Will there be a new Mac Pro in 2015?

[ManuelGomes]

filmak, right on. That's what I'm trying to say here, the nMP was designed that way with a purpose. And you know what you want or need for sure, no one is buying such a pricey machine without at least considering the pros and cons, and see if there's a viable alternative that will fit their needs better.
So, for me the nMP is a great machine and I'd expect everyone to consider it carefully before buying, knowing the limitations and key benefits.

 

[ManuelGomes]

Capitan, I understand that of course. Software will need to catch up but it's taking it's time I guess.
The idea, good or bad, is to move all those cards to external TB boxes.
10GbE will come with TB3 anyway.

 

[filmak]

It's not just gaming people who are disappointed. I have seen a lot of Photoshop users who have found bugs in the performance. There's something going wrong somewhere. Then there are video editors and compositors who use Red Rocket capture cards, internal RAIDs and 10 Gigabit Ethernet. They can't use a nMP and have built PCs.

I fully understand the shortcomings you are referring. Before buying the second nMP I was toying with the idea of a hackintosh for similar reasons. The thing that stopped me was not the technical skills but the time that someone has to spend for the whole project and maintaining it. I don't have anymore this luxury of plenty of time.

I'm really interested as a Photoshop - Lightroom user (also ID, AI etc.) about the problems you mentioned, can you please be more specific? Perhaps they are software related?

 

[SoyCapitanSoyCapitan]

I fully understand the shortcomings you are referring. Before buying the second nMP I was toying with the idea of a hackintosh for similar reasons. The thing that stopped me was not the technical skills but the time that someone has to spend for the whole project and maintaining it. I don't have anymore this luxury of plenty of time.

I'm really interested as a Photoshop - Lightroom user (also ID, AI etc.) about the problems you mentioned, can you please be more specific? Perhaps they are software related?

The issues are Photoshop works normally and then suddenly there's a slowdown with the cursor lagging behind. It could be something to do with the graphics card or CPU switching power modes in the background. There are other random slowdowns, like the guy currently having problems in the Photoshop benchmark topic.

 

[flat five]

#1621
"It's really not a good idea to do it under warranty."


Of course and it's not a good idea.

If anything happens and you bring your nMP in for repairs, they know by the s/n the initial configuration and ...

again the Apple's words:
"Don’t open your Mac Pro except to install memory and solid state drives (SSD), and don’t attempt to repair your Mac Pro by yourself. Your Mac Pro doesn’t have any user-serviceable parts, except for memory and SSDs."

apple offers DIY parts service within their warranty.. for example, you can bring in a bad ssd from your mac pro and apple will give you a new one with the expectation that you'll switch it yourself.. you don't have to bring in the whole computer or send it away etc.. with the mac pro, this service applies to ram and ssd.. if a gpu blows and you want it serviced under warranty through apple directly, you have to bring in the whole machine.. if you want, you can buy a replacement d700 and swap it out yourself and warranty remains valid.. probably better off having apple do it though since you won't have to pay for the d700 that way.

the warranty reads:
This Warranty does not apply: (a) to consumable parts, such as batteries, unless failure has occurred due to a defect in materials or workmanship; (b) to cosmetic damage, including but not limited to scratches, dents and broken plastic on ports; (c) to damage caused by use with another product; (d) to damage caused by accident, abuse, misuse, liquid contact, fire, earthquake or other external cause; (e) to damage caused by operating the Apple Product outside Apple’s published guidelines; (f) to damage caused by service (including upgrades and expansions) performed by anyone who is not a representative of Apple or an Apple Authorized Service Provider (“AASP”); (g) to an Apple Product that has been modified to alter functionality or capability without the written permission of Apple; (h) to defects caused by normal wear and tear or otherwise due to the normal aging of the Apple Product, or (i) if any serial number has been removed or defaced from the Apple Product.

note f:
the warranty voids if you damage the machine while preforming an upgrade.. the warranty does not void if you upgrade while not damaging the machine.

there is a law, a real law, which protects people's rights to upgrade electronics while under warranty.. apple can't circumnavigate this law and they aren't.. but they can and are making it seem as if they have the right to void your warranty.. just like every other electronics manufacturer does.. most people assume warranty will void if you replace a part but that doesn't make it so.

 

[filmak]

The issues are Photoshop works normally and then suddenly there's a slowdown with the cursor lagging behind. It could be something to do with the graphics card or CPU switching power modes in the background. There are other random slowdowns, like the guy currently having problems in the Photoshop benchmark topic.

I'll check it , thank you.

 

[SoyCapitanSoyCapitan]

I'll check it , thank you.

It's possible that it could be fixed in El Capitan. It's not Adobe's fault for sure.

 

[filmak]

with the mac pro, this service applies to ram and ssd.. if a gpu blows and you want it serviced under warranty, you have to bring in the whole machine.

This is it.

 

[filmak]

It's possible that it could be fixed in El Capitan. It's not Adobe's fault for sure.

Unfortunately Yosemite has a lot of bugs.

 

[flat five]

This is it.

sort of.
this is it if we're talking about costs.. it's much cheaper (ie- free) to have apple or authorized service center do the repair while under warranty.

the point i'm making though is that you can buy the gpu and replace it yourself while the machine is under warranty and the warranty will remain vaild.

it's just that it's a pretty dumb way to do it if it's avoidable.. (rare cases where it wouldn't be avoidable is if i need my computer right now.. machine breaks.. i need to fix it.. now.. so i go buy the part and i'm up and running in an hour or two instead of waiting a couple of days for apple to make the repair)

---

edit-- that said.. once the computer is out of warranty, it will be cheaper for you to buy the part and fix it yourself.. the part will cost the same but you avoid labor costs if repairing yourself.

this example is already in play to a tiny degree.. there are (i imagine) a handful of warranty_less 6.1s out there.. if something in it breaks, the owner has avenues available for fixing the machine themselves.. PSU, ssd, GPU, CPU (ie- everything in the nmp) can be bought brand new/non-black-market as individual parts and replaced by the owner using standard tools and not requiring a whole lot of technical know how.

i literally argued people for a year around here about this being the case in the future (that being now).. but now that it's shown to be true, let's just brush it under the carpet and forget about it

 

[ManuelGomes]

FFC filings for the new Magic Mouse 2 and keyboard with BT 4.2 LE surfaced.
About time, these accessories needed an upgrade long ago.
Integrated batteries too.

 

[ixxx69]

Nope, just you. Point being that people who don't understand the tech they are posting about shouldn't post about it.

If you don't understand how 4,1 to 5,1 hack works, you don't.

All of the machine firmware hacks just used an existing firmware, completely 100% unmolested by anyone.

To add GPUs to 6,1 firmware would be a HUGE undertaking. Again, research is what you need to do to understand.

Just as a reminder, this is exactly what MVC's replying to in my post discussing environmental/energy impact:

And any nMP will still be useful long after it's no longer good enough for serious video editing - being such a small quiet machine, I'm sure people will be finding all sorts of uses for them even a decade from now. Most Macs less than 10 years old EOL when it's broken, not because it doesn't have the latest GPU.

So again MVC, WTF does your reply have to do with anything I wrote? Be specific about how any of the statements in my post are related to what you're ranting on about.

This is MVC's typical modus operandi to try and discredit people...

1. He'll reply by first insulting you with a "you don't know/understand anything" statement - this is almost guaranteed to elicit an angry and defensive reply from the poster - anytime someone is called out in that way in a public forum, they naturally feel the need to defend themselves.

2. He purposely misconstrues what was written to suggest something completely different or unrelated - this is intended to push you off balance - you either don't know how to respond because it's like conversing with a crazy person, or you get sucked into his straw-man arguments.

3. MVC will then continues to rant for a few posts without actually addressing the original points he was replying to - this is meant to distract readers from his hat trick... you can't argue with the random and unrelated factual information he drops in, which is intertwined with further accusations that you don't know what they're talking about. There's no way to reply to that.

The problem is, while all those technical details about hacks and firmware may be largely correct, they don't have anything to do with what I wrote. I guess he just wanted to insult and discredit me, but couldn't find a relevant opening, so he just picked a random quote of mine and started spouting off.

 

[goMac]

apple offers DIY parts service within their warranty.. for example, you can bring in a bad ssd from your mac pro and apple will give you a new one with the expectation that you'll switch it yourself.. you don't have to bring in the whole computer or send it away etc.. with the mac pro, this service applies to ram and ssd.. if a gpu blows and you want it serviced under warranty through apple directly, you have to bring in the whole machine.. if you want, you can buy a replacement d700 and swap it out yourself and warranty remains valid.. probably better off having apple do it though since you won't have to pay for the d700 that way...

You're correct. Apple can't void the warranty if you swap the GPUs, unless you break something while you do it. The warranty would not apply to the new GPUs, so you'd need to swap them back before getting your machine serviced.

This is basically where CPU upgrades fall as well. The new CPU itself is not covered, and damage you do to the machine is not covered, but swapping the CPU in a cMP does not void the warranty. For the few out there that still have warranties.

I don't think the GPUs on the Mac Pro are really user serviceable though.

 

[MacVidCards]

In case anyone is wondering why the mutual admiration society has spent 2 pages of time glad handing and congratulating each other it is because someone took a nasty poo on himself (not once but twice actually) 3 pages back and they want it good and buried by Monday.

Buried, but not forgotten.

 

[koyoot]

If anyone of us would make this sort of **** on forum as MVC does we would be banned already. It is beyond me how can he still be on forum if he cannot discuss without insults and assumptions about person he's is talking to. No constructive talk. Only crapping.

It beggars belief.

ixxx69, you have shown exactly same thing what he did in argument with me about Fiji chip in Mac Pro. That is exactly why I've put him on ignore list.

EOT.

 

[MacVidCards]

If anyone of us would make this sort of **** on forum as MVC does we would be banned already. It is beyond me how can he still be on forum if he cannot discuss without insults and assumptions about person he's is talking to. No constructive talk. Only crapping.

It beggars belief.

ixxx69, you have shown exactly same thing what he did in argument with me about Fiji chip in Mac Pro. That is exactly why I've put him on ignore list.

EOT.

I beg to differ.

I'm also curious what you consider an insult? Just because someone takes a different viewpoint than yourself, doesn't mean they have insulted you.

Your claims about Fiji were balderdash and you knew it. You posted links to articles that claimed under clocking didn't reduce power without killing performance then claimed the article said the opposite. You were deliberately misleading people who might not follow the link and read the actual conclusion reached by the people who ran the tests.

 

[flat five]

In case anyone is wondering why the mutual admiration society has spent 2 pages of time glad handing and congratulating each other it is because someone took a nasty poo on himself (not once but twice actually) 3 pages back and they want it good and buried by Monday.

Buried, but not forgotten.

are you talking about this? :

arguing about super upgradable machines doesn't really hold when you take a look around.. how many people are using 10 year old computers due to their upgradability? which one of you upgrade maniacs on this forum are using some decade old computer? (crickets)

if so.. i should of written cricket instead of crickets.. i only hear one chirping in the thread

(as in- all the upgrade maniac geekbench players aren't using old computers.. they upgrade the whole machine at a decent clip)

 

[Bradleyone]

My feelings reading this thread...

 

[mathpunk]

My feelings reading this thread...

Nice work.

 

[JamesPDX]

are you talking about this? :



if so.. i should of written cricket instead of crickets.. i only hear one chirping in the thread

(as in- all the upgrade maniac geekbench players aren't using old computers.. they upgrade the whole machine at a decent clip)

Sometimes I still use a 2003 DP G5 because I can record 16 discrete, simultaneous channels of 24/44.1 audio into Pro Tools 7 and it'll all be perfectly in sync. I can also slave that machine to a G4 533 for another 8 channels.

Or I could go drop 22k on a nMP and a full Pro Tools HDX system and do the same thing, but, uh, more quietly. But I have a machine room. Anyway, my point is that it's paid-for and it can be hauled around w/o fear of somebody running off with it. It's not a "funstation" it's a workstation.

 

[flat five]

Sometimes I still use a 2003 DP G5 because I can record 16 discrete, simultaneous channels of 24/44.1 audio into Pro Tools 7 and it'll all be perfectly in sync. I can also slave that machine to a G4 533 for another 8 channels.

Or I could go drop 22k on a nMP and a full Pro Tools HDX system and do the same thing, but, uh, more quietly. But I have a machine room. Anyway, my point is that it's paid-for and it can be hauled around w/o fear of somebody running off with it. It's not a "funstation" it's a workstation.

neat. you're using an aged computer.. i have a mp1.1 and a powerbook that still work too.

are people not getting my point on purpose or am i really being unclear with it?

 

[JamesPDX]

Not sure if you're being sarcastic. Are you speaking of upgrades of nMP (GPUs, warranties, consumer law, etc.) I'll respond anyway.

Nobody's "not getting your point on purpose..." Maybe they have a different opinion of what you're driving at. I merely gave an example of the ongoing utility of older-tech in relation to replacing drives and keeping things running. So let me be more specific in reply to you comment "...how many people are using 10 year old computers due to their upgradability? which one of you upgrade maniacs on this forum are using some decade old computer?")


I have a few macs, some newer, some older. Some still have utility that has extended beyond their perceived value.
I recently gave away another G5 with an LED monitor, a recording interface (with a fully functioning Pro Tools 7 system) ad a portable FW400 Rocstor Drive because the person can't afford new tech. But he can make great use of this old-tech to do something creative until he can buy the next big thing.

In most of the great recording systems, you can't just throw an old interface onto a new computer or vice versa without suffering some horrendous latency issues, or simple non-functionality, so you have to buy your entire system in one huge purchase. We're talking about a lot of money for most people.

I resist and resent willful, planned obsolescence and the assorted c**k-blockery of soldered-in CPUs, GPU's, and RAM, especially when that market strategy comes from a company that claims to be so... Environmental. Everybody should know that computer/component "recycling" really means that it's harvested for rare-earth metals then crushed and shipped to a landfill in Africa or China.

 

[flat five]

Not sure if you're being sarcastic. Are you speaking of upgrades of nMP (GPUs, warranties, consumer law, etc.) I'll respond anyway.

Nobody's "not getting your point on purpose..." Maybe they have a different opinion of what you're driving at.

the context i was replying to was one in which people are whining about no upgradeability in the new mac pro..

"Apple put all their R&D efforts with the nMP on optimising around things that have little to no performance advantage over what could be user-added to the previous design, at the cost of removing flexibility and longevity from the machine."

my question was something like 'which one of you upgrade maniacs are using a 10 year old computer?" ..upgrade maniacs referring to people in this thread claiming d700 is old tech.. mp6.1 is already dead.. etc. regardless of the fact that it's actually very new tech and definitely the most advanced and most powerful macintosh ever made.

the only gpu worthy of using at any given time is the one that was released for sale within the past 90 days..


the same people often complain of macs being disposable appliances.

but the reality is that they buy new computers more often than normal people even though they're sitting around touting how awesomely upgradeable the previous mac pros were.. the second question i asked is something like 'if that computer is so upgradeable etc, why even concern yourself with the nmp design? just keep upgrading the old one"

I resist and resent willful, planned obsolescence and the assorted c**k-blockery of soldered-in CPUs, GPU's, and RAM, especially when that market strategy comes from a company that claims to be so... Environmental. Everybody should know that computer/component "recycling" really means that it's harvested for rare-earth metals then crushed and shipped to a landfill in Africa or China.

i don't disagree with that.. but really, i don't think apple says "let's solder the cpu in a macbook air to force people to buy a new one in 3 years".. they solder it in there for different reasons under the knowledge of "these freaking people are going to buy a new one in 3 years anyway and it really doesn't matter if we solder it in or not."

people love to put all the blame for disposable electronics on the manufactures.. and there is truth in it.
but at least half the blame needs to be placed on the consumers.. we're the ones throwing the crap away instead of repairing it.. how many tvs do you think are in the landfill with a blown capacitor worth 10¢?
new!new!new!.. gimme new!
that's us consumers saying that.. not the corporations
(just look at this thread for example)

 

[MacVidCards]

the context i was replying to was one in which people are whining about no upgradeability in the new mac pro..

"Apple put all their R&D efforts with the nMP on optimising around things that have little to no performance advantage over what could be user-added to the previous design, at the cost of removing flexibility and longevity from the machine."

my question was something like 'which one of you upgrade maniacs are using a 10 year old computer?" ..upgrade maniacs referring to people in this thread claiming d700 is old tech.. mp6.1 is already dead.. etc. regardless of the fact that it's actually very new tech and definitely the most advanced and most powerful macintosh ever made.

the only gpu worthy of using at any given time is the one that was released for sale within the past 90 days..


the same people often complain of macs being disposable appliances.

but the reality is that they buy new computers more often than normal people even though they're sitting around touting how awesomely upgradeable the previous mac pros were.. the second question i asked is something like 'if that computer is so upgradeable etc, why even concern yourself with the nmp design? just keep upgrading the old one"




i don't disagree with that.. but really, i don't think apple says "let's solder the cpu in a macbook air to force people to buy a new one in 3 years".. they solder it in there for different reasons under the knowledge of "these freaking people are going to buy a new one in 3 years anyway and it really doesn't matter if we solder it in or not."

people love to put all the blame for disposable electronics on the manufactures.. and there is truth in it.
but at least half the blame needs to be placed on the consumers.. we're the ones throwing the crap away instead of repairing it.. how many tvs do you think are in the landfill with a blown capacitor worth 10¢?
new!new!new!.. gimme new!
that's us consumers saying that.. not the corporations
(just look at this thread for example)

As full of it as ever.

What I pointed out was that while you are making fun of people using 10 year old computers, THE MOST POPULAR THREAD on the MP board is the one where people figured out how EASY it is to run Yosemite on a 2006 MP.

You have done nothing but drop layer upon layer of gibberish after this.

It IS the most popular thread. There is basically no chance whatsoever that a nMP will even be close to running a current OS in 2023 due to those pre-crippled GPUs.

So, keep laying it on. But a 2006 MP can still be a viable machine, and easily runs better GPUs then the trash can. But please make more fun of the people posting in a thread with 554,000 views. I'm sure you know better.

 

[JamesPDX]

Re: All of this. There are a lot of interesting points here and I learn something new everytime I read these forums. But the OP's 2010 caught my eye and I really wanted to help. (Actually, I wanted to offer him money for it, but I've restrained myself.) OTOH, I've lost a link to some guy that hot rods old mac pros with new chips, flashing GPUs, etc. I love that intrepid attitude and industry of talent with thermal paste. I love the 2013 MP's quiet power, but I'd really like to have all that in a box jammed full of SSDs and still have dual GB ethernet. It seems we can't have it all. Or can we? Maybe the compromise is in possibly being able to swap-out the processor (6-core and up socket?-Or is everything about to change again?) My studio is silent with the 2012 Mini (thank god I got that when I did and maxed it out), but I'd really like more power, but the realistic shame is that I just can't swing the cost.

Re: Electronic waste, a lot of fingers could be pointed at Dell's MiniTower line, where one cheap capacitor in the PSU took down the whole machine in seconds, along with dozens of its brothers in those corporate "bulk PC buys" that are familiar to so many of us. Anybody still running a Tangent with NT? Maybe on day there will be build-quality laws.

IMHO...