Other Who really gives a damn about the camera? - give us something else new please Apple!

[DevinNj]

Per your title OP-
"Who really gives a damn about the camera?"
This is a very subjective opinion, the camera on the Pro version is the reason I buy it. The telephoto lens is big for me, I've taken some very nice pics with it. Maybe it's not a selling point for you, but Apple sells millions of them yearly, so...

 

[mdkdue]

Well, on the plus side, if you don't care about having the better camera, the cheaper 12 is a fantastic deal as it improves even over the 11 Pro in a lot of areas. Better chip, better water resistance, MagSafe accessories, bigger screen, lighter, £250 cheaper at the 64GB tier...

Still nothing particularly exciting though is it...any of that really worth laying out £800 for when I have an XS?

 

[mdkdue]

I do. Because I have a family with kids and don’t want to lug around my Nikon D90 dSLR but also want to be able to capture great videos and pictures. I don’t think my use case is all that unique either.

Everyone is just missing the point, you talk like an XS has a garbage camera and is massively inferior, which is simply not the case, at all!

 

[Steve121178]

Still nothing particularly exciting though is it...any of that really worth laying out £800 for when I have an XS?

The Xs is adequate but the 11 Pro mauls it in low light performance especially. Imagine what the 12 Pro can do in comparison.

 

[1rottenapple]

Fully prepared for the flaming as I know how these forums in particular are ,but I feel this needs to be said as it infuriates me every bloody year.

Seriously, who really cares about the Pro cameras? I mean really? How good does a camera need to be for the ’normal’ user? Or are you honestly telling me this is a forum of true photo enthusiasts who take countless photos each day?

I am still using an iPhone XS and for the odd snap and video here and there it takes absolutely fantastic pictures.

Why oh why oh why are people so drawn to the damn cameras? And why oh why do Apple seem to think everyone cares that much? I couldn’t give a rats behind about everything they say year on year about the ‘best’ camera ever, as long as the odd photo I take looks nice it means absolutely zero to me.

Why don’t they concentrate on upgrading things people actually care about like the notch, which quite frankly is completely unacceptable in 2020 and an absolute embarrassment to Apple, considering I can buy a £200 chinese phone from Amazon which doesn’t have one. And where are features like 120hz?

This is now going to be the third iteration since the iPhone X and what has REALLY changed since then? Very little apart from ‘ooooh this chip is our fastest ever and oooh we now have blah blah number of lenses’

I love iPhones, and used to really look forward to my new one each year, but its sad how it just seems to be let down after let down these days.

Ill be skipping this year again.

Flaming can start now.....

because that's the one feature that can actually change year over year people posting on line can say wow look at this pic my iPhone took, and people to some degree care about the camera. Its hard to explain to normal people what 120hz display is, its not really going to capture the regular person and say I want that feature. But everyone understands "this is the best camera on a phone."

You can't really push display technology year or year, or battery life or physical design changes. But tweak the software, update the sensor on a camera and you can make a big difference. I agree with you though, for many of us its not a big difference, that's why I held on to my XS max. Now the 6.7in display might be a little compelling for some who want a change in display size I am a little tempted not going to lie lol I really need to see one in person before I actually commit to the cash.

 

[DexBell]

Fully prepared for the flaming as I know how these forums in particular are ,but I feel this needs to be said as it infuriates me every bloody year.

Seriously, who really cares about the Pro cameras? I mean really? How good does a camera need to be for the ’normal’ user? Or are you honestly telling me this is a forum of true photo enthusiasts who take countless photos each day?

I am still using an iPhone XS and for the odd snap and video here and there it takes absolutely fantastic pictures.

Why oh why oh why are people so drawn to the damn cameras? And why oh why do Apple seem to think everyone cares that much? I couldn’t give a rats behind about everything they say year on year about the ‘best’ camera ever, as long as the odd photo I take looks nice it means absolutely zero to me.

Why don’t they concentrate on upgrading things people actually care about like the notch, which quite frankly is completely unacceptable in 2020 and an absolute embarrassment to Apple, considering I can buy a £200 chinese phone from Amazon which doesn’t have one. And where are features like 120hz?

This is now going to be the third iteration since the iPhone X and what has REALLY changed since then? Very little apart from ‘ooooh this chip is our fastest ever and oooh we now have blah blah number of lenses’

I love iPhones, and used to really look forward to my new one each year, but its sad how it just seems to be let down after let down these days.

Ill be skipping this year again.

Flaming can start now.....

Do you know how many photos and videos are shared to social media sites daily? Its literally BILLIONS. Last I heard, it was like 1.8 billion 5-6 years ago, way more than that now with IG and TikTok explosion in popularity. The camera is arguably the most important feature on the phone and its the reason the camera industry has been getting smashed by the smartphone industry. Its huge.

 

[GrumpyCoder]

Ok so for this who do actually care about the camera (if you say so), do you not think those of us who couldn’t give a monkeys deserve something to get excited about?

The problem is, nothing exists to be excited about... you can have the usual spec bump, which makes some things a little faster (games, graphics). For 99% of the apps, you won't notice this. HDR, Dolby Vision, speakers... nice gimmicks, is anyone actually watching movies/series on a phone? Without headphones? The last innovation was the iPhone X, ever since that, minimal improvements. The camera (and software for it) is the only thing they can do to improve things and make people buy new phones. Taking a pic here or there is nice, so it recording a quick video. But you can't beat physics. Noise, dynamic range, low light performance are functions of pixel and sensor size. Phones are really bad when it comes to this, which leaves software to cheat around it. I personally take a "real" camera with me, if I know I need it. Sure, the camera body alone and each of the lenses costs more than a iPhone Pro Max, but the results are also much better. For me, a camera in a phone is nice to have when I don't have a "real" camera with me.

 

[1rottenapple]

Everyone is just missing the point, you talk like an XS has a garbage camera and is massively inferior, which is simply not the case, at all!

Its really a great camera the XS max. yes the 11 beats it on the night mode, but for day to day pics many including myself cannot tell the difference in quality for day time pictures.

Anyway congrats you just saved $1250 on an iPhone 12 pro max, donate to your favorite candidate, invest it in mutual funds, or donate to westside German Shepard rescue in Los Angeles

 

[Chompineer]

One of the only features I actually care about.

I don’t need my phone to be stupidly powerful, all I do is watch videos and text, but I do need a good camera, and I don’t intend to lug a DSLR around.

 

[zipster]

Everyone is just missing the point, you talk like an XS has a garbage camera and is massively inferior, which is simply not the case, at all!

The XS has fine cameras. The 12s have better ones.

 

[mdkdue]

Ok..title edited to make my point clearer..which is that I want something more from them now..not just the standard incremental camera upgrade, which is all we seem to get now.

 

[JPack]

And my iPhone XS takes fantastic front camera pics and pretty decent low light pics, perfectly acceptable to post on social media or show to friends.

Which again is my point, unless you are a photographer who is going to develop them and potentially blow them up in size does anyone else really need any better?

Fine, let Apple upgrade the cameras, just not at the expense of doing anything else new to their phones, which unfortunately seems to be their strategy for the last 3 years.

I see a huge difference in front camera quality between the XS and 11.

If you do any FaceTime calls, you'll immediately notice.

 

[bobright]

Wait, so the Camera is the only “upgrade” from the iPhone 12 to the Max? Battery life isn’t better? Better screen or no?

 

[JPack]

Wait, so the Camera is the only “upgrade” from the iPhone 12 to the Max? Battery life isn’t better? Better screen or no?

Bright screen on the Pro. 625 vs. 800 nits.

 

[Knowlege Bomb]

The bit about the cheap Chinese Amazon phone is absolutely ridiculous. Of course it doesn't have a notch. It likely doesn't have any sort of secure biometric, let alone something as advanced as FaceID.

I, for one, am pretty disappointed that the TouchID sensor in the power button didn't carry over from the iPad as I am sick to death of typing my passcode. Getting the Apple Watch saved me some of the headache for Apple Pay when I'm out and about but I was really hoping to see that. Couldn't care less about the notch as I've had the X, XS, XR and now 11 Pro and it has never bothered me in the least.

Besides, if they got rid of the notch how would random screengazers know you're using an iPhone?

 

[Steve121178]

Ok..title edited to make my point clearer..which is that I want something more from them now..not just the standard incremental camera upgrade, which is all we seem to get now.

What exactly do you want? Spec bumps are all you are going to get.

You are also overlooking advancements in software which people take for granted.

 

[mdkdue]

because that's the one feature that can actually change year over year people posting on line can say wow look at this pic my iPhone took, and people to some degree care about the camera. Its hard to explain to normal people what 120hz display is, its not really going to capture the regular person and say I want that feature. But everyone understands "this is the best camera on a phone."

You can't really push display technology year or year, or battery life or physical design changes. But tweak the software, update the sensor on a camera and you can make a big difference. I agree with you though, for many of us its not a big difference, that's why I held on to my XS max. Now the 6.7in display might be a little compelling for some who want a change in display size I am a little tempted not going to lie lol I really need to see one in person before I actually commit to the cash.

But we are not talking year on year change though are we? Especially for the display. This is 4 years now with basically the same display (not talking about resolution )

The notch needs to go! It’s was totally unacceptable in 2018/2019..and now it’s still gonna be here in 2021!

 

[now i see it]

The camera always gets top billing because there's so much room for improvement. Not so much for the rest of the phone. Has anyone noticed that they NEVER do anything about the white elephant in the room - Call Quality?
Or their flickering OLED screens that cripple some people? Or their connectivity issues? Or the Globally maligned Notch?

Nope - they pretend that those issues don't exist and give us little camera improvements. Truly they've lost the plot

 

[canyonblue737]

Fully prepared for the flaming as I know how these forums in particular are ,but I feel this needs to be said as it infuriates me every bloody year.

Seriously, who really cares about the Pro cameras? I mean really? How good does a camera need to be for the ’normal’ user? Or are you honestly telling me this is a forum of true photo enthusiasts who take countless photos each day?

I am still using an iPhone XS and for the odd snap and video here and there it takes absolutely fantastic pictures.

Why oh why oh why are people so drawn to the damn cameras? And why oh why do Apple seem to think everyone cares that much? I couldn’t give a rats behind about everything they say year on year about the ‘best’ camera ever, as long as the odd photo I take looks nice it means absolutely zero to me.

Why don’t they concentrate on upgrading things people actually care about like the notch, which quite frankly is completely unacceptable in 2020 and an absolute embarrassment to Apple, considering I can buy a £200 chinese phone from Amazon which doesn’t have one. And where are features like 120hz?

This is now going to be the third iteration since the iPhone X and what has REALLY changed since then? Very little apart from ‘ooooh this chip is our fastest ever and oooh we now have blah blah number of lenses’

I love iPhones, and used to really look forward to my new one each year, but its sad how it just seems to be let down after let down these days.

Ill be skipping this year again.

Flaming can start now.....

well the camera is incredibly important to many people, trust me apple does studies on what drives upgrades and camera improvements are right up there. people have to take pictures of those food plates and kids ya know.

as for other features, i'm sure apple will get rid of the notch when they can. sure they could create a punch out now but they would lose faceid and that technology is a calling card for the iPhone at this point so they have to figure out how to get rid of the notch without losing what they already have. the rumors just last week indicated for NEXT years iPhone the notch will remain and strangely not get less wide but will get far less tall... so it will be thinner basically. i'm HOPING they can afford to add the touchid power button from the iPad air to the iPhone next year because of COVID but no rumors on that yet. i think based on what happened this spring and the rumors it seems obvious they intended this year's pro models to have 120 hz screens but they couldn't get enough production volume (remember, apple makes so many more iPhones than any one model from a competitor so just because XYZ android phone has it doesn't mean apple can find someone to make it in the volume of units they need) so that is going to come next year. speed has increased, screen sizes have gotten both bigger and smaller... not sure what you want?

 

[mdkdue]

The bit about the cheap Chinese Amazon phone is absolutely ridiculous. Of course it doesn't have a notch. It likely doesn't have any sort of secure biometric, let alone something as advanced as FaceID.

I, for one, am pretty disappointed that the TouchID sensor in the power button didn't carry over from the iPad as I am sick to death of typing my passcode. Getting the Apple Watch saved me some of the headache for Apple Pay when I'm out and about but I was really hoping to see that. Couldn't care less about the notch as I've had the X, XS, XR and now 11 Pro and it has never bothered me in the least.

Besides, if they got rid of the notch how would random screengazers know you're using an iPhone?

Not it actually has in glass fingerprint sensor

 

[mdkdue]

The camera always gets top billing because there's so much room for improvement. Not so much for the rest of the phone. Has anyone noticed that they NEVER do anything about the white elephant in the room - Call Quality?
Or their flickering OLED screens that cripple some people? Or their connectivity issues? Or the Globally maligned Notch?

Nope - they pretend that those issues don't exist and give us little camera improvements. Truly they've lost the plot

Well said

 

[mdkdue]

well the camera is incredibly important to many people, trust me apple does studies on what drives upgrades and camera improvements are right up there. people have to take pictures of those food plates and kids ya know.

as for other features, i'm sure apple will get rid of the notch when they can. sure they could create a punch out now but they would lose faceid and that technology is a calling card for the iPhone at this point so they have to figure out how to get rid of the notch without losing what they already have. the rumors just last week indicated for NEXT years iPhone the notch will remain and strangely not get less wide but will get far less tall... so it will be thinner basically. i'm HOPING they can afford to add the touchid power button from the iPad air to the iPhone next year because of COVID but no rumors on that yet. i think based on what happened this spring and the rumors it seems obvious they intended this year's pro models to have 120 hz screens but they couldn't get enough production volume (remember, apple makes so many more iPhones than any one model from a competitor so just because XYZ android phone has it doesn't mean apple can find someone to make it in the volume of units they need) so that is going to come next year. speed has increased, screen sizes have gotten both bigger and smaller... not sure what you want?

I don’t get this. Samsung and countless other manufacturers have their version of Face ID, with no notch. Then there is in glass fingerprint sensors, Touch ID on power buttons. So many options.

We need to stop making excuses for Apple and call them out on it. It’s unacceptable in 2020, that’s the truth.

 

[coney718]

I'm sure Apple has a top tier research team that lets them know what is the most important features for customers and I assume the camera would be near the top of that list. People take pics of everything now and many content creators rely on the iPhone for video so yes they want the best quality they can get. Me personally, I still have a XS Max and the camera is more than capable but compared to my sisters 11 Pro I can clearly see the difference so I'm definitely looking forward to getting the 12 Pro next week.

 

[Jimmy James]

I see both sides. Apple has made some of the most meaningful advancements in smartphone photography by focusing on optics, sensors, and software. For anyone interested it matters.

On the other hand it doesn’t matter much to the average user who isn’t a photography enthusiast. It seems like a selling feature to compel us to spend money when we already have perfectly good phones.

 

[Falhófnir]

Still nothing particularly exciting though is it...any of that really worth laying out £800 for when I have an XS?

Well, over the XS you get lots of little incremental improvements that will add up:

• bigger screen in a thinner, lighter package
• Slightly refined design, if not earth shattering.
• Brighter XDR screen
• Longer battery life
• 5G
• better water resistance
• A14 chip
• Better protection from drops
• New MagSafe accessories

If you're coming up on a standard 2 year replacement cycle, you get a fresh battery with the new phone as well, and at a £200 discount over what you paid for the XS.

I think I get what you mean in the OP though, you think Apple puts too much effort into the camera to the neglect of other improvements? It does sometimes feel like that, but I think it's more that the camera is one thing they can improve year over year that a lot of people actually do care about, while phones in general have reached a bit of a plateau in other features.