Windows 11

[maflynn]

This is an interesting test. Though folks were pointing out that all AMD hardware would have seen a bigger performance improvement.

Dave2D did a YT, comparing Lenovo's Legion Go handheld, there's two flavors, one that runs windows, and the other steamos. Identical hardware, two different operating systems. The steamOs version largely beat out the windows version, and that's really sad. An emulator beating out natively executing games because of the bloat that is built into windows.

 

[diamond.g]

Dave2D did a YT, comparing Lenovo's Legion Go handheld, there's two flavors, one that runs windows, and the other steamos. Identical hardware, two different operating systems. The steamOs version largely beat out the windows version, and that's really sad. An emulator beating out natively executing games because of the bloat that is built into windows.

yeah, I saw that video (and everyone who did a copy of it basically). I think MS understands that Windows 11 as is isn't good for compute/performance limited devices (aka handhelds). Sadly I am fairly certain that MS is going to use a more generic version of Windows for the next xbox because folks want to be able to install steam games on it (and the pricing will be higher to accommodate the loss of store sales).

 

[maflynn]

I think MS understands that Windows 11 as is isn't good

I'd say they understand that it isn't good in general, particularly for handhelds but also in general. Hence the talk about them understanding our frustrations and 2026 we'll see improvements to the OS

I'm waiting to see the price point of the Steam Machine. I'm leaning heavily to buying that when it becomes available.

 

[diamond.g]

I'd say they understand that it isn't good in general, particularly for handhelds but also in general. Hence the talk about them understanding our frustrations and 2026 we'll see improvements to the OS

I'm waiting to see the price point of the Steam Machine. I'm leaning heavily to buying that when it becomes available.

I am prepared to be wildly surprised if it is less than a PS5 Pro. Valve pushing back the release date and pricing doesn't inspire confidence.

 

[maflynn]

This is an interesting test. Though folks were pointing out that all AMD hardware would have seen a bigger performance improvement

One thing I am curious about is, that this YT shows how a "used" PC will drag down performance, and how a clean install of windows does matter, a lot. So when we install other stuff that starts to sap performance, will this occur with Linux?

I like the point she was driving with comparing apples to apples with windows and linux.

The TLDR, is the the more you use windows and isntall software, the slower it gets - this isn't rocket surgery, most hobbyists and gamers already know this. Does that same thing happen with Linux?

 

[maflynn]

I am prepared to be wildly surprised if it is less than a PS5 Pro. Valve pushing back the release date and pricing doesn't inspire confidence.

I'm not expecting it to be less then the PS5 Pro. I'm guessing it will be closer to 1,000 then to the PS5 pro price, though I'm hopeful that it will be under a grand

 

[Ethosik]

This is an interesting test. Though folks were pointing out that all AMD hardware would have seen a bigger performance improvement.

I have NVIDIA and I tried Linux. Didn’t work well. I get vastly better performance on Windows and it’s a shame I would like to just get rid of windows.

 

[pshufd]

What is that? Sorry never heard of this.

It's supposed to be the thing that causes your problem from your description.

 

[pshufd]

I like how Bellular News describes the issues that MS had this past year - they're a gaming news site, so they have that perspective.

I like what he had to say, even if the problems are effecting 5% of the user base, that's millions of users, given the huge installed base of windows.

I think that the title is wrong. Everyone isn't turning on Windows.

As of mid-2025 there were 700 million Windows 11 users. Microsoft characterized it as a few million. So a reasonable percentage would be 0.4%. A lot of users but you'd hear a lot more screaming along with WSJ articles like you did with the butterfly keyboards.

 

[pshufd]

I have NVIDIA and I tried Linux. Didn’t work well. I get vastly better performance on Windows and it’s a shame I would like to just get rid of windows.

I think that you take your chances with nVidia drivers. There might be a driver set that works a lot better for Linux. I am amazed at how many bugs they introduce with updates while fixing other bugs.

Intel has had their problems but I find that their drivers for a variety of devices are less bug-prone compared to nVidia.

 

[maflynn]

I have NVIDIA and I tried Linux. Didn’t work well. I get vastly better performance on Windows and it’s a shame I would like to just get rid of windows.

I've not delved into a lot of the hows/whys but AMD seems to be the platform that is giving the best performance. Nvidia has seemingly been a thorn in people's sides when running Linux

 

[maflynn]

So a reasonable percentage would be 0.4%

Is that just a number you pulled out of the air or is that being reported somewhere?

 

[pshufd]

Is that just a number you pulled out of the air or is that being reported somewhere?

Despite the negativity surrounding the current version of Windows, it remains the most widely used operating system on the world’s desktop and laptop computers, and people usually prefer to stick to what they’re used to. As a result, Windows 11 has just cleared a big milestone—Microsoft CEO Satya Nadella said on the company’s most recent earnings call (via The Verge) that Windows 11 now has over 1 billion users worldwide.

People complaining about Windows 11 hasn't stopped it from hitting 1 billion users

Windows 11 clears a milestone as Windows 10 continues its slow fade.

arstechnica.com

I saw the term "a few million" but I can't find the article now. No matter, the term millions has been used in other articles.

Microsoft’s “nightmare” January update continues to plague millions of Windows users. Despite multiple emergency updates, there’s no signs of stability yet. Worse, the issues affect Outlook and cloud platform users as well. And the workaround is drastic.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/zakdoffman/2026/01/22/microsoft-warns-millions-of-pc-owners-remove-windows-update/

This incident highlights the critical importance of staged rollout strategies and thorough pre-release testing for major security updates affecting millions of devices worldwide.

Microsoft Investigates Windows 11 25H2 Boot Failures After January Update

The update, identified as KB5074109, was intended to deliver security enhancements to Windows 11 versions 25H2 and 24H2

cyberpress.org

Microsoft Emergency Windows Update Triggers GPU Slowdowns for Millions of PC Users​

https://www.ibtimes.co.uk/microsoft-emergency-windows-update-triggers-gpu-slowdowns-millions-pc-users-1771819

That's still under 1%.

 

[diamond.g]

I think that you take your chances with nVidia drivers. There might be a driver set that works a lot better for Linux. I am amazed at how many bugs they introduce with updates while fixing other bugs.

Intel has had their problems but I find that their drivers for a variety of devices are less bug-prone compared to nVidia.

I've not delved into a lot of the hows/whys but AMD seems to be the platform that is giving the best performance. Nvidia has seemingly been a thorn in people's sides when running Linux

Yeah from my understanding AMD get a lot of leeway because they open source their drivers (which is why SteamOS can't do HDMI VRR officially). I'm not quite sure nvidia drivers on Linux have the same issues they do on Windows.

 

[Ethosik]

I think that the title is wrong. Everyone isn't turning on Windows.

As of mid-2025 there were 700 million Windows 11 users. Microsoft characterized it as a few million. So a reasonable percentage would be 0.4%. A lot of users but you'd hear a lot more screaming along with WSJ articles like you did with the butterfly keyboards.

And the butterfly keyboard was finally acknowledged as an issue from Apple. Microsoft has confirmed Windows is a mess. It doesn’t matter that 1 billion people have Windows 11. Windows still has a stranglehold on a lot of people - myself included for gaming. And right now, Windows 11 is the ONLY supported version. So I had no choice if I wanted to stay secure which I do. I am not running Windows 10 even though it was a million times better than 11 and 7 was a million times better than 10 was.

 

[Ethosik]

Yeah from my understanding AMD get a lot of leeway because they open source their drivers (which is why SteamOS can't do HDMI VRR officially). I'm not quite sure nvidia drivers on Linux have the same issues they do on Windows.

I’m sorry. But I just want to play games. I have limited time to do so. I do not want to waste hours/days/weeks/months getting Linux to work properly.

 

[maflynn]

I’m sorry. But I just want to play games. I have limited time to do so. I do not want to waste hours/days/weeks/months getting Linux to work properly.

And that's why I think steamos will succeed.

 

[boppin]

I’m sorry. But I just want to play games.

Just do it!

Remembers me on "good old times" by installing Windows XP on the Intel Core 2 Duo iMacs my collegue and I bought back then. For playing games I still use the last white MacBook.

 

[maflynn]

So here's how fun windows 11 has turned out to be.

I was playing with the Live USB for Fedora, and that somehow invoked the need to re-enter my bitlocker recovery key. Took a bit, but I got the key from my account and entered it.

System rebooted and I presented with the Login screen, but my pin was not going to work. I sadly had tied this laptop with my microsoft account, because, you know I was forced too. So I enter my userid, and it forces me to use a passkey, except I don't have a passkey.

There is no other way to log into my account, I've tried every option that is being shown. I suppose I could try creating a new microsoft account, but that seems ridiculous

Its a thinkpad, so I may look to just do a recovery from the recovery partition

 

[pshufd]

So here's how fun windows 11 has turned out to be.

I was playing with the Live USB for Fedora, and that somehow invoked the need to re-enter my bitlocker recovery key. Took a bit, but I got the key from my account and entered it.

System rebooted and I presented with the Login screen, but my pin was not going to work. I sadly had tied this laptop with my microsoft account, because, you know I was forced too. So I enter my userid, and it forces me to use a passkey, except I don't have a passkey.

There is no other way to log into my account, I've tried every option that is being shown. I suppose I could try creating a new microsoft account, but that seems ridiculous

Its a thinkpad, so I may look to just do a recovery from the recovery partition

I just set mine up without a Microsoft account when I got it but did set up a passcode. This is my standard routine for setting up Windows.

All of the directions that I see for installing a Windows VM show you how to run Windows without a Microsoft Windows account.

 

[maflynn]

I just set mine up without a Microsoft account when I got it but did set up a passcode. This is my standard routine for setting up Windows.

I was not prompted for this when this computer was initially set up last year.

Personally I avoid passkeys, I have the Microsoft Authenticator app so it’s strange that was not an option

 

[pshufd]

I was not prompted for this when this computer was initially set up last year.

Personally I avoid passkeys, I have the Microsoft Authenticator app so it’s strange that was not an option

There are some magic incantations you have to do to bypass NRO. I don't really think about it as I've been doing it for the past ten years.

 

[maflynn]

There are some magic incantations you have to do to bypass NRO. I don't really think about it as I've been doing it for the past ten years.

Before when I had to enter my bit locker recovery key all I had to do was enter my userid and password.

Why is that option not provided?

 

[maflynn]

Let me rephrase my issue, perhaps I was unclear.

Because of some error, or issue related to the linux boot drive, I had to re-enter my bitlocker encryption recovery key. Which I did and once windows rebooted, I was presented with the normal login screen. I could not enter a pin, or my userid or password.

I was forced to only use a passkey, there were no other options to use the userid and password that I used every time I booted up my PC, no options to recover from a forgotten password (I was asked my hint questions when setting this up). I had no way of using my microsoft account with the authenticating app.

All I could do was use a passkey, which of course was never setup - this is ludicrous because it effectively locked me out of my own PC. I was never prompted to create a passkey in my configuring the laptop, or using the laptop, or after it performed its typical updates.

 

[diamond.g]

So here's how fun windows 11 has turned out to be.

I was playing with the Live USB for Fedora, and that somehow invoked the need to re-enter my bitlocker recovery key. Took a bit, but I got the key from my account and entered it.

System rebooted and I presented with the Login screen, but my pin was not going to work. I sadly had tied this laptop with my microsoft account, because, you know I was forced too. So I enter my userid, and it forces me to use a passkey, except I don't have a passkey.

There is no other way to log into my account, I've tried every option that is being shown. I suppose I could try creating a new microsoft account, but that seems ridiculous

Its a thinkpad, so I may look to just do a recovery from the recovery partition

You could try logging into your MS account on your iPhone and set up a passkey there.

I just updated my bios (new memory access mode, supposed to improve performance). I had to log back in using passkey because the bios update cleared my TPM settings.