Yea I don't get how people can argue that coverage is not an important factor in purchasing a phone. Here in the US, Verizon is not popular because it's logo is a big checkmark. It's because of its coverage and its reliability...
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Yea I don't get how people can argue that coverage is not an important factor in purchasing a phone. Here in the US, Verizon is not popular because it's logo is a big checkmark. It's because of its coverage and its reliability...
Yep. If o2 hadn't of got the iPhone here first i don't think i'd have had one as i certainly wouldn't want a phone that, well, can't be used as a phone.
sorry to tell you this but it is the Apple fanboys that use that argument to bash people who like Android. I know plenty of people who really like the droid 3 which is 3G only and they jumped on it as soon as Verizon released it.
High end Android phones as a group out sells the iPhone.
in the high in for at least Android more people are choosing the OS they want first then choosing which phone. They are out selling the iPhone plane and simple.
AT&T smartphone market share of iPhones as dropped as AT&T is finally started offering some real Android phones. Market share I am referring to is AT&T smart phones only so it is small subset of the smart phone market.
The problem is Android fanboys seem to think that 4G is an android innovation. It's not. Eventually Apple will have a 4G iphone and that 4G iphone will outsell every 4G Android phone. There's no way to think that that won't be the case simply because history doesn't lie. Every iteration of the iPhone has outsold every individual android phone, and is barely being outsold by the android phones collectively.
You can't really be arguing that when a 4G iPhone drops, that people are not going to buy it in droves, can you?
And you fail to understand people are more choosing an os first. More android phones on the market means those sales are split up.
I see that argument you are making is the way of trying to dodge the fact that android is popular. Accept that fact.
I do not know where you are getting the 4G is everything. Go to some android forums and you will see that 4G is more of a bonus at best for the device but not a large factor in choosing between phones.
I have an Atrix and i would not call it 4G. At best it is 3.5 g but I spend most of my time on wifi so what does it matter. I choose carrier then os then phone. The in the high end you generally see os choose come before phone.
If sales fall off, I imagine Apple/providers will adjust prices. You can pay a last generation iphone for $35 (USD) through ATT which I realize may not be an option where you live. Providers set rates, not Apple (I believe, but don't know for sure). I realize purchase prices start at Apple and flow downhill.
Recently I saw a Droid X and it did seem impressive. However, my son had a droid and ending up ditching it due to problems and then there is the lack of App vetting... As I seem to be Apple centric, iPhone seems to be the way to go.
For anyone, if you were to summarize an Android phone's advantage(s) as compared to an iphone what would they be?
Ok. Gotcha. I read it out of context then, I thought you were commenting on the numbers. Error on my part.
It been the same from most of these calls no matter the company. Bigger they are in the media the worse it is. This put Apple up near the top if not the top in marketing BS from the calls.
The numbers are the short of it but then you have to do major reading between the lines to get any useful information out of it as 99% of it is pure marketing BS.
Apple is one of the best companies I know at marketing. They could sell dog crap in a box and people would buy it claiming it is great. Do they sell good stuff yes they do but does not change the fact they are great at marketing.
They're also one of the best companies we all know at making some amazing products that the rest of the industry not only notices, but emulates with feverish abandon.
Is your perfidy deliberate, or is it just due to anger? Do you just not understand?
Interesting. I'm on 3 and I've yet to have a problem. I live in just outside Huddersfield, West Yorkshire. Nor have I had a problem with Orange (apart from their rather high Payasyougo prices). Never been on O2, so I can't comment there though.
(Aren't the iPhone and many of the popular Android handsets on pretty much all the networks anyway?)
I think the point more is first rule is CHOOSE YOUR CARRIER FIRST.
I know in the US for example Verizon is great for a lot of people but I left Verizon because were at the time were I spent 9 months out of the year Verizon sucked so I switch to Cingular which AT&T bought up. I have been happy with AT&T because of where I live and spend my time it works and has worked great. No reason to change.
It seems to me that your are trying to imply that other companies basically give up profit margin in order to "pass savings on" to customers or some other altruistic reason. Utterly wrong!
Obviously, you despise Apple. Fair enough. But let me tell you this. Every company in the tech industry would kill to be in Apple's situation.
Android OEMs like HTC are not competing just against other platforms like Apple and RIM. They are competing against other Android OEMs. Price is one of the ways in which Android manufacturers try to undercut one another.
This is exactly why Windows PCs have gotten so inexpensive over the years. It's not because of some altruistic reason such as wanting to "pass on savings" to customers. It's because they have no choice. Windows PC OEMs have almost no way of differentiating their products. To a consumer, there is practically no difference between a Dell laptop and an HP laptop with identical specs. The consumer will choose the one with the lower price. When a consumer wants to buy a Windows PC, I bet most of them don't say they want a "Dell laptop" or an "Acer laptop." They'll probably say, "I want a PC."
In this manner, Android OEMs are better off than Windows PC OEMs because they have more leeway to differentiate their products. I've heard people say "HTC phone" or "Samsung phone" rather than just "Android phone." There's a big difference between the latter and the former two.
Also, have you heard of any company say, "We're making too much money so we're going to cut our prices."? I doubt it.
Rodimus Prime said:
Apple makes around 50% gross profit margin, RIM around 40%, and most others around 30%. Everyone's making money. Most have record profits.
Apple is also competing against every one of the the Android (and WP7) phones, and also must use price to try to undercut them. Hence, their $49 iPhone model.
By Christmas, there might even be more than the two current iPhone models for sale. (Or three current models, if you count the Verizon iPhone separately, just as most people tend to separate out Android versions per carrier.) Apple knows that just one model cannot hit all the markets.
As for the comparison people often make to desktop computer pricing, I don't think that works very well, since many phones are subsidized, including the iPhone. Overseas, sometimes even down to free on contract.
And when phones go on sale or with BOGO offers, etc, at least in the USA it's usually the carriers setting their own sale prices to dump excess inventory... not the manufacturers losing anything.
So it's mostly competition on finding the right model mix with different price ranges, not so much on the prices themselves. A top phone is going to get top dollar, no matter what. Samsung seems to want the high end with their Galaxy series. HTC is happy in the upper middle class. ZTE and Huawei are fine with the low end. Motorola and LG are still figuring out what they want to be.
You clearly don't see the argument I'm making because there would be no argument if you did. I've never said Android isnt popular. It is. But that "popularity" is based on numbers and marketshare and those metrics are inherently skewed (to anyone who looks at it objectively, which you clearly are not).
Android is an amazing OS, but its success absolutely has to do with the fact that it is more widely available, on multiple carriers, at multiple pricepoints on multiple devices. I mean, this should be common sense, and I will never understand why it's not.
If Android is popular, then iOS is ridiculously popular to the point of disbelief. You've got one smartphone keeping pace with hundreds as a collective unit. Android is the king and queen of homecoming, iOS is the freakin school where the homecoming dance is held.
If one smartphone destroys (yes, destroys) every individual android phone, and is barely destroyed by the whole collective unit, only someone who refuses to acknowledge the iPhone would downplay its success. That's what you're doing.
And I'm sorry but I wholly disagree with your "more people are choosing an os first". Simply not the case. Carriers are being chosen first, and then the os is chosen. This is quite evident (again to those who don't have some weird vendetta against Apple) with the release of the Verizon iPhone in the US. If people were choosing OS first, the Verizon iPhone wouldn't have shattered every sales record known to man in the first two hours of its availability to current Verizon customers. It outsold every phone in history before it was even available to people who didn't have Verizon. What does that say? That people are not going to switch carriers to get a phone, but when the phone they want comes to their carrier they will get it, or settle for another phone on their carrier until they can get the one they want. Denying the obvious does nothing.
I mean they sold 20+ million iPhones last quarter. 20M! Like I said, the Charge, Revolution, and TB combined probably has not even sold 10 million (and that's being super generous). Lump in all the 3G android phones on Verizon, and they probably have not even sold 20M last quarter. Stop ignoring a fact that's right in your face. You have some odd and foolish hatred toward Apple, but when one phone can outsell multiple phones combined, and one company can post in the words of a Forbes analyst "ridiculous" profits every QUARTER as compared to the previous and YOY, denying it makes you look bizarre. I mean a 142% increase from last year on iPhone sales? And people are suggesting that Apple is floundering, or that they are not popular anymore?? Really?
I said it before and I'll say it again, the marketshare numbers are a testament to iOS, not Android. Profits, app revenue, sales all belong to Apple and iOS. People who boast about marketshare in an environment where its 300 to 1, really have no clue.
As an extra note, I find it funny, then not one droid site is talking about apple's earnings call. Sites which mention apple at the drop of a hat are suddenly quiet. This will be swept under the rug until Nielsen releases their next marketshare report at which point the iOS bashing will re-commence.
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Bear in mind that those 20 million iPhone sales were worldwide, and included the sales of two models: the iPhone 4 and the $49 iPhone 3GS. We don't know the breakdown between them.
Together, Samsung and Motorola sold about 20 million Android phones in the same amount of time. Sales from HTC, LG, ZTE and Huawei probably add another 30 million, for a total of _50_ million Android phones each quarter ( over a million handsets sold every two days).
Add to that he fails to understand the consept of splitting market among multiple sellers.
If you want iOS you have 1-3 choices (depending on how you divide it up) while Android you have 5+ for each carriers. The addition phones do not really increase you market that much. Instead it splits it up so each person gets a smaller piece of the pie.
I also find that a good part of his argument breaks down when it is pointed out that for the most part iPhone is on most carriers and really it is only in the US that it is limited and even then it is what 70+% of the market has their choice of getting the iPhone and yet people choose Android in large numbers.
Good question. Freeness of the OS is the only one I can think of. However, if you were to reverse the question, tight integration with Apple products would be the only answer I can think of.
for me on Android it would be choices.
For example
Do not like the stock SMS client change it. I dumped it for GO SMS but there are several that are really popular
Want a different launcher change it. There are several good choices.
Same with Email client.
Same with how contacts are handled.
Hell most things in the phone can be replaced with something else as the client.
It is choices.
Again, I've already explained the 70% choosing Android in large numbers, and you again fail to see that. Yes iPhone is on most carriers, but does iPhone offer subsidies on most carriers? The average price of the iPhone worldwide is something like $600US. In my previous post I already mentioned the multiple pricepoints as another reason why Android is chosen. That's not a slight to Android. They did it right, by offering multiple pricepoints, on multiple carriers to multiple OEMs. I'm speaking logically, and you're getting emotional about Android.
My point is, and it's a point that you refuse to see, that Apple is in NO WAY worried about anything considering the numbers they put out every month every quarter every year. I'm talking to the people who are silly enough to suggest that Apple is floundering, is not popular anymore, or that Steve Jobs is biting his fingernails trying to figure out how to save his company from bankruptcy. I mean some guy on an android blog actually told me "Wait till the iPhone5 tanks and then you'll see"...I mean really?? The iPhone5 is gonna tank? Foolish statements like that make me realize just how sad the android community is. Be happy with your OS's success, sure, but stop trying to detract from another company's just because you are a follower who regurgitates the same crap about cults and kool aid that every android fanboy does. The truth of the matter is, in this economy, people are still shelling out hundreds of dollars every quarter to the tune of 20M iPhones sold, for an iPhone.
I'm not trying to slight Android, I'm trying to say that market share is irrelevant because Apple is not struggling to move units because people are choosing Android in "large numbers". Their one device (or since you guys want to split it up into 2 devices, which you would never do for Android) is outselling every single individual android phone and barely being outsold by the collective group (barely is a relative term, meaning it's not like Apple is suddenly facing losses and scrambling to figure out how to recoup). In fact, Apple, as I mentioned should be quite happy with how things turned out.
Sales, profits, revenue, app revenue, developer interest, and desirability are all with their product. Like I said, I'm quite certain that Steve Jobs is not crying himself to sleep every night because of the Android onslaught. Apple gets more app revenue in one quarter then Android as a collective unit gets in an entire year. Developers flock to iOS because that's where the money is at. Sales records being shattered are a given, it would be more of a shock if they didn't set records. Industry experts can't begin to explain how Apple is such a successful company in spite of the current economy. Ridiculous, unbelievable, unreal and amazing are some of the words these analysts (who I'd say know a little better then you or I) are using for Apple's success.
Android fanboys like to tout marketshare left and right, and post blogs about Apple's lack of marketshare, but not one android blog mentioned the earnings call. Why? Because it's easier to sweep Apple's success under the rug then acknowledge it. When the Nielsen share stats come out again, you better believe every android blog will have it happily posted on their front page, proclaiming victory over "Uncle Steve" and his "Kool Aid" drinking "disciples". Android fanboys are easily the worst type of fanboy on the internet, and the internet is chock full of fanboys.
Give credit where it's due, like I'm doing. Android is an amazing OS with amazing success, but it is no way destroying Apple. The only thing Android has is marketshare. Apple has everything else, and quite handedly I might add.
How is this "freeness" (debatable) really benefiting the majority? It's not like every android user is rooting, running custom ROMs, applying themes and overclocking and flashing updates themselves. The average user is dumb and just uses the phone as is. They're not on the internet searching ways to hack their phone. "Freeness" is a silly buzzword found only on android forums as a way for people to think they have some advantage. The amount of people actually taking advantage of this "freeness" is quite small.
Choice is a better advantage. If you can't afford the high end phones, you can still get a cheap or free smartphone. If you want the cutting edge tech you can get that too. Freeness is not an advantage.
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Apparently AT&T activated 3.6 million iPhones in the June quarter. Thats 120,000 units a day. On one carrier alone. In the US. On a phone thats a year old.
Thats pretty impressive if you ask me.
Thats pretty impressive if you ask me.
It's impressive if you ask anyone, except those that refuse to acknowledge what Apple is doing (see Android fanboy)
Oh but I guess it's just a fad or the "in" thing to do...
I think your math is off.
They said 3.6 million during the quarter which I believe ended in June.
It is more like 40,000 per day which is still a very impressive number when you consider it is a single carrier.
120k is way to high for daily activation as it takes up way to large of a chunk of what Apple says is there daily which was around 220k give or take.
haha. You know what, i read "June quarter" and thought "Idiots".
Sorry my bad. But yeah 40,000 still buying iPhone 4's is pretty good.
Which is getting it's ass kicked by sony
Actually that brings me to a thought: Sony can be an apple-esque maker. Their products are beautiful, their UIs on the phones etc look admirably nice and they have the tendency to keep a strict hold on their products. I dont get why they are wasting time on android.
If Sony picked up meego and made it their thing, made it integrated with their PSN platform as well, that would be something really nice.
It's nice to see a company like Apple pushing elegance and innovation ( seriously where were all those popular galaxies and HTCs and tablets before the idevices?) but it's disappointing to see no one else trying to take risks and match apple on the trend setting level. One tech company doing all that in today's huge world is depressing sometimes. Still, there is at least one lol.
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