As has appened already plenty times in the past, MacBook Pro actually run better with Windows. This is absurd on so many levels. Apple with their stupid yearly software upgrade cycle bullsh*t has really dropped the ball, and we're all paying for it. Just give us back Snow Leopard and call it a day.
Got a tip for us?
Let us know
Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
(2019) 16" is HOT & NOISY with an external monitor! :(
- Thread starter Appledoesnotlisten
- Start date
- Sort by reaction score
Nothing official back from AMD on mine, but filed with both AMD and via Apple Feedback.
Anyone still reading at this point should certainly do both:
AMD: https://www.amdsurveys.com/se/5A1E27D23A3DE966
Apple Feedback for MBP: https://www.apple.com/feedback/macbookpro.html
Last edited:
I don't want to come across as needing spoon-feeding, but can you post your text/description on here.... more people likely to log these issues if they can just copy/paste, and maintain consistency
What do you use your MacBook for if you don’t mind i ask. 64gb ram used often?I don't want to come across as needing spoon-feeding, but can you post your text/description on here.... more people likely to log these issues if they can just copy/paste, and maintain consistency
I use it for dev, but also it's my mobile lab as I'm an IT consultant... so running many VMs concurrently such as win 10, server, sharepoint, sql etc. Part of the jump to 64GB was that I bought refurbished and the difference between 2.4/32GB and 2.3/64GB was £130 over here.
My 2015 rMBP also throttles back the CPU when doing GPU-intensive tasks with my 2 4k monitors hooked up to it. It throttles the CPU to like 1.5ghz, which is a whole ghz lower than the *base* clock speed. I read online that other people have the same issue. Strangely enough, it doesn't seem to happen in Windows. Makes me think macOS does something funny with the clock speeds on Macbook Pros. Hopefully a software update will fix it? I've repasted it so the thermals are as good as they can get on this thing. You can only do so much with a razor thin heatsink...
I was strongly considering buying the base MacBook Pro 16 but the horror stories online have me reconsidering. I can't stand a loud machine or one that randomly locks up. Worst part is Apple knows about the issue but won't fix the underlying problem. I'm thinking about grabbing a fully loaded 2020 MacBook Pro 13 now as the benchmarks are showing it being pretty close to the 16 inch, at least in single core scores. My 2017 MBP has been dead silent for all my workloads, it does bog down from time to time with the measly dual core CPU.
For those of you that have the 16 inch, when plugged in to the wall does it still make tons of fan noise when using the GPU or is the problem only when connecting to an external display?
For those of you that have the 16 inch, when plugged in to the wall does it still make tons of fan noise when using the GPU or is the problem only when connecting to an external display?
I'm occasionally seeing kernel panics when waking from sleep. Kinda annoying as macOS (more like Mac OS X) was once a pillar of stability.
Not sure if it helps, but I can do light gaming with no audible fan noise whatsoever. Obviously demanding titles or games that pump the CPU will cause fan noise, but that’s to be expected. Very often I’ll hear the fans kick in only when running a game but switching to the Finder to do a few things.
Only you can determine what is acceptable. At max speed, it does sound blowy, but I rarely get there for long with what I do and I’m not sure if it’s much or any worse than the 2012-15 era Pros. Maybe a little but not much.
[automerge]1589305857[/automerge]
Be sure to keep sending them to Apple when the reporting wizard pops up. The more we send, the more likely they might actually do something about it.
I recommend saving them as well, so you’ve got a record if you ever have more serious problems (not that they aren’t serious) and need to negotiate with Apple.
Last edited:
For sure that does help, have you had any other problems with it? How about when connecting to an external display?
Yup, I always send logs to Apple.
[automerge]1589306051[/automerge]
No real problems with fans. I connect to an LG 5K and don't see much spin up unless I'm firing up multiple VMs.
I don’t use an external display, so I can’t help with that, sorry. I’ll be happy to do a few other tests and record audio with my phone if you’d like.
With general use and things like photo applications, I don’t think you’ll hear the fans much. Only when doing intensive processing and exporting, or when multitasking a lot of things quickly do they really kick in.
Battery life isn’t as good as I expected given the 100 Wh battery, so I tend to disable turbo boost on battery and that helps. I’m guessing it’s still better than comparable Windows laptop however.
Apart from the occasional sleep panic that everybody seems to be getting and maybe a little whine somewhere around 2/3 to 3/4 fan speed I’ve not had any problems.
Last edited:
Go ahead and grab the fully loaded 2020 MacBook Pro 13 and then spend an extra $600 on an eGPU if you're going to use external displays (which you maybe would've spent getting the 16"?). You should then be golden!
As this entire thread makes bare, you're likely to fall into the 95th percentile of customers with external display issues w/ the 16" Macbook Pro. If you have zero issues, consider yourself lucky enough to fall into the remaining 5% of customers in this thread content with their external display usage.
An eGPU has shown to fix the external display issues, but of course, that is an even more expensive alternative to something that shouldn't even be an issue.
Full disclaimer: I just ordered a Macbook Pro 16" today, but I've also ordered an eGPU enclosure and an additional Radeon 5500XT graphics card so that I can smoothly power my two external ultra-widescreen monitors.
Last edited:
Nice setup!
Re your question - not exactly the same test you did, but I was posting istats results after approx 30min of light use with external monitor - both fans were at minimum (overall temp increased 10-15 st C):
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/16-mbp-i7-or-i9.2212684/post-28036911
You have super wide monitor, I've been testing on standard 4k - this may cause different results.
I may try 30mins with 1920x1080 YouTube on external 4k monitor during weekend. I'll report back if I do this.
The problem is only when you connect to an external display and you also open the lid.
It's very specific.
If you keep the lid closed, you just need a USB-C or Thunderbolt 3 display, or the right adapter.
In normal use, I have not heard the fan on my 16" at all. Not during Zoom, not even when I compile some more intensive projects.
Do not listen to people who recommend you to get an external GPU. I have an external GPU with a 13" MacBook Pro. Been there, done that. The external GPU at idle is louder than my MacBook Pro 16" with the lid open (the worst possible configuration) under heavy load. It makes sense because the external GPU needs its own power supply, which has a fan, plus the GPU itself needs its own fan.
I think I have kept saying this multiple times in this thread but people keep ignoring the facts.
An external GPU even at idle has far worse fan noise than the 16" MacBook Pro by itself. Unless you specifically get one of those external GPUs that have passive cooling (which performs horribly anyways).
I went from 13" + eGPU to 16". The 16" is better in every way possible. If portability is not a concern, the 16" should be at the top of your list. Otherwise, get the 13" for portability. It cannot be beaten.
Fan noise is a known issue with all external GPUs. Bar none.
Sorry if I offend anyone with the above, but... I find it weird that people would want to go eGPU to fix "fan noise" with the 16". It's baffling. If you have used an external GPU, it's the inverse of what you can call "silent".
notebookcheck checked the 16" to have the same fan noise under heavy load as those eGPU I linked above at... idle. So yeah... it's consistent with my own experience.
Apple MacBook Pro 16 2019 Laptop Review: A convincing Core i9-9880H and Radeon Pro 5500M powered multimedia laptop
Notebookcheck.com reviews the flagship model of the MacBook Pro 16, Apple's latest multimedia laptop. The machine comes with an AMD Radeon Pro 5500M GPU and an Intel Core i9-9880H CPU, along with 16 GB of DDR4-2666 RAM and a 1 TB SSD. Read on to find out why have awarded the MacBook Pro 16 top...
Last edited:
Makes sense. I figued those egpu boxes had to be noisy.
While I'm unhappy with the excess heat that seems to be tied in to the way the Radeon card works in the 16", I have to say I was surprised to read all of the comments over the past few months that the 16" has louder fans than the previous 15" model.
My friend's 15" has noisier fans than my 16". I don't really notice the 16" fans until they get up to around 3500 rpm. Maybe 2800 if I'm in a really quiet room. I found the sound of the 15" fans to be more annoying though at full blast - as if you can hear the air getting sucked through smaller passageways. The 16" sounds like it's breathing better for sure. Of course I guess maybe my friend has a lot of dust inside his 15"...
To me the fan noise is a concern, but honestly I'd take a slightly more aggressive fan curve and lower CPU temperatures over the current apple strategy to let the CPU run up to 100 degrees celsius before really kicking the fans on. I also find it annoying that once the fans get up to over 3k or so, they want to stay there for a few minutes - even if the CPU has cooled down sufficiently and isn't even under load anymore. I wish they would quiet down right away as temperatures come back down.
I've tried making custom fan profiles using 3rd party programs but I don't like how the fan speed seems to jump around a lot - that's more annoying to me than a smooth and consistent fan speed.
While I'm unhappy with the excess heat that seems to be tied in to the way the Radeon card works in the 16", I have to say I was surprised to read all of the comments over the past few months that the 16" has louder fans than the previous 15" model.
My friend's 15" has noisier fans than my 16". I don't really notice the 16" fans until they get up to around 3500 rpm. Maybe 2800 if I'm in a really quiet room. I found the sound of the 15" fans to be more annoying though at full blast - as if you can hear the air getting sucked through smaller passageways. The 16" sounds like it's breathing better for sure. Of course I guess maybe my friend has a lot of dust inside his 15"...
To me the fan noise is a concern, but honestly I'd take a slightly more aggressive fan curve and lower CPU temperatures over the current apple strategy to let the CPU run up to 100 degrees celsius before really kicking the fans on. I also find it annoying that once the fans get up to over 3k or so, they want to stay there for a few minutes - even if the CPU has cooled down sufficiently and isn't even under load anymore. I wish they would quiet down right away as temperatures come back down.
I've tried making custom fan profiles using 3rd party programs but I don't like how the fan speed seems to jump around a lot - that's more annoying to me than a smooth and consistent fan speed.
It's because macos uses 3D (GPU) a lot for the interface. Using more GPU just for the basic UI means less thermal capacity available for the CPU.
The GPU is hardwired to the display ports so it keeps it on all the time with an external display...makes it run so hot
Obviously if your doing something very GPU intensive then you might well want an eGPU with the 13. However it’s perfectly capable of running 2 x 4K external screens without one (Or 1 x higher res)
For my use case I run some VM’s, coding and such but nothing generally that’s GPU heavy in my day to day. Hence I figured a i7 / 32GB 13 would suit me nicely as I value the portability.
I’m reasonably confident it’ll do external screens without any increase in noise at all really.
I have seen people mention this a few times. Specifically talking about clamshell mode, is HDMI problem with higher power draw on the 16"?
My other concern is that my current monitor (Dell U2713HM), which I plan to use with the new computer until I can afford a 4K monitor), is connected via DisplayPort, which I understand is slightly different than Thunderbolt. Anyone have any experience they care to share?
Sorry, but this is just not true. It may be your experience, with your chosen eGPU and your chosen graphics card, but it is not mine.
The Blackmagic eGPU is reported to have a noise level of 18dB. Only audible with your ear right next to it.
I just got a Razer Core X Chroma and Sapphire Pulse RX 5500 XT 4GB to eliminate crippling performance issues (not heat/noise) on my 2019 MBP 15". The Sapphire card was noted to be very quiet in reviews (40dB under load).
It is *slightly* louder than the MBP at idle with internal display (~2100 RPM). I measured the noise level with my iPhone as 28dB next to my ear at my normal sitting position, about 2 feet away from the eGPU.
It is *considerably* quieter than the MBP at max fans (~5900 RPM). The sound is a much lower pitch, too, with larger and lower RPM fans, which you can swap out if you want it even quieter. You can also put it under the desk. I have mine next to the monitor.
The graphics card fans don't even spin up at all below 50C, which is most of the time because the most intensive graphics work I do is video conferencing and macOS "Mission Control" and "App Exposé" gesture animations.
I ran some tests in a fresh Catalina install to compare CPU performance (Cinebench) with an external 4K display at "looks like 2560x1440" scaled resolution, both with the eGPU and the dGPU, as performance is my primary concern (not noise and heat, which may be the cause of the degraded performance).
1. Sustaining 47-50W and 2.7-2.9GHz with external display and eGPU after 95 passes
2. Sustaining 47-50W and 2.7-3.1GHz with external display and eGPU and Luxmark eGPU benchmark (no change)
3. Sustaining 34-37W and 2.3-2.5GHz with external display and dGPU
4. Sustaining 26-30W and 1.9-2.1GHz with external display and dGPU and Discord 1-1 video chat in Safari
5. Drops from sustained 40W to 23W with external display and dGPU and Luxmark dGPU benchmark
That's a significant drop in CPU performance, from (2) sustained 47-50W and 2.7-3.1GHz even with an extreme GPU benchmark running concurrently, down to (4) 26-30W and 1.9-2.1GHz while doing a 1-1 video conference in Safari. I also tested in Chrome, and the native Discord app, with no significant difference.
You can also see the immediate negative impact on CPU performance when a dGPU benchmark runs concurrently (5), vs no impact at all when an eGPU benchmark runs concurrently (2).
This morning, after a couple hours of light to medium work with external display attached to eGPU, CPU frequencies are frequently averaging 3.3-3.5GHz and peaking at 4.1GHz, and the 15" fans are ~2500. Without the eGPU in the past, with the same external display at the same resolution, the system fans would be near max in this scenario and CPU performance would be lower.
I'll run the same tests on a 16" next week.
To anyone who wants CPU performance, get the 8-core 16" and use it with internal display only or an eGPU. If you don't need CPU performance and must use it with internal and external displays, get the 4-core 13". If you're on the fence, get one or both and test them out. Send it back if you're not happy. Apple has a 2 week return policy.
Attachments
-
1. Sustaining 47-50W and 2.7-2.9GHz with external display and eGPU.png -
2. Sustaining 47-50W and 2.7-3.1GHz with external display and eGPU and Luxmark eGPU benchmark ...png -
3. Sustaining 34-37W and 2.3-2.5GHz with external display and dGPU.png -
4. Sustaining 26-30W and 1.9-2.1GHz with external display and dGPU and Discord 1-1 video chat ...png -
5. Drops from sustained 40W to 23W with external display and dGPU and Luxmark dGPU benchmark.png
Here is a data point that I hope helps someone. My 2019 16” with 5300 GPU was showing 17-18W with my external 2560x1440@60 HZ display. (Plugged into HP G2 TB3 dock via DisplayPort-DisplayPort.) At idle the fans were running at 1800 RPM, but it was still hotter than without the external display. This was in clamshell mode.
What worked for me was something people have suggested: getting SwitchResX and playing with the refresh rate. The display goes up to 75 Hz, but setting it to that didn’t work. What did work was some oddball frequencies like 45.00 and 57.00. It looks no different than 59.88 which is what it was before, but that dropped the GPU (again, in clamshell mode) down to under 5 watts at idle. Even running a video or webgl demo, the GPU stays at 7-8 watts.
While my fans were manageable at idle before, this gives much more headroom. Total system power at idle drops to 15W. Running Intel Power Gadget, the system boosts to 4 GHz on all six cores indefinitely, while keeping system power under 75 watts.
What worked for me was something people have suggested: getting SwitchResX and playing with the refresh rate. The display goes up to 75 Hz, but setting it to that didn’t work. What did work was some oddball frequencies like 45.00 and 57.00. It looks no different than 59.88 which is what it was before, but that dropped the GPU (again, in clamshell mode) down to under 5 watts at idle. Even running a video or webgl demo, the GPU stays at 7-8 watts.
While my fans were manageable at idle before, this gives much more headroom. Total system power at idle drops to 15W. Running Intel Power Gadget, the system boosts to 4 GHz on all six cores indefinitely, while keeping system power under 75 watts.
Last edited: