2017 - A year leaving the Apple walled garden

[krause734]

I feel the same way. I jumped ship from the current ancient Mac Mini to an Intel NUC w/ Linux Mint. Linux Mint runs better than expected and I now prefer it to MacOS.

Still on contract with my iPhone but I am looking at the Pixel 2 and Galaxy S8 when my contract is up this summer. For a laptop/tablet I am debating between a Galaxy Tab and a Chromebook. More affordable than a Macbook/iPad for my basic usage.

Once I broke my precious jamz free from iTunes it was no looking back. Linux has a simple program called Rhythymbox that isn't a mess like iTunes.

If Apple wows me again like Steve did I may consider coming back but I think they've lost a customer and the word is that Apple is losing their mojo.

 

[Vegastouch]

If Apple was so bad to work for, nobody would work there.

I never said they were bad to work for. They just don't give things to their employees that others do. I'm not sure they even give their employees discounts on products.

 

[Michael Goff]

I never said they were bad to work for. They just don't give things to their employees that others do. I'm not sure they even give their employees discounts on products.

Which the other companies do out of the kindness of their hearts, right?

 

[Septembersrain]

I won't come back because I haven't left. I feel that I will always have an appreciation for iOS. However, right now my primary device is an Android. I started with Android.

I also like Windows or Linux.

I think everyone should find what works for them. For me, Android still functions better as an actual device for my area and network. Unless Apple gets Intel up to speed with Qualcomm, I don't foresee myself using an iPhone primarily.

 

[Vegastouch]

Which the other companies do out of the kindness of their hearts, right?

Lol, well obviously you don't believe it. I don't know who you work for but evidently they don't do crap for you. All I can tell you is what I've been a part of. I've also worked at a Casino in Vegas ( The Palms), and they feed all their employees for free too. Pretty much all the casinos do. I Know, hard to believe there are companies that treat their employees well and not just care about the mighty dollar that Apple is concerned about.

My Daughter works at The Wynn in Las Vegas and not only do they feed them for free, they had a employee wide meeting around a month ago and Steve Wynn told them that since the new tax law is going to take effect ..I think this month or April where you get more money on your paycheck, he was going to give them all back pay from the first of the year for what extra they were to get from it. He doesn't have to do that, but he is.

 

[akash.nu]

This is a great point! In the US iMessage is the best for us, however, for my coworkers throughout the world (EU, MEA, APAC), WhatsApp rules! None of them use native messaging. Anytime we travel overseas we have to make sure WhatsApp is loaded.

This is an issue for me as well. I love iMessage but for some reason people use WhatsApp more even when everything you do on WhatsApp can be done on iMessage and more.

 

[akash.nu]

I work in IT security.....my company deploys 5000 iphones. The people that mange and run them say they are less secure than the Samsung phones they replaced. But the SVPs and executives upstream liked Apple products because of what they used at home.

“The people that mange and run them say they are less secure than the Samsung phones they replaced.” - if your IT admins say that then they’re chatting pure crap. I’m sorry that you work at a company where the IT admins are so bad.

 

[akash.nu]

Apple doesn't want to retain their employees in that same competive market? The point is Apple won't give anything away while Google does. But you will see it how you want.

Honestly, having read a lot of your comments now, I couldn’t stop myself from responding. You’re really delusional about how these big tech giants work.

 

[bruinsrme]

I never said they were bad to work for. They just don't give things to their employees that others do. I'm not sure they even give their employees discounts on products.

Try to take a peek at the benefits they offer their employees.
What exactly should they be giving their employees?

 

[nj1266]

Google does it, why cant Apple? You can get all of Googles apps on iOS. Google gives you unlimited space on Google photos for pics and videos, why cant Apple do that? Both make profits and are bazilionaires. It wont hurt Apples profits but greed is their thing. They want to lock you into their world and dont care about the people. They slowed your old phones down with no warning on purpose and only fixed that when it came out they were doing it for their gain, dispite what they said afterwords.

Google is an advertising company and not a hardware company. Google can abandon the making of the Pixel and still make profits. 70% of Apple’s profits come from the iPhone. Giving away iMessages to Android will hurt Apple. Google gives their Apps because they make money from tracking you via their apps and then targeting you with commercials. That is why google has refused to natively put ad blockers on Chrome. Only recently did google allow it.
No hardware company that is as dependent as Apple is on one product will do what you suggested. It will be suicide and the CEO will be fired.

 

[Vegastouch]

Try to take a peek at the benefits they offer their employees.
What exactly should they be giving their employees?

All I'm saying is Apple doesn't give anybody anything while others do. Even when it comes to their own employees. Just trying to show that not every company is for the max profit and actually give people something. Not everybody is stingy like they are.
[doublepost=1520177918][/doublepost]

Honestly, having read a lot of your comments now, I couldn’t stop myself from responding. You’re really delusional about how these big tech giants work.

Perhaps, or maybe you are wrong how you think they work. If its me I can except that. But I've been in their buildings and talked to some of their people on both sides.
In the grand scheme, I don't really care but for some to disregard what some companies do that is possitive but see it as a negative reason IMO is wrong.
Just except that some companies do more for others than Apple. That isn't a bad thing against Apple, I just think they are stingy and don't care about their users as much. But if people don't care and are ok with paying more for their devices xand paying for space on top of that and not getting what you have been asking for, for years then fine. That's not me.

Microsoft wants you to pay for more space too but at least they give you more than 5 friggin GB. So does DropBox.

 

[decafjava]

All I'm saying is Apple doesn't give anybody anything while others do. Even when it comes to their own employees. Just trying to show that not every company is for the max profit and actually give people something. Not everybody is stingy like they are.
[doublepost=1520177918][/doublepost]
Perhaps, or maybe you are wrong how you think they work. If its me I can except that. But I've been in their buildings and talked to some of their people on both sides.
In the grand scheme, I don't really care but for some to disregard what some companies do that if possition but see it as a negative reason IMO is wrong.
Just except that some companies do more for others than Apple. That isn't a bad thing against Apple, I just think they are stingy and don't care about their users as much. But if people don't care and are ok with paying more for their devices xand paying for space on top of that and not getting what you have been asking for, for years then fine. That's not me.

Wow, I really like to read other's opinions and preferably diverse ons but I am always amazed how many people at this site don't even use or like Apple stuff. Anyone is free to post here as long as they respect the rules just wonder what they get out of it?

 

[I7guy]

All I'm saying is Apple doesn't give anybody anything while others do. Even when it comes to their own employees. Just trying to show that not every company is for the max profit and actually give people something. Not everybody is stingy like they are.
[doublepost=1520177918][/doublepost]
Perhaps, or maybe you are wrong how you think they work. If its me I can except that. But I've been in their buildings and talked to some of their people on both sides.
In the grand scheme, I don't really care but for some to disregard what some companies do that if possition but see it as a negative reason IMO is wrong.
Just except that some companies do more for others than Apple. That isn't a bad thing against Apple, I just think they are stingy and don't care about their users as much. But if people don't care and are ok with paying more for their devices xand paying for space on top of that and not getting what you have been asking for, for years then fine. That's not me.

Do you have some evidence of this alleged stinginess with respect to peer companies; not casinos?

It’s the CEOs duty to go for max profit, part of his or her fiduciary responsibility except if you are a not for profit corporation. I have no problems with any company charging what they want...I can always choose whether to buy their products.

 

[Vegastouch]

Wow, I really like to read other's opinions and preferably diverse ons but I am always amazed how many people at this site don't even use or like Apple stuff. Anyone is free to post here as long as they respect the rules just wonder what they get out of it?

I don't dislike them and have an iPad. This is strictly just disagreeing with someone who thinks Google doesn't give anybody anything for the hec of it and no companies do. I've worked for some that do. I just wish Apple would let the OS be more customizable and open it up some....as many others wish they would. But i still wont pay $1000 for a phone whether it is Apple or whoever. I didnt buy the GS8 last because of how much it was and was looking for others but decided to keep what i had. The GS9 came down a lot and i pre ordered it for 50% off with a trade in of my phone so i couldnt pas that up.
[doublepost=1520178996][/doublepost]

Do you have some evidence of this alleged stinginess with respect to peer companies; not casinos?

It’s the CEOs duty to go for max profit, part of his or her fiduciary responsibility except if you are a not for profit corporation. I have no problems with any company charging what they want...I can always choose whether to buy their products.

Did you read the other posts? I mentioned Google and another tech company i worked at. And dont dont Casinos count? They are built by billionaires and they give things away to employees.

Do you have Apple products? I know you do. And your right you can choose and it's why I usually choose others over Apple but mostly for different reasons.

 

[I7guy]

Did you read the other posts? I mentioned Google and another tech company i worked at. And dont dont Casinos count? They are built by billionaires and they give things away to employees.

Do you have Apple products? I know you do. And your right you can choose and it's why I usually choose others over Apple but mostly for different reasons.

The multiple companies have different business models and ways of deriving their revenue from that business model and have different benefits to their employees. Why does that matter in this thread, since you brought it up?

And sure, it's tough to disagree with a statement such as "choose your own product for your own reasons."

 

[Vegastouch]

The multiple companies have different business models and ways of deriving their revenue from that business model and have different benefits to their employees. Why does that matter in this thread, since you brought it up?

And sure, it's tough to disagree with a statement such as "choose your own product for your own reasons."

Are you joking? A billion dollar company is a billion dollar company. It doesn't matter how they got it. But both Apple and the Casinos have huge buildings with thousands of employees,
..actually some casinos have more than Apple does. Steve Wynn owns four or five just in Vegas, as does some others and both have employee cafaterias. They feed their people for free, Apple makes theirs pay.
You brought up comparing tech companies instead of Casinos, if that isn't what youyou m as far as how this matters in this thread, you need to go back and read how it came up.

 

[I7guy]

Are you joking? A billion dollar company is a billion dollar company. It doesn't matter how they got it. But both Apple and the Casinos have huge buildings with thousands of employees,
..actually some casinos have more than Apple does. Steve Wynn owns four or five just in Vegas, as does some others and both have employee cafaterias. They feed their people for free, Apple makes theirs pay.
You brought up comparing tech companies instead of Casinos, if that isn't what youyou m as far as how this matters in this thread, you need to go back and read how it came up.

Your rational does not track, with google being altruistic company, while apple is the penny-pinching scrooge. You may have your reasons for not liking apple as a company along with apples' products, and may believe that because one company feeds their employees for free another should also.

What matters to me, is how the product impacts my daily work, not how much storage I get for photos. Personally I'd rather pay for storage on apple, than get it free on Google. To each their own. However, casinos feeding employees is certainly far off from the ops original post.

 

[Vegastouch]

Your rational does not track, with google being altruistic company, while apple is the penny-pinching scrooge. You may have your reasons for not liking apple as a company along with apples' products, and may believe that because one company feeds their employees for free another should also.

What matters to me, is how the product impacts my daily work, not how much storage I get for photos. Personally I'd rather pay for storage on apple, than get it free on Google. To each their own. However, casinos feeding employees is certainly far off from the ops original post.

I never said I disliked Apple.
You evidently didn't go back and read how this came about. Figures.
It isn't just about who feeds their employees but that is something that shows about how Apple cares more about money while others are looser with things.
And of course your fine with paying Apple for more space. If you want the ecosystem, you will pay and they expect that. It's why they don't give you much.

 

[I7guy]

I never said I disliked Apple.
You evidently didn't go back and read how this came about. Figures.
It isn't just about who feeds their employees but that is something that shows about how Apple cares more about money while others are looser with things.
And of course your fine with paying Apple for more space. If you want the ecosystem, you will pay and they expect that. It's why they don't give you much.

I read all of your posts in this thread and you’re making assumptions as you don’t know the total compensation package across all employees in these companies and “how much” they give their customers. At any rate if photo space is the deal breaker and you’re okay with google mining your photos, then happy uploading. You don’t think google is giving away photo space because they are altruistic, do you?

 

[StellarVixen]

I *might* leave the iOS when something other than Android comes to power all those decent phones. Google's total and blatant disrespect of user privacy and treating its customers as geese that lay golden eggs for them via ads is a deal breaker for me, and it will keep being a deal breaker forever. I do dislike some limitation of this walled garden, but that's it for now, I do not have a choice. MeeGo is dead. Symbian is dead. Windows Phone is dead. Blackberry OS is dead. Only Android powers damn non Apple phones.

 

[maflynn]

I've used Android, windows, BlackBerry and of course iPhones, each has some advantage over the other in some respects but for my usage patterns, wants and needs. iOS gives me everything I need.

The one major flaw I see with android is the fact that you rely on the telecom companies to roll out android updates and its been my experience that this happens so slowely that its not worth it. Android version adoption rate, shows that my experience is common. I totally understand that I can get an android phone that runs generic android and I've done that, but overall I think that's android's achille's heel.

 

[Wildo6882]

I've used Android, windows, BlackBerry and of course iPhones, each has some advantage over the other in some respects but for my usage patterns, wants and needs. iOS gives me everything I need.

The one major flaw I see with android is the fact that you rely on the telecom companies to roll out android updates and its been my experience that this happens so slowely that its not worth it. Android version adoption rate, shows that my experience is common. I totally understand that I can get an android phone that runs generic android and I've done that, but overall I think that's android's achille's heel.

Just to play Devil's Advocate here (as I type from my iPhone), OS upgrades on Android are not the same as OS upgrades on iOS. So that doesn't necessarily bother me. Android can update so much of the OS through app updates and updates to Google Play Services, which will hit every single Android phone at the same time. If they need to add something to their calendar app, they update the app. If Apple wants to do the same, they have to wait for an OS point release. In all honesty, what does Oreo offer that's so much better than Nougat? Native picture in picture is literally all I can think of. But things like split screen that's now native in Android existed on other Android phones long before it became native.

The big problem is the lack of consistent security updates. My wife has an unlocked S8 and it's on the Dec security patch. That bothers me, especially as people who use their phones for work purposes.

 

[meerkat1990]

I read all of your posts in this thread and you’re making assumptions as you don’t know the total compensation package across all employees in these companies and “how much” they give their customers. At any rate if photo space is the deal breaker and you’re okay with google mining your photos, then happy uploading. You don’t think google is giving away photo space because they are altruistic, do you?

You are correct. While you retain ownership of what you upload, you give them license to use the content even after you leave the service. This is straight from Google's Terms of Service.


"Your Content in our Services
Some of our Services allow you to upload, submit, store, send or receive content. You retain ownership of any intellectual property rights that you hold in that content. In short, what belongs to you stays yours.

When you upload, submit, store, send or receive content to or through our Services, you give Google (and those we work with) a worldwide license to use, host, store, reproduce, modify, create derivative works (such as those resulting from translations, adaptations or other changes we make so that your content works better with our Services), communicate, publish, publicly perform, publicly display and distribute such content. The rights you grant in this license are for the limited purpose of operating, promoting, and improving our Services, and to develop new ones. This license continues even if you stop using our Services (for example, for a business listing you have added to Google Maps). Some Services may offer you ways to access and remove content that has been provided to that Service. Also, in some of our Services, there are terms or settings that narrow the scope of our use of the content submitted in those Services. Make sure you have the necessary rights to grant us this license for any content that you submit to our Services.

Our automated systems analyze your content (including emails) to provide you personally relevant product features, such as customized search results, tailored advertising, and spam and malware detection. This analysis occurs as the content is sent, received, and when it is stored.

If you have a Google Account, we may display your Profile name, Profile photo, and actions you take on Google or on third-party applications connected to your Google Account (such as +1’s, reviews you write and comments you post) in our Services, including displaying in ads and other commercial contexts. We will respect the choices you make to limit sharing or visibility settings in your Google Account. For example, you can choose your settings so your name and photo do not appear in an ad.

You can find more information about how Google uses and stores content in the privacy policy or additional terms for particular Services. If you submit feedback or suggestions about our Services, we may use your feedback or suggestions without obligation to you."

 

[Roadstar]

Just to play Devil's Advocate here (as I type from my iPhone), OS upgrades on Android are not the same as OS upgrades on iOS. So that doesn't necessarily bother me. Android can update so much of the OS through app updates and updates to Google Play Services, which will hit every single Android phone at the same time. If they need to add something to their calendar app, they update the app. If Apple wants to do the same, they have to wait for an OS point release. In all honesty, what does Oreo offer that's so much better than Nougat? Native picture in picture is literally all I can think of. But things like split screen that's now native in Android existed on other Android phones long before it became native.

The big problem is the lack of consistent security updates. My wife has an unlocked S8 and it's on the Dec security patch. That bothers me, especially as people who use their phones for work purposes.

I agree. Feature updates aren’t that big a deal when they’re mostly handled by app and Google Play Services updates, but the security updates are my main issue with Android right now. My S8+ is currently on the Feb patches which is naturally fine this early in March, but before getting the Feb patches bundled with Oreo I was stuck on the Nov patches. That gap was quite a bit too long for my liking and I wonder when I’m going to get the next patch. In two months? Three months? Half a year? That’s one of the reasons I’m typing this on an iPhone.

 

[maflynn]

In all honesty, what does Oreo offer that's so much better than Nougat? Native picture in picture is literally all I can think of.

The fact remains that many android users are unable to upgrade because the carrier has yet to roll out the latest version of android for their phones

The first chat is the adoption rate of android for the first 12 months (source). Nougat has a paltry 14%


The iOS adoption rate is completely different tale. In just 5 days, 20% of the people upgraded. The chart below is only upto iOS 10, I didn't want to kill myself for a similar one that includes iOS 11, but from my research iOS adoption rate is similar.




As you mention this can be a big issue with security and patching vulnabilities. It also can be frustrating when you spend nearly a thousand dollars for a new phone and you have to wait 6 months, or longer for the carrier to roll out Android. Step down from a flagship phone and you may not even see an upgrade. That happened to me, on a phone, they promised, and then didn't roll one out.