Not happy with the useless space that sometimes appears between the buttons above in the mail window. The result is that they are not all immediately visible.
Last edited:
Got a tip for us?
Let us know
Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
anyone else think Big Sur mail sucks?
- Thread starter adr1974
- Start date
- Sort by reaction score
I had the new Mac mini with the new chip and BigSur...I sent it all back to apple....BigSur fixes things that were not broken...iTunes...mail and more
I think Apple Geeks in Cupertino had nothing better to do than screw around and make everything more difficult...ie: iTunes, Notifications etc....It doesn't suck. It blows.
Actually, there is something about the layout (added space or maybe a font change?) that makes it harder to read.
Really don't like that they not only removed the sort widget from the toolbar, but removed it from the possible widgets one can add to the toolbar. So, somebody decided not only that most people don't use it but nobody should be allowed to. That was unnecessary and annoying.
Also, why did the flags move to the right in the mail list? That may make sense in right-to-left leading languages, but for those of us who read left to right, placing the thing that is supposed to highlight an entry out in right field is barely better than removing the feature entirely.
Overall, I don't really like the UI changes in Big Sur. A number of things are now more difficult to figure out. Maybe this is all pent up demand from designers who were waiting for Jony Ive to leave and let them force their ideas on a user base that didn't need them and doesn't necessarily like them... well, except for the fanboys who mindlessly like anything from Apple regardless.
After using mail for some time, I noticed at least two annoying bugs and an UI issue, I am not sure if they have already been reported here:
- Like in Cataline mail sometimes hangs and is unresponsive, usually after a few seconds it is usable again.
- When searching, I have to enter the search term an the very right, but to specify to search in all mailboxes I have to move the mouse to the very left.
- When searching the result table headers indicate, that the results are sorted by time, but they are not. I have to click on the column header to actually sort them by time.
Mail was perfectly OK before Catalina. I really do not get why Apple is always changing things to make perfectly good software to something nearly useless...
- Like in Cataline mail sometimes hangs and is unresponsive, usually after a few seconds it is usable again.
- When searching, I have to enter the search term an the very right, but to specify to search in all mailboxes I have to move the mouse to the very left.
- When searching the result table headers indicate, that the results are sorted by time, but they are not. I have to click on the column header to actually sort them by time.
Mail was perfectly OK before Catalina. I really do not get why Apple is always changing things to make perfectly good software to something nearly useless...
No doubt Mail has had some issues but I dispair of users constantly complaining that it is all due to an update or upgrade. More often these issues a carried over from some error in the previous macOS or caused by an error in the upgrade process or in some cases by the email provider themselves. If you think this is just an Apple issue I invite you to visit Mac-Forums sister site for Windows. https://windowsforum.com/
Yes, the "design for yourself" rule that some companies like to use is not always good for the broader audience. I notice also that Apple designers brought back color - although the colors are a bit bright. I think Apple (Ivy?) went from color to gray scale around 2007 as a solution for accessibility and colorblindness. When using colors, if you choose colors that are less likely to cause problems for the colorblind, they will be high contrast, bright colors. My guess is this explains the color choices made as Apple embraces color again.
I think Apple has been infiltrated by Microsoft.
Everything is not about "it just works' any longer.
All has a cycle up and down.
Miss the good old times when it just worked.
I actually truly believed a mole was planted back in 2013 because I couldn't for the life of me see iOS 7 (and the UI it started which everyone else copied) as anything that I'd expect of Apple. I really wished that Steve lived just long enough to view that image of iOS 7 on stage just to see his no doubt hilarious reaction to it. It would have made the Bill Gates Window 98 BSoD pale in comparison...
...And then, Flat UI would've never happened again. It flopped for Microsoft and Windows 8, so the last thing I expected was for Apple to even bother. Boy, was I wrong!
...And then, Flat UI would've never happened again. It flopped for Microsoft and Windows 8, so the last thing I expected was for Apple to even bother. Boy, was I wrong!
Mail on Big Sur is just a widget. It's less functional than on an iPad. I just replaced it with Thunderbird before saying 'to hell with this' and going to Linux.
The mail widget on my old Galaxy Note 10.1 tablet was more functional than Big Sur mail.
The mail widget on my old Galaxy Note 10.1 tablet was more functional than Big Sur mail.
Good news...
I upgraded to 11.1.
Mail is working much better now.
I can search better.
My smart mailboxes are working.
My new problems is my proton mail accounts are not working right.
I think I just need to reinstall the profiles to fix it.
Not a big problem.
A big part of my life is searching emails since I get so many.
It's working now.
With Big Sur, you can use APFS format for Time Machine.
I upgraded all my backup drives to this new format and I believe it's better.
Now, if only Lifeproof would ship my iPhone 12 Pro case so I can finally unbox and use my new iPhone 12 Pro.
The Reminders app only works on the newer iOS.
I'm still using a iPhone 6!
I upgraded to 11.1.
Mail is working much better now.
I can search better.
My smart mailboxes are working.
My new problems is my proton mail accounts are not working right.
I think I just need to reinstall the profiles to fix it.
Not a big problem.
A big part of my life is searching emails since I get so many.
It's working now.
With Big Sur, you can use APFS format for Time Machine.
I upgraded all my backup drives to this new format and I believe it's better.
Now, if only Lifeproof would ship my iPhone 12 Pro case so I can finally unbox and use my new iPhone 12 Pro.
The Reminders app only works on the newer iOS.
I'm still using a iPhone 6!
I just received my brand new MacBook Pro with Apple processor. I transfered all my apps and documents from my time honoured, nearly 10 year old, early 2011, MacBook Pro. I had decided not to push my luck with a no longer updatable OS (High Sierra) but my old computer is still working faultlessly after so many years. When I started the new one I made the sad discovery that quite a few of my most frequently used apps no longer worked with the new OS (MS Office, Adobe Creative Suite, just to name a few). I find it outrageous that 32 bit applications should no longer be supported.
It looks like I find myself with a sort of glorified and overpriced iPad with keyboard.
Moreover, since I don't intend to spend several hundreds of dollars a year, on renting some 20 years old applications, which I had already purchased once in the first place, I decided to switch to Pages, Numbers and Keynote, and other substitutes. Dictation on Big Sur is at last really smart, though prone to crashes. The whole system is certainly not as fast and smooth as I was expecting from a much more powerful machine compared to my previous one.
It looks like I find myself with a sort of glorified and overpriced iPad with keyboard.
Moreover, since I don't intend to spend several hundreds of dollars a year, on renting some 20 years old applications, which I had already purchased once in the first place, I decided to switch to Pages, Numbers and Keynote, and other substitutes. Dictation on Big Sur is at last really smart, though prone to crashes. The whole system is certainly not as fast and smooth as I was expecting from a much more powerful machine compared to my previous one.
Last edited:
Believe it or not, you will NOT instantly get hacked nor will your device up and self-destruct just because it no longer gets updates. In fact since updates have frustrated me in recent years, I prefer my devices never getting updates. Always changes what shouldn't be changed. Also, in the tablet space, I use older models which can't get updates anymore period, and retained the UI I prefer. No worries anymore about any updates snuck in without me knowing it.
I use devices until they no longer serve my needs, and often that means they have to fail catostrophically. As in they no longer turn on, or they let out the smoke, or the motherboard dies.
I watch YouTube via a 2012 Galaxy Note 10.1 tablet. Still works fine, and no hacks, no viruses. OF course I don't go to sketchy sites either. I have identity monitoring and they never give me any alerts. You just have to be smart.
I use devices until they no longer serve my needs, and often that means they have to fail catostrophically. As in they no longer turn on, or they let out the smoke, or the motherboard dies.
I watch YouTube via a 2012 Galaxy Note 10.1 tablet. Still works fine, and no hacks, no viruses. OF course I don't go to sketchy sites either. I have identity monitoring and they never give me any alerts. You just have to be smart.
Couldn’t agree more. However I must admit that especially while your device is still new, some updates really bring some cool new features. Improved dictation is one of the enhancements that is constantly being improved and an important feature to me in terms of productivity. Another motive for me was a somewhat sluggish performance on my beloved 2011 MBPro in video-conferencing, which I am using a lot at professional level. And this sluggishness caused me some issues recently. So now a I have to decide which is going to be my main computer, because it would be confusing to go on using both. I was also very much in doubt whether it was worth investing in a computer at all, as an iPad is getting closer to replacing a laptop in every day use.
There are alternatives. Mail.app is just a client. Many of the complaints here are about that, and not the actual Apple email service itself. I just use MailMate for some of my accounts. Works well, kind of old school. But I must say the Big Sur edition of Mail.app gave me a lot less grief than Catalina did.
It’s called change and it happens. It’s annoying because once you get used to doing it one way things change but that’s how computers work.
As to the mail I don’t see anything wrong with it. If it’s for work just use Outlook and half the time for my personal email I open the web browser.
Edit: For those having problems with iCloud email in Outlook I found this. I haven’t tested it but it looks like a pretty good guide
How to Set Up iCloud Email on Microsoft Outlook - Support.com TechSolutions
Step by step instructions to open setup your iCloud account in the Outlook program, making it easier to check your mail.
For myself a tablet will always be best as a media consumption device. I can't imagine one replacing a laptop without it being frustrating (many apps are just blown up phone apps, especially if you're into Android). Keyboard covers really kinda suck. Also I hate having fingerprint smudges all over a screen when I have to view sites like I'm doing now on my Mac. I'm happy they didn't force the touchscreen on Macs.
Mail's UI is easily solved by sideloading an old version of Mozilla Thunderbird (which, ironically, still works in Big Sur; It didn't bloody attempt to load in Catalina). But I just screwed it and went Linux. Tons more customization there. Seems today, all my apps and games run in Linux so why use Windows or Mac OS?
Updates can bring new features but usually at a cost, the unnecessary flattening or rearranging of vital UI functions akin to Wal-Mart rearranging their stores every few months just to frustrate their customers who finally memorized where everything was. It's a 'caveat emptor' gamble to update any app today. I simply refuse to do so. On Apple devices, that update is permenant. On Android, yea, you might be able to uninstall the updates and revert, but only if it doesn't make the app a device administrator, which I often can't undo without settings crashing.
Mail's UI is easily solved by sideloading an old version of Mozilla Thunderbird (which, ironically, still works in Big Sur; It didn't bloody attempt to load in Catalina). But I just screwed it and went Linux. Tons more customization there. Seems today, all my apps and games run in Linux so why use Windows or Mac OS?
Updates can bring new features but usually at a cost, the unnecessary flattening or rearranging of vital UI functions akin to Wal-Mart rearranging their stores every few months just to frustrate their customers who finally memorized where everything was. It's a 'caveat emptor' gamble to update any app today. I simply refuse to do so. On Apple devices, that update is permenant. On Android, yea, you might be able to uninstall the updates and revert, but only if it doesn't make the app a device administrator, which I often can't undo without settings crashing.
I also miss the old search options where you could change the scope by click next to the search window. Now you have to navigate on the left side of the screen to set options for the search bar on the right side of the screen.
What were they thinking?
As I've been told in countless forums whenever I make a legitimate complaint about unnecessary change fixing what was not broken:
"You're not in their demographic anymore! They're catering to the masses"
Each time I hear that sentence it pretty much precedes everything being bland later on. Sadly, Apple has succumbed to it. I give them credit for keeping the good longer than most. Pros seem to be approaching endangered status. Pretty much every UI today for any app feels intended for grade school children.
"You're not in their demographic anymore! They're catering to the masses"
Each time I hear that sentence it pretty much precedes everything being bland later on. Sadly, Apple has succumbed to it. I give them credit for keeping the good longer than most. Pros seem to be approaching endangered status. Pretty much every UI today for any app feels intended for grade school children.
Mail.app in Big Sur, in my usage, seems to be slightly improved over Catalina. I never had any huge problems with it before, it was always just small lingering bugs that were irritating.
Namely, the notification bug where you would hear the new mail sound, and the visual notification would slide onto the screen anywhere from 10-30 seconds later. That seems to have been fixed in Big Sur as my notifications seem far more synchronized.
The ones that are still there, and have been since possibly (High) Sierra days (I forget which version I noticed it first), is the notification badge bugs, the first which loves to show 1 unread email when there are no unread emails in my inbox. Refreshing the inbox from the check for new mail button does not work, only a restart of Mail.app clears the incorrect notification.
Another less noticed notification bug is when the Dock icon shows 1 unread email and you open Mail and there's more than 1 unread email. That one I have noticed occasionally through multiple iterations of macOS that still shows up now and again. Sometimes Mail can count, sometimes it can't.
Are these showstopper bugs to make me pay for a different email client? Not so far I guess.
Namely, the notification bug where you would hear the new mail sound, and the visual notification would slide onto the screen anywhere from 10-30 seconds later. That seems to have been fixed in Big Sur as my notifications seem far more synchronized.
The ones that are still there, and have been since possibly (High) Sierra days (I forget which version I noticed it first), is the notification badge bugs, the first which loves to show 1 unread email when there are no unread emails in my inbox. Refreshing the inbox from the check for new mail button does not work, only a restart of Mail.app clears the incorrect notification.
Another less noticed notification bug is when the Dock icon shows 1 unread email and you open Mail and there's more than 1 unread email. That one I have noticed occasionally through multiple iterations of macOS that still shows up now and again. Sometimes Mail can count, sometimes it can't.
Are these showstopper bugs to make me pay for a different email client? Not so far I guess.
Even with the update, Mail wont search.
I now have a link in Firefox to my email client web portal that I use exclusively for doing searches.
I migrated to Firefox recently, also.
When filling out an important work related form on Safari, it screwed up real bad and I didn't realize it for months. When I discovered the error, I resubmitted the form from Firefox and it was accepted. It seems Safari is quirky like that. However, for backing up bookmarks Safari gives you a document with hot links. That is awesome if you want a stand alone copy of your bookmarks. So, if ever I want to back up my bookmarks on Firefox, I'll export them to Safari and export the hot link file from Safari.
Other than Mail and Safari, Big Sur does not have any more problems for me, right now.
The only minor problem I have had thus far with BS and the mail app on my new Christmas Eve day M1 is that sometimes times there is a delay with getting the mail in the box even though I received the banner notification. Search works fine as well.
you won't open your new iPhone 12 because you don't have a case for it?