Why's fragmentation so bad?

[MRU]

This misses the point entirely. Android OS should be compared to general PCs; you check out the specs beforehand and the version of the OS it is running in order to know or have an idea of what you can utlilise on the device.

I wouldn't expect to play DX11 games on a windows xp device until I had upgraded the OS and hardware. With a non upgradable device, its vital to have an idea of what it can do and be expected to do in the future.

This is something most of us do with many other devices, be it a computer, a HDTV, a DVD player, microwave etc; we look ahead at our expected usage and what may come about in the future that the device may be able to do or access.

Apps again, should be alikened to software; 'software A' which is utilised for a Radeon HD7800 running windows 7, may not be able to run at all on Windows Vista on a Nvida 8800 GT. Its misplaced then to blame the platform when getting burnt by not understanding the 'recommended specs' of the software.

The philosophy or the end product of how Android and IOS work offer alternative uses for different users. The trade off for a more PC-like platform is to have the same issues which confront PC users. However, anyone who is familiar with Windows and understands that it is not a closed system and yet can navigate themselves with minimal confusion regarding hardware and OS and the combination's compatibility with a specific piece of software, will have little problem with Android, understanding the tradeoff of the OS.

Obviously, with far less combinations of hardware and software configurations, as opposed to the almost infinite combinations with Android devices, Apps developed for the IOS platform will be less varied in compatibility. The tradeoff with IOS is that apps are somewhat held back by the capabilities of the lower end IOS devices and I'd say are artificially restrained.

So they both have pluses and minus'; the perspective is based on the user's preferred use of their device. No right or wrong answer.

Actually whilst equally valid this answer too misses the point. The OP is asking why fragmentation is bad and which is worse iOS or Android.

The day the average consumer has to start approaching buying a handset like a computer with the same variables is the day the mobile phone market pretty much dies.

Your explanation only further expands the reason why fragmentation is bad and why Android fragmentation is worse than iOS with its finite set of hardware rather than an infinite set of variables in the android approach.

 

[Dontazemebro]

We'll see for sure, and until that day comes, enjoy iOS 7 and probably iOS 8 when 90% of android users who got a tablet around the same time will be stuck on ice cream sandwich, honey comb, our even gingerbread...

Thing is those 90% probably won't even care as long as their phone can still text and perform other mundane routine functions. While on the other hand, that 10% that cares will either have flagship devices that update faster, a Nexus device or will be rooted & rom'd running the latest.

 

[Technarchy]

Thing is those 90% probably won't even care as long as their phone can still text and perform other mundane routine functions. While on the other hand, that 10% that cares will either have flagship devices that update faster, a Nexus device or will be rooted & rom'd running the latest.

Highly possible. Though I think banking on the ignorance or indifference of the customer to justify poor product support is in poor form.

Personally I'll likely be upgrading yearly so fragmentation will not affect me all that much if I remain with android and with my iPhone it is a complete non-issue.

 

[Dontazemebro]

Highly possible. Though I think banking on the ignorance or indifference of the customer to justify poor product support is in poor form.

Personally I'll likely be upgrading yearly so fragmentation will not affect me all that much if I remain with android and with my iPhone it is a complete non-issue.

That's just it though. I'm banking on the customer to do their due diligence and know what they're getting locked into before hand. Shouldn't really be an issue If you do some homework. Basically what I'm saying is that the options are there if you require the latest & greatest.

 

[Savor]

I'm one of those users that doesn't rush to update my software so soon. I remember when I had iOS4 on my 4, everything was smooth. Being forced to update to iOS6 made the experience a bit worse for me as it lags or sometimes my iPhone screen does not sleep unless I click the power button.

And another thing I like with Android is I notice I can still install many current apps on Gingerbread. Now remember GB came out the same year as iOS4 but in late 2010 when the Nexus S was released. I can still play new apps on a near 3-yr old firmware while when I was using iOS4 for three years, I needed iOS5 minimum in some cases to update or even use current popular apps.

I feel Gingerbread is like Windows XP and Jelly Bean is Windows 7. I can see Google using Gingerbread for years and years for the lower end and then dominate with JB devices for the higher end. They already seem to max out and matured with Android's current architecture with Jelly Bean. My wishlist from Key Lime Pie isnt as long as it was from ICS and JB. It is similar to iOS4 and iOS5. I felt iOS6 was not a necessary update. I felt iOS peaked and matured before that. After the peak, the updates start to become added bloat or overkill. Look at those people not rushing to Windows 8. Already content on what they currently have.

 

[Klosefabrinio]

And so what if they say that? Some people misuse the word fragmentation. :|

o the irony

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With nearly every iPhone release, Apple has introduced a new feature that is only available on the newest hardware. In my mind, this is fragmentation. Yeah, the previous 3 generations of iPhones will be able to use iOS 7. Unfortunately, the older devices don't support all of the newer features. Artificially limited functionality.

Why can't the iPhone 3Gs and 4 do turn by turn directions with Apple Maps? Google Maps does turn by turn and it runs just fine on these devices.

Why isn't Siri available on the iPad 2? The iPad mini is essentially the same device with a smaller screen and it offers Siri.

Anyway, my point is aside from minor annoyances, fragmentation doesn't seem to be causing any huge issues.

agreed, i've never seen any app which wasn't able to run on my device

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I'm one of those users that doesn't rush to update my software so soon. I remember when I had iOS4 on my 4, everything was smooth. Being forced to update to iOS6 made the experience a bit worse for me as it lags or sometimes my iPhone screen does not sleep unless I click the power button.

And another thing I like with Android is I notice I can still install many current apps on Gingerbread. Now remember GB came out the same year as iOS4 but in late 2010 when the Nexus S was released. I can still play new apps on a near 3-yr old firmware while when I was using iOS4 for three years, I needed iOS5 minimum in some cases to update or even use current popular apps.

I feel Gingerbread is like Windows XP and Jelly Bean is Windows 7. I can see Google using Gingerbread for years and years for the lower end and then dominate with JB devices for the higher end. They already seem to max out and matured with Android's current architecture with Jelly Bean. My wishlist from Key Lime Pie isnt as long as it was from ICS and JB. It is similar to iOS4 and iOS5. I felt iOS6 was not a necessary update. I felt iOS peaked and matured before that. After the peak, the updates start to become added bloat or overkill. Look at those people not rushing to Windows 8. Already content on what they currently have.

exactly... android is offering much more (an i've yet to notice any apps which aren't compatible with my devices)

 

[Michael Goff]

o the irony

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agreed, i've never seen any app which wasn't able to run on my device

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exactly... android is offering much more (an i've yet to notice any apps which aren't compatible with my devices)

We get it, you come in with a premise that there really isn't Android fragmentation and then you refuse to hear otherwise. You just want an echo chamber of people agreeing with you.

Fragmentation is real, whether or not you want it to be. Google is trying to get to the point where it doesn't matter, and they're honestly almost there in terms of their main apps. Windows had this issue a long time back, they had to come up with a way of dealing with it too.

 

[MRU]

exactly... android is offering much more (an i've yet to notice any apps which aren't compatible with my devices)

I have a stack of purchased games and a few non gaming apps that are not compatible with my S4.
Just because you don't have any yourself doesn't mean they do not exist and poses a genuine problem to many users.


analogy... I don't have AIDS/HIV but I wouldn't be brazen to say that 'as it doesn't effect me' then it does not pose a genuine problem for many people in the world.

 

[Sodner]

Anyone voting for iOS is an Android FanBoy blinded by their love of giant sized phones running a 2 year old OS.

 

[Klosefabrinio]

OK, so after 3 days and 3 pages of discussion, here's the conclusion:

android fragmentation: developers have to work on making the app compatible with more devices rather than working on the app and making it better (and the developers aren't getting any help or extra money for this), application that lists itself as for Android 4.1 and above will not always run even if the device is capable enough. android fragmentation occurs because of different internals and different android versions which make the model completely unique and different and so developers, google and the phone manufacturers have to make a special update for each model. android fragmentation can also affect OS's security, performance and stability, it's best to be on the latest version of android. only a VERY SMALL amount of android users will find some apps which dont run on their devices although their device is capable enough to run that app, it's not such a big issue (for most android users), but apple uses this issue against android and android phone manufacturers. GE phones, nexus phones and motorolla phones are especially influenced by google so you wont notice android fragmentation in these phones, android fragmentation has an ADVANTAGE also (and the adv. is bigger than it's disadv.), consumers get different options (in smartphones), more variety (and this has helped android grow). apple's currently working on a lower-end device, increasing the fragmentation of their ecosystem in the process, suggesting that the Android ecosystem is not only doing something right, but doing something to be imitated.

iOS fragmentation: apple doesn't uses different software and hardware in iphone, so, there aren't many different combinations, and so developers can work on making the app better rather than working on making the app compatible with more devices (microsoft also solved their fragmentation problem years ago). When people refer to iOS fragmentation they refer to bits of iOS 7 that older devices wont get - such as Airdrop (although the device can run most of those left out features, but apple leaves them out so people buy the new iphone). However an app programmed for iOS7 will normally work on any device running iOS 7. Regardless of whether its new or old. Yes there may be performance differences or app limitations but fundamentally it will work regardless of device.

people are complaining that a 1yr old android phone doesnt gets update but the iphone get update for 3-4 yrs, well that's because the iyr old android phone sells for $300, while the iphone sells for $1000. (and btw android flagship phones get updates for 2 YEARS)

 

[Michael Goff]

OK, so after 3 days and 3 pages of discussion, here's the conclusion:

android fragmentation: developers have to work on making the app compatible with more devices rather than working on the app and making it better (and the developers aren't getting any help or extra money for this), application that lists itself as for Android 4.1 and above will not always run even if the device is capable enough. android fragmentation occurs because of different internals and different android versions which make the model completely unique and different and so developers, google and the phone manufacturers have to make a special update for each model. android fragmentation can also affect OS's security, performance and stability, it's best to be on the latest version of android. only a VERY SMALL amount of android users will find some apps which dont run on their devices although their device is capable enough to run that app, it's not such a big issue (for most android users), but apple uses this issue against android and android phone manufacturers. GE phones, nexus phones and motorolla phones are especially influenced by google so you wont notice android fragmentation in these phones, android fragmentation has an ADVANTAGE also (and the adv. is bigger than it's disadv.), consumers get different options (in smartphones), more variety (and this has helped android grow). apple's currently working on a lower-end device, increasing the fragmentation of their ecosystem in the process, suggesting that the Android ecosystem is not only doing something right, but doing something to be imitated.

iOS fragmentation: apple doesn't uses different software and hardware in iphone, so, there aren't many different combinations, and so developers can work on making the app better rather than working on making the app compatible with more devices (microsoft also solved their fragmentation problem years ago). When people refer to iOS fragmentation they refer to bits of iOS 7 that older devices wont get - such as Airdrop (although the device can run most of those left out features, but apple leaves them out so people buy the new iphone). However an app programmed for iOS7 will normally work on any device running iOS 7. Regardless of whether its new or old. Yes there may be performance differences or app limitations but fundamentally it will work regardless of device.

people are complaining that a 1yr old android phone doesnt gets update but the iphone get update for 3-4 yrs, well that's because the iyr old android phone sells for $300, while the iphone sells for $1000. (and btw android flagship phones get updates for 2 YEARS)

What iPhone are you looking at that costs $1000?

 

[Klosefabrinio]

I have a stack of purchased games and a few non gaming apps that are not compatible with my S4.
Just because you don't have any yourself doesn't mean they do not exist and poses a genuine problem to many users.


analogy... I don't have AIDS/HIV but I wouldn't be brazen to say that 'as it doesn't effect me' then it does not pose a genuine problem for many people in the world.

maybe an update will solve your problem.

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What iPhone are you looking at that costs $1000?

why dont you wait till 10th sep?

 

[Michael Goff]

maybe an update will solve your problem.

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why dont you wait till 10th sep?

So there is no $1000 iPhone right now?

And what flagship phone sells for 300$ off contract, other than the Nexus 4?

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

people are complaining that a 1yr old android phone doesnt gets update but the iphone get update for 3-4 yrs, well that's because the iyr old android phone sells for $300, while the iphone sells for $1000. (and btw android flagship phones get updates for 2 YEARS)

There are no complaints from me. I think Apple go far beyond expectations in terms of supporting older devices. When you consider a 3 year old iPhone 4 is included in the iOS 7 update, that bodes rather well. Sure the iP4 won't get every single feature, but lets be realistic as to why that is. When I was with HTC I had an update 6 months after it was originally launched and it ground my phone almost to a halt. That particular model was not even 12 months old at the time and I had a hell of a game trying to revert it to a previous release.

I've had more faith in iOS releases as they generally work on the phones they are aimed at. I do feel with Android its a chase concerning hardware to keep up. This works for some and not for others. I intend to keep my phones for two years and don't expect to be forced to upgrade because of software that hasn't been tested thoroughly for my particular device. That was my biggest complaint concerning Android, but on the whole I enjoyed it while I was on it.

 

[Klosefabrinio]

So there is no $1000 iPhone right now?

And what flagship phone sells for 300$ off contract, other than the Nexus 4?

you're giving the option and then you're saying "except"? wow

here's another phone http://www.gsmarena.com/blu_life_play-5359.php

 

[Michael Goff]

you're giving the option and then you're saying "except"? wow

here's another phone http://www.gsmarena.com/blu_life_play-5359.php

Yes, if you don't want to make any money from your phone (Nexus)... a company can give you a cheap phone. As for the phone you showed? Have fun with almost no space (my Lumia 520 has more internal space) and a slow processor. Don't let the term "quad core" fool you into thinking this is a flagship-level device.

I thought you were talking about flagships, but I guess you're going down the budget line with the hopes of making the price difference show up more. It's okay, you're allowed to like Android without needing to hate iOS.

 

[aristobrat]

I am not expert either but if you know a little on how java works (which is how android app is built on) then we know that those who brought in hardware as a factor in fragmentation argument is most probably talking nonsense.

If you write your app in Java, it's most likely going to run on just about any Android phone that's running the version of Android that you developed on. That's the nice thing about Java, right?

But when Google releases a new version of the Android OS with some new APIs that you (the developer) want to start using to make your app better, you're now in a position where only a small amount of your customers will have phones that support the new Android OS. The majority of your customers will have phones that will never support the new OS. That's where the OS fragments (based on hardware that Google doesn't make the new Android OS available to), and Java doesn't help you there.

My theory is that the majority of Apple hate comes from people who didn't get to experience the iPod.

I have a (unrelated, totally switching gears) theory that the folks that are having fun cooking up ROMS over at XDA-developers (and proposing that as a viable alternative for anyone who has hardware that doesn't get a manufacturer/carrier approved Android update) will eventually get tired of doing that.

I joined XDA-Developers back in 2004. Back then, if you wanted a decent Windows smartphone, you had to buy it from eBay UK, and cooking your own ROM was the only way to get it without the weird manufacturer/carrier customizations.

Have to admit, it was fun to have that much control and customization, but after a couple of years of HAVING to do it, it got old and became annoying.

I'm curious to see if the current batch of folks having fun will run into the same realization down the road.

 

[Hastings101]

oops, I think I voted wrong. I picked iOS thinking that iOS' increasing fragmentation is more dangerous to Apple because of how anti-fraggificationizinationily this and that they were.

Obviously Android is more fragmented haha but that's nothing new.

 

[Donvald]

Actually whilst equally valid this answer too misses the point. The OP is asking why fragmentation is bad and which is worse iOS or Android.

The day the average consumer has to start approaching buying a handset like a computer with the same variables is the day the mobile phone market pretty much dies.

Your explanation only further expands the reason why fragmentation is bad and why Android fragmentation is worse than iOS with its finite set of hardware rather than an infinite set of variables in the android approach.

Your prediction of the mobile phone market dying is just that; a prediction. Not based on anything really. The fact is that this is essentially already happening and Android is growing. Not sure where you get this guesstimate from.

Perhaps in addition you didn't understand my point. In summary if you didn't read; Open OS, more complex choices > closed OS less complex choices. Either one is attractive to various users. There is no winner. It is stupid to side either way.

 

[surjavarman]

Took my old ipod touch 2G out of the drawer and tried to download some apps. I couldn't download 100% of the apps in the appstore. None of them were compatible with my device.

Talk about fragmentation being exclusive to android

 

[aristobrat]

Took my old ipod touch 2G out of the drawer and tried to download some apps. I couldn't download 100% of the apps in the appstore. None of them were compatible with my device.

Talk about fragmentation being exclusive to android

I've never seen an article (or forum post here) that says fragmentation is exclusive to Android. More prevalent in Android, yes. Exclusive to Android, no.

Interestingly, it's not uncommon to see posts from Android owners on here complaining about compatibility issues when their 18-month old Android device doesn't get an upgrade to the next Android OS. Even had someone last week mention how they couldn't download some current games on their GS4.

Your example is with an iOS device that is twenty days away from having been launched half-a-decade ago.

 

[Michael Goff]

Took my old ipod touch 2G out of the drawer and tried to download some apps. I couldn't download 100% of the apps in the appstore. None of them were compatible with my device.

Talk about fragmentation being exclusive to android

Wait.

You took an obsolete device and aren't able to download things? SHOCKER.

Why not complain about not being able download WP8 apps on Windows Mobile 6 while you're at it?

 

[gotluck]

Wait.

You took an obsolete device and aren't able to download things? SHOCKER.

Why not complain about not being able download WP8 apps on Windows Mobile 6 while you're at it?

to be fair you can still download a good number of apps on old gingerbread devices

 

[MRU]

Your prediction of the mobile phone market dying is just that; a prediction. Not based on anything really.

You took an skeuomorphic expression and twisted it into meaning that I was giving a factual prediction ?

We better watch out when using more idioms on this forum folks...

Just to clear it up...

"hell doesn't really freeze over"
"there really isn't a month of sundays"
"no such thing as a blue moon - even once"........ /s

 

[DeathTheKid]

Yes..It's A Problem

I have a Nexus 7 FHD and I have seen a couple of times where the Google Play store won't allow me to download an app because it is "Incompatible with my Device". However, this is more of the exception than the norm.

The main issue is the varying screen sizes. Also, on higher end 3D games, the quality of the GPU. Also the hardware features differ from phone to phone (ex one phone may have a GPS while another may not).

Most Android App scale well to different screen sizes. The API was designed with that in mind. However, it seems a lot of developers do not take the time to actually change their layout for larger screens. This looks downright awkward on a Nexus 10. For me it is a little annoying on the 7, but not a deal-breaker like it was on the 10.

However, Google is actively trying to combat fragmentation and make the platform more appealing to mobile developers. They released a new IDE called "Android Studio". You can read more about it here and here. Of course, like any other endeavor, it requires cooperation by the development community. Also, it has been rumored that Key Lime Pie will help to combat fragmentation, by making the OS more compatible to run on older device. However, these are just rumors.