Will there be a new Mac Pro in 2015?

[goMac]

Anyone who claims that they know whether or not the tube Mac Pro's GPUs will have upgrades available is either lying or works for Apple.

The one thing I will say is that some people should already be smart enough to know Apple never, ever, ever does mid-cycle GPU upgrades as policy. So no GPU upgrade appearing for the nMP yet is not evidence one way or another.

I would assume it hasn't been ruled in or out because if Apple does something like un-gimp the power supply they can't put a higher power draw card into the older tube. But if the new tube uses a similar design it could be a possible option. We won't know one way other another until the new machine shows. Apple may know by now which way they'll go but I seriously doubt anyone in this thread does.

 

[JamesPDX]

OP (Post #1) If I had your fine machine, I'd jam at least one Angelbird Wings PCIe (2x1TB SSDs) in there, and place as many 1 TB SSDs into your existing bays that the law will allow. (use you spinners as backups/clones) Put it all on a UPS, and buy the finest EIZO ColorEdge monitor(s) you can afford. And vacuum the thing out now and then. That's what I'd do.

 

[MacVidCards]

Anyone who claims that they know whether or not the tube Mac Pro's GPUs will have upgrades available is either lying or works for Apple.

The one thing I will say is that some people should already be smart enough to know Apple never, ever, ever does mid-cycle GPU upgrades as policy. So no GPU upgrade appearing for the nMP yet is not evidence one way or another.

I would assume it hasn't been ruled in or out because if Apple does something like un-gimp the power supply they can't put a higher power draw card into the older tube. But if the new tube uses a similar design it could be a possible option. We won't know one way other another until the new machine shows. Apple may know by now which way they'll go but I seriously doubt anyone in this thread does.

And there you have it, boys and girls.

I would trust this guy before I'd trust most of the people MR puts on front page.

More connected than I am, for sure. He proved me wrong about a VERY specific thing in a coming OS. He knew. So, find your answer above, it's in those words.

(or whatever he changes them to by AM)

So, a lily livered 7,1 in the works. Has a watered down Hawaii ready to go, likely with 8GBs and some pretty low clocks. Also, a Fiji Nano version , similarly watered down clocks and faster fan. And possibly a fatter PSU to allow those new AMD GPUs from their "Space Heater" division to run. CPU shuffling, maybe GDDR4. TB3 and.....

 

[ixxx69]

Please, for the sake of something, do some reading. There is one, and only 1 Mac from 2006 that can still run anything past 10.7.5. with no excuses. It is the cMP. And it is because 10.8 wrote all of the EFI32 GPUs out of the OS drivers. So the 2006 GPUs no longer have driver support, at all. They have basic EFI support. Screen gets drawn but moving the mouse across screen gives new meaning to "drag & drop" as screen is actually being drawn by the already-overwhelmed CPU.

I am not exaggerating, go read the threads. So all 2006-7 Macs running anything past 10.7.5 have ZERO (0) (NADA) (NONE) OpenGl, OpenCl, and 3D at all. No gaming, no CUDA, no transparency or translucency. The dock is a solid colored strip with icons on it. Meanwhile, the cMP from 2006 can have 2 files switched, run Yosemite or Yellowstone or whatever the new one is, and with a new GPU, have better OpenGl then any Mac shipping today.

Really think about that.

I have absolutely no idea what your post has to with what I wrote. You're acting like a raving lunatic. Did you mean to reply to a different post?

 

[MacVidCards]

I have absolutely no idea what your post has to with what I wrote. You're acting like a raving lunatic. Did you mean to reply to a different post?

Nope, just you. Point being that people who don't understand the tech they are posting about shouldn't post about it.

If you don't understand how 4,1 to 5,1 hack works, you don't.

All of the machine firmware hacks just used an existing firmware, completely 100% unmolested by anyone.

To add GPUs to 6,1 firmware would be a HUGE undertaking. Again, research is what you need to do to understand.

 

[filmak]

i knew the nmp was designed to be upgradeable and user servicable.. nothing has changed about my views on that and most of the stuff i've said has already been proven true.

I'm sorry but what do you mean?

As far as we know Apple states in the nMP user's guide:
"Don’t open your Mac Pro except to install memory and solid state drives (SSD), and don’t attempt to repair your Mac Pro by yourself. Your Mac Pro doesn’t have any user-serviceable parts, except for memory and SSDs."

Perhaps at first you loose your warranty ?
and..
Yes, you can remove the screws but where will you find compatible boards - especially GPUs, SSD connector, mainboard, PSU, Fan etc, to use? they are all custom built - special Apple's designs.

PSUs, Storage drives, fans, GPUs are the most common failing parts in Computers.

 

[ManuelGomes]

Man, you really are mad at the world in general, or people in particular, right MVC?
Do you have a problem talking to people in a proper manner? Is it that hard?
Or is it because you think of yourself so highly being in the Hollywood film industry? Or because you can tweak firmware like few do? Netkas does it and he seems a nice person, why can't you be one too?
Don't you have to rest from your surgery or something?
Leave people here discuss as they want, even if it's just wishing for something.
Open your own thread so you can moan at yourself as much as you want.
It's obvious you don't like the nMP, or AMD (or only the current GPU lineup).
Maybe NVidia cards are easier to tweak the firmware, and that's where the profit is, but we've heard all your arguments before, so give it a rest.
Don't you have something else to do, something more zen, like knitting?
Sorry guys for this outburst, I'm really a calm person and can live along all sorts of people, but this guy is really hard to swallow. This must be the film industry attitude, I don't know.

 

[flat five]

Wow, who's that from, your Uncle Joe? You must really be terrified that I may post something impressive.

See, usually when you quote something, you MENTION WHO YOU ARE QUOTING to lend some credence to it. (i.e., "President Kennedy, 1962 Rose Bowl Parade Speech", something like that. So you don't seem desperately grabbing for support from nameless nobodies.) I guess you used bold and large font, must be important and right then.

the new forum software uses a rich text editor.. copy/pasting will bring the original formatting into the post.

 

[flat five]

I'm sorry but what do you mean?

As far as we know Apple states in the nMP user's guide:
"Don’t open your Mac Pro except to install memory and solid state drives (SSD), and don’t attempt to repair your Mac Pro by yourself. Your Mac Pro doesn’t have any user-serviceable parts, except for memory and SSDs."

Perhaps at first you loose your warranty ?

you don't void your warranty.. you can swap a cpu in a nmp which is under warranty and it will remain under warranty.

that said, i understand the vast majority of people believe warranty will void -- as well as if a part breaks while under warranty then they're going to have apple fix it instead of buying the part and repairing it themselves..

so for ease of discussion, i'll play along with the "you lose your warranty" bit and assume widespread user serviceability of mp1.1 won't kick in for another year or two..

and..
Yes, you can remove the screws but where will you find compatible boards - especially GPUs, SSD connector, mainboard, PSU, Fan etc, to use? they are all custom built - special Apple's designs.

PSUs, Storage drives, fans, GPUs are the most common failing parts in Computers.

so if one of those parts break, the computer is totaled and must be replaced? or the only people that can fix it are apple themselves?
i can take a mac to at least 20 places around here that isn't apple and have it fixed.. legitimately.
i can also buy parts from said places.

---
but just using the first result in a search 'buy parts for mac pro'..

http://www.dvwarehouse.com/Mac-Pro-Cases-and-Parts-c-5190.html

their listed selection will grow as the 6.1 ages.. but if you need a 2013 psu for example, buy it from them.

 

[ManuelGomes]

OK, now that I've let it out of my chest (which I usually don't even come close to) back on topic.

We must agree that, although technically possible, there really are few upgrade paths for the nMP. If you start with a lower configuration you can always upgrade to the higher end parts, be it GPU, SSD or RAM, and even CPU. That's what Apple defined and that's what we need to live with, like it or not. Still, it's upgradable. Not as much as some would want it to be, but it is. It's good enough for some, but not everyone and that's a fact.
If it's not good enough for you, other manufacturers will have a good solution for you for sure. Go for it.

I believe this thread was started for those who appreciate the nMP as a good machine for their needs, not to have someone with a visible dislike to keep saying how such a trash it is.
Those who really don't like or care for the nMP I'm sure there are other threads on other forums to highlight the good things about HP or Dell workstations.

Is it expensive? Hell, yes. Worse in Europe for sure (still better here than Romania it seems, sorry dude). So why complain all the time? Well, maybe Apple will listen but that is highly doubtful.

So, we all agree that being a workstation (no comments please) the upgrade cycle is longer than desktop. Parts at the moment are either no yet widely available or are older tech. Not the ideal scenario for an updated machine, agree.
I guess with IDF coming up we'll know more soon.

Regarding warranty, if most of the machines are being sold in Europe (which is doubtful but at least a significant part must be) the warranty here is 2 years, so every nMP is still under warranty, even without Apple Care.

 

[flat five]

OK, now that I've let it out of my chest (which I usually don't even come close to) back on topic.

We must agree that, although technically possible, there really are few upgrade paths for the nMP. If you start with a lower configuration you can always upgrade to the higher end parts, be it GPU, SSD or RAM, and even CPU. That's what Apple defined and that's what we need to live with, like it or not. Still, it's upgradable. Not as much as some would want it to be, but it is. It's good enough for some, but not everyone and that's a fact.
If it's not good enough for you, other manufacturers will have a good solution for you for sure. Go for it.

it's not really upgradeable now because there's nothing to upgrade it to.
just like when the mp1.1 came out, there was nothing to upgrade it to until further revisions were released.

right now, i can say "coool.. i upgraded a mp1.1 to a mp2.1"
i can't say "coool.. i upgraded a 6.1 to a 7.1"

there is no 7.1

 

[ManuelGomes]

Just out of curiosity, if you crack open your PC (HP or Dell workstation if you will) and change your GPU, CPU or SSD/HDD and have a problem, will the manufacturer repair it under warranty? They'll tell you that you voided your warranty when you changed the specs of your PC.

The DIY scene is nice and all, I used to be one of those as well, but when it comes to the warranty you must be aware that it's a tricky business. You can't go mixing and matching stuff and OCing and overvolting at will and think that when things go south you always have the warranty to replace whatever you broke, even out of spec.
Manufacturers aren't stupid.
Even worse if you buy an assembled machine. If you change anything that will indeed probably void the warranty, it's not supposed to be a configurable machine.
If not, consider you swap GPU in an HP PC. If it brakes, was it your fault (you assembled it wrongly - and I know everybody here knows how to put a GPU in a PCIe slot but HP will not go for it), was the GPU the culprit, or the PC in the first place? How will you prove what was to blame? Of course, all the involved parties will try to avoid the cost of repair or exchange.

The nMP, like most other computers nowadays, is not intended to be subject to modifications, although it's indeed possible.

 

[flat five]

Just out of curiosity, if you crack open your PC (HP or Dell workstation if you will) and change your GPU, CPU or SSD/HDD and have a problem, will the manufacturer repair it under warranty? They'll tell you that you voided your warranty when you changed the specs of your PC.

that's illegal for them to do so and has been that way since 1975.
http://blog.macsales.com/18244-owc-diys-wont-void-your-macs-warranty

 

[ManuelGomes]

flat, I'm with you. I understand what you're saying.
Time will tell but I believe the 6.1 will not be upgradable to the 7.1 when it comes.
I can live with that, or that the 7.1 will not be to the 8.1 if it ever comes out.
I will still buy the 7.1 when it comes out.

 

[SoyCapitanSoyCapitan]

that's illegal for them to do so and has been that way since 1975.
http://blog.macsales.com/18244-owc-diys-wont-void-your-macs-warranty

Doesn't cover CPUs. PC manufacturers allow you to upgrade everything else labelled 'user upgradable' meaning graphics, PC Cards, drives, memory.

 

[ManuelGomes]

Thanx for the link. But it states there that it doesn't cover problems with installation, and that's too vague. A manufacturer might claim that a certain part was not properly installed and how will you refute that?
If the part doesn't work properly, might they not say that it was not tested with said part?

 

[flat five]

I will still buy the 7.1 when it comes out.

heh.. me too.. maybe

currently, my software isn't ready to utilize all the vram that will be available in a 7.1 (or in a 6.1)..
so personally, i hope the 7.1 doesn't come out for a while still.. i want my software to be ready first.. seems at least another 6 months until the rewritten pure openCL renderer will be ready.

 

[ManuelGomes]

You might retain warranty if the upgrade is performed by Apple or a certified partner, but by you or someone without the proper credentials? Very much doubt so.

 

[flat five]

Thanx for the link. But it states there that it doesn't cover problems with installation, and that's too vague. A manufacturer might claim that a certain part was not properly installed and how will you refute that?
If the part doesn't work properly, might they not say that it was not tested with said part?

yeah, i get it that there's doubt.
we've discussed this quite a bit in the past but i'd rather not go searching for those links..

the reality (for me at least) is that a machine that's under warranty doesn't need upgrading anyway.. even people who like upgrading generally don't do it.. if something breaks, they'll have apple fix it since it's free.. if they want to upgrade, they do it after the computer is a few years old.. (or buy an older used model for cheap then upgrade that)

Doesn't cover CPUs. PC manufacturers allow you to upgrade everything else labelled 'user upgradable' meaning graphics, PC Cards, drives, memory.

that's not true.. you can upgrade a cpu and not void warranty.

i'll cede your point though.. because it doesn't matter.. even if it were crystal clear that upgrading a cpu in nmp wouldn't void the warranty, nobody would do it anyway.. (or if they did, they'd be severely ripping themselves off )

 

[ManuelGomes]

I'd say the 7.1 is still those 6 months away anyway.

 

[ManuelGomes]

It's really not a good idea to do it under warranty.

 

[ManuelGomes]

And why do people keep saying that cMP is a much better machine cause you can sink newer GPUs into it, but then you need to add all sorts of extra cards to get new functionality?
And still stuck on PCIe 2, with possible performance penalty? Some will say you can't notice that on GPUs (really!) but what about SSDs? And everything else you might have connected to it?
Tis page is slow, is it just me?

 

[filmak]

We must agree that, although technically possible, there really are few upgrade paths for the nMP. If you start with a lower configuration you can always upgrade to the higher end parts, be it GPU, SSD or RAM, and even CPU. That's what Apple defined and that's what we need to live with, like it or not. Still, it's upgradable. Not as much as some would want it to be, but it is. It's good enough for some, but not everyone and that's a fact.
If it's not good enough for you, other manufacturers will have a good solution for you for sure. Go for it.

I believe this thread was started for those who appreciate the nMP as a good machine for their needs, not to have someone with a visible dislike to keep saying how such a trash it is.
Those who really don't like or care for the nMP I'm sure there are other threads on other forums to highlight the good things about HP or Dell workstations.

Is it expensive? Hell, yes. Worse in Europe for sure (still better here than Romania it seems, sorry dude). So why complain all the time?

As Manuel said this iteration of Mac Pro is what it is, and as it seems, by Apple words, and the following models for the next decade will be in this form and this philosophy.

The nMP certainly has its plus and its minus points.
Right now it may have a little older hardware built in but for us the non gaming people it's still very very capable and useful.

I would like also to make clear that (imho) we all know what kind of workstation we're buying, we know its abilities, what we need to have our work done, the additional needed peripherals and of course its shortcomings / minus points.

No one, who really needs this kind of hardware (and by choice not a mac mini or even an iMac) is buying blindly, he has certainly done the proper research. The costs of these kind of projects/upgrades are not a joke.

There is no need to bash such fine equipment or use personal attacks and nasty words and characterizations.

Peace...

 

[filmak]

#1621
"It's really not a good idea to do it under warranty."


Of course and it's not a good idea.

If anything happens and you bring your nMP in for repairs, they know by the s/n the initial configuration and ...

again the Apple's words:
"Don’t open your Mac Pro except to install memory and solid state drives (SSD), and don’t attempt to repair your Mac Pro by yourself. Your Mac Pro doesn’t have any user-serviceable parts, except for memory and SSDs."

and then you really have a problem.

After warranty, or if you don't care for such things anytime, you can do any modifications you want.
Possibly only a CPU upgrade and for now D300 to D700 at best, if you can find one. (and Yes, I know about the one and only ebay seller...)

 

[SoyCapitanSoyCapitan]

As Manuel said this iteration of Mac Pro is what it is, and as it seems, by Apple words, and the following models for the next decade will be in this form and this philosophy.

The nMP certainly has its plus and its minus points.
Right now it may have a little older hardware built in but for us the non gaming people it's still very very capable and useful.

I would like also to make clear that (imho) we all know what kind of workstation we're buying, we know its abilities, what we need to have our work done, the additional needed peripherals and of course its shortcomings / minus points.

No one, who really needs this kind of hardware (and by choice not a mac mini or even an iMac) is buying blindly, he has certainly done the proper research. The costs of these kind of projects/upgrades are not a joke.

There is no need to bash such fine equipment or use personal attacks and nasty words and characterizations.

Peace...

It's not just gaming people who are disappointed. I have seen a lot of Photoshop users who have found bugs in the performance. There's something going wrong somewhere. Then there are video editors and compositors who use Red Rocket capture cards, internal RAIDs and 10 Gigabit Ethernet. They can't use a nMP and have built PCs.