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I don't get it. Why is the 2013 Mac Pro not a viable option to buy right now? Is it like slow or something?

Or are you ppl, kinda like those guys who want the fastest and newest? And it doesn't really matter if the 2013 Mac Pro is still viable today. And the new MBP with Thunderbolt 3 also another option? Even though its not a desktop?

I don't think there will be heat issues. These new GPU's are more power efficient and thermally perfect for mobile solutions (its where the industry was heading to anyway). And the cooling of the new MBP starting with whenever they put those air vents on the bottom side are very efficient at cooling.

I don't get it. I would love to be able to afford a 2013 Mac Pro. And, even though there is no new Mac Pro announced, you know, Apple will update the Mac Pro. It's just a matter of time. Which Apple needs to make sure that when they do update the Mac Pro that the manufacturing logistical questions are addressed, such as availability, etc...

Seriously, hearing all these ppl whine about moving to HP makes it seem like the 2013 Mac Pro is an obsolete machine for their work. What kind of work do you guys do anyway that you're like itching for the newest chip that intel has, which if you follow intel has only managed to create 10% improvements on their cpu's each year since the first core series back in 2009 or whathaveyou.

2013 Mac Pro was already outdated when it came out. Many pros need more than one processor. Many pros want a lot more internal storage than the nMP has or need more RAM. Many Pros need better GPUs, especially ones that they can upgrade themselves, or need CUDA which the nMP can't do at all. Pros also want a clear roadmap so they can run a business without a lot of guesswork and prayer.
 
Sooo... no new MacPro today, only MacBook with last year's Skylake CPU... in that case maybe it is time to simplify life and get a "Surface Studio"

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2013 Mac Pro was already outdated when it came out. Many pros need more than one processor. Many pros want a lot more internal storage than the nMP has or need more RAM. Many Pros need better GPUs, especially ones that they can upgrade themselves, or need CUDA which the nMP can't do at all. Pros also want a clear roadmap so they can run a business without a lot of guesswork and prayer.

I just googled!

E5-1620v2 is the cpu on the 2013 Mac Pro. On intel's page it says it was launched in Q3 of 2013. How is a chip launched in the third quarter of 2013 "outdated" released for the new Mac Pro in 2013?

Max ram for 2013 Mac Pro is 128 GB!!!

128GB!!!

128GB!!!

12-cores is available for the 2013 Mac Pro. Twelve!!!!! That's 24 Threads!!!!

24!!!!

Storage for nMP with Thunderbolt is infinity. or close to it. Daisy chain it via TB!

The nMP also has 2 GPU's! Very good GPU's for crunching Open CL operations.

And CUDA can be installed via eGPU solutions with Nvidia GPU's in thunderbolt enclosures...

Unless you're making Avatar 2 to render those CG scenes, I don't know what else where so many GPU's, CPU's, RAM, HDD are needed. Or, scientific calculations, curing cancer, deep blue learning, etc...
 
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The 2013 nMP can handle such a huge percentage of use cases that Apple has not chosen to worry about the niche market that actually needs more grunt. That's a reasonable business decision. Like some others who frequent this forum, I work with high resolution motion imagery in multiple formats/file types so the 2013 nMP is weak sauce for my particular needs.

I'm a 30 year Mac guy with plenty of clients asking for ProRes files, so a proper Apple workstation would be most welcome in my world. In the segment of the industry I work in, a rack mountable box with nVidia GPU support and plenty of PCIe slots would sell well - even at >$10K if the performance was there.

The tube concept with lower energy consumption and a larger/slower fan does serve one segment of the market quite well, but some of us do have legitimate needs beyond it's capabilities - not just ego/dick measurement.
 
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I don't get it.
Nope, guess you don't
Is it like slow or something?
Yes, but thats not its main problem
I don't get it... ...makes it seem like the 2013 Mac Pro is an obsolete machine for their work.
It was nearly obsolete on launch. But the main problem is that it had nothing that differentiated it from an iMac aside from non-mobile parts and more ports. Worse even, since the iMac is laughably and arguably more upgradable and customizable than the nMP. That is (was) the main distinguishing feature of the Mac Pro line, and is why people still stick with their pre-2013 Pros over the nMP, even though they have slower hardware.

You're not dropping that amount of money on a machine that you are required to completely replace every 6-12 months due to changing hardware standards. That also means likely changing every peripheral that you bought for it. It is a very poor investment for the majority of professionals who would have a long-term use for hardware like a Mac Pro.
 
In response to this news I just ordered a Radeon 7970 for my 2009 cMP... and earlier this week I installed a CalDigit USB 3.1 PCIE card. I'm gonna keep the old beast running awhile longer...
 
Nope, guess you don't

Yes, but that's not its main problem

It was nearly obsolete on launch. But the main problem is that it had nothing that differentiated it from an iMac aside from non-mobile parts and more ports. Worse even, since the iMac is laughably and arguably more upgradable and customizable than the nMP. That is (was) the main distinguishing feature of the Mac Pro line, and is why people still stick with their pre-2013 Pros over the nMP, even though they have slower hardware.

You're not dropping that amount of money on a machine that you are required to completely replace every 6-12 months due to changing hardware standards. That also means likely changing every peripheral that you bought for it. It is a very poor investment for the majority of professionals who would have a use for hardware like a Mac Pro.

Thunderbolt is here to stay. It's even getting faster with Thunderbolt 3.

the 2013 Mac Pro is not upgradeable like the old Mac tower (which I bought used this year to upgrade from a mid-2010 15" MBP for video editing. Can't afford used 2013 MP or thunderbolt devices). But, the GPU's in the nMP is still viable today, I think. There's also two of them. And, with Thunderbolt 2, I think ppl can add Nvidia GPU's in Thunderbolt enclosures for CUDA operations.

Why would you replace your 2013 MP, say, a year from now if you bought it this year when it doesn't slow down because a new GPU is released or a new CPU is released?

Are you like one of those guys who measure stuff congruent to the specs of their computers?

Although, I do agree that if you bought say, a 2013 MP today and then Apple releases a new Mac Pro early next year with faster CPU, GPU and Thunderbolt 3 that you'd be like, I want to get that. But, if you can afford a 2013 MP, you can probably afford a new Mac Pro when it comes out next year, let's say. Or, you can sell your nMP to get the newer one. Let's just say....
 
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In the segment of the industry I work in, a rack mountable box with nVidia GPU support and plenty of PCIe slots would sell well - even at >$10K if the performance was there.

As far as rack mounted workstations I was looking into a Cubix (or similar) set-up with multiple GTX1080 GPUs connected to 2012 MP.
 
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I just googled!

E5-1620v2 is the cpu on the 2013 Mac Pro. On intel's page it says it was launched in Q3 of 2013. How is a chip launched in the third quarter of 2013 "outdated" released for the new Mac Pro in 2013?

Max ram for 2013 Mac Pro is 128 GB!!!

128GB!!!

128GB!!!

12-cores is available for the 2013 Mac Pro. Twelve!!!!! That's 24 Threads!!!!

24!!!!

Storage for nMP with Thunderbolt is infinity. or close to it. Daisy chain it via TB!

The nMP also has 2 GPU's! Very good GPU's for crunching Open CL operations.

And CUDA can be installed via eGPU solutions with Nvidia GPU's in thunderbolt enclosures...

Unless you're making Avatar 2 to render those CG scenes, I don't know what else where so many GPU's, CPU's, RAM, HDD are needed. Or, scientific calculations.

And yet, many pros want more, or in some cases simply different, with the flexibility that comes from using standard PCI slots with the option of two CPUs, like the cMPs had.

There are workstations for sale by other companies with up to a TB of RAM. 128 is nice, more than I personally need, but there are pros who need more and Apple won't make that available. It's also DDR3, when DDR4 has been out for quite a while.

12 cores is actually kind of pathetic these days. HP makes a very popular workstation now with up to 44 cores. No amount of exclamation marks after the number twelve will make up for that huge gap in performance.

Thunderbolt adds significant additional cost compared to internal storage. Those chassis are not cheap, and lead to a rats nest of cables in what was once contained in a neat box for no extra cost.

The two GPUs were a year old when Apple decided to relabel them and pass them off as fancy and new. Also, they're underclocked. Why? Because Apple made a computer designed for form instead of function. They are certainly nothing to brag about four years later, and as I said, a 2010-2012 Mac Pro can run circles around them in terms of GPU compute.

eGPU? Don't make me laugh. Even if TB had the bandwidth PCI does, it still requires very expensive additional hardware, just to provide functionality that was included in the box in the previous Mac Pro.
 
I don't get it. Why is the 2013 Mac Pro not a viable option to buy right now? Is it like slow or something?

Or are you ppl, kinda like those guys who want the fastest and newest? And it doesn't really matter if the 2013 Mac Pro is still viable today. And the new MBP with Thunderbolt 3 also another option? Even though its not a desktop?

I don't think there will be heat issues. These new GPU's are more power efficient and thermally perfect for mobile solutions (its where the industry was heading to anyway). And the cooling of the new MBP starting with whenever they put those air vents on the bottom side are very efficient at cooling.

I don't get it. I would love to be able to afford a 2013 Mac Pro. And, even though there is no new Mac Pro announced, you know, Apple will update the Mac Pro. It's just a matter of time. Which Apple needs to make sure that when they do update the Mac Pro that the manufacturing logistical questions are addressed, such as availability, etc...

Seriously, hearing all these ppl whine about moving to HP makes it seem like the 2013 Mac Pro is an obsolete machine for their work. What kind of work do you guys do anyway that you're like itching for the newest chip that intel has, which if you follow intel has only managed to create 10% improvements on their cpu's each year since the first core series back in 2009 or whathaveyou.
10% annual increases over a year add up to 77% overall increase. Sounds like a worthwhile upgrade to me.
 
And yet, many pros want more, or in some cases simply different, with the flexibility that comes from using standard PCI slots with the option of two CPUs, like the cMPs had.

There are workstations for sale by other companies with up to a TB of RAM. 128 is nice, more than I personally need, but there are pros who need more and Apple won't make that available. It's also DDR3, when DDR4 has been out for quite a while.

12 cores is actually kind of pathetic these days. HP makes a very popular workstation now with up to 44 cores. No amount of exclamation marks after the number twelve will make up for that huge gap in performance.

Thunderbolt adds significant additional cost compared to internal storage. Those chassis are not cheap, and lead to a rats nest of cables in what was once contained in a neat box for no extra cost.

The two GPUs were a year old when Apple decided to relabel them and pass them off as fancy and new. Also, they're underclocked. Why? Because Apple made a computer designed for form instead of function. They are certainly nothing to brag about four years later, and as I said, a 2010-2012 Mac Pro can run circles around them in terms of GPU compute.

eGPU? Don't make me laugh. Even if TB had the bandwidth PCI does, it still requires very expensive additional hardware, just to provide functionality that was included in the box in the previous Mac Pro.

Well, I agree that thunderbolt devices are cost prohibitive. But, that's only really where I agree with you. 44 cores? I'm an aspiring video editor, and 44 cores (88 threads) sounds like I would be able to edit anything I want at super fast speeds. But, it won't make me more efficient or better or make me more money. I don't think content creation in this level is in that micro level in terms of money, time and CPU core counts.

I like the form of the new Mac Pro. And doesn't it function what it is intended to do?

I mean, if you're buying a workstation level PC, you're not looking at cost of PCI devices vs. Thunderbolt devices. Are you?
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10% annual increases over a year add up to 77% overall increase. Sounds like a worthwhile upgrade to me.

Well, Apple is probably releasing a new Mac Pro next year. They need time to be able to deliver them to their consumers, which is why Apple does not follow the time frame that PC's have when x99 products are released. I think they follow the Xeon time frame.... So, whenever that is. Probably next year.

Like I said, they can't just release new Mac Pro's with new Xeons like HP has because Apple makes more Mac Pro's I think and needs more of them than HP does. I'm guessing.

The availability is not there!

But, Apple will release a new Mac Pro. I think the hold up this time was not Xeons from Intel. But, probably viable GPU's from AMD. Polaris GPU's only became readily available this summer. And, the gpu's needed for a workstation like a Mac Pro is probably the Vega one which AMD is not releasing until next year.

I think people would be disappointed if Apple released a new Mac Pro this fall with like two RX 480 equivalent GPU's, which is the fastest GPU appropriate for Mac Pro enclosure available today. I think the Fury line, even though it's a generation old and will be fast in Open CL operations runs power hungry and hot!
 
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Thunderbolt is here to stay. It's even getting faster with Thunderbolt 3.

the 2013 Mac Pro is not upgradeable like the old Mac tower (which I bought used this year to upgrade from a mid-2010 15" MBP for video editing. Can't afford used 2013 MP or thunderbolt devices). But, the GPU's in the nMP is still viable today, I think. There's also two of them. And, with Thunderbolt 2, I think ppl can add Nvidia GPU's in Thunderbolt enclosures for CUDA operations.

Why would you replace your 2013 MP, say, a year from now if you bought it this year when it doesn't slow down because a new GPU is released or a new CPU is release?

Are you like one of those guys who measure stuff incongruent to the specs of their computers?

The GPU I bought over a year ago for $150 is already more powerful than both of the nMP GPUs combined.

The problem is, its not for most people it was 'designed' for. It is a different class of computer than the old Mac Pro and is essentially a slightly more powerful iMac without a built in screen.

Thunderbolt frankly sucks as an option for most people. Thunderbolt hardware is EXTREMELY limited and overpriced compared to PCIe and SATA alternatives. Thunderbolt GPUs are plagued with problems and have been for a long time. They've been trying to get the external GPU stuff working for years now with very little luck. "Viable" is great when you're talking theoretically, but when it only works well in one case out of ten... that is 'measurably congruent.' You don't want your computer booting up with video to be a game of chance.

Changes in hardware come with more than simple speed changes. GPU chipsets contain different features. CPUs have different architectures. If you don't know about them I suggest you do some reading up. I can keep going? Or are you like one of those guys that is going to keep being willfully ignorant and insulting? I'm not interested in "convincing" you if you're just here to argue. Its great that the nMP is a machine that works for you. You keep up the good work of buying whatever machine has more cores. Those are always better. (sarcasm, obv.)
 
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Well, Apple is probably releasing a new Mac Pro next year. They need time to be able to deliver them to their consumers, which is why Apple does not follow the time frame that PC's have when x99 products are released. I think they follow the Xeon time frame.... So, whenever that is. Probably next year.

Like I said, they can't just release new Mac Pro's with new Xeons like HP has because Apple makes more Mac Pro's I think and needs more of them than HP does. I'm guessing.
Yes, you're guessing. Given the versatility of HP's Z-series (you think an unsupported 128GB of RAM is impressive? The Z840 can officially support 2TB of RAM) I'd be surprised if the nMP outsold the Z-series line (there are several models to fit everyone's needs).
 
The problem is, its not for most people it was 'designed' for. It is a different class of computer than the old Mac Pro and is essentially a slightly more powerful iMac without a built in screen.

Thunderbolt frankly sucks as an option for most people. Thunderbolt hardware is EXTREMELY limited and overpriced compared to PCIe and SATA alternatives. Thunderbolt GPUs are plagued with problemss and have been for a long time. They've been trying to get the external GPU stuff working for years now with very little luck. "Viable" is great when you're talking theoretically, but when it only works well in one case out of ten... that is 'measurably congruent.' You don't want your computer booting up with video to be a game of chance.

Changes in hardware come with more than simple speed changes. GPU chipsets contain different features. CPUs have different architectures. If you don't know about them I suggest you do some reading up. I can keep going? Or are you like one of those guys that is going to keep being willfully ignorant and insulting? I'm not interested in "convincing" you if you're just here to argue. Its great that the nMP is a machine that works for you. You keep up the good work of buying whatever machine has more cores. Those are always better.

Well, I don't think Apple will release a Mac Pro tower. If, they were announcing a new Mac Pro, I would expect it to be the trash can one with new stuff inside.

And, I don't have the nMP. I have the old MP. The tower one.
 
But, Apple will release a new Mac Pro.
It would be nice to get some confirmation on this from Apple. It's just as likely that the Mac Pro will never be updated again since Apple seems to be more interested in cars, watches and tax avoidance strategies these days. Can you really blame anyone for not wanting to sink more money into what could very well be a dead end?
 
the Microsoft Surface Studio makes my 2015 iMac look like a grandma!!! Apple under TC has no mojo!!
Why insult Grandma?

Although TC does look a little like her, come to think of it, but I'm pretty sure she's more tech Savvy.
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Sigh...
Well, I wonder how many people are ditching Apple now...
I'm not, I can still get my work done on oMPS for now, but when these babies die, I'm going to walk all over America planting Apple Trees, if I can find a rustic hat.
 
Why insult Grandma?

Although TC does look a little like her, come to think of it, but I'm pretty sure she's more tech Savvy.
[doublepost=1477611362][/doublepost]I'm not, I can still get my work done on oMPS for now, but when these babies die, I'm going to walk all over America planting Apple Trees, if I can find a rustic hat.
Hardcore user!
 
I'm not, I can still get my work done on oMPS for now, but when these babies die, I'm going to walk all over America planting Apple Trees, if I can find a rustic hat.
There ya go. Since Apple won't produce them, you will just go out a grow them yourself.:)
 
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Both Federighi and Schiller believe the laptop is a form factor that's going to be around for a long time. "As far as our eyes can see, there will still be a place for this basic laptop architecture," Schiller said, pointing out that it's been useful for the past 25 years.

I.E. no Mac Pro updates, only updates for Mac computers that have integrated screens in the short run, and the laptop "architecture" to be supplanted by iPad & iPad Pro models in the long run.
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Thanks for your reply NostromoUK.... would you really do something so drastic...? [in reply to idea of switching to an HP workstation PC] I will wait about 1 more year... making this current computer the longest I have ever had...

Well by this time next year, you should be able to buy a $6-8,000 (or more) iMac Pro with 10 i7 CPU cores.
Al-while the PC world will have 40-50 Xeon CPU core options in workstations w/ CUDA support for thousands less.
 
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IWell by this time next year, you should be able to buy a $6-8,000 (or more) iMac Pro with 10 i7 CPU cores.
Al-while the PC world will have 40-50 Xeon CPU core options in workstations w/ CUDA support for thousands less.
If I were in Tim's shoes, a couple of years ago I would have called a top-level meeting with the agenda "the internet has exploded with complaints that the MP doesn't support Nvidia cards - why?".

...and I would have fired most of the people who bad-mouthed Nvidia

...and assigned as many engineers as possible to make Apple the best CUDA platform around.

Apple has thrown OpenCL under the bus - it's time to go full CUDA.
 
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