Will you leave the Apple ecosystem because of CSAM?

[MBAir2010]

i recently left the apple eco system
for almost 2 months all my apple things were rotting in a container
i even gifted a new TV and trashed the iphone and touch that fought themselves.
deleted my  accounts and swore off this site
THEN
a project came up were heavy photo editing and slide shows HTML5 something
were need for a firm i worked for since 2007 on and off
the PC laptop system (dell ups and affinity) ruled, but not as fluid and sharp as photoshop
So
the macbook air 2010 was plugged in and money was earned.

maybe a break from  is needed once in a while.

the banter over apple is overwhelming and the eco system and their repair tactics are ruthless
i think we should ignore that static and take our  products for tools and productitity.

 

[Mercury7]

If by „spyware“ you are referring to the CSAM scanning software, no, it’s not part of iOS 15.

And you know that because?

 

[eltoslightfoot]

If by „spyware“ you are referring to the CSAM scanning software, no, it’s not part of iOS 15.

Where is the evidence of this absolutely not being in there? Like even the code?

 

[leman]

And you know that because?

Because they said they are not shipping it. It would be utterly idiotic of them to lie.

 

[leman]

Where is the evidence of this absolutely not being in there? Like even the code?

What is the evidence of it being there?

 

[Mercury7]

What is the evidence of it being there

Where is the evidence of this absolutely not being in there? Like even the code?

thats Kinda my point… would be nice to have a trusted source to scan the code for nefarious stuff…. This is what happens when you lose trust, gotta verify for now on…. It kinda sucks

 

[dk001]

What is the evidence of it being there?

Pieces of it existed in the 14.x series.
Have not seen anything on 15.0

To @Mercury7 point, it would be nice to see if it exists and not on or it was not included.
Transparency. It's a cool thing.

 

[crymimefireworks]

Hoping Apple leaves it gone.

The reason I left is because privacy intrusion is inevitable for Apple at this point.

Maybe it will be about terrorism, or pornography, or financial protection.

Whatever they call it doesn't matter. Apple has declared war on our privacy:

The All-Seeing "i": Apple Just Declared War on Your Privacy

“Under His Eye,” she says. The right farewell. “Under His Eye,” I reply, and she gives a little nod.

edwardsnowden.substack.com

 

[GBaughma]

It's only a theory until it's later a fact. It's been done before. How many other forms of censorship began with the phrase 'Will somebody please think of the children?!'

Well, I know the "Think of the Children" has been used to slowly eliminate and outlaw vaping, even though it's 95%+ safer than smoking a cigarette.
The FDA has not yet approved a SINGLE flavor. They have no intention to.

 

[twdawson]

It would not surprise me if the code was in there and they are just waiting for all of this outcry to calm down and then they will simply flick the switch.

I only have one Apple device left and that's not signed in to an Apple ID.

 

[crymimefireworks]

What is the evidence of it being there?

Just to clarify, NeuralHash code was already included in iOS 14.3 but inactive. That's the source of these articles, which Apple responded to:

Outdated Apple CSAM detection algorithm harvested from iOS 14.3 [u] | AppleInsider

A user on Reddit says they have discovered a version of Apple's NeuralHash algorithm used in CSAM detection in iOS 14.3, and Apple says that the version that was extracted is not current, and won't be used.

appleinsider.com

 

[Romain_H]

Well, I know the "Think of the Children" has been used to slowly eliminate and outlaw vaping, even though it's 95%+ safer than smoking a cigarette.

Well, that is what doctors very much dispute. I don‘t think that is really true

 

[eltoslightfoot]

Just to clarify, NeuralHash code was already included in iOS 14.3 but inactive. That's the source of these articles, which Apple responded to:

Outdated Apple CSAM detection algorithm harvested from iOS 14.3 [u] | AppleInsider

A user on Reddit says they have discovered a version of Apple's NeuralHash algorithm used in CSAM detection in iOS 14.3, and Apple says that the version that was extracted is not current, and won't be used.

appleinsider.com

Exactly, they would have to actively remove it from iOS15, and my bet is that they haven't done that. They are just waiting for something else to distract everyone and then turn it on. This is the way to get everyone to download iOS15 and Mac Whatever-California-Place (not sure 'cause I sold my mac)...

 

[dk001]

Exactly, they would have to actively remove it from iOS15, and my bet is that they haven't done that. They are just waiting for something else to distract everyone and then turn it on. This is the way to get everyone to download iOS15 and Mac Whatever-California-Place (not sure 'cause I sold my mac)...

The backlash will be bad if they do.

 

[Ethosik]

The reason I left is because privacy intrusion is inevitable for Apple at this point.

Maybe it will be about terrorism, or pornography, or financial protection.

Whatever they call it doesn't matter. Apple has declared war on our privacy:

The All-Seeing "i": Apple Just Declared War on Your Privacy

“Under His Eye,” she says. The right farewell. “Under His Eye,” I reply, and she gives a little nod.

edwardsnowden.substack.com

You do realize this is pushed by government, NCMEC and other agencies right? It might eventually come to everything including linux. If the US goes the way of China, nothing is really safe unless you implement your own linux distro for yourself and can not distribute it.

 

[AltecX]

i recently left the apple eco system
for almost 2 months all my apple things were rotting in a container
i even gifted a new TV and trashed the iphone and touch that fought themselves.
deleted my  accounts and swore off this site
THEN
a project came up were heavy photo editing and slide shows HTML5 something
were need for a firm i worked for since 2007 on and off
the PC laptop system (dell ups and affinity) ruled, but not as fluid and sharp as photoshop
So
the macbook air 2010 was plugged in and money was earned.

maybe a break from  is needed once in a while.

the banter over apple is overwhelming and the eco system and their repair tactics are ruthless
i think we should ignore that static and take our  products for tools and productitity.

Just get Photoshop for PC. Problem solved. The fact you had to cave because you didn't want to spend like $15/mo seems like a sad excuse to me. None of your story 'required' you to go back to Apple. You just wanted to.

 

[AltecX]

You do realize this is pushed by government, NCMEC and other agencies right? It might eventually come to everything including linux. If the US goes the way of China, nothing is really safe unless you implement your own linux distro for yourself and can not distribute it.

It's more like China is just openly doing what the US pretends it's not trying to accomplish behind closed doors. Only the US usually hides behinds things of "patriotism" and "National Security" when they try to argue it knowing most people are too stupid to even understand the topic in general let alone see through the BS. Let's not pretend they are not BOTH plotting the same things just from different angles.

 

[Ethosik]

It's more like China is just openly doing what the US pretends it's not trying to accomplish behind closed doors. Only the US usually hides behinds things of "patriotism" and "National Security" when they try to argue it knowing most people are too stupid to even understand the topic in general let alone see through the BS. Let's not pretend they are not BOTH plotting the same things just from different angles.

I don't think you understand what I was saying. I quoted someone saying they left Apple because of surveillance, but at some point, if the government pushes for it, no matter where you go it doesn't matter. Windows, Mac, Linux, iPhone, Android whatever. If the government really wants to track everything we do, nothing will stop us. Not even Apple fighting for it because they would just not be able to do business in the US.

I am not saying US is doing the same thing as China.

 

[MBAir2010]

Just get Photoshop for PC. Problem solved. The fact you had to cave because you didn't want to spend like $15/mo seems like a sad excuse to me. None of your story 'required' you to go back to Apple. You just wanted to.

the point of the post was not to be bothered by static and perhaps a break can do some good.

and why pay adobe a month fee when we own that software already?

 

[Ethosik]

Just get Photoshop for PC. Problem solved. The fact you had to cave because you didn't want to spend like $15/mo seems like a sad excuse to me. None of your story 'required' you to go back to Apple. You just wanted to.

I know you are discussing Photoshop here and personally I do find Photoshop "easier" than Affinity since I have used it for 15+ more years.

There appears to be a problem with After Effects and Premiere Pro on Windows with a AMD 5700XT GPU. There are several posts about this on the Adobe forum discussing it. Whether its a problem with AMD or Adobe, I do not know. But my iMac with a 5700XT does not have issues with these programs.

Not to say the flipside can't occur, but I have had way more random issues on Windows than mac - not just including this 5700XT issue. And it really is enough to want me to get a NVIDIA card, but I CANT and that is the problem right now. So I am essentially forced to use my Mac for some of this stuff when I would prefer to use my other system that has more hardware in it from CPU to storage.

 

[mrex]

Not csam but now apple start to diagnose people too…

that is just too much! ios 14.8 and this is the last ios on my devices.

 

[eltoslightfoot]

You do realize this is pushed by government, NCMEC and other agencies right? It might eventually come to everything including linux. If the US goes the way of China, nothing is really safe unless you implement your own linux distro for yourself and can not distribute it.

Do you have some sort of proof this is motivated by anything other an Apple thinking they found a cute way to get around cloud scanning by doing something worse?

I believe that all the tech companies have implemented something cloud-based. What we don't know is if the government requested/demanded that. I don't see anything saying they did. I think this was a "for the children" thing in the cloud. Then I think Apple decided all on their own to come up with a "cool Apple solution" that was anything but.

I do not think the government is demanding on-device scanning of anyone. If you have something, I would love to see it.

 

[Ethosik]

Do you have some sort of proof this is motivated by anything other an Apple thinking they found a cute way to get around cloud scanning by doing something worse?

I believe that all the tech companies have implemented something cloud-based. What we don't know is if the government requested/demanded that. I don't see anything saying they did. I think this was a "for the children" thing in the cloud. Then I think Apple decided all on their own to come up with a "cool Apple solution" that was anything but.

I do not think the government is demanding on-device scanning of anyone. If you have something, I would love to see it.

I believe as a hosting provider for files, Apple is legally required to scan for this sort of thing. Which is why Dropbox, OneDrive, Google Drive and others do the same. So Apple needs to do something, whether its on-device or somewhere else its up to them. But they need to do SOMETHING. Apple chose this option because, honestly, it really is the most privacy-focused approach. Alternative would be to not encrypt data or have a backdoor for the encrypted files on their servers in order for the scans to run.

 

[eltoslightfoot]

I believe as a hosting provider for files, Apple is legally required to scan for this sort of thing. Which is why Dropbox, OneDrive, Google Drive and others do the same. So Apple needs to do something, whether its on-device or somewhere else its up to them. But they need to do SOMETHING. Apple chose this option because, honestly, it really is the most privacy-focused approach. Alternative would be to not encrypt data on their servers in order for the scans to run.

They are not. They are required to report it, but are not required to find it. Even in the cloud. All the cloud providers in question are choosing to look for it as an altruistic gesture it seems. Again, unless you have something that says different. They need do nothing.

Plus, they do not encrypt our data in iCloud in any meaningful way now, so that is a moot point. Plus, they have given that data up many times when requested by the government with a warrant. So there isn't a technical reason to scan the device except that I think they thought it was a cool way to do it?

 

[MBAir2010]

Not csam but now apple start to diagnose people too…

that is just too much! ios 14.8 and this is the last ios on my devices.

I'm stopping too
i was think how nice safari 15 would be on my MacBook air and ipad
but safari 15 won't work on the MacBook air, so why do i need iOS15?