(2019) 16" is HOT & NOISY with an external monitor! :(

[IceStormNG]

Any idea how apple cinema 27” behaves? Iam considering one secondhand

The 27" Cinema Display is pretty overpriced by today's standards. For that money you can get a much better screen factory new.

Just my 2c.

 

[new_user28]

Hi all

I have not been through all of the previous 168 pages, but in a summary my understanding is that the Macbook Pro 16 inch with 5300m/5500m GPU suffers from excessive noise and overheating when connected to an external display.

On the basis that I am planning to use the laptop without connecting it an external display, would you recommend buying one (particularly the base model)? (Note: I will definitely wait for Tuesday's event to check whether a newer version will be available, but if not I am wondering whether I should buy last year's version).

I should also add that except for some possible light gaming (title of game that I would like to play Civilisation 6) every now and then, I will not be using the laptop for any graphic intensive operations. Should I expect for the laptop to overheat in this case, even though it will not be connected to an external display?

Many thanks in advance.

 

[IceStormNG]

Hi all

I have not been through all of the previous 168 pages, but in a summary my understanding is that the Macbook Pro 16 inch with 5300m/5500m GPU suffers from excessive noise and overheating when connected to an external display.

On the basis that I am planning to use the laptop without connecting it an external display, would you recommend buying one (particularly the base model)? (Note: I will definitely wait for Tuesday's event to check whether a newer version will be available, but if not I am wondering whether I should buy last year's version).

I should also add that except for some possible light gaming (title of game that I would like to play Civilisation 6) every now and then, I will not be using the laptop for any graphic intensive operations. Should I expect for the laptop to overheat in this case, even though it will not be connected to an external display?

Many thanks in advance.

If you don't connect your machine to an external display, you're fine. The machine is surprisingly silent when used as a laptop (=> without external display) even under higher load.

The machine also does not overheat it just gets hot which makes the fans noisy.
Overheating would mean that it has to throttle down or shutdown to protect itself. (well, it does throttle under high GPU load but that's not because of an external monitor but because Apple decided not to cool the VRMs. See the thermal pad modification for a fix).

 

[new_user28]

If you don't connect your machine to an external display, you're fine. The machine is surprisingly silent when used as a laptop (=> without external display) even under higher load.

The machine also does not overheat it just gets hot which makes the fans noisy.
Overheating would mean that it has to throttle down or shutdown to protect itself. (well, it does throttle under high GPU load but that's not because of an external monitor but because Apple decided not to cool the VRMs. See the thermal pad modification for a fix).

This is helpful.

Assuming that I do not apply the thermal pad modification fix, would the machine get significantly hot/noisy and/or suffer from throttling when browsing the web/watching Netflix, Youtube and/or playing a video game (this being the most intensive GPU operation that I will use the laptop for)? To be clear, I would not undertake all of these activities simultaneously.

For a bit of additional info, the laptop from which I would upgrade is a MBP 2015 13". Throughout the years, I have been incredibly happy with how this laptop has coped with my light usage (not played any video games on it) despite sometimes using it in bed or on some non-flat surfaces it has always stayed incredibly cool and never had any issues with it becoming hot. Hence the reason for asking the questions.

Thank you very much for your input.

 

[IceStormNG]

If you read the post about the thermal Pad fix, you will notice that the 16“ will throttle under Gaming load. The CPU will then lock itself to 1.0 or 1.8GHz until the VRMs cooled down (which will not happen while playing the game).

This also happens when doing a lot of video editing or video encoding (Final Cut, Premiere Pro, ...). For me it was most noticeable when exporting videos from final cut. The CPU locked itself to 1GHz and heavily slowed the export down. After placing the thermal pads onto the VRMs, this doesn’t happen anymore.
Everting else on your list won’t cause the VRM throttle to kick in

 

[Mity]

What app is this? https://forums.macrumors.com/attachments/bildschirmfoto-2020-10-07-um-22-45-28-png.964017/

I'd like to report on my experience with my new MBP 16" 5600m. I'm only playing a video on Udemy and have pages open and my fans are very loud. I guess about 2800-3000 rpms (I have an MSI GS60 which is a bit louder than this so I have a base case to compare off.).

Edit: I found out elsewhere that this is iStat Menus by bjango: https://bjango.com/mac/istatmenus/

Just an FYI for anyone looking to install iStat Menus on their 16", you have to use the link mentioned below. If you download it from the website, that version doesn't have all of the sensor data. imgur.com/8MDOhlW

----------

I've had a full 2 days with my 16" i9 2.3 / 64GB / 1TB / 5600m and I can conclude that this machine is truly unremarkable. The numbers below are with the lid closed and connected to a LG 43UD79-B 3820x2160 monitor and a LG 29EA73 2560x1080 monitor. Video showing setup: imgur.com/P9V0KL1

The following is a typical scenario for me: a video on Udemy to learn coding, 47 chrome tabs open to see reference material (static pages), and the Mail app. I am using Google Chrome. I don't even have Postgres or Tableau running yet and here are the stats:
imgur.com/z8beRle

And no, my computer is not indexing. I only have a few files stored in iCloud. Even though Chrome can utilize a lot of resources, I have 64GB of RAM. That more than enough for the tasks that I've described above. And after closing all of these programs, the computer is back to being quiet:
imgur.com/hzwCNyw

So, it's a quiet machine, as long as yo don't use it. The worst thing is that my 2015 MSI GS60 i7 6700HQ makes about the same amount of noise under load. The MBP 16 is only quieter with few tasks running.

Edit: These are the stats while installing pandas

imgur.com/OWKyaYr
imgur.com/cOsS5jN
imgur.com/CEPP5gK

The connection ports don't matter - I've tried HDMI via the Sabrent Thunderbolt 3 to Dual HDMI 2.0 Adapter, Cable Matters Display Port to USB-C cable and neither make any difference. I've also tried connecting only the 4K monitor and that did nothing. The last screenshot above was actually with only the 4K monitor attached while pandas was installing.

I forgot to mention that I tried a 20 Gbps Thunderbolt 3 Cable for a direct connection and it wouldn't even connect to my Mac. That cable works fine with my MSI GS60.

 

[GumaRodak]

Civilization 6 will trigger fans in like 2-3 minutes. I have played it. Considering an cheap egpu for light gaming on internal display to avoid unnecesary heat generation inside the mbp

 

[Ramonitor]

Civilization 6 will trigger fans in like 2-3 minutes. I have played it. Considering an cheap egpu for light gaming on internal display to avoid unnecesary heat generation inside the mbp

Any suggestions for a cheap eGPU to at least fix the fan noise / heat issue (apart from gaming)?

 

[Ramonitor]

I just did force my LG 38wk95c 38 inch screen to be exactly 60hz instead of 59.something and I have the feeling it makes the fans a lot more quiet. Is it expected that the Radeon High Side sensor to still show a draw of around 20 watts in this case?

Any thoughts on this? Is it logical that the power draw did *not* change after syncing refresh rate to exactly 60hz, but the constant fan noise I had previously seems to be gone.

 

[Camberwell Carrots]

Hey @IceStormNG

I've now done the VRM mod. I was skeptical that a bit of thermal padding would work at first but thought it's only £10 to find out. I have my machine set up to two monitors at 50Hz refresh 1080P which gives me a 5Watt High Radion Gpu power draw at idle, rather than the usual 20Watts at higher refresh rates / resolutions. Together with this and the VRM mod I can't seem to push my fans past 2500 rpm for my everyday usage - heavy sets (Music Production). Which makes the machine silent, which is crazy as before the machine would blast at max rpm and once or twice my machine throttled to 1.5ghz. I also have a stand that put's my mac at an angle (clam shell mode), so the only other mod I could think of now would be to get a stand with active fan cooling but im not sure ill need! Ofcourse I need to test for a few more weeks to be sure, but wanted to say thanks! Yes the cover was a huge pain to get off but I did it without damaging it!

 

[Mity]

I'm in Germany (and I also have Apple Care+). You can remove the pads without residue. So Apple won't know what I did if I don't tell them... and I won't.

It dissipates some of the heat through the bottom plate. The plate is out of aluminium. The VRMs definitely need cooling. they're naked and not in the airflow at all. They're cooled through ambient air in the case.

The TB3 chips are also not cooled but Air streams over them when the fans run loud. Sadly, apply put some sticker on them. Either to make the inside look nice or it's a heatshield. I haven't removed the sticker as that wouldn't be reversible anymore and would definitely void my warranty.

The other point is: Heat will of course collect under the MacBook now as there's really low clearance between the bottom plate and the desk, so my desk gets pretty toasty. If I move the MacBook a few centimeters to the side onto a cool spot, its temperatures drop by a few °C (especially the TB3 drops by 4-5°C in 1 minute). This means: A cooling stand (even without fans), or a vertical stand when using clamshell mode, would now increase cooling even more because the bottom plate acts as a giant heatsink for VRM and TB3 controllers.

So, the bottom plate is acting as a heatsink? If that's the case and your table is getting hot, try putting bottle caps under each corner. I use these to give me almost an inch of clearance:

https://imgur.com/AyXCyER

 

[antipodean]

Any suggestions for a cheap eGPU to at least fix the fan noise / heat issue (apart from gaming)?

Not sure if it meets your definition of “cheap”, but the BlackMagic 580-based eGPU is certainly quiet. As in you will likely struggle to hear it at all.

 

[GumaRodak]

Any suggestions for a cheap eGPU to at least fix the fan noise / heat issue (apart from gaming)?

I would say some with radeon 580 or a 5500xt as a newer card... i do some research on site egpu.io

 

[Camberwell Carrots]

Not sure if it meets your definition of “cheap”, but the BlackMagic 580-based eGPU is certainly quiet. As in you will likely struggle to hear it at all.

why would you spend hundreds of dollars on an eGpu, when for 10 dollars you can prevent throttling with the VRM mod?

 

[IceStormNG]

So, the bottom plate is acting as a heatsink? If that's the case and your table is getting hot, try putting bottle caps under each corner. I use these to give me almost an inch of clearance

I tested it with an old laptop cooling stand I found here. When I put the machine on that and power on the two 140mm fans of the stand, temperature of the MacBook drops significantly. The 140mm fans are very quiet on low RPM. Especially compared to the jet engines of the MacBook itself.


@Camberwell Carrots

Great that it worked for you. Yeah it's ridiculous how 10$ worth of thermal pads can fix this expensive machine. I mean: Apple's cooling has always been a joke but they clearly didn't learned from the 2018 MBP which had exactly this problem... just way more extreme.

Dell has learned and made the heatsink a bit longer on the newer XPS 15 to also cover the VRMs.

 

[petterihiisila]

Any suggestions for a cheap eGPU to at least fix the fan noise / heat issue (apart from gaming)?

Try search in this thread, “Razer” as the keyword. More info there.

In short: Razer Core X and a Radeon 580-based card gets rid of laptop fan noise pollution, and they’re both often available second-hand. Plenty fast for multi-4k desktop use. Plug and play, no drivers needed. Check that the 580 can turn its fans off under light loads, “0 dB mode” or similar.

Optionally, a Noctua NF-A12x25 FLX fan replacement to make the enclosure itself whisper-quiet. It’s a trivial drop-in operation, 5 minutes, 4 screws.

Optionally, a Radeon 5700-based card for more performance, if you know you‘re going to need it. No need to “future-proof” this part, because this year’s flagship card is likely next-year’s mid tier card anyway, at half the price. Progress is fast in this front.

 

[mouthster]

I just wish there was a way to cap the performance of the 5500m.

 

[Ramonitor]

Thanks all for suggestions about eGPU's! Will definitely try the VMR mod first! Just installed Turbo Boost Switcher, together with the vertical Hz sync via SwitchResX might solve the problem already. If not, an eGPU might be worth the money.

 

[Jbk123]

Just wanted to clarify, what does the VRM mod do exactly, does it prevent the high power drain in GPU when connecting to an external monitor? I saw the old fix was to use SwitchResX

 

[LithiumChrome]

Just wanted to clarify, what does the VRM mod do exactly, does it prevent the high power drain in GPU when connecting to an external monitor? I saw the old fix was to use SwitchResX

Apologies I haven't been through all the pages but could you please explain (or link me to) the SwitchResX solution? The main issue for me is battery drain when connecting to an external monitor. Not getting any issues with fan speed but I'm not using my MacBook for intensive processes.

 

[Jbk123]

Roughly like this:

1. Get SwitchRexX (I think this requires paid version but not 100% sure).
2. Disable SIP, detailed guide here: https://www.madrau.com/support/support/srx_1011.html
3. Open SwitchResX, select your monitor, open Custom resolutions.
4. Click plus (+) button to add a resolution.
5. In the appearing modal window, make sure you have Custom resolution selected in the dropdown and change Vertical scan rate to e.g. 55Hz or 50Hz. Press OK.
6. Go to File -> Save Settings (or just press cmd + S)
7. Restart your macBook.
8. Open SwitchResX, select your monitor, open Current Resolutions.
9. Change resolution to the one you created above (look for the 55Hz or 50HZ refresh rate).
10. You can now re-enable SIP.

Hope this helps, a bit more info with screenshots can be found in the manual https://www.madrau.com/srx_howtouseit/howtouseit.html



Could someone confirm? I had this worked for me back in April before I reset my computer

 

[Jbk123]

Apologies I haven't been through all the pages but could you please explain (or link me to) the SwitchResX solution? The main issue for me is battery drain when connecting to an external monitor. Not getting any issues with fan speed but I'm not using my MacBook for intensive processes.

Go to page 90 something on this tread.

 

[Hollycene]

Roughly like this:

1. Get SwitchRexX (I think this requires paid version but not 100% sure).
2. Disable SIP, detailed guide here: https://www.madrau.com/support/support/srx_1011.html
3. Open SwitchResX, select your monitor, open Custom resolutions.
4. Click plus (+) button to add a resolution.
5. In the appearing modal window, make sure you have Custom resolution selected in the dropdown and change Vertical scan rate to e.g. 55Hz or 50Hz. Press OK.
6. Go to File -> Save Settings (or just press cmd + S)
7. Restart your macBook.
8. Open SwitchResX, select your monitor, open Current Resolutions.
9. Change resolution to the one you created above (look for the 55Hz or 50HZ refresh rate).
10. You can now re-enable SIP.

Hope this helps, a bit more info with screenshots can be found in the manual https://www.madrau.com/srx_howtouseit/howtouseit.html



Could someone confirm? I had this worked for me back in April before I reset my computer

Hey Jbk123, I recently tried your solution, but unfortunately it doesn't work for me. Is there anything else I could try? Have you guys solved this gpu wattage issue? It's driving me crazy.

MBP 16, i9, 64GB, 5500m 8GB, Catalina 10.15.7

 

[ght56]

Hey Jbk123, I recently tried your solution, but unfortunately it doesn't work for me. Is there anything else I could try? Have you guys solved this gpu wattage issue? It's driving me crazy.

MBP 16, i9, 64GB, 5500m 8GB, Catalina 10.15.7

What is your display setup?

 

[Hollycene]

Ou I realized that this SwitchRexX solution only works for clamshell mode. Is that a truth? Is there really no fix to open lid with 5500m macbooks? I'm so disappointed. You literally cannot work with external monitor with lid open on internal keyboard unless you accept that your fingers gonna burn down. Sad story for this "pro" notebooks.

btw I connect MBP16, i9, 64GB, 5500m 8GB, Catalina 10.15.7 to FullHD 60HZ Benq monitor via VGA adapter and also get 18Watts GPU usage when open lid.