Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.

When do you expect an iMac redesign?

  • 4rd quarter 2019

    Votes: 34 4.1%
  • 1st quarter 2020

    Votes: 23 2.8%
  • 2nd quarter 2020

    Votes: 119 14.5%
  • 3rd quarter 2020

    Votes: 131 15.9%
  • 4rd quarter 2020

    Votes: 172 20.9%
  • 2021 or later

    Votes: 343 41.7%

  • Total voters
    822
  • Poll closed .

spidertaker23

macrumors regular
Aug 5, 2009
152
41
Apple should just put AMD Ryzen CPU's with Radeon 5700 GPU's in the iMac and kick Intel to the curb! The "new" 10th gen Intel CPU's basically just increase core counts and re-enable hyperthreading on the i7 all at the expense of increase power consumption and more heat. Intel is going to be stuck on the 14nm process forever! Time for Apple to move on. That being said if Apple releases a redesigned iMac or Mac Mini with the new AMD RDNA2 GPUs in them I will be buying one for sure!
 

Voyageur

macrumors 6502
Mar 22, 2019
262
243
Moscow, Russia
I've been a tech geek since 15 and recently turned 51. There are at least two immutable truths in tech. Yes, Intel's (and Apple's and AMD's and everyone's) roadmaps slip all the time. And yes, the greatest tech ever with the best features ever is ALWAYS the next one just around the next corner. I promise you this will still be true even when Rocket Lake launches. The beauty of it is you're free to wait if you wish!
Yes, I heard about these rules from many smart people and I understand it myself, however, these rules have not been working for 2 generations of Intel processors in a row. If you take only the last time. Take iMacs 2017, 2019 - do they have fundamental differences besides a small stub in the form of an increase in power? No. Throttling - yes. And 2020 will not be if they come out on the 10 gen processors. And it’s one thing that there are no new technologies, it’s about real problems that Intel does not solve from year to year.
 

Moonjumper

macrumors 68030
Jun 20, 2009
2,746
2,935
Lincoln, UK
Apple should just put AMD Ryzen CPU's with Radeon 5700 GPU's in the iMac and kick Intel to the curb! The "new" 10th gen Intel CPU's basically just increase core counts and re-enable hyperthreading on the i7 all at the expense of increase power consumption and more heat. Intel is going to be stuck on the 14nm process forever! Time for Apple to move on. That being said if Apple releases a redesigned iMac or Mac Mini with the new AMD RDNA2 GPUs in them I will be buying one for sure!
The thing most likely to stop AMD adoption is an impending swap to Arm. Swapping for just a year or two before switching again seems unlikely.
 

dn325ci

macrumors regular
Mar 13, 2009
124
116
Yes, I heard about these rules from many smart people and I understand it myself, however, these rules have not been working for 2 generations of Intel processors in a row. If you take only the last time. Take iMacs 2017, 2019 - do they have fundamental differences besides a small stub in the form of an increase in power? No. Throttling - yes. And 2020 will not be if they come out on the 10 gen processors. And it’s one thing that there are no new technologies, it’s about real problems that Intel does not solve from year to year.
Agreed, and follows the rule of the next thing is always the best thing. Step back from it a little. Perspective. You're free to wait for the next thing!
 

Azrael9

macrumors 68020
Apr 4, 2020
2,287
1,835
Wow that is something I didn't know and don't see other people comment about. It sucks that this generation of processors is not worth it and we have to wait for the next one. The waiting is unbearable.

Seems to be the endless wait of waits.

Big Navi? End of year. Ryzen 4k? End of year. Intel CPUs that don't need a nuclear reactor to cool them? End of year...

iMac shipping desktop macs? End of year?

Azrael.
[automerge]1588342416[/automerge]
Apple should just put AMD Ryzen CPU's with Radeon 5700 GPU's in the iMac and kick Intel to the curb! The "new" 10th gen Intel CPU's basically just increase core counts and re-enable hyperthreading on the i7 all at the expense of increase power consumption and more heat. Intel is going to be stuck on the 14nm process forever! Time for Apple to move on. That being said if Apple releases a redesigned iMac or Mac Mini with the new AMD RDNA2 GPUs in them I will be buying one for sure!

16 core, 12 and 8 core Ryzens in an iMac 27 incher could be done now with a Radeon 5700 XT and borrow the iMac Pro's cooling and the 6k monitor's screen.

You'd have a kick Az set up.

The RDNA2. We're going to be in for a long wait. Probably shipping Dec/Jan. Apple have done naff all with desktops and it's May already. Nearly half a year gone.

Azrael.
 
Last edited:

Voyageur

macrumors 6502
Mar 22, 2019
262
243
Moscow, Russia
Agreed, and follows the rule of the next thing is always the best thing. Step back from it a little. Perspective. You're free to wait for the next thing!
Unfortunately no. I have long needed a new computer and the longer, the harder it is to wait. Perhaps I will have to buy a generation that will be released soon on these 10 processors, because otherwise the next update will be released in another year and a half. But it will be much better if they come out all the same at the end of the 20th with jump to the 11th gen, and not now.
 

sublunar

macrumors 68020
Jun 23, 2007
2,311
1,680
Seems to be the endless wait of waits.

Big Navi? End of year. Ryzen 4k? End of year. Intel CPUs that don't need a nuclear reactor to cool them? End of year...

And if you square that off with the CoinX leak implying iMacs 'soon' in the same post the mini - and we know what became of that - it still tips us towards a mild parts bump for the 21.5" and 27" models.

And I daresay that the 23" iMac coming in Q3/Q4 is likely to be *the* all new model by default whether Apple decide to use the 4k 23" LG panel in the Apple Store right now or if they have something up their sleeve and spring a 4.6k panel on an iMac Pro platform on us instead for instance.
 

Komodo Rogue

macrumors member
Apr 10, 2010
48
20
Pennsylvania
And if you square that off with the CoinX leak implying iMacs 'soon' in the same post the mini - and we know what became of that - it still tips us towards a mild parts bump for the 21.5" and 27" models.

And I daresay that the 23" iMac coming in Q3/Q4 is likely to be *the* all new model by default whether Apple decide to use the 4k 23" LG panel in the Apple Store right now or if they have something up their sleeve and spring a 4.6k panel on an iMac Pro platform on us instead for instance.

That's a reasonable guess. The rumors seem to be that the 23" is next, but if Apple is planning on launching a new 23" iMac while simultaneously planning a spec bump for the current design then I can see how those timelines could get confused.

Then again, I dunno, a spec bump in summer and a redesign in the fall? MBPs have had somewhat similar timelines but seems awfully close together for iMacs.

I don't know about those displays though. Isn't affordability the rumored focus of the new 23"? Those monitors would be half the cost of a base $1300 iMac.
 

dn325ci

macrumors regular
Mar 13, 2009
124
116
And if you square that off with the CoinX leak implying iMacs 'soon' in the same post the mini - and we know what became of that - it still tips us towards a mild parts bump for the 21.5" and 27" models.

And I daresay that the 23" iMac coming in Q3/Q4 is likely to be *the* all new model by default whether Apple decide to use the 4k 23" LG panel in the Apple Store right now or if they have something up their sleeve and spring a 4.6k panel on an iMac Pro platform on us instead for instance.

Maybe. We're all guessing, so I'll throw out an alternative theory for the same fact pattern. CoinX says minis and iMacs coming soon. Doesn't mean at the same time. Apple's change to the mini is spec bumps, so they release as a press release.

iMac is a more substantial redesign of an 8+ year old format, so get more credit for it: put out a WWDC announcement with Mac-centric clues on it and announce in June. A redesign is newsworthy enough to hold for the next available keynote, but it's possible that it also contains 10th gen Intel CPUs, so hold for that reason as well.

None of the rumors of a 23" iMac exclude a redesign of the 27" iMac. And MaxTech and others have argued (quite rightly) that it doesn't make sense to redesign the bottom end of the line and not the top end. It makes sense a chassis/screen change is also coming for the larger iMac.

None of this precludes a production held until Q3/Q4. Indeed, the prior WWDC announcement for iMac Pro was well in advance of production. If memory serves, I think that was also true of the trashcan Mac Pro.

So that's my humble take on these facts. I think it's a redesign, or they would have released it with the mini. The big question is when does the new hotness go into production?
 

762999

Cancelled
Nov 9, 2012
891
509
So that's my humble take on these facts. I think it's a redesign, or they would have released it with the mini. The big question is when does the new hotness go into production?

- leaks imply the iMac(s) is/are ready and should be a redesign
- intel cpus are out
- wwdc seems to be scheduled June 1st (leaked date)
- BTO 27" in Canada are shipping June 3rd.

knowing that the leaks are validated by more than one source, i think the release is imminent.
 
  • Like
  • Haha
Reactions: dn325ci and gusping

gusping

macrumors 68020
Mar 12, 2012
2,020
2,306
- leaks imply the iMac(s) is/are ready and should be a redesign
- intel cpus are out
- wwdc seems to be scheduled June 1st (leaked date)
- BTO 27" in Canada are shipping June 3rd.

knowing that the leaks are validated by more than one source, i think the release is imminent.
Woah... No rumour says the next iMacs WON'T have Intel CPUs. They 100% will, and will exclusively have Intel CPUs. What have you been smoking. An ARM entry level iMac is at least 12-18 months away.
 

762999

Cancelled
Nov 9, 2012
891
509
Woah... No rumour says the next iMacs WON'T have Intel CPUs. They 100% will, and will exclusively have Intel CPUs. What have you been smoking. An ARM entry level iMac is at least 12-18 months away.

you misinterpret everything, when I say they are out. I don't mean out of the imac, I say out as 'released'. Next iMac WILL have Intel cpus. Never said anything about Arm.
 

Nugget

Contributor
Nov 24, 2002
2,166
1,466
Tejas Hill Country
A few things don't really ring true for me in the collision between all the various rumors that are being discussed.

It seems really off-brand to me to imagine Apple making any sort of ARM strategy announcements at WWDC alongside the release of new, Intel-based iMacs. Especially if those iMacs are a significant redesign. Those two messages are at cross-purposes. Apple isn't going to want to navigate the mixed-messaging that would arise from "best iMac we've ever built" and "ARM is the clear and obvious future for the platform".

Similarly (and unrelated to the above), I have a tough time imagine how Apple would walk the tightrope of selling the world on ARM as a superior solution while at the same time implicitly creating a dividing line between "ARM on the low end and Intel on the high end" among the macOS product matrix. Any ARM announcements have to be paired with "Reality Distortion Field"-level cheerleading for the technical improvements of ARM. How do you accomplish that while in the same breath admitting that ARM is only for the low end of the product line?

I don't pretend to know what conclusions should be drawn, but as a whole package these rumors feel like they're missing something to me.
 

dn325ci

macrumors regular
Mar 13, 2009
124
116
A few things don't really ring true for me in the collision between all the various rumors that are being discussed.

It seems really off-brand to me to imagine Apple making any sort of ARM strategy announcements at WWDC alongside the release of new, Intel-based iMacs. Especially if those iMacs are a significant redesign. Those two messages are at cross-purposes. Apple isn't going to want to navigate the mixed-messaging that would arise from "best iMac we've ever built" and "ARM is the clear and obvious future for the platform".

Similarly (and unrelated to the above), I have a tough time imagine how Apple would walk the tightrope of selling the world on ARM as a superior solution while at the same time implicitly creating a dividing line between "ARM on the low end and Intel on the high end" among the macOS product matrix. Any ARM announcements have to be paired with "Reality Distortion Field"-level cheerleading for the technical improvements of ARM. How do you accomplish that while in the same breath admitting that ARM is only for the low end of the product line?

I don't pretend to know what conclusions should be drawn, but as a whole package these rumors feel like they're missing something to me.

I agree. I don't think ARM is coming to iMac anytime soon. Do you guys remember when the 2015 Retina MacBook model came out and it contained the "Core M" cpu's? The positioning at that time was about the convergence between MacBook and mobile platforms. I think that's directionally where this ARM discussion is going - at least in the beginning. It will start as a "convergence" of mobile/laptop type of positioning. An entry level type of product.
 

Moonjumper

macrumors 68030
Jun 20, 2009
2,746
2,935
Lincoln, UK
A few things don't really ring true for me in the collision between all the various rumors that are being discussed.

It seems really off-brand to me to imagine Apple making any sort of ARM strategy announcements at WWDC alongside the release of new, Intel-based iMacs. Especially if those iMacs are a significant redesign. Those two messages are at cross-purposes. Apple isn't going to want to navigate the mixed-messaging that would arise from "best iMac we've ever built" and "ARM is the clear and obvious future for the platform".

Similarly (and unrelated to the above), I have a tough time imagine how Apple would walk the tightrope of selling the world on ARM as a superior solution while at the same time implicitly creating a dividing line between "ARM on the low end and Intel on the high end" among the macOS product matrix. Any ARM announcements have to be paired with "Reality Distortion Field"-level cheerleading for the technical improvements of ARM. How do you accomplish that while in the same breath admitting that ARM is only for the low end of the product line?

I don't pretend to know what conclusions should be drawn, but as a whole package these rumors feel like they're missing something to me.

I see what you mean, "Here are new Intel Macs, but Intel will be replaced soon" is problematic. The messaging will have to be careful, but I think Apple can resolve the issue by discussing a long transition and even longer support.
 

sublunar

macrumors 68020
Jun 23, 2007
2,311
1,680
None of the rumors of a 23" iMac exclude a redesign of the 27" iMac. And MaxTech and others have argued (quite rightly) that it doesn't make sense to redesign the bottom end of the line and not the top end. It makes sense a chassis/screen change is also coming for the larger iMac.

None of this precludes a production held until Q3/Q4. Indeed, the prior WWDC announcement for iMac Pro was well in advance of production. If memory serves, I think that was also true of the trashcan Mac Pro.

So that's my humble take on these facts. I think it's a redesign, or they would have released it with the mini. The big question is when does the new hotness go into production?

If it's a full redesign of the iMac line then they surely want to wait for all models to be refreshed at the same time as the 23" iMac unless Apple have decided that sales need a boost so they wanted to do a spec bump rather than a price cut. If the sales of the Mac mini were not going to affect the bottom line in their excellent Q2 results call then they'd have been happy to put it out prior to April 30. But they might have decided very late in the day to put the figures from a spec bumped iMac into Q3 - hence the delay.

If Apple thinks people will be buying Macs (and iPads) in Q3 to cope with working (and learning) from home then they can help drive sales with at least a soft refresh to make their products decent value (see the mini) when news of WWDC starts hitting tech websites in June - "by the way, Apple recently refreshed the iMac (and mini)...".

The difference between the trashcan 2013 Mac Pro, the 2019 Mac Pro, and the iMac Pro was that Apple had no viable product in that price range at time of announcement.

Apple would never pre-announce a refresh of an existing product line in the price range of other existing similar products and then wait 6 months - it's a recipe for commercial suicide.


- leaks imply the iMac(s) is/are ready and should be a redesign
- intel cpus are out
- wwdc seems to be scheduled June 1st (leaked date)
- BTO 27" in Canada are shipping June 3rd.

knowing that the leaks are validated by more than one source, i think the release is imminent.

I just tried a BTO 27 in the UK and shipping is similarly in early June (1-4) - even for models with just a 16Gb RAM BTO. Stock models are May 4. Something may be afoot. This doesn't mean that Apple will launch something at WWDC, they might release in the last 2 weeks of May if they don't deem it important enough to interrupt a software developers conference for lightly retouched hardware.

When you say Intel CPUs are out it's more correct to say they are launched. That's how Intel's site describes it. Apple don't aways use the latest and greatest Intel stuff immediately out the gate anyway - they have their own schedules.

Bear in mind that Coffee Lake CPUs were starting to get replaced by Coffee Lake Refresh CPUs when the Mac mini was launched. I couldn't honestly say at the time why the mini got updated in October 2018 and the iMac didn't. And by the time the iMac was out in March 2019 the 9th generation CPUs were already starting to appear in the wild - just not used by Apple.

And also think again about why the Mac mini only got a storage bump. Surely it can't get replaced as soon as October (the same year) with a Comet Lake model?

Apple could still subsidise a spec bump in the iMacs to boost sales - inserting more RAM would be an obvious across the board thing they could do for instance.

Comet Lake S feels like something for Q3/Q4 this year once Intel get volume production up - that's based on a likely Apple release schedule - there is nothing preventing a late June release for an iMac.

It might line up with volume production of suitable Comet Lake S and a 23" iMac if they are refreshing the whole line. I can't see why a 23" iMac would get released months later if its pricing were falling between the 21.5" and 27" models.

It will be too soon for AMD RDNA2 CPUs (Q4), and for the successor to macOS Catalina (likely October) though.

A few things don't really ring true for me in the collision between all the various rumors that are being discussed.

It seems really off-brand to me to imagine Apple making any sort of ARM strategy announcements at WWDC alongside the release of new, Intel-based iMacs. Especially if those iMacs are a significant redesign. Those two messages are at cross-purposes. Apple isn't going to want to navigate the mixed-messaging that would arise from "best iMac we've ever built" and "ARM is the clear and obvious future for the platform".

Similarly (and unrelated to the above), I have a tough time imagine how Apple would walk the tightrope of selling the world on ARM as a superior solution while at the same time implicitly creating a dividing line between "ARM on the low end and Intel on the high end" among the macOS product matrix. Any ARM announcements have to be paired with "Reality Distortion Field"-level cheerleading for the technical improvements of ARM. How do you accomplish that while in the same breath admitting that ARM is only for the low end of the product line?

I don't pretend to know what conclusions should be drawn, but as a whole package these rumors feel like they're missing something to me.

They don't have to announce what's going on from an iMac point of view. Look at the iPad Pro - The 2020 model gets a LIDAR sensor with no obvious application months ahead of an expected iPhone release. This is so they can discuss developing for LIDAR sensors without blowing the cover off the heavily expected LIDAR array on iPhone 12 Pro models.

Similarly, I don't even think they'll be talking about macOS for ARM at WWDC 2020. The right time to announce a seismic ARM Mac would be at a WWDC - so people could discuss it and coding for it. But the right Mac for that would be an 'iBook' - an ARM MacBook with 5w A14x CPU in WWDC June 2021 for example. And they still wouldn't need to discuss how that fits into an iMac.

I'd expect this product to be launched with App Store only (Gatekeeper controlled). And the focus on development would be for that device with a select few developers trusted to make sure they have working ports of their popular software.

Once the idea of developing for macOS for an 'iBook' is out in the wild it's only baby steps to consider coding apps for heavier duty Macs once Apple have figured how how ARM cpus should scale at higher TDPs. Higher clock single core speeds or throw more cores at it? Leave more room for Imagination Technologies Ray Tracing GPU on chip or design something that would use AMD GPU?

Apple don't even have to discuss what happens to the intel Macs and nobody said that ARM would only be for 'low end' of the product line. For certain workflows (video exporting) ARM could really kill Intel and the low power cores could really help with the portability side of things.

ARM at the moment really lends itself to portable devices hence why the iPad is rightly becoming more interesting. If we're seeing a 12" iBook why not then see a 15" iBook for example? It's not a stretch to see a future product with a 15w TDP or even 28w TDP stretch itself in a larger portable case.

So there's no reason at all why a redesigned Intel iMac wouldn't last an entire product cycle - 4 refreshes - before we see what a 65w ARM iteration can do. Especially one with an AMD RDNA3 GPU hanging off it in the future.
 
  • Like
Reactions: AlexGraphicD

CWallace

macrumors G5
Aug 17, 2007
12,526
11,543
Seattle, WA
It seems really off-brand to me to imagine Apple making any sort of ARM strategy announcements at WWDC alongside the release of new, Intel-based iMacs. Especially if those iMacs are a significant redesign. Those two messages are at cross-purposes. Apple isn't going to want to navigate the mixed-messaging that would arise from "best iMac we've ever built" and "ARM is the clear and obvious future for the platform".

Assuming the first ARM-powered Mac is similar (if not identical) to the 12" MacBook Retina, IMO Apple can pretty easily position it within the overall Mac lineup.

"The new MacBook ARM is designed for general use computing like web browsing, content consumption and light productivity with Pages, Numbers and Keynote in the lightest package with multi-day battery life."

They then announce the new iMac and iMac Pro "designed for our customers who do content creation, software development and other tasks where the power of the new 10th Generation Intel processor can be fully utilized."
 

sublunar

macrumors 68020
Jun 23, 2007
2,311
1,680
Assuming the first ARM-powered Mac is similar (if not identical) to the 12" MacBook Retina, IMO Apple can pretty easily position it within the overall Mac lineup.

"The new MacBook ARM is designed for general use computing like web browsing, content consumption and light productivity with Pages, Numbers and Keynote in the lightest package with multi-day battery life."

They then announce the new iMac and iMac Pro "designed for our customers who do content creation, software development and other tasks where the power of the new 10th Generation Intel processor can be fully utilized."

Sounds like a plan. I would imagine iWork apps to be available from launch. Would be great if Microsoft 365 (the renamed Office 365) were available too. And no doubt some of Apple's trusted developers may get tapped up for apps to be highlighted at the relevant keynote.

I'm not really sure of a 2020 launch though. It makes more sense for an A14X based ARM CPU, inevitable that it'll get called something like M1 or something, in June of 2021. And we could see refreshes of the M series CPUs every 2 years or so as a pattern seems to be emerging with the A series CPUs getting an X variant every other year.
 

dn325ci

macrumors regular
Mar 13, 2009
124
116
If it's a full redesign of the iMac line then they surely want to wait for all models to be refreshed at the same time as the 23" iMac unless Apple have decided that sales need a boost so they wanted to do a spec bump rather than a price cut. If the sales of the Mac mini were not going to affect the bottom line in their excellent Q2 results call then they'd have been happy to put it out prior to April 30. But they might have decided very late in the day to put the figures from a spec bumped iMac into Q3 - hence the delay.

If Apple thinks people will be buying Macs (and iPads) in Q3 to cope with working (and learning) from home then they can help drive sales with at least a soft refresh to make their products decent value (see the mini) when news of WWDC starts hitting tech websites in June - "by the way, Apple recently refreshed the iMac (and mini)...".

The difference between the trashcan 2013 Mac Pro, the 2019 Mac Pro, and the iMac Pro was that Apple had no viable product in that price range at time of announcement.

Apple would never pre-announce a refresh of an existing product line in the price range of other existing similar products and then wait 6 months - it's a recipe for commercial suicide.
I don't think Apple necessarily has to start production of the small & large iMacs at the same time - they've broken apart iPhone, iPad and MacBook production timing before. But, sure, that would be nice to do it together.

And I don't think you're correct on the announcements - I'm pretty sure the trashcan Mac Pro was still for sale when the current gen Mac Pro was announced. But I take your point anyway that a long delay in production after a refresh announcement is bad for sales in the meantime. I guess we'll see! My personal view of the facts is there is a redesign in the near future, which is exciting. But I could be wrong.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Voyageur

_Skyfire_

Suspended
Aug 16, 2017
101
55
Assuming the first ARM-powered Mac is similar (if not identical) to the 12" MacBook Retina, IMO Apple can pretty easily position it within the overall Mac lineup.

"The new MacBook ARM is designed for general use computing like web browsing, content consumption and light productivity with Pages, Numbers and Keynote in the lightest package with multi-day battery life."

They then announce the new iMac and iMac Pro "designed for our customers who do content creation, software development and other tasks where the power of the new 10th Generation Intel processor can be fully utilized."
Yep this is why I'm hoping for a switch to Ryzen. ARM iMacs are quite far off still
 

Patchwork

macrumors 6502
Jan 6, 2008
345
504
Near Preston, UK
What if the 23 inch iMac is designed to replace both the 21 inch and 27 inch models, as this would then give a clear gap between the top of the range iMac and the bottom of the range iMac Pro? My thought behind this is that there‘s been rumours about a 23 inch iMac and about the iMac Pro going mini led, but nothing of any real detail about the existing models. if that’s the case it might just be a small spec bump for the iMac like the mini’s just had and then a full refresh later in the year, probably in Q4.
 
  • Like
Reactions: AlexGraphicD
Register on MacRumors! This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.