Will there ever be a new large iMac (Pro)?

[Homy]

Now that Intel has added i9-10850K to its list, we have seen leaked benchmarks and Jon Prosser says Aug I bet on next Tuseday 4th Aug. That's also the date online stores here in Sweden state as next delivery date for current iMacs. It's also the week after antitrust hearings this Wednesday. A good way to start the week after.

 

[Freida]

Nah, October with RDNA2 ;-)

 

[CWallace]

but 10900K can be configured to 95W also so what is really the benefit of this bastard child?

Cheaper price to the customer and better overall returns for Intel.

Every i9 Intel makes is designed to be a 10900K, however various defects cause the chip to not support the highest clock speed or some of the cache is bad, etc. So Intel sells these "rejects" at slower speeds for a lower price rather than bin them.

 

[pldelisle]

Exact. It's re-binning the CPUs that doesn't reach the 10900K specs.

 

[Azrael9]

Mandatory watching for where this ARM and AS transition is going.

Azrael.
[automerge]1595874351[/automerge]

I have 2017 MBP 15" and that crap is noisy as hell too. I hate mobile computers - so many compromises. If Mac Pro wasn't so expensive for the base model I would get that but no way I'm giving them so much money for so little fanfare.

XDR the same

I like that. 'So much money for so little fanfare.' Nice turn of phrase. And so apt.

That's entry price Mac Pro is a £1250 computer masquerading as something else. If Apple charged £2k for it...it would still be expense for so poor a spec. It's artificially planted at the top of the tree. Just stick a different mother board in it...with an i9 chip and sell it for a god reasonsable £1750. (ie. Minus a 5k screen. And let the bladdy customer decide.)

I never rated laptops. They've got better for people that 'need on the go.'

But I never liked the keyboard attached to the screen. I didn't find that particularly ergonomic. I don't like the 'finger claw rsi' trackpad...or the tiny screens.

I tried doing some Flash, PS work on an iBook 13 inch back in the day. Slow going. Cramped. Fans blowing. (Bit noisy...) and never did get on with the track pad. It all felt very rickety and fragile.

Azrael.
[automerge]1595874543[/automerge]

Nah, October with RDNA2 ;-)

The RDNA2 (as anyone can see with the Tom's Hardware link...) is going to be a beastly performer.

Great 50% efficiency. Ray tracing. Prices. $999. $599 (something like that.) For top and mid-performers.

It will bury the 'last year' 5700XT.

As for that being in an iMac. There is hope it will be in an iMac. PErhaps the iMac Pro if that 'is' turning up at the end of the year?

If iMac comes mid-August. No chance.

If iMac Pro comes in the fall? Likely.

That way both iMacs live on for another year and Apple can get £££ from Intel Mac buyers.

Ideally, I'd like to see Apple offer the consumer iMac with an RDNA2 BTO. That would be killer.

But iMac history is against my wishes.

Azrael.

 

[Azrael9]

Looking at the prices I can't help but think that AS will (or should) introduce some significant savings. Its almost $500 per chip (sure Apple gets them cheaper but for illustration) + GPU that will probably cost around the same (or more).

So for illustration lets just take it that $1000 is for these 2.
Now, iPhone SE is $400 and has the A13. There has to be some saving on the AS computers. iPhone will drive the development etc. so the cost of R&D will be funded fine and that should provide us with cheaper chips that will give us tons of benefits. 1 chip inhouse vs 2 chips from other vendors.

Sure, Apple can be fusion fusers and pocket the difference but do they really need to? Cutting the prices and making the computers more affordable will in return bring in more customers so Apple wins and customers win. Is that really unreasonable to expect?

If new playstation etc. can bring a console that is massively fast for basically peanuts then Apple should be able to do better with their own solution.

iMac Pro should be much cheaper
Mac Pro should be better specs or much cheaper
iMac should be at least $200 and BTO upgrades better priced (that will probably be thing of a past with AS - for GPUs)
notebooks? Who cares - they all suck

XDR - bring back consumer style display like the 30" ACD used to be. That thing was just stunning piece of hardware

Dream - Mac Mini with Mini XDR = less than $3.5k

here is the thing - until now Apple used Intel as an excuse and they said that they have crippled their innovation. Now, no more excuses and now Apple - shows us what you've got. Its your turn to prove it.

Apple. No more excuses.

Azrael.
[automerge]1595875085[/automerge]

considering how noisy my 2019 i9 is I would never buy another one in the same chassis and cooling setup. I have been very disappointed in this iMac, it is the loudest I have owned and rivals if not exceeds the GRII Asus on my desk which I thought would take off at times

Noisy. Ouch.

What kind of work are you doing on it?

Azrael.
[automerge]1595875161[/automerge]

In that case this new iMac better be $35 cheaper!

yeah. I have this thing...about Apple underclocking kit...and charging full whack for it.

Price trim, please.

Azrael.
[automerge]1595875299[/automerge]

I think consumer computer (iMac 24, MBP13, Air) will see a price cut to increase sales. Volume sales will benefit services so profit will go up totally because of that. High-end lower volume AS will probably cost an ARM and a LEG though but not more than Intel/AMD.

This makes sense.

If I was Apple (...no jokes, please, folks...) I'd want to get an installed base of AS Macs as soon as possible.

So I'd dish out a dramatic cut of prices.

eg?

£499 Mac Mini.
£999. iMac24.
£750 MB Air.

Larger iMac. £1500.

Those are the entry prices. BTO upsell still applies as do T1/2/3 models.

Azrael.

 

[Freida]

I agree with this guy and also feel that AS is the end of Intel (and AMD for that matter).

Sooner or later the whole tech industry will move over to ARM as that is where the future is (for now). x86 is dead and those that adapt will benefit - those that live in last century will die and Intel is on its way out. I was almost tempted to short Intel when AS was announced but wasn't free on funds. Now, I would probably make nice profit if I have.

Anyway, AS (& ARM) is what will drive the future and I'm super happy that I can say that I was there when it all started. In 3-5 years we will be shaking our heads and think why Apple didn't switch before. Its going to be same like when UK banned smoking inside and now its unimaginable that you would have your lunch and some ducker next to you would be smoking. What a bloody disgusting thing.

So yeah, this will be the same. Bloody disgusting Intel - Bye bye!

Mandatory watching for where this ARM and AS transition is going.

Azrael.
[automerge]1595874351[/automerge]


I like that. 'So much money for so little fanfare.' Nice turn of phrase. And so apt.

That's entry price Mac Pro is a £1250 computer masquerading as something else. If Apple charged £2k for it...it would still be expense for so poor a spec. It's artificially planted at the top of the tree. Just stick a different mother board in it...with an i9 chip and sell it for a god reasonsable £1750. (ie. Minus a 5k screen. And let the bladdy customer decide.)

I never rated laptops. They've got better for people that 'need on the go.'

But I never liked the keyboard attached to the screen. I didn't find that particularly ergonomic. I don't like the 'finger claw rsi' trackpad...or the tiny screens.

I tried doing some Flash, PS work on an iBook 13 inch back in the day. Slow going. Cramped. Fans blowing. (Bit noisy...) and never did get on with the track pad. It all felt very rickety and fragile.

Azrael.
[automerge]1595874543[/automerge]


The RDNA2 (as anyone can see with the Tom's Hardware link...) is going to be a beastly performer.

Great 50% efficiency. Ray tracing. Prices. $999. $599 (something like that.) For top and mid-performers.

It will bury the 'last year' 5700XT.

As for that being in an iMac. There is hope it will be in an iMac. PErhaps the iMac Pro if that 'is' turning up at the end of the year?

If iMac comes mid-August. No chance.

If iMac Pro comes in the fall? Likely.

That way both iMacs live on for another year and Apple can get £££ from Intel Mac buyers.

Ideally, I'd like to see Apple offer the consumer iMac with an RDNA2 BTO. That would be killer.

But iMac history is against my wishes.

Azrael.

 

[Homy]

Mandatory watching for where this ARM and AS transition is going.

Azrael.

 

[ssong]

I agree with this guy and also feel that AS is the end of Intel (and AMD for that matter).

Sooner or later the whole tech industry will move over to ARM as that is where the future is (for now). x86 is dead and those that adapt will benefit - those that live in last century will die and Intel is on its way out. I was almost tempted to short Intel when AS was announced but wasn't free on funds. Now, I would probably make nice profit if I have.

Anyway, AS (& ARM) is what will drive the future and I'm super happy that I can say that I was there when it all started. In 3-5 years we will be shaking our heads and think why Apple didn't switch before. Its going to be same like when UK banned smoking inside and now its unimaginable that you would have your lunch and some ducker next to you would be smoking. What a bloody disgusting thing.

So yeah, this will be the same. Bloody disgusting Intel - Bye bye!

If intel’s earnings call was any indication they got far bigger issues than losing their hegemony in the chip market. For intel to actively consider using a third party foundry is insane and extremely good news for TSMC and possibly Samsung who may now have extra business.

 

[fireguy286]

I agree with this guy and also feel that AS is the end of Intel (and AMD for that matter).

Maybe the beginning of the end of x86, but it will be a slow slog - not sure I buy the death of Intel bit.

Intel still has a license for ARM. They always say they don't intend to use it, but we shall see if they reconsider...

 

[pldelisle]

Maybe the beginning of the end of x86, but it will be a slow slog - not sure I buy the death of Intel bit.

Intel still has a license for ARM. They always say they don't intend to use it, but we shall see if they reconsider...

If they want to survive, they will need too. If Intel shift completely to ARM, this could lead to a ton of innovation and push everything very far. But changing the ship's direction of such a big corporation is near inconceivable. Apple did it several times ago and has the enterprise culture and structure to do it. Intel does the exact same things since the late 70s, just like AMD is doing since its inception.

 

[Nicole1980]

Just a thought but maybe some of you are right on the August release. The very first iMac was announced in 8/15 and two other launches. Legit just clinging on to hope lol

I hope so. That would mean we'd have the option of keeping it at Catalina or going for Big Sur down the road. If they wait til after the release of Big Sur to release the iMac, then we'd be stuck with Big Sur whether we like it not.

Note, I'm not saying Big Sur is bad, but having a choice of more os versions to install would be nice.

 

[Azrael9]

I'm looking forward to Big Sur.

Azrael.

 

[Freida]

You are talking about Catalina as a good choice? Nah, I haven't even updated to it. Its Vista for Mac.
In fact, I want only Big Sur - better overall

(also, it would mean redesign so yeah, I want Big Sur only)

I hope so. That would mean we'd have the option of keeping it at Catalina or going for Big Sur down the road. If they wait til after the release of Big Sur to release the iMac, then we'd be stuck with Big Sur whether we like it not.

Note, I'm not saying Big Sur is bad, but having a choice of more os versions to install would be nice.

 

[gusping]

You are talking about Catalina as a good choice? Nah, I haven't even updated to it. Its Vista for Mac.
In fact, I want only Big Sur - better overall

(also, it would mean redesign so yeah, I want Big Sur only)

Wise, Freida. Very wise. It is worse than Vista

 

[pldelisle]

Wise, Freida. Very wise. It is worse than Vista

Even .6 is broken. Seriously. Wtf Apple. Hope it will pay in Big Sur.... hope all these errors and mistakes will make Big Sur more stable.

 

[gusping]

Even .6 is broken. Seriously. Wtf Apple. Hope it will pay in Big Sur.... hope all these errors and mistakes will make Big Sur more stable.

It is incredible. I've heard v bad things for the mini on .6, so haven't touched it yet. I need to try Windows 10 in bootcamp so I can see how bad it is for myself. Not properly used Windows for years.

What I find worry is that very little changes in Mac OS versions. So... how can everything go to ****? Perhaps lots is changing behind the scenes which is causing all the issues? It is mind-boggling how poor Apple software has been recently, but particularly Mac OS.

 

[xiaocong500]

anyone owns a Surface PRO X here.
I think that machine is one of the most powerful ARM based PC in the market now.

 

[The_Lord_of_Apple]

You are talking about Catalina as a good choice? Nah, I haven't even updated to it. Its Vista for Mac.
In fact, I want only Big Sur - better overall

I took a punt early this year to migrate to Catalina and I only lasted one week and back to Mojave. This is something I had alluded to in one of my previous posts that Apple's OS releases are going downhill.

I am sceptical at best with Big Sur but happy to be proven wrong come October.

With regards to dates, if I am going to wait till 19th/24th August, I wait as well wait till October 27th(??). Been waiting since March. In hindsight, I should have got the iMac Pro mid-last year when I had the perfect opportunity to do so.

 

[DQ11]

Its performance is still fine and that what matters. A 10-core xeon (1100/9500 geek bench )and 10900 10C (1400/11000) only differes 20-30% 20-30%. We will not get a 10900k that is not throttling so the performance difference will be (much) smaller.

I would rather take a good cooling and slightly lower perfomance than an "new" comet lake chip i iMac case/cooling.

Performance will be different depending on what it's used for. Those two extra cores should help in Logic Pro....but yea the throttling does limit it's full abilities.

 

[smoledman]

I don't have much faith we'll get more than a spec bump.

 

[iPadified]

Performance will be different depending on what it's used for. Those two extra cores should help in Logic Pro....but yea the throttling does limit it's full abilities.

If you need more cores, configure it with 18-cores chip (half the performance of the 2020 28 core chip) that will outpace the 10900k. The only concern with buying a 2017 machine is that Apple likely drops support in 5 years. Performance it still very competitive in iMac Pro. It is too pricy though for the average customer.

 

[DQ11]

If you need more cores, configure it with 18-cores chip (half the performance of the 2020 28 core chip) that will outpace the 10900k. The only concern with buying a 2017 machine is that Apple likely drops support in 5 years. Performance it still very competitive in iMac Pro. It is too pricy though for the average customer.

I don't need more cores, I'm ok with the current 2019 i9 model, but I'm still not sure how much better the 10 core will be.

 

[iPadified]

I don't need more cores, I'm ok with the current 2019 i9 model, but I'm still not sure how much better the 10 core will be.

With Intels messy turbo boost architecture that is optimised for getting high Geekbench scores, it is difficult to say. Multithread will be up to 25 % better than current i9 due to the extra cores while single thread can be improved up to 15% better. In real life though I guess max 10% improvements as turbo boost cannot be used all the time.

 

[iDan75]

Serious question. Are current iMacs really as bad as this forum makes out? Overheating seems to be a huge problem. Is it only power users that have the issue or do they run hot all the time?

And Catalina... everyone seems to hate it, but I’ve not encountered any issues. What does everyone hate about it?