Who has or is planning to get an electric car / EV Talk

[44267547]

And……there you have it.

Ford CEO Says Zero Negotiation Pricing Transactions Necessary for EV Business

CEO Jim Farley says the company has to build out its infrastructure to support online, delivered, zero-negotiation sales.

www.roadandtrack.com

Ford is basically following Teslas pathway, and is only allowing 100% EV ordering online, with zero negotiation and direct pricing with their new EV ordering structure.

I’m all for it. No more dealing with shady-uneducated-sales representatives with cheap tactics and the EV vehicles deliver direct to the buyer. This is how it should be from my perspective, given that you can’t find EV’s sitting on lots anyways, so why not migrate to ‘direct ordering’, and the consumer knows exactly what they’re paying upfront and/or what needs to financed ahead of time.

 

[diamond.g]

And……there you have it.

Ford CEO Says Zero Negotiation Pricing Transactions Necessary for EV Business

CEO Jim Farley says the company has to build out its infrastructure to support online, delivered, zero-negotiation sales.

www.roadandtrack.com

Ford is basically following Teslas pathway, and is only allowing 100% EV ordering online, with zero negotiation and direct pricing with their new EV ordering structure.

I’m all for it. No more dealing with shady-uneducated-sales representatives with cheap tactics and the EV vehicles deliver direct to the buyer. This is how it should be from my perspective, given that you can’t find EV’s sitting on lots anyways, so why not migrate to ‘direct ordering’, and the consumer knows exactly what they’re paying upfront and/or what needs to financed ahead of time.

They talk big, but lets see them actually follow through. Since they have existing franchising all those dealership protection laws will be kicking in (unless Ford spins off the electric vehicles into their own brand [a la Volvo/Polestar]).

 

[Apple fanboy]

Here's a picture I took of mine this morning.

 

[Rafterman]

They talk big, but lets see them actually follow through. Since they have existing franchising all those dealership protection laws will be kicking in (unless Ford spins off the electric vehicles into their own brand [a la Volvo/Polestar]).

Updated June 3, 2022, 4:00 p.m. EST: When reached for comment, Said Deep, a spokesperson for Ford, said the quote was taken out of context. The spokesperson claims Farley was referencing a 100 percent digital architecture that could support online transactions, not all transactions taking place online.

 

[960design]

Updated June 3, 2022, 4:00 p.m. EST: When reached for comment, Said Deep, a spokesperson for Ford, said the quote was taken out of context. The spokesperson claims Farley was referencing a 100 percent digital architecture that could support online transactions, not all transactions taking place online.

Strangely, not surprised at all.
Albert Einstein : “Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.”

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

I live in the U.K., we are years from having even a half decent charging infrastructure, plus it can cost a literal fortune to use fast chargers in some places from what I’ve read, councils apparently cashing in, and we severely lack the power station infrastructure for everyone to have electric cars, because we would have endless power cuts too then, due to decades of lack of planning and investment by government.
I do see more and more electric cars on the roads though, hopefully that will help spur things along. For now though for me it’s hybrid or petrol.

A lot of people in the UK are against Hinckley Point and opposed to nuclear energy, but they have no idea how important it is that we get that up and running on deadline. The stark reality is if Hinckley Point wasn’t built, the UK is heading back to the 70’s where blackouts were a weekly occurrence. With the grid stretched even more than ever as more people are buying electric cars and more charge points are installed, it’s fundamental. The longterm plan is for 64 mini nuclear reactors to be installed across the UK, similar in size to those powering our submarines. It’s going to take decades but we need it in this new era of massive electricity demand. We’ve spent 36 years being reliant on France for much of our electricity and need to start supplying ourselves.

 

[Pezimak]

A lot of people in the UK are against Hinckley Point and opposed to nuclear energy, but they have no idea how important it is that we get that up and running on deadline. The stark reality is if Hinckley Point wasn’t built, the UK is heading back to the 70’s where blackouts were a weekly occurrence. With the grid stretched even more than ever as more people are buying electric cars and more charge points are installed, it’s fundamental. The longterm plan is for 64 mini nuclear reactors to be installed across the UK, similar in size to those powering our submarines. It’s going to take decades but we need it in this new era of massive electricity demand. We’ve spent 36 years being reliant on France for much of our electricity and need to start supplying ourselves.

Yeap, we will see how this mini nuclear power station idea goes, but something has to be done. They should have invested far more into renewables too. The correct solution is to have a mix of sources for power, not just one. But at the moment the U.K. hasn’t enough of any source, it’s a complete mess. But if you want everyone to have electric vehicles you need a reliable power supply to go along with it.

 

[Neodym]

Second hand is of course easier to buy a car to own, but with electric vehicles you have to think about the battery life. A motor can be fixed, an engine fixed, you have to replace an entire battery I presume in a car?

EV batteries can be fixed already without the need to completely replace them, though you either have to do it yourself or need to find one of the rare DIY people who offer services of this kind. Problem often is to source the required parts, such as e.g. individual cells. But with more EV‘s coming onto the streets, that probably will get better.

There is lots of knowledge existing beyond official dealerships. For example, for the Renault Twizy there is a community project to replace the (really tiny) manufacturer battery with a higher capacity DIY variant.

And when buying second hand, you can take a look at things like full battery AC (which is still not ubiquitous) and fast-charging (or better lack thereof). Fast-charging does more harm to the battery, even with AC in place.

I therefore intentionally opted for a slow-charger (max. 3.600W, at home even less via standard outlet), because I only drive electric in urban scenarios and can easily recharge over night (usually once a week). My battery health is still around 95% - not bad for a nine year old car ;-) Next project will be solar charging, using photovoltaic excess power generation.

 

[whitby]

I know my next car will be an EV. However as a dedicated BMW driver for many years with the occasional Jag and MB, I have been anxiously awaiting BNW’s efforts. However their current EVs are just plain ugly, something that has put me off all Teslas except the S. I may have to hold my nose and go for the new BMW i4 (that grill ug…). The new Hyundai and Kia efforts look very attractive but when I looked inside them, their interiors are definitely below par. I will definitely upgrade my electricy supply to ensure I get a decent charge rate. But we have to get away from the old ICE, much as I love them and that visceral excitement as we go through the gears. Time moves on and we must move with it.

 

[Apple fanboy]

I know my next car will be an EV. However as a dedicated BMW driver for many years with the occasional Jag and MB, I have been anxiously awaiting BNW’s efforts. However their current EVs are just plain ugly, something that has put me off all Teslas except the S. I may have to hold my nose and go for the new BMW i4 (that grill ug…). The new Hyundai and Kia efforts look very attractive but when I looked inside them, their interiors are definitely below par. I will definitely upgrade my electricy supply to ensure I get a decent charge rate. But we have to get away from the old ICE, much as I love them and that visceral excitement as we go through the gears. Time moves on and we must move with it.

Can’t agree on the BMW having just bought an i3. But agree the rest of the line up for BMW EV’s is a bit blah. Well the i8 is nice but not practical as a daily driver!
Agree the interior of a car is as important if not more so than the outside. After all that’s the bit I see!
But as someone who has always driven Manuel cars, it does take a while getting used to basically one pedal driving. But if you still desire a rush of adrenaline, you’ll find the instant kick of power more than makes up for the loss of engine noise.
On long journey’s you really enjoy the lack of engine noise. Much quieter place to be.

 

[AJK13K]

So much to unpack here.

Blondes? Brunettes? its what makes the world go round and I appreciate your opinion; more brunettes for me.
Blondes are cheap to get, expensive to maintain and a bit 'slow'.

Which of the following made in America cars are you currently recommending: Ford Mustang, Jeep Cherokee, Chevy Corvette or Honda Ridgeline?
#1 and #3 made in America cars are EVs, and you already stated, "hell no" to those.
View attachment 2012463

My made in America car is a BMW X5. and I love it. By the way it is maintained by a mechanic in my local village.

 

[Apple fanboy]

I know my next car will be an EV. However as a dedicated BMW driver for many years with the occasional Jag and MB, I have been anxiously awaiting BNW’s efforts. However their current EVs are just plain ugly, something that has put me off all Teslas except the S. I may have to hold my nose and go for the new BMW i4 (that grill ug…). The new Hyundai and Kia efforts look very attractive but when I looked inside them, their interiors are definitely below par. I will definitely upgrade my electricy supply to ensure I get a decent charge rate. But we have to get away from the old ICE, much as I love them and that visceral excitement as we go through the gears. Time moves on and we must move with it.

Can’t agree on the BMW having just bought an i3. But agree the rest of the line up for BMW EV’s is a bit blah. Well the i8 is nice but not practical as a daily driver!
Agree the interior of a car is as important if not more so than the outside. After all that’s the bit I see!
But as someone who has always driven Manuel cars, it does take a while getting used to basically one pedal driving. But if you still desire a rush of adrenaline, you’ll find the instant kick of power more than makes up for the loss of engine noise.
On long journey’s you really enjoy the lack of engine noise. Much quieter place to be.

 

[diamond.g]

I know my next car will be an EV. However as a dedicated BMW driver for many years with the occasional Jag and MB, I have been anxiously awaiting BNW’s efforts. However their current EVs are just plain ugly, something that has put me off all Teslas except the S. I may have to hold my nose and go for the new BMW i4 (that grill ug…). The new Hyundai and Kia efforts look very attractive but when I looked inside them, their interiors are definitely below par. I will definitely upgrade my electricy supply to ensure I get a decent charge rate. But we have to get away from the old ICE, much as I love them and that visceral excitement as we go through the gears. Time moves on and we must move with it.

Have you checked out the Jag IPace?

 

[Apple fanboy]

Have you checked out the Jag IPace?

They have a beautiful interior. At least my friends does. Cream leather. Not too practical for me, but a very nice place to be.

 

[960design]

My made in America car is a BMW X5. and I love it. By the way it is maintained by a mechanic in my local village.

#78 out of 90... well at least some of it was made in america

Mostly just lego'd together in California. Assembly of individual parts is done around the world:

• Araquari, Brazil
• Shenyang, China
• Chennai, India
• Kaliningrad, Russia
• Jakarta, Indonesia
• Rayong, Thailand

Good on you on purchasing a worldly car. Look at you go!
It is a very nice automobile!

Where Is The BMW X5 Made? (Solved & Explained) - Engine Patrol

Whether you’re seeking out adventure or convenience, the BMW X5 is ready to perform. Available in a wide range of trims and engine choices, the X5 is one of the most recognizable luxury SUVs. If you’re looking to buy one, […]

enginepatrol.com

BMW X5 to be added to the list of models built in China

The BMW X5 will now be added to the list of BMWs built in China, in addition to the models being built in Spartanburg.

www.bmwblog.com

BMW X5 - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Avtotor - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[whitby]

Can’t agree on the BMW having just bought an i3. But agree the rest of the line up for BMW EV’s is a bit blah. Well the i8 is nice but not practical as a daily driver!
Agree the interior of a car is as important if not more so than the outside. After all that’s the bit I see!
But as someone who has always driven Manuel cars, it does take a while getting used to basically one pedal driving. But if you still desire a rush of adrenaline, you’ll find the instant kick of power more than makes up for the loss of engine noise.
On long journey’s you really enjoy the lack of engine noise. Much quieter place to be.

One of my biggest issues with EVs is their weight. They may use lots of tricks to keep it on the road, but physics demands that when you change direction in a heavier vehicle, it will try to keep going in the original direction.

I agree that because of the zero speed torque that an electric motor can provide, the initial rush is quite exciting. However it is not sustainable as the speed increases and that weight again becomes an issue. Overall the handling and overall driver interaction in an EV is not comparable to the better ICE cars. It will get better as battery technology improves but at the moment there is no comparison. If you want a smooth quiet ride and are not bothered about how a car handles, current EVs are reasonable but they have a long way to go before they have the driver involvement that some of the older ICE cars were capable of, but that is a small proportion of the driving population. Unfortunately for me, I am one of them.

 

[Apple fanboy]

One of my biggest issues with EVs is their weight. They may use lots of tricks to keep it on the road, but physics demands that when you change direction in a heavier vehicle, it will try to keep going in the original direction.

I agree that because of the zero speed torque that an electric motor can provide, the initial rush is quite exciting. However it is not sustainable as the speed increases and that weight again becomes an issue. Overall the handling and overall driver interaction in an EV is not comparable to the better ICE cars. It will get better as battery technology improves but at the moment there is no comparison. If you want a smooth quiet ride and are not bothered about how a car handles, current EVs are reasonable but they have a long way to go before they have the driver involvement that some of the older ICE cars were capable of, but that is a small proportion of the driving population. Unfortunately for me, I am one of them.

My BMW i3 is lighter and handles as well as my VW golf did. Lower Center of gravity and the use of carbon fibre and plastics (a lot of which is recycled) rather than traditional steel help a lot there.
But the truth is it’s a daily driver not a track car. Although I think it would be a hoot on a track!

 

[Neodym]

One of my biggest issues with EVs is their weight. They may use lots of tricks to keep it on the road, but physics demands that when you change direction in a heavier vehicle, it will try to keep going in the original direction.

I agree that because of the zero speed torque that an electric motor can provide, the initial rush is quite exciting. However it is not sustainable as the speed increases and that weight again becomes an issue. Overall the handling and overall driver interaction in an EV is not comparable to the better ICE cars. It will get better as battery technology improves but at the moment there is no comparison. If you want a smooth quiet ride and are not bothered about how a car handles, current EVs are reasonable but they have a long way to go before they have the driver involvement that some of the older ICE cars were capable of, but that is a small proportion of the driving population. Unfortunately for me, I am one of them.

I’m pretty sure that combustion engines stay available for many years to come, so you can satisfy your driver involvement needs, until you eventually settle down a bit and can enjoy the advantages of EV’s.

Besides, I think you exaggerate the differences. If you are really concerned about weight in a car, you would probably go to especially lightweight designed cars like the old Lotus cars. Something roughly comparable also exists in the EV world - think of e.g. the Tesla Roadster.

 

[Motionblurrr]

I know my next car will be an EV. However as a dedicated BMW driver for many years with the occasional Jag and MB, I have been anxiously awaiting BNW’s efforts. However their current EVs are just plain ugly, something that has put me off all Teslas except the S. I may have to hold my nose and go for the new BMW i4 (that grill ug…). The new Hyundai and Kia efforts look very attractive but when I looked inside them, their interiors are definitely below par. I will definitely upgrade my electricy supply to ensure I get a decent charge rate. But we have to get away from the old ICE, much as I love them and that visceral excitement as we go through the gears. Time moves on and we must move with it.

Believe it or not BMWs new EVs (i4) are deemed quite fantastic. Especially in terms of an EV having a bit of 'soul'. And BMW did what consumers wanted: make an EV car but don't make it FuTuRiStIc looking like Tesla, MB's awful looking EV, Mustang EV, etc. It's basically a 4 series but EV version. Brilliant!

In person, that front grille is actually pretty good looking--in photos it's terrible most of the time. In the flesh it is quite aggressive and expensive looking. Disliking it has been a bit of a bandwagon internet thing because most offline people think it looks cool when they see one.

 

[AlaskaMoose]

I’m pretty sure that combustion engines stay available for many years to come, so you can satisfy your driver involvement needs, until you eventually settle down a bit and can enjoy the advantages of EV’s.

Besides, I think you exaggerate the differences. If you are really concerned about weight in a car, you would probably go to especially lightweight designed cars like the old Lotus cars. Something roughly comparable also exists in the EV world - think of e.g. the Tesla Roadster.

The battery is the heaviest component of an EV. Tesla batteries weight from 1,200 to perhaps 1,600 lbs. The chassis, body, brakes/wheels, and other components can be made lighter, but the car will cost a lot more. The same can be done with ICE automobiles. Just look at the 798 kgs (1,759-lbs) F1 automobiles.

 

[Apple fanboy]

The battery is the heaviest component of an EV. Tesla batteries weight from 1,200 to perhaps 1,600 lbs. The chassis, body, brakes/wheels, and other components can be made lighter, but the car will cost a lot more. The same can be done with ICE automobiles. Just look at the 798 kgs (1,759-lbs) F1 automobiles.

Although to be fair they have an ICE and battery!

 

[nrvna76]

Believe it or not BMWs new EVs (i4) are deemed quite fantastic. Especially in terms of an EV having a bit of 'soul'. And BMW did what consumers wanted: make an EV car but don't make it FuTuRiStIc looking like Tesla, MB's awful looking EV, Mustang EV, etc. It's basically a 4 series but EV version. Brilliant!

In person, that front grille is actually pretty good looking--in photos it's terrible most of the time. In the flesh it is quite aggressive and expensive looking. Disliking it has been a bit of a bandwagon internet thing because most offline people think it looks cool when they see one.

The BMW’s looks great! I hope t they come up with a slightly lower tier option in the future as they are both pricey.

 

[whitby]

Believe it or not BMWs new EVs (i4) are deemed quite fantastic. Especially in terms of an EV having a bit of 'soul'. And BMW did what consumers wanted: make an EV car but don't make it FuTuRiStIc looking like Tesla, MB's awful looking EV, Mustang EV, etc. It's basically a 4 series but EV version. Brilliant!

In person, that front grille is actually pretty good looking--in photos it's terrible most of the time. In the flesh it is quite aggressive and expensive looking. Disliking it has been a bit of a bandwagon internet thing because most offline people think it looks cool when they see one.

I have driven both the i4 and the iX (I have decent connections in the industry) for a couple of days each and I am sorry but that grill does not improve with viewing them in real life (especially on the iX), not to me and I know it is intensely personal. I looked at an M3 and M4, and although they drove extraordinarily well, they are really ugly cars and that, along with the feeling I needed to look at something more eco friendly, stopped me buying one (I am a BMW nut having owned 23 of them).

I tend to err along Harry Metcalfe of Harry's Garage view of electric cars and I love his review of the i4M50, which says it all for me, although he does not have the distaste for the appearance that I do.

With regard to the driving experience, electric cars are very different to their ICE equivalents and they do not provide the visceral involvement that the lighter ICE cars do. Maybe once the battery technology gets more efficient, we may be able to enjoy that zero speed torque. But by then we will probably have autonomous vehicles and driving will be for the dinosaurs. BMW are doing a better job than most and I don't belittle their efforts but electric cars are different and I am not sure where they are going as autonomous vehicles and electric vehicle converge, but I suspect the day of the 'drivers' car is numbered and we had better live with that fact.

 

[AlaskaMoose]

Although to be fair they have an ICE and battery!

True. I was referring to how lightweight F1 automobiles are.

 

[Tagbert]

The battery is the heaviest component of an EV. Tesla batteries weight from 1,200 to perhaps 1,600 lbs. The chassis, body, brakes/wheels, and other components can be made lighter, but the car will cost a lot more. The same can be done with ICE automobiles. Just look at the 798 kgs (1,759-lbs) F1 automobiles.

Are we supposed to be comparing our EVs to F1 automobiles, now?

I used to have a ‘75 Scirocco that was almost exactly that weight but that was a very different time. Not ready to go back to that.