(2019) 16" is HOT & NOISY with an external monitor! :(

[impulse462]

These temperatures with external monitor are the same I see on my 2018 560X. I am by no means happy with those values, since I get around 34 without external monitor. The decision to force dGPU with whatever monitor I plug does not get thumbs up from me. I want to type on my machine doing light work without any heat on my hands. I can get it on 13 inch but I don't want such a small screen.
Apple is giving us the choice of no choice on this one. I was expecting a different approach on these new 16 inch machines.

People talk a lot about how Intel is dropping the ball on 10nm, but my 14nm processor ramps up from 34 to 50 just by attaching an external display. It is not the processor, it is the GPU that elevates the whole heat pipe!!! If Apple chooses to call PRO because it has a dedicated GPU, give us users who don't want this "issue" a 15 Air or something (but with proper cooling, not the Air joke).

It is working as intended? Yes. Is it satisfactory for me? No. And for the looks of some users, it does not get for them also. I am sorry, I would like to part some cash for the new 16, when I saw the news of better thermals I was trilled, but they chose to give it to performance instead of letting users choose if they want comfort or performance.

I see some users mentioning clamshell mode. I don't see Touch Bar functionality on a stand alone keyboard, I want to still use the keyboard that comes with the machine. To be forced to use it that way to get the desired comfort from a 3000EUR machine because of a "design decision", no thanks. Stop blaming Intel for something that Apple should have solved since the first dual GPU MacBook Pro in 2011...

what you're asking for is two competing things though. the 45W chips don't come with iris graphics (at least the ones that apple use) so those integrated graphics couldn't handle the external displays that the 16" is advertised as being capable of running. the dGPU has to be used to run all these external displays. what you're asking for is gimped performance because you don't feel with heat gain, which is not apple's defintiion of someone who this computer is meant for.

i agree though, apple should offer a variant of a larger display without a dGPU. they probably want to keep it on message though. my feeling though is that if people are unhappy with heat being generated by this computer, they should get the 13" because the computer is meant to run heavy applications for content creation whether that be video editing or software development (amongst many others), and these apps WILL push the hardware

 

[pshufd]

These temperatures with external monitor are the same I see on my 2018 560X. I am by no means happy with those values, since I get around 34 without external monitor. The decision to force dGPU with whatever monitor I plug does not get thumbs up from me. I want to type on my machine doing light work without any heat on my hands. I can get it on 13 inch but I don't want such a small screen.
Apple is giving us the choice of no choice on this one. I was expecting a different approach on these new 16 inch machines.

People talk a lot about how Intel is dropping the ball on 10nm, but my 14nm processor ramps up from 34 to 50 just by attaching an external display. It is not the processor, it is the GPU that elevates the whole heat pipe!!! If Apple chooses to call PRO because it has a dedicated GPU, give us users who don't want this "issue" a 15 Air or something (but with proper cooling, not the Air joke).

It is working as intended? Yes. Is it satisfactory for me? No. And for the looks of some users, it does not get for them also. I am sorry, I would like to part some cash for the new 16, when I saw the news of better thermals I was trilled, but they chose to give it to performance instead of letting users choose if they want comfort or performance.

I see some users mentioning clamshell mode. I don't see Touch Bar functionality on a stand alone keyboard, I want to still use the keyboard that comes with the machine. To be forced to use it that way to get the desired comfort from a 3000EUR machine because of a "design decision", no thanks. Stop blaming Intel for something that Apple should have solved since the first dual GPU MacBook Pro in 2011...

Keep complaining as I'm hoping Apple addresses this problem. I do not need to upgrade though I think that I would buy the 16 if I needed it and just run a fan or two underneath it.

 

[PiresT]

I think this problem would be easily solved if apple used the iGPU to render the internal display and the dGPU to render the external displays, what they do is they use the dGPU for both displays

 

[pshufd]

I think this problem would be easily solved if apple used the iGPU to render the internal display and the dGPU to render the external displays, what they do is they use the dGPU for both displays

One reason why I prefer a dGPU is decreased memory bus contention from the Northbridge to the RAM.

dGPUs are fine as long as thermal conditions are properly engineered.

 

[x3sphere]

This isn't just about the native resolution of the monitor - it is the effective resolution you run it at. For instance, someone running a 4K 27" monitor is unlikely to run it at native 4K resolution - if they did it would require little processing power but everything would look tiny. They are more likely to run it at something that looks like 2560x1440. The crucial part here is that MacOS can run this in either 'scaled mode' or 'low resolution mode'

The former renders at twice the 2560 resolution then downscales it to the 4K panel to give the best possible 'retina like' picture. This is quite a lot of work. The latter simply throws out that resolution and lets the monitor's scaling do its stuff which is usually crap and blocky. In fact I haven't seen these low resolution options recently so they might have even been removed in later MacOS versions.

The person running a 3440x1440 screen - that is not actually all that high a resolution, it is simply a normal resolution but ultra-wide. That means no special scaling is required and it can simply be run at its native resolution - i.e. low processing overhead.

No scaling is required, but I'm also running my 3440x1440 display at 120Hz. That does increase the GPU load quite a bit. Still, only getting 5-6W usage.

Also - a few people in here are getting 20W usage on lower resolution screens like 2560x1080, which is very odd...

And like I mentioned before... I'm also getting the 20W usage when I don't run it in clamshell mode. Power usage shouldn't more than double just because I add another display into the mix. Someone posted results from the previous 15" and the power usage didn't increase that dramatically, only went up to 12W - which seems far more reasonable: https://forums.macrumors.com/thread...external-monitor-mbp-16.2216009/post-28076720

The Navi drivers are pretty new so I think it's reasonable to assume there could be a bug here. If so, hopefully it gets fixed.

 

[milhous]

No scaling is required, but I'm also running my 3440x1440 display at 120Hz. That does increase the GPU load quite a bit. Still, only getting 5-6W usage.

Also - a few people in here are getting 20W usage on lower resolution screens like 2560x1080, which is very odd...

And like I mentioned before... I'm also getting the 20W usage when I don't run it in clamshell mode. Power usage shouldn't more than double just because I add another display into the mix. Someone posted results from the previous 15" and the power usage didn't increase that dramatically, only went up to 12W - which seems far more reasonable: https://forums.macrumors.com/thread...external-monitor-mbp-16.2216009/post-28076720

The Navi drivers are pretty new so I think it's reasonable to assume there could be a bug here. If so, hopefully it gets fixed.

How’s the load at 60Hz?

 

[dingobiatch]

Whoa. Interesting update:

I got my 34” LG widescreen in, connected directly via USB-C, and only 5w usage! Then I tried connecting via HDMI through my Anker dock, and it went straight to 20w! So, it may have something to do with docks?!

 

[PiresT]

Whoa. Interesting update:

I got my 34” LG widescreen in, connected directly via USB-C, and only 5w usage! Then I tried connecting via HDMI through my Anker dock, and it went straight to 20w! So, it may have something to do with docks?!

Are you connection with a usbc-usbc, usbc-hdmi or usbc-displayport cable?

 

[dingobiatch]

Are you connection with a usbc-usbc, usbc-hdmi or usbc-displayport cable?

5w was USB-C to USB-C. But the fact is, if I can get 5w and basically 10-15 degrees less by using one connection and not with another, then something is actually wrong.

 

[Idec50]

5w was USB-C to USB-C.

Hm well that is interesting. Is it somehow offloading some of the work onto the monitor? What monitor is that?

FWIW I have tried HDMI from a Lention dock with a 1080p monitor and DisplayPort from a Caldigit dock with an ultra-wide 1440p and both give me 20W.

 

[dingobiatch]

5w was USB-C to USB-C.

Hm well that is interesting. Is it somehow offloading some of the work onto the monitor? What monitor is that?

FWIW I have tried HDMI from a Lention dock with a 1080p monitor and DisplayPort from a Caldigit dock with an ultra-wide 1440p and both give me 20W.

Doubt it.. there must be some difference in how the computer determines how much power to put out.

 

[iMacDragon]

WHat GPu is it reporting for the LG? I'm wondering if a true native USB C display can be routed diffeerently.

 

[dingobiatch]

WHat GPu is it reporting for the LG? I'm wondering if a true native USB C display can be routed diffeerently.

I'll check on this ASAP.

 

[Hexley]

Has Apple release a software update addressing "HOT & NOISY"?

 

[Appledoesnotlisten]

Has Apple release a software update addressing "HOT & NOISY"?

My 16" behaves way better now. It might be because of a software update, or because I changed my monitor cables.

 

[PiresT]

Has Apple release a software update addressing "HOT & NOISY"?

Not yet

 

[soiramk]

My 16" behaves way better now. It might be because of a software update, or because I changed my monitor cables.

Which are? From what to what, if you could remind me.

 

[niho]

I've just returned my 16" macbook. For this price, that much noise on idle is not acceptable.
I think I'm gonna build a macintosh.

 

[MacFlaX]

Finally I decided to return my full spec MacBook Pro 16, which was intended as desktop replacement for my MacPro 5.1.
The fan noise, especially when using with external monitor (LG Ultrafine 5k), was to annoying. The fan speed in idle mode with about 1800-2200 rpm was ok and not noticeable. But with any activity the fans kicked in very quickly. E.g. minor brightness adjustment in Lightroom with approx 10% CPU load caused fan speeds up to 4500rpm. Looks like this is the price to pay for such incredible power in this small form factor. I loved the machine, but can’t accept the noise for my use case.

 

[nmikhail]

I want to buy one for my development work, i mainly going to use it stationary with 2 external monitors(full and uhd) not clamshell mode. I don't mind the noise, but is it okay to use it like that with 2 externals monitors 8 hours every day? is the heat going to slowly kill the hardware? i'm really on the verge, want to upgrade my 2015 macbook with 2 cores.

 

[topcat001]

I'd put it on a raised stand (or perhaps a vertical stand if you're in clamshell mode) so that the bottom plate has some clearance. Then it should be fine unless you're using it in tropical summer weather

I use it with a couple of 1080 displays at home and it's fine. It seems that third party docks have issues. This is not Apple specific though. At work, which is all Dell hardware and accessories, we have had endless issues with their own docks! Partly because of this I never use them at home. It's got enough ports for two monitors directly connected, and I connect a USB hub to another port for keyboard/mouse/drives which are type A for me. Just FYI.

 

[nethead]

Good news for XDR display owners: The dGPU of the MBP 16" only draws ~5W when in clamshell mode and driving an XDR display in the recommended resolution ("default for this display"), so low temperature and no fan noise. 🎉

 

[Daverru]

Looks like we need to make a list of "~5W" displays...
With which ones the dGPU does draw the same with resolution higher than 1080p?

 

[dingobiatch]

Super weird.. as stated before, when I plugged in my LG Ultrawide via USB-C, it worked @5w. When I tried plugging in HDMI->Active DisplayPort adapter->Caldigit TS3+, it went to 20w. But then I went to System prefs -> display and noticed it had switched to the custom scaling screen, 50hz refresh rate. I changed it to 60w, and it went back to 5w! After a restart, I couldn't get the display working anymore, so I'm not sure if the active adapter is messing things up..

 

[Idec50]

FWIW I returned mine, a fully loaded 2019 MBP because my old 2017 runs cooler - with or without an external monitor. I hope you all figure out the issue or Apple resolves it, or someone figures out how to run it cooler. But I'm not keeping a $6k machine that runs 20 degrees fahrenheit hotter than my old machine when only web browsing, spikes to 190/200 degrees, makes noise and vibrates slightly when plugged into a wall charger. That doesn't sound like a machine that will last.

My general thoughts on the machine compared to my 2017 MBP:

+3 Speaker quality is significantly improved
+3 I actually really like True Tone in my often yellow-tinted environment
+1 The screen is a noticeably larger and it makes a difference because I run it in 2x retina (lower equivalent pixels than default)
+1 I like the T2 and improved security by default (now I'm encrypting my old machine and it hope it doesn't slow it down too much)
+0 Shockingly, I'm actually neutral on the keyboard. My issues with my old machine have resolved and with the old keyboard, I can tell when I press the keys. with the new keyboard I often hit it and get no input.
+0 Less shockingly, I don't care about a physical escape key (I use caps lock). a forward delete would be huge.
-9 It runs stupidly hotter