If it was just me, I would use Strongbox. I think it’s really nice and easy to use.
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1Password migrants thread
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Perhaps you're thinking of mSecure?
Minimalist still offered the one-time purchase as well as subscription. Jeffrey Fulton said he was discontinuing Minimalist because:
However, he did also say:
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Perhaps you're thinking of mSecure?
Minimalist still offered the one-time purchase as well as subscription. Jeffrey Fulton said he was discontinuing Minimalist because:
However, he did also also say:
he can always open source it!
That's wrong. All vaults are stored on 1password.com. You don't have a local vault. You can't access your local vault, you can't copy it anywhere else, you can't do anything with it. However, when you use the app on your device without Internet access 1Password keeps a locally cached copy of your vaults so you can still unlock and use your passwords offline. This is not the definition of a local vault. It's just a cache file.
Some information that might change your thinking...
/Users/<username>/Library/Group Containers/2BUA8C4S2C.com.1password/Library/Application Support/1Password/Data
has a bunch of files that represent what I and others refer to as the 1Password's local vault. They constitute an SQLite database. You can use standard database query tools to explore the database tables if you wish. The contents of the various tables are mostly encrypted.
Using this database, the 1Password application lets you view and modify your credentials without access to the 1Password servers. This local vault synchronizes with the vault on the 1Password server when access is available. By a typical definition of a cache, this local vault is not that; it is a complete copy of all of your credentials, not just the ones you happen to have retrieved from the server, being cached for faster subsequent access.
All you are doing is misleading users who think that 1Password still has local vaults as it had in former versions and other password apps and devs are defining local vaults.
A cached copy of a cloud vault is not the same thing as a standalone or local vault. The local files cannot be created independently, cannot be imported or used without signing in to the cloud account, cannot be moved or synced by the user, and cannot exist if the cloud account is removed. This means the local data depends entirely on 1Password’s servers, which makes it a cache by definition.
1Password itself draws a clear distinction between a standalone local vault and the cached local copy that 1Password 8 uses. This is not a matter of “who defines what a local vault is.” The company explicitly defines it in their documentation and support responses.
I offered some facts that I am pretty sure you didn't know. When read literally, many things you say are provably false. But, you write very loosely and I'm not good at converting a false statement into the truth you meant to relay.
If all you're trying to say is that 1Password cannot be fully utilized without access to their servers, I'm not disagreeing with that.
1Password: “Standalone vaults are no longer supported in 1Password 8. 1Password 7 is the last version to support local vaults.”
This is an official statement from AgileBits staff. A standalone vault is what 1Password calls a local vault. According to the developers, 1Password 8 does not support them at all.
1Password also states: “All your vaults are stored in your 1Password account” and “1Password keeps a local copy of your data for offline access. This is a cached copy of your vaults.”
They explicitly refer to the local data as a cache, not as a vault. They also say that the vaults themselves are stored in the 1Password account, which means they are on 1Password’s servers.
Wikipedia, summarizing 1Password’s own documentation, states: “1Password 8 removed support for local vaults. Vaults are now stored on 1Password’s servers.”
The conclusion is straightforward. 1Password defines what a local or standalone vault is, and they officially removed that feature in 1Password 8. The files in the macOS container are a cached copy of a cloud vault, not a local vault in the sense that 1Password used the term for years.
No matter how you or anyone else personally defines “local vault” for yourselves, companies like 1Password, KeePass, Bitwarden and the wider industry use this term very differently. A “local vault” in the generally accepted sense is not a bunch of SQLite files somewhere deep inside a system folder that you could theoretically open with a hex editor.
1Password has increased the price from something like £34 to 49.
What I don't like Bitwarden is you have to provide your credit card details to subscribe so there is no option to do on App Store. I don't mind if they have a bit expensive price like US$13-15 on App Store as their original price is low ($10) in this case.
What I don't like Bitwarden is you have to provide your credit card details to subscribe so there is no option to do on App Store. I don't mind if they have a bit expensive price like US$13-15 on App Store as their original price is low ($10) in this case.
I mean if you don't trust them why store all your personal information and login data on their servers. Either you trust them then it doesn't matter to give them your credit card information or you don't trust them but then why would you want to use their service? If they are rogue they could do anything with your most precious secrets...
Once again, I respectfully offered you information you didn't know anything about. That pissed you off enough to respond "All you are doing is misleading users". I don't care about you, but my apologies to other users who drew the conclusion that I was suggesting 1Password can function fully without access to their servers.
To more receptive readers...
The sequence of posts that lead to the build-up of JohnKree's outrage started with the simple assertion that 1Password stores credentials on their servers as well as locally.
This seems to be true and the location of the local files is known. And even though JohnKree said "That's wrong" in response to the post
I can attest that my experience is the same as that of the poster.
It was what you are suggesting that actually screwed me over. I bought 1Password 6 off of the App Store. Because of that, and not purchasing a license through AgileBits, I couldn't migrate to 1Password 7, which which was only available at 1Password.com, due to not having that license, despite having purchased a legal copy of their product. With 1Password 7 being the last version to support local vaults, I had no valid upgrade path to get to 1Password 7, especially with Apple moving from Intel to Silicon (1Password 6 was an Intel binary).
In the next 1-2 years, Apple will be dropping Rosetta 2 support, as the last Intel Macs produced will be transitioning to being obsolete, which would kill my ability to run 1Password 6, so I'd be screwed from running 1Password 6, plus no way to get to upgrade and keep my local vault. If I had bought 1Password 6 directly from AgileBits and not through the App Store, I would not have this problem.
BL.
There is no “outrage”, and nobody is calling you names.
If you are happy with having a local copy of the vault for situations when you are offline, fine. I would also call it a local cache.
Can the files be used if they are not on the server too? What happens next time you connect if your local copy is different from the server version?
Does 1password let you use the local copy if you are connected but your login credentials are no longer valid?
Did I say anything about local vaults? I didn't. All I said I can access 1Password without internet.
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My 1Password subscription was renewed this week, and 1st time without discounts.
I'm ok with the price, but of couurse I've definitely appreciated the discounts that I've got.
I'm pretty sure it will some different discounts in the future as well.
Paying approx. what I pay for 1,5 kg quality espresso-beans, for having 1Password subs/year and what I appreciate with that app, is worth it as well as my espressos 😋
I'm ok with the price, but of couurse I've definitely appreciated the discounts that I've got.
I'm pretty sure it will some different discounts in the future as well.
Paying approx. what I pay for 1,5 kg quality espresso-beans, for having 1Password subs/year and what I appreciate with that app, is worth it as well as my espressos 😋
Yeah, I didn't hear anyone calling me names.
Does 1password let you use the local copy if you are connected but your login credentials are no longer valid? - no idea. The other questions are answered below.
1Password uses the term vault to mean a particular collection of credentials. In 1Password, I have many vaults for different purposes. All of the those vaults are visible and usable within the 1Password application without a connection to the internet.
When you connect after being disconnected changes are pushed up. I tested by modifying an item, deleting an item, and adding a new item, all while disconnected (blocked by Little Snitch). None of the changes showed on my phone. Once I allowed the connection all pending changes were synchronized to the servers and subsequently showed up on my phone.
While disconnected, 1Password shows a small cloud with a strikeout indicating the lack of connection. When you try to connect, or first start up the app without an available connection, 1Password briefly shows a popup at the bottom of the application:
I was not allowed to create a new vault while disconnected, but could work with my existing ones. Also, once I deleted an entry when disconnected, that entry did not show up in the "recently deleted" category until I reconnected with the server. So, it might be hard to recover an accidentally deleted entry. Once I connected to the 1Password server, the entry that I deleted did appear in the "recently deleted" category.
So, my tentative conclusion is that 1Password's local vaults are fully functional, but the application in total has some limitations.
I do not have any evidence that a user can game this by cancelling their subscription and using the 1Password application permanently disconnected. I also think that if you don't have a subscription to their service you are no longer granted a license to the software.
When someone says 1Password has no local vaults, they might be right or they might be wrong; it depends on their definition of vaults. If you keep the definition of vault simple (an encrypted storage of credentials), then 1Password has local vaults.
When someone says 1Password's local storage of credentials is a cache, they might be right or they might be wrong; it depends on the definition of cache. I suspect 1Password's local vaults are as much a cache as my Dropbox folder is, where all content is forced to be available offline. The more I think about this particular topic the more I realize that it's a technically subtle issue and well out of scope.
Oh yes. You did.
Thanks for testing this, but what you are describing is exactly how a synchronized offline copy works, not a standalone local vault. And this isn’t a matter of personal interpretation. In technology, terms like “local vault” have established meanings.
A local vault, as defined by 1Password in versions 4–7 and by the wider password-manager industry, is a completely independent encrypted data store that the user can create, open, move, back up, and use without any cloud account or subscription. KeePass, Enpass, Bitwarden’s offline mode, and 1Password 7 all follow this model.
What 1Password 8 provides is different. The data stored on disk cannot be created offline, cannot be used without logging into your 1Password account, cannot be moved or imported elsewhere, and stops being usable if the subscription ends. All of these behaviours are consistent with a cloud vault that has a local replica for offline access. That is exactly what 1Password themselves call it: “a local copy of your account data for offline access.” In other words, a cache.
So whether an individual user chooses to call that local replica a “vault” doesn’t change anything. The company’s definition and the industry standard definition are what matter. By those definitions, 1Password 7 had local vaults and 1Password 8 removed them. The local files in 1Password 8 are just an offline working copy of cloud-hosted vaults, not standalone vaults in the traditional sense.
I have 1Password 6 via the Mac App Store as well but upgraded when v7 was still the latest with no issues. I feel your pain.
I've had this happen with several developers/apps: You only have so much time to upgrade without a subscription to what you need or want before the door closes but you don't get notified about it. Kaleidoscope was one and MotionVFX mFlare v2 is another (waited years for that upgrade without subscription to open old projects!). Both I found out just after the fact and now I am stuck on old islands without any way to get to the mainland without subscriptions for life. Grrrr.
I never mentioned anything about "standalone". That's another subtle topic that would be impossible to discuss with you.
My guess is you don't like 1Password and have a bit of a grudge. You want language to conform to a particular usage to be able to assert easily that 1Password lacks something. So it offends you when someone says that 1Password maintains local vaults; it's dangerous talk and should be suppressed. I'm actually sympathetic.
Let's just say "1Password maintains a local database of all your credentials" and the credentials are organized into vaults on your local machine. Those locally located vaults might sometimes be called "local vaults", but should not be confused with "standalone local vaults" (even though they do mostly function standalone).
If you ever want to know more about 1Password's locally located vaults, you can read my post that tells you where they are on disk and the file structures used to store them. Hopefully that will lead you to believe 1Password's locally located vaults do exist and provide evidence to support Mr Heckles' and my claim that we can access 1Password credentials while offline. And maybe you'll even retract your "That's wrong" response to Mr. Heckles, who didn't say anything about vaults.
Oh, I get it. The part that actually bothered me wasn't 1Password going subscription, because that is what they wanted to do, thanks to venture capitalists pouring money into the application. The problem I have is that they went back on what they said about nothing changing for Mac users and the location of the users' vaults. In all honesty, I could have stayed on 1Password 6 forever, since that was a true standalone application; however, I lost all MacOS support on my MBA at the time, because not only was it moved to obsolete status 5 years ago, but support for the OS on it also was dropped 3 years ago. That, and moving to Silicon being the wave of MacOS at the time had me making the choice to cut my losses, update from that Mac, and move away from 1Password altogether. I haven't looked back at 1Password or AgileBits since.
They went back on their promise to their customers, so I spoke my mind/voted with my wallet.
BL.
I am so with you on that. A ton of people would have stayed with them if they would have allowed local vaults as they always did. But between the subscriptions and no local vaults, both NO's for me, it forced a lot of users out.
I am moving, over time, to Strongbox. Which is the only real solution to replace what I have with 1Password. I've read every page of this discussion as it happened. It has been a long ride.