2023 Formula 1 Season thread

[CWallace]

I think Ferrari did all they could to get second. They just couldn’t with just one horse in the race compared to Mercedes two.

I know they were pinning their hopes on a late Safety Car, but they should have pitted Sainz with enough time to try and get back into the points as by 10 to go, an SC/VSC was very unlikely and every lap they waited past that ensured he would not finish in the points.

I’m not expecting a big change in racing for wins next season. RBR have been working on their 2024 car since April.

Yes, I expect Max will continue to dominate next season. I think McLaren might be in the best position to challenge them for wins, as Mercedes will likely still be working on moving from the "zero sidepod" concept of the W13 and W14 and Ferrari is...well, Ferrari.

 

[cyb3rdud3]

Hamilton still wouldn't win. 🤣

Well, I'm not so sure. I think he looks stunning! Especially compared to Max Verstappen

 

[TheIntruder]

Once it became pretty clear that Verstappen would not face a serious challenger for the title, I was mostly curious whether RBR could pull off what McLaren didn't in 1988, and sweep the table, no thanks to Jean-Louis Schlesser…or Senna's impatience.

 

[Pezimak]

RB19 will without a doubt go down in history as one of the greatest race cars. Total domination all year.

So for this year, most outstanding team? McLaren, best driver? Piastri, he is a rookie and McLaren were a mid field team, they worked enough to be able to challenge the front and Piastri is a rookie who was getting front role quali results and harassing the front runners! Amazing work.

Another favourite is Alonso and Aston, my dream car manufacture and bar his VERY naughty brake check on Lewis today, he's an amazing old dog who can really tech the youngsters a thing or two.

But my team, RB. What fantastic work, nailed the rules nailed the car design and just utterly dominated. One for the history books, Max and the RB19 and the Red Bull F1 team of the 2023 season. And Perez nailing second.

Biggest surprise for me though has to have been the Las Vegas track, I truly thought it would be boring and dull, but it provided some of the most exciting racing all year!

 

[Pezimak]

I’m not knocking Max or RB. He is a great driver and it’s a great car. But the fact that they have won so many races by such a large margin is not good for the sport.

And yet Ferrari and Schumacer did the same and Mercedes and Lewis did the same, win after win after win, sometimes by 30 seconds. History has proved it's the nature of the sport some years.

 

[Biro]

History has proved it's the nature of the sport some years.

Exactly. It’s been the case for at least 25 years - maybe longer. And that’s a problem - at least for me. In the 90s we’d see a back marker or mid-field team pull off the odd win every season. No longer. Many Americans who have fallen in love with F1 over the past few years are beginning to grumble. Competition is usually much better on this side of the pond. And I say this as an F1 fan since the 1960s.

 

[JustinePaula]

There is a serious problem in F1, and they, F1/FIA/Liberty don't seem too worried about it, it is not right or healthy for 1 competitor to be this dominant, it starts to affect the brand, folks want to see duels, who will ever forget the last season of Rosberg, the duel in the desert, that was so exciting.. We love close combat...This is what F1 should be, 20 cars, 20 drivers, down to the last race, like F2 was..

The points are stupid, way too many, and no incentive to go for the win.. If a win is possible.. Not enough pitstops, and the dull pathetic crack-cocaine derived sprints, which are not delivering what it promised.. Sprints should be for the 3rd or F2 drivers to race for, 6 events, so they get enough track miles, and some sort of bragging rights.. But for the WDC, insane and juvenile..

All too often, where were the sane rational adults, 1 time, they pitched, event cancelled, rightfully so.. But the calendar as a whole for F1/F2/F3 was not at all well considered..Then Las Vegas, cold temps, no support events, I can see why, maybe the bloke running F2/F3 is in fact adult, sane, rational, and thought ahead, and maybe surmised it would not be in the brand's best interest, rather take it to Adu Dhabi..Great...

In every decade there has always been at least 1 dominant team, or driver, I wonder if now, it is too much, how much of the car is driven by the meat in the seat, and how much is done via fibre to Brackley? Maybe time to tone down the bits and bytes, and leave it up to the meat in the seat.. Ditch the electronics, have a semi auto gearbox, and bring back at least 3 optional gear selection options, so that you have more of a match between track and engine, not as it is now, you arrive in testing with the ratio's for the season.. I would suggest that maybe 2nd to 10th each lower position gets more options for changes.. Or a kg of ballast per point...

Glad this disaster of a season is over, nothing to really stand out, no real winners, sad that the blokes that are in charge cannot see the writing on the wall.. Why should they care, they are paid regardless of how bad the season is.. Max will never know how good/bad/mediocre a driver he is, as he will never really have a challenge, how sad that must be, how hollow, all fake.. Like costume jewels, plastic and pathetic.. Oh well, Congrats to Max on his 4th and 5th titles in 2024/2025...

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

Once it became pretty clear that Verstappen would not face a serious challenger for the title, I was mostly curious whether RBR could pull off what McLaren didn't in 1988, and sweep the table, no thanks to Jean-Louis Schlesser…or Senna's impatience.

Thankfully they didn’t and Sainz managed to break the monotony in Singapore. 1988 is remembered as a season with the most perfect race car of the modern F1 era at this point. I think this years Red Bull will also be seen in this light within time. I don’t remember another car this dominant in all my years following the sport. It’s definitely one of the greats.

I’d gladly go the rest of my life not seeing it repeated by anybody else though.

 

[pachyderm]

F1 is a joke, a meme, worse than 1980's WWF with Hulk and the Million Dollar Man.. F1 is so fake and forgetful.. I wonder how many true fans are left.. The season is way too long, the points system is insane, it is harder to not get points, than get points..

I remember when I think it was Prost having a go at Bernie about when they discussed raising the points from 1st to 6th, to 10th. Prost was livid, said it was a bad idea.. Now we have sprints, points for fastest lap, why no points for fastest pit stop, most laps led? Fasted car rebuild, fewest penalty points...

All Liberty are doing is putting lipstick on pre bacon, and sorry but no amount of lipstick is going to change it is still pre-bacon.. A pig is a pig, no matter what brand of lipstick used..

Agreed

 

[Abdichoudxyz]

Well, I'm not so sure. I think he looks stunning!

I admit I was stunned by that... thing he's wearing. 🤯

 

[Abdichoudxyz]

Glad this disaster of a season is over, nothing to really stand out, no real winners, sad that the blokes that are in charge cannot see the writing on the wall.. Why should they care, they are paid regardless of how bad the season is.. Max will never know how good/bad/mediocre a driver he is, as he will never really have a challenge, how sad that must be, how hollow, all fake.. Like costume jewels, plastic and pathetic.. Oh well, Congrats to Max on his 4th and 5th titles in 2024/2025...

What does this even mean?? 🤔🤷‍♂️

 

[Pezimak]

Max will never know how good/bad/mediocre a driver he is, as he will never really have a challenge, how sad that must be, how hollow, all fake.. Like costume jewels, plastic and pathetic.. Oh well, Congrats to Max on his 4th and 5th titles in 2024/2025...

I guess the years Max was in F1 before winning his first championship didn’t exist then? Nor all the prior years he was racing most likely since he was a child. Your comment totally disregards the years of racing they all have to do to reach an F1 drivers level. A bit naive really. Max has learnt a lot I think and it shows.

 

[Don Quixote]

I guess the years Max was in F1 before winning his first championship didn’t exist then? Nor all the prior years he was racing most likely since he was a child. Your comment totally disregards the years of racing they all have to do to reach an F1 drivers level. A bit naïve really. Max has learnt a lot I think and it shows.

he he he...

 

[Biro]

Your comment totally disregards the years of racing they all have to do to reach an F1 drivers level. A bit naive really. Max has learnt a lot I think and it shows.

As you say, all of the other drivers need to go through years of racings to reach F1 as well. And they weren’t winning very much. Only three wins out of 22 - and two of those three by Max’s teammate in the same car. The point of the other post is that the Red Bull is what has given Max this level of dominance. He may still be a very good driver - just like Hamilton and Schumacher. But they had dominant cars/teams as well. if the cars were much more equal, we’d have a better idea of just how good each driver is. Which is why F1 is really only a constructor’s championship these days.

 

[danpass]

For those complaining about dominance … that’s the point.

Someone dominates, other winners rise to the occasion (like McLaren), and the whole sport improves.

It always grates on me how many don’t understand this concept, or worse, refuse to accept it.

As far as a ‘solution’ goes …. LESS regulation.

-

 

[Abdichoudxyz]

Which is why F1 is really only a constructor’s championship these days.

When has it ever been anything else?

 

[Apple fanboy]

I think LeClerc has consistently shown a lack of ability to mix it up with Max. 3 chances he had at the start yesterday jump Max for the lead. I don't for a second think it would have changed the result, but we know Max will get his elbows out in a way LeClerc won't. Its cost him points this year for sure. Max knows when they both go for the same piece of track, he'll bail in a way Lewis or Alonso won't.

 

[Biro]

When has it ever been anything else?

Well, they have had something called the World Driver’s Championship since 1950. I submit that it has become irrrelevent.

 

[Pezimak]

As you say, all of the other drivers need to go through years of racings to reach F1 as well. And they weren’t winning very much. Only three wins out of 22 - and two of those three by Max’s teammate in the same car. The point of the other post is that the Red Bull is what has given Max this level of dominance. He may still be a very good driver - just like Hamilton and Schumacher. But they had dominant cars/teams as well. if the cars were much more equal, we’d have a better idea of just how good each driver is. Which is why F1 is really only a constructor’s championship these days.

Yes I agree, but that wasn’t my point to the OP, my point was aimed at the accusation Max is hollow and will never know what kind of driver he is as he has t been challenged this year. Which is utterly false as I pointed out, Max will know exactly what kind of driver he is, he has no place in F1 if he doesn’t.
You looked at the entire post and not the piece I specifically quoted.

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

For those complaining about dominance … that’s the point.

Someone dominates, other winners rise to the occasion (like McLaren), and the whole sport improves.

It always grates on me how many don’t understand this concept, or worse, refuse to accept it.

As far as a ‘solution’ goes …. LESS regulation.

-

I’m in a camp where I have followed the sport long enough to know every team strives to be dominant and it’s the nature of the sport for it to happen at certain periods.

I am a viewer who likes to see racing for wins though and although I know the point of the sport is to dominate, I also like to see the sport remaining fresh and exciting. That often isn’t the case in Formula One of course, but there is nothing wrong or ‘grating’ with hoping for better racing whilst acknowledging one team has done a better job in a certain period.

Less regulation doesn’t stop teams dominating either. Back in the good old days when McLaren were developing ‘qualifying’ engines with Honda, Williams were outspending every other team by £50m, Ferrari were developing fuel with Shell and exclusive tyres with Bridgestone, we still had dominance. The only way it was mixed up was when big teams experienced mechanical failures and teams like Ligier were able to sneak in a win. Budget caps were brought in the curb super rich teams from developing cars completely out of reach of the rest of the grid. Clearly Red Bull have found a performance advantage within these budgets (catering spends not included) so it doesn’t always work but at least the entire grid behind them are within 2 seconds of each other.

The only way you get pure racing with drivers being tested on pure ability against each other is a fully regulated series with identical cars. That’s not Formula One though and it’s an R&D category at the end of the day.

 

[Biro]

For those complaining about dominance … that’s the point.

Someone dominates, other winners rise to the occasion (like McLaren), and the whole sport improves.

It always grates on me how many don’t understand this concept, or worse, refuse to accept it.

As far as a ‘solution’ goes …. LESS regulation.

-

As I noted earlier, I’ve been an F1 fan since the 1960s. And each era has had its dominant players. Fangio in the 50s, Clark in the 60s, Stewart in the late 60s and early 70s, Senna and Prost in the 80s. With the exception of one year for McLaren, it was nothing like today in which the dominant driver/team pretty much cleaned up everything. The lack of reliability was one factor but the cars were much closer to each other.

And, something else having to do with the fans. I began to notice this a bit during the Senna era but it really took off in the Schumacher era. Fans who really didn’t want to see a race. Rather, they were there to bask in the greatness of their chosen driver and see the coronation every other week. The race was almost beside the point.

The race is also almost beside the point, with perhaps a few exceptions, for all of the Beautiful People and celebrities who show up at every race. And the F1 machine seems to be feeding into that because it’s a way to hype the glamor and generate more money.

And, make no mistake, F1 is all about the money these days. Note the resistance by teams to Andretti Racing’s effort to get a franchise. The presence of Andretti and GM would be great for the sport. But, for the teams, it’s all about the money.

It’s those who want to see a close race who are most frustrated these days. And I suspect they and fans of the status quo will never see eye to eye on that.

 

[Pezimak]

As I noted earlier, I’ve been an F1 fan since the 1960s. And each era has had its dominant players. Fangio in the 50s, Clark in the 60s, Stewart in the late 60s and early 70s, Senna in the 80s. With the exception of one year for McLaren, it was nothing like today in which the dominant driver/team pretty much cleaned up everything.

But this IS a rare event when a team does clean sweep it, Red Bull just had it together this year in a huge way. The presenters said it’s a record they set but also how a clean sweep doesn’t happen often like this year, next year it’s a new car I believe so could be totally different. Ferrari and McLaren have worked wonders, and Mercedes have even made their poor design work, although I believe next year they also have a new car.

I want RB to win, but also McLaren and Aston winning would be nice, I’m in it to see the racing, it’s why the Vegas track for me was great, I want to see the hard fought battles. It’s why I hate the tyre degradation lol as it means they can’t be racey all the time. Gotta look after those tyres, sigh.

 

[Apple fanboy]

I would be more than happy if no celebrities turned up at the races. Mostly the only celebrities I recognise are retired drivers.
One team always dominates when a major rule change comes in. Usually the gap isn't as big as it is right now. Sadly this is making some pretty dull racing. The fact that the RBR number 2 driver isn't challenging the no 1 very often. At least Weber, Ricardo and Roseburg kept their team mates honest.

 

[danpass]

I don’t recall pissing and moaning about Merc/Hamilton dominance.

So what happened in 2021? Someone figured it out, someone named Red Bull. After seven YEARS of trying to catch up they finally did and brought it to Mercedes.

That’s the kind of thing I like to see.

If I want to watch some spec series I’ll watch IndyCar or F4 races, maybe European F3 or F2.

But I don’t. Instead I want to the see pinnacle series, unbridled, unrestrained, everyone going for gold AND BEING FREE TO DO SO.

My solution for dominance is that teams are free TO DO WHATEVER THEY WANT within the box … But then they have to give up that secret within two race seasons

-

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

I don’t recall pissing and moaning about Merc/Hamilton dominance.

So what happened in 2021? Someone figured it out, someone named Red Bull. After seven YEARS of trying to catch up they finally did and brought it to Mercedes.

That’s the kind of thing I like to see.

If I want to watch some spec series I’ll watch IndyCar or F4 races, maybe European F3 or F2.

But I don’t. Instead I want to the see pinnacle series, unbridled, unrestrained, everyone going for gold AND BEING FREE TO DO SO.

My solution for dominance is that teams are free TO DO WHATEVER THEY WANT within the box … But then they have to give up that secret within two race seasons

-

I moaned a bit during the Mercedes era, especially after Rosberg retired, even though I support Hamilton. I enjoyed him being tested and pushed for wins and felt Bottas wasn't quite good enough. Plenty of people were vocal about Mercedes dominating and it went on a bit longer than we see now.