iPad Anyone miss the old Apple lineup?

[JM]

I don’t particularly see a mess, so no pass given here.

it's a hot garbage mess. Apple is doomed.

Doomed I tell you 😂

 

[mectojic]

I think that some people miss the point of Steve Jobs' simple product line, and the greater implications.

The reason there was a simple product line in the first place was so that Apple's A-team could be working on every single product. No project was delegated to some lesser designer. The fact that the iPad 10th gen could get a camera reposition, but the M2 Pro can't, suggests that there are multiple B-teams working separately on separate iPads these days. Today, I can only suspect that the person who 'designed' the 'new' 2022 M2 13-inch Pro had never stepped into the same room as the team working on the 14 and 16-inch designs.

Secondly, a simple product line reflects a company who is confident about what they sell. Apple in the 90s sold a ton of products, just like every other company. Cutting the product line to 4 quadrants (consumer/pro + laptop/desktop) was a stunning move, but it showed a company confident that their new, colourful iMac was so good that it would suit the needs of every consumer. Within a year though, sure, they stopped selling 1 model and started offering 3 (good, better, best), and that formula seems to be the winner. Any more, and as I said, it starts to look like compromised products whose purpose is unclear. The G4 Cube was the first attempt outside the 4-product quadrant, and it failed horribly (for a number of reasons).

Finally, since these forums often get stuck in the problems of today, over and over again, I want to offer a longer-term perspective on the matter (think Apple collectors / history museums). I don't care about an Apple that produces a ton of products to hit different price points, with some features missing. The best of the best products, the ones that people remember, are the ones that weren't compromised, had excellent industrial design and were historically significant (think iMac G3, original Macintosh – yes, both 'compromised' in lacking expansion, but that was done purposefully for the consumer market; they didn't stop selling the Power Mac and Apple II for pro users).

When you look at the lineup today, how much is really 'iconic'? How many of the products today will survive the trash, and be looked back at fondly? I would answer, primarily the ones that had no compromises, that had a distinct purpose in the lineup. Apple's industrial design today is top of the industry, no question about that, but their hardware + software departments seem to be far more scattered than ever before. You still get nice concepts, such as the dynamic island or the M1 iMac, but the ideas never seem to cross over around the whole product line. Instead, each little department (e.g. the iPad 10th gen company) lives in their own world, occasionally doing spec bumps that are sometimes independent of others, and other times slapped on too little, too late. The end result is that no one will look back at the 10th gen iPad and say "wow, what a great device" (it will get one sentence in the history books, for being the first iPad with a side camera – that's it). Meanwhile, I am constantly looking back at my redesigned MacBook Air from 2010, or my iMac G3, and admiring the brilliance of it. I used both machines in the day too, so it's not pure nostalgia, I recognised the quality of them in the day too – we knew they were consumer machines, and they did their job exceptionally well.

A lot of people on these forums use their devices for 5+ years, these days. You want a device that you can look back on happily, assured that it was a great product. That's Apple. This ain't some Microsoft forum. I get that these discussions aren't typical of the tech world.

 

[JM]

I think that some people miss the point of Steve Jobs' simple product line, and the greater implications.

The reason there was a simple product line in the first place was so that Apple's A-team could be working on every single product. No project was delegated to some lesser designer. The fact that the iPad 10th gen could get a camera reposition, but the M2 Pro can't, suggests that there are multiple B-teams working separately on separate iPads these days. Today, I can only suspect that the person who 'designed' the 'new' 2022 M2 13-inch Pro had never stepped into the same room as the team working on the 14 and 16-inch designs.

Secondly, a simple product line reflects a company who is confident about what they sell. Apple in the 90s sold a ton of products, just like every other company. Cutting the product line to 4 quadrants (consumer/pro + laptop/desktop) was a stunning move, but it showed a company confident that their new, colourful iMac was so good that it would suit the needs of every consumer. Within a year though, sure, they stopped selling 1 model and started offering 3 (good, better, best), and that formula seems to be the winner. Any more, and as I said, it starts to look like compromised products whose purpose is unclear. The G4 Cube was the first attempt outside the 4-product quadrant, and it failed horribly (for a number of reasons).

Finally, since these forums often get stuck in the problems of today, over and over again, I want to offer a longer-term perspective on the matter (think Apple collectors / history museums). I don't care about an Apple that produces a ton of products to hit different price points, with some features missing. The best of the best products, the ones that people remember, are the ones that weren't compromised, had excellent industrial design and were historically significant (think iMac G3, original Macintosh – yes, both 'compromised' in lacking expansion, but that was done purposefully for the consumer market; they didn't stop selling the Power Mac and Apple II for pro users).

When you look at the lineup today, how much is really 'iconic'? How many of the products today will survive the trash, and be looked back at fondly? I would answer, primarily the ones that had no compromises, that had a distinct purpose in the lineup. Apple's industrial design today is top of the industry, no question about that, but their hardware + software departments seem to be far more scattered than ever before. You still get nice concepts, such as the dynamic island or the M1 iMac, but the ideas never seem to cross over around the whole product line. Instead, each little department (e.g. the iPad 10th gen company) lives in their own world, occasionally doing spec bumps that are sometimes independent of others, and other times slapped on too little, too late. The end result is that no one will look back at the 10th gen iPad and say "wow, what a great device" (it will get one sentence in the history books, for being the first iPad with a side camera – that's it). Meanwhile, I am constantly looking back at my redesigned MacBook Air from 2010, or my iMac G3, and admiring the brilliance of it. I used both machines in the day too, so it's not pure nostalgia, I recognised the quality of them in the day too – we knew they were consumer machines, and they did their job exceptionally well.

A lot of people on these forums use their devices for 5+ years, these days. You want a device that you can look back on happily, assured that it was a great product. That's Apple. This ain't some Microsoft forum. I get that these discussions aren't typical of the tech world.

No, No... The 14 Plus will DEFINITELY go down as one of Apple's best products ever. So much courage and design aplomb with that one. 🤣

 

[an_apple.a.day]

don’t miss it at all. if someone at tesla came out with cybernetic implants tomorrow i’d say sign me up. i don’t look back with tech, only forward

 

[aevan]

Those were good times. Late 2010 Apple store. No compromises anywhere. Sure, iPads have evolved from what they once were, but still – did it have to become what it is now? View attachment 2098838

The answer to your question (from the thread title) is: no.

While certainly not perfect, I'm loving modern Apple more than any of its previous periods. Best Macs, best iPads, best iPhones, Apple Watch, AirPods - all of it.

 

[rafark]

I think the point the OP is trying to make is that this lineup was easier to understand. That’s all! Not that these products were objectively better, just the lineup was simple.

but they were..

 

[aevan]

I think that some people miss the point of Steve Jobs' simple product line, and the greater implications.

The reason there was a simple product line in the first place was so that Apple's A-team could be working on every single product. No project was delegated to some lesser designer. The fact that the iPad 10th gen could get a camera reposition, but the M2 Pro can't, suggests that there are multiple B-teams working separately on separate iPads these days. Today, I can only suspect that the person who 'designed' the 'new' 2022 M2 13-inch Pro had never stepped into the same room as the team working on the 14 and 16-inch designs.

Secondly, a simple product line reflects a company who is confident about what they sell. Apple in the 90s sold a ton of products, just like every other company. Cutting the product line to 4 quadrants (consumer/pro + laptop/desktop) was a stunning move, but it showed a company confident that their new, colourful iMac was so good that it would suit the needs of every consumer. Within a year though, sure, they stopped selling 1 model and started offering 3 (good, better, best), and that formula seems to be the winner. Any more, and as I said, it starts to look like compromised products whose purpose is unclear. The G4 Cube was the first attempt outside the 4-product quadrant, and it failed horribly (for a number of reasons).

Finally, since these forums often get stuck in the problems of today, over and over again, I want to offer a longer-term perspective on the matter (think Apple collectors / history museums). I don't care about an Apple that produces a ton of products to hit different price points, with some features missing. The best of the best products, the ones that people remember, are the ones that weren't compromised, had excellent industrial design and were historically significant (think iMac G3, original Macintosh – yes, both 'compromised' in lacking expansion, but that was done purposefully for the consumer market; they didn't stop selling the Power Mac and Apple II for pro users).

When you look at the lineup today, how much is really 'iconic'? How many of the products today will survive the trash, and be looked back at fondly? I would answer, primarily the ones that had no compromises, that had a distinct purpose in the lineup. Apple's industrial design today is top of the industry, no question about that, but their hardware + software departments seem to be far more scattered than ever before. You still get nice concepts, such as the dynamic island or the M1 iMac, but the ideas never seem to cross over around the whole product line. Instead, each little department (e.g. the iPad 10th gen company) lives in their own world, occasionally doing spec bumps that are sometimes independent of others, and other times slapped on too little, too late. The end result is that no one will look back at the 10th gen iPad and say "wow, what a great device" (it will get one sentence in the history books, for being the first iPad with a side camera – that's it). Meanwhile, I am constantly looking back at my redesigned MacBook Air from 2010, or my iMac G3, and admiring the brilliance of it. I used both machines in the day too, so it's not pure nostalgia, I recognised the quality of them in the day too – we knew they were consumer machines, and they did their job exceptionally well.

A lot of people on these forums use their devices for 5+ years, these days. You want a device that you can look back on happily, assured that it was a great product. That's Apple. This ain't some Microsoft forum. I get that these discussions aren't typical of the tech world.

And yet, in those "more focused, simpler times" Apple was even more stubbourn, didn't listen to feedback and we're looking at it with rose-colored glasses.

Current MacBooks are simply amazing. I'm sorry, with all respect to your 2010 Air or G3, I don't think Macs were ever better. Also, while far from where I'd like them to be, iPads have also never been better. Remember the time where you took notes or drew illustrations with your fingers or those rubber-tip styluses? Remember when iPad didn't have a Files app or external disk support? Hey, do you think "old' Apple would ever add a pointer to iPads? Because, let me tell you, that little pointer is great.

Also, if you think each department lives in their own world, how do you explain Universal Control, Handoff, AirPods working seamlessly between platforms, shared hardware designs such as Mini LED screens or Taptic engines, audio innovations, Find My, etc. ?

The difference is that today's Apple releases an update of a certain product the moment it's ready instead of waiting for the whole lineup. And while that creates a messy lineup, it also comes with benefits - like regular iPad users not having to wait for the Pros to come out with new designs to move the camera. Also, keep in mind that we're still recovering from chip and component shortages, a pandemic (that's still going on, tbh), etc. Supply chain issues are real, as well as Apple hides them.

Apple is not perfect, but when you think about it - with the exception of a few quirks here and there, there isn't a single Apple major product that they are selling - that's bad. Quite the contrary. Heck, even the M2 MacBook Pro - while disappointingly having an old design - is still one of the best laptops you can buy, compared to Windows laptops. And I'm not just talking about the chip either - compare the screen or sound quality to the competition. And that's arguably the worst laptop Apple sells currently.

So, no, I don't think I'm missing the point of Steve's product line. I just think this one is better.

 

[Kashback]

Those were good times. Late 2010 Apple store. No compromises anywhere. Sure, iPads have evolved from what they once were, but still – did it have to become what it is now? View attachment 2098838

Yep. Clear and concise product line up. Also liked it when they used to release an update to a product and the previous version just disappeared.

 

[aevan]

Yep. Clear and concise product line up. Also liked it when they used to release an update to a product and the previous version just disappeared.

Do you prefer that to offering the previous version for a lower price? Why?

 

[transpo1]

Definitely miss the days when you could see the lineup all on one page. It needs some simplification.

But Steve Jobs always wanted build a company that was strong and lasting so we can at least take comfort in the fact that they are in a very strong position— and that comes partially from continuing to monetize their successful products.

 

[MisterTibbs]

Instead, each little department lives in their own world.

One of my friends I grew up with emigrated and eventually worked there, and this was one of the reasons he left.
We were talking a few weeks ago about how I used to get so excited about new product launches, but it's been a while since I got that tingle! The G4 iMac blew my mind, moving from a Lime iMac to that felt like the future I was promised as a kid. Same with the iPad, iPod and iPhone. Today's smaller bezels, better cameras and faster processors feel like tweaks, rather than the innovative, world changing devices I grew up with.

 

[Rogifan]

The iPod started with one model and matured to 4 variants by 2010 based on customer use cases under Steve Jobs tenure. The same thing has happened with iPad and iPhone over the past decade.

The Mac lineup is largely the same quantitatively speaking.

I don’t think the current iPad lineup has much to do with use cases. It’s about Apple filling price gaps.

 

[Rogifan]

Easy for me to decide. Only the Pro iPhones and iPads from here on out since that’s my budget. I just have to decide what size I want.

I said in another thread the only people not confused are people who want/need a 12.9” iPad Pro or an iPad mini.

 

[Rogifan]

What is with people and this obsession with a "clean" and "simple" lineup? How does this impact you? Seriously?

You don't become a trillion dollar company without having something to sell to everyone.

I think if Apple had a good > better > best iPad lineup they would be catering to everyone. They made the decision that the ‘good’ iPad should look similar to the ‘better’ and ’best‘ iPads. But that resulted in a price increase so they kept around the previous model so they could still hit the existing price point. You have a lineup where one iPad straddles the ‘good’ and ‘better’ category and another straddles the ‘better’ and ‘best‘ category. And for those who say this is temporary I give you the 3rd gen Apple Watch which stayed in the lineup far longer than it should have.

 

[Kashback]

Do you prefer that to offering the previous version for a lower price? Why?

Why would I want to buy something new that is actually old and out of date?

 

[oldmacs]

but they were..

I disagree - the original iPad was gimped, while I preferred the design of that era MacBook Pro and the upgradability, the M1 and M2 chips are simply amazing.

Swings and roundabouts I guess!

 

[JM]

I think if Apple had a good > better > best iPad lineup they would be catering to everyone. They made the decision that the ‘good’ iPad should look similar to the ‘better’ and ’best‘ iPads. But that resulted in a price increase so they kept around the previous model so they could still hit the existing price point. You have a lineup where one iPad straddles the ‘good’ and ‘better’ category and another straddles the ‘better’ and ‘best‘ category. And for those who say this is temporary I give you the 3rd gen Apple Watch which stayed in the lineup far longer than it should have.

I present to thee, the Apple lineup in all its perfectly clear and easily understood glory!

So easy!

Just reading your post and trying to make sense of it gave me a headache. 😩

 

[JM]

Why would I want to buy something new that is actually old and out of date?

If you followed that advice, you’d never buy any computer tech except the most bleeding edge expensive stuff.

 

[Unregistered 4U]

Rose colored glasses and wishful thinking. There were compromises *everywhere* in that lineup.

Essentially, “Things were better in MY day, now get off my lawn!”

Fortunately for Apple, the folks in the market to buy new things now and new things for, like, the next 50 years or so, aren’t easily confused. Imagine, thinking that teenagers or your average college student are confounded by a computer lineup!

 

[Richard8655]

I present to thee, the Apple lineup in all its perfectly clear and easily understood glory!

So easy!

Just reading your post and trying to make sense of it gave me a headache. 😩

Take a couple aspirins and lie down for a while.

But seriously, I think the OP makes a good point. Sure, for us Apple geeks we can easily discern the technical functions and differences. But many customers are either new to Apple, or don't want to be bothered with comparing model details. They just want a basic easy to understand lineup choice. I think the lineup may be getting a bit overlapping and muddled.

 

[mrmister]

I bet those were lively debates back then too

They were—we had them here!

 

[Kashback]

If you followed that advice, you’d never buy any computer tech except the most bleeding edge expensive stuff.

It’s tech, the reason you buy new tech is to have “new tech.”

Back when apple used to discontinue the previous gen, it was still available through 3rd parties. So people who were after a deal on old tech could still get it. Just not from apple.com You went to apple.com to see and buy their latest and greatest.

 

[magicMac]

Those were good times. Late 2010 Apple store. No compromises anywhere. Sure, iPads have evolved from what they once were, but still – did it have to become what it is now? View attachment 2098838

More colourful as well! Everything on there apart from appleTV had a headphone jack. Use your favourite headphones with any of your apple devices, and the iPhone came with a simple wired headset that would work well on the MacBook and iPad without adapter. It was a wonderful tech life for those who consumed media or created light media.

I suppose the Apple Watch has gradually replaced the iPod in that lineup, there was even a watch face for that iPod nano! Personally don’t bother with the Apple Watch anymore but it’s “the other thing more portable and simple than the iPhone”

Apart from that, the only “new” products are Apple Pencil and AirPods. Apple Pencil makes sense, Steve job was not a fan of the stylus and shouldn’t be the main way to interact with the device , but for those who want to draw accurately it’s a good product fairly hassle free (Attaching to the side with magnets).

AirPods just a headache in my opinion, and the most Tim Cook thing rammed down our throats. The sooner the iPhone switches to USB-C the better, the fact regulators have to mandate this just shows what sort of company apple has become.

 

[cupcakes2000]

The amount of Steve Jobs references referring to how he would never this and that… talk about remembering with rose tinted specs! If he had his way everything would be locked down, everything inaccessible and everything proprietary. There would be no backtracking, or reintroduction of ports. There would be no stylus. We are lucky there was an AppStore!

I’m impressed by Jobs as much as the next person, but Tims Apple has opened up vastly in comparison with his Apple, whilst still maintaining his core ethics and ideals.

And on topic: we have a refined product line, it’s just bigger.

 

[aevan]

Why would I want to buy something new that is actually old and out of date?

To save money, because these products are more than capable. For example, MacBook Air M1 still runs circles around the same class of Windows laptops, even if it’s 2 years old at this point.

Of course, some people don’t mind paying more for latest and greatest - and I’m one of them. But it’s great to have this option for people who are more economical with their budget, or simply don’t care about the new features.