outreach when faced with that stat?

 

[jamezr]

So why is it then that Android has 3 times as much marketshare as iOS devices but accounts for the same percentage of global mobile internet traffic? I think my assumption carries a little more weight when compared to this rather significant statistic.

Of course there will be iOS users too who use their devices as dumb phones but is it not glaringly obvious it is significantly more predominant within the wider Android outreach when faced with that stat?

You bring up some good points. I am not sure why IOS users use the internet more. I know I use both my iPad and Android phone for internet use. At home it is just my MBP or iMac.
Here is the latest data i could find on it. Looks like for whatever reason Android is closing the gap.....

http://androidspin.com/2014/07/01/android-overtake-ios-global-web-traffic-figures/

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

You bring up some good points. I am not sure why IOS users use the internet more. I know I use both my iPad and Android phone for internet use. At home it is just my MBP or iMac.
Here is the latest data i could find on it. Looks like for whatever reason Android is closing the gap.....

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http://androidspin.com/2014/07/01/android-overtake-ios-global-web-traffic-figures/

Back in August Android was 0.5% ahead of iOS so if that is a recent graph it may be that the recently released iPhone 6 and 6Plus has bumped the percentage in Apples favour? Regardless though I think it is pretty equal which is why my original point about Google dumping iOS would be a mistake. They both need each other for the service to work at this moment in time.

 

[jamezr]

Back in August Android was 0.5% ahead of iOS so if that is a recent graph it may be that the recently released iPhone 6 and 6Plus has bumped the percentage in Apples favour? Regardless though I think it is pretty equal which is why my original point about Google dumping iOS would be a mistake. They both need each other for the service to work at this moment in time.

I think it would be a mistake as well. But we don't know of the percentage of both platforms that are internet connected are using Google apps. The data just shows web traffic unless i missed something.
I think you are right...there might be a spike for IOS when all the new IP6 users are added to the mix....

 

[I7guy]

Back in August Android was 0.5% ahead of iOS so if that is a recent graph it may be that the recently released iPhone 6 and 6Plus has bumped the percentage in Apples favour? Regardless though I think it is pretty equal which is why my original point about Google dumping iOS would be a mistake. They both need each other for the service to work at this moment in time.

My only that, as some one claimed iphone serves 15% of the worlds wealthiest. Don't you want clients with money using your services. Maybe not, I don't know.

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

What if Google kept it's apps and services exclusive like Apple?

I think it would be a mistake as well. But we don't know of the percentage of both platforms that are internet connected are using Google apps. The data just shows web traffic unless i missed something.

I think you are right...there might be a spike for IOS when all the new IP6 users are added to the mix....

Indeed we don't know how many Google users are within those stats, I think we just assume because of how dominant Googles services are.

It's nice to have a discussion/debate on here with all parties remaining civil and respectful, cheers

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My only that, as some one claimed iphone serves 15% of the worlds wealthiest. Don't you want clients with money using your services. Maybe not, I don't know.

I don't know how true that is because I'm certainly not wealthy and neither are the vast majority of my friends or colleagues with iPhones. I see your point though if that statement were to be taken literally

 

[jamezr]

Indeed we don't know how many Google users are within those stats, I think we just assume because of how dominant Googles services are.

It's nice to have a discussion/debate on here with all parties remaining civil and respectful, cheers

I was thinking the same thing! Have great day......

 

[TacticalDesire]

Part of why I use google is because I can use their services on damn near anything.

 

[pdqgp]

I know Google is more of an information, ad revenue, and internet based company. But just for kicks, what if Google kept it's apps and services exclusive like Apple does?

What if Google said "Make some of your apps and services cross platform, or we'll make ours exclusive." You think Apple would cave in to such a demand?

I don't think it would makes sense or be a good move. It certainly wouldn't be doing them any favors. Information is power and that's what Google is about is gathering information. Apple iOS users are using their stuff. It's not hurting them in any way, thus who cares. In fact it is in their favor to gather usage and information from all users.

Apple wouldn't cave. They aren't dumb, they lead the way of their stuff based on their road map not that of others. That's playing to win. Weaker companies play off what the competition does. Neither Google or Apple is weak.

 

[bkar89]

Don't really think I'll miss them. they're needed on Androind phones, as they are a lot better than most default apps form companies like Samsung and HTC (only Android phone makers i have experience with) And they are classified as bloatware in my book.

I could really rock a clean Nexus product if i weren't so heavily invested in the Apple eco system.

But on my iPhone I don't really use any google services except YouTube every now and then. God, the ads... So many ads!

The few times I find a need for a Map, Apple Maps really isn't that bad. Fills my needs, never done me wrong.

 

[I7guy]

Can you back that up with anything other than your opinion?
just thinking it doesn't make it so......
The numbers will change when all the recent iphone sales numbers are included. But not by that much....

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I think you are missing the point. There is only one IOS phone sold. That is the iPhone. What other phone would you compare to Android phones? This discussion was about IOS and Android.

The correct way to say this is Apple is the top smartphone oem, while android is the top smartphone platform. Two categories, two metrics. Not one metric and category.

 

[jamezr]

The correct way to say this is Apple is the top smartphone oem, while android is the top smartphone platform. Two categories, two metrics. Not one metric and category.

Really...just really? Are you ever objective? Sure lets change everything just for your narrow POV.
You should take these off when you go to post.....people would take you more seriously.....

 

[LIVEFRMNYC]

The correct way to say this is Apple is the top smartphone oem, while android is the top smartphone platform. Two categories, two metrics. Not one metric and category.

What does that even mean?

Hasn't it already been explained to you that due to the exclusivity of each other, iOS and the iPhone can't be compared as separate entities?

 

[weespeed]

Too late for Google to do anything that will affect Apple now.

If they did it in the beginning, Apple may or may not have the same success. People need to remember that when the iPhone came out it was pretty gimped compared to the WinMo phones of the time.
What they did have was a browser that looked like what you would see on a desktop browser when on the internet. That was to me the most revolutionary thing they did.
Then Apps and a lot of services that were available for the iPhone made it more interesting.

If Google pulled the plug now, Apple has so much money, they would start or buy competting services. It'll be a painful 2-3 years but in the end they would be fine.

But to get an idea of what could have happened just look at the Google and Windows phone situation. Not having many of Google services hurts the Windows platform. Not just in user experience, but also in mind share. The media slams Windows ecosystem and also slams them for not having natuve youtube app, etc.

 

[LIVEFRMNYC]

If Google pulled the plug now, Apple has so much money, they would start or buy competting services. It'll be a painful 2-3 years but in the end they would be fine.

But to get an idea of what could have happened just look at the Google and Windows phone situation. Not having many of Google services hurts the Windows platform. Not just in user experience, but also in mind share. The media slams Windows ecosystem and also slams them for not having natuve youtube app, etc.

So true and well said.

You just gave me a differ perspective. If all Android phones were Vanilla, then it would actually be in Google's benefit to do so. It will give Android users an incentive of exclusive apps and services. But the smartphone manufacturers actually add the incentives and exclusivity. iOS and Windows Phone is basically Vanilla, and show a huge contrast when comparing their success, for obvious reasons that you mentioned.

 

[I7guy]

What does that even mean?

Hasn't it already been explained to you that due to the exclusivity of each other, iOS and the iPhone can't be compared as separate entities?

Your grouping makes no sense. You have to compare manufacturer to manufacturer, platform to platform.

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Really...just really? Are you ever objective? Sure lets change everything just for your narrow POV.
You should take these off when you go to post.....people would take you more seriously.....

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Based on what I've read I am as about objective as anybody else in this forum.

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Too late for Google to do anything that will affect Apple now.

If they did it in the beginning, Apple may or may not have the same success. People need to remember that when the iPhone came out it was pretty gimped compared to the WinMo phones of the time.
What they did have was a browser that looked like what you would see on a desktop browser when on the internet. That was to me the most revolutionary thing they did.
Then Apps and a lot of services that were available for the iPhone made it more interesting.

If Google pulled the plug now, Apple has so much money, they would start or buy competting services. It'll be a painful 2-3 years but in the end they would be fine.

But to get an idea of what could have happened just look at the Google and Windows phone situation. Not having many of Google services hurts the Windows platform. Not just in user experience, but also in mind share. The media slams Windows ecosystem and also slams them for not having natuve youtube app, etc.

IMO a native youtube app was not the reason I didn't get a windows phone. IOS requires apps to do what it's browser can't. As long as the browser on windows does everything I need it's less of an issue when there is no native app.

 

[jamezr]

Your grouping makes no sense. You have to compare manufacturer to manufacturer, platform to platform.

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Based on what I've read I am as about objective as anybody else in this forum.

Sure buddy...... Data Analytics is a billion dollar market. But of course you know better than all of them........
They should change the way they collect data and present it just for you......because it would fit your narrow POV that way......

 

[I7guy]

Sure buddy...... Data Analytics is a billion dollar market. But of course you know better than all of them........
They should change the way they collect data and present it just for you......because it would fit your narrow POV that way......

All right "pal"(no offense) this is bupkis stuff, everybody is out to show they are correct. You can present a fact and still miss the big picture.

If you feel this makes sense to you and you really want to believe in these numbers, go for it. Makes no sense, unless the other side is looked at.

 

[LIVEFRMNYC]

Your grouping makes no sense. You have to compare manufacturer to manufacturer, platform to platform..

Smartphones:

Apple >>>> iOS >>>> iPhone
Source: http://www.apple.com/iphone/

599 manufacturers >>>>>> Android >>>>>> 3,997 smartphone models
Source: http://dottech.org/74341/there-are-3997-unique-android-in-existence-599-manufacturers/ (Exact numbers are outdated, but you get the point)




Now what is it you can't seem to understand?

 

[F123D]

Man.. I didn't realize how many of Google services I actually used. Almost 90% of the ones listed..

 

[I7guy]

Smartphones:

Apple >>>> iOS >>>> iPhone
Source: http://www.apple.com/iphone/

599 manufacturers >>>>>> Android >>>>>> 3,997 smartphone models
Source: http://dottech.org/74341/there-are-3997-unique-android-in-existence-599-manufacturers/ (Exact numbers are outdated, but you get the point)




Now what is it you can't seem to understand?

I understand perfectly; Apple is the number one smartphone maker in the world. IOS is the number 2 mobile operating system in the world. Understand