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That’s literally the way personal computing technology has been sold for decades. When has owning the latest tech not cost a premium over the stuff from one or two years ago? I don’t own many Apple products, but I have always considered Apple to be a designer brand that was as much about style as it was about anything else. I never owned an iPod because there were music players with more capacity and better sound quality for less, but they just didn’t look as cool or work as easily as the iPod. Sometimes I think the Apple premium is worth it, and sometimes I don’t.
You're right. The thing is that for most consumers Apple always has been a designer brand. But the shift I'm referring to is that Apple is becoming a designer brand within the consumer base that already could afford it. The MacBook Pro is a good example. Really expensive for a laptop. Now with $1200-$1300 iPhones becoming the norm, Apple is transitioning to designer-level prices even for first-world consumers.
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I think thats a dangerous strategy in the long term when you consider how many demographics buy the iPhone. If they stop producing interesting products for the mainstream and expect them to purchase much older handsets, it’s likely to cause a shift to more affordable options with modern features.
The thing is that Apple is a really smart company. Have they researched what you're proposing? Better believe it. They priced the iPhone where it is after exhaustive study, I'm sure. They know they can get away with it, all while they're boosting prices & services revenue in order to begin compensating for mid-term declines in consumer hardware as we know it. Essentially they're staying one step ahead of the game at all times, and the new iPhone lineup shows it: The XR is is the new medium, yet it is priced like the previous top-end. The X and now XS / Max set the new standard for the $1,000+ market segment. So Apple is taking that, as well as the "old" high-end (now occupied by the XR), and everything else beneath that trickles down to their previous handsets in price. So yes Apple isn't going for the bottom of the barrel like Android and that's precisely where I think Google found their killer angle (similar to Windows vs Mac OS). Apple knows this so they aren't wasting their time competing in those markets. As far as we know the Apple Car is till happening, and better believe that an AR device is in the works. Apple knows what they're doing and have the roadmap for the next 3-5 years pretty darn well figured out it seems.
 
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Was going to buy the XS Max until they priced it way above $1000. $1100 for a 64GB Max is pathetic. Also unlike what Tim Cook says I only pay full price upfront for my phones. Last years iPhone X was my absolute limit for phone pricing. I am looking into getting a Note 9 next month. Time to check out Android. I am breaking up my ecosystem unfortunately but no choice.
[doublepost=1538321656][/doublepost]
You're right. The thing is that for most consumers Apple always has been a designer brand. But the shift I'm referring to is that Apple is becoming a designer brand within the consumer base that already could afford it. The MacBook Pro is a good example. Really expensive for a laptop. Now with $1200-$1300 iPhones becoming the norm, Apple is transitioning to designer-level prices even for first-world consumers.
[doublepost=1538321229][/doublepost]
The thing is that Apple is a really smart company. Have they researched what you're proposing? Better believe it. They priced the iPhone where it is after exhaustive study, I'm sure. They know they can get away with it, all while they're boosting prices & services revenue in order to begin compensating for mid-term declines in consumer hardware as we know it. Essentially they're staying one step ahead of the game at all times, and the new iPhone lineup shows it: The XR is is the new medium, yet it is priced like the previous top-end. The X and now XS / Max set the new standard for the $1,000+ market segment. So Apple is taking that, as well as the "old" high-end (now occupied by the XR), and everything else beneath that trickles down to their previous handsets in price. So yes Apple isn't going for the bottom of the barrel like Android and that's precisely where I think Google found their killer angle (similar to Windows vs Mac OS). Apple knows this so they aren't wasting their time competing in those markets. As far as we know the Apple Car is till happening, and better believe that an AR device is in the works. Apple knows what they're doing and have the roadmap for the next 3-5 years pretty darn well figured out it seems.
Apple knows very well that once they raise prices Samsung and Google will follow suit and customers will still get an iPhone. Samsung will price the Note 10 next year at the same price as the XS Max.
 
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Was going to buy the XS Max until they priced it way above $1000. $1100 for a 64GB Max is pathetic. Also unlike what Tim Cook says I only pay full price upfront for my phones. Last years iPhone X was my absolute limit for phone pricing. I am looking into getting a Note 9 next month. Time to check out Android. I am breaking up my ecosystem unfortunately but no choice.

Isn't the Galaxy Note 9 a $1,000 phone? Isn't that also ridiculous?

I understand that you're mad at Apple's prices... but how much is their ecosystem worth?

If I were you... I'd find the extra few hundred dollars to stay in Apple's ecosystem. There's no way I'd throw everything away just because of the price tag of the phone you'll use dozens of times a day for the next couple years.

I'm assuming you have some sort of job where you earn regular income. That's how you have $1,000 in the first place.

So can't you wait a couple extra weeks to make more money to buy the Apple phone? The phone you actually want?

Look... I get it. Paying $1,000 for a phone sucks. But paying $1,000 for a phone you don't want is even worse.

Maybe find someone with a Galaxy Note 9 and see if you like it... and realize what you won't have by leaving the Apple ecosystem.

It would be terrible to pay $1,000 for a Samsung phone and regret it for the next couple years.
 
The X seems to be appealing to the core fan base, but so many people I know are either sticking with their current iPhone or going to another phone vendor. In our office not a single person out of 30 is remotely interested in the X. Of these, about 3/4 are iPhone users. Five of those (including me) have switched to an S8 or Note 8. In past years, there was a palpable excitement about the new phones. This round has fallen very flat. Where does Apple go from here? Yes, the X is selling well overall, but Apple is losing its mojo and edge as they slowly run out of ideas. Are the exciting days gone? Is the iPhone just another phone to most people outside of the fan base?

I guess you are wrong on sales of the X in retrospect! LOL!
 
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Isn't the Galaxy Note 9 a $1,000 phone? Isn't that also ridiculous?
Unlike iPhones the Samsung galaxies drop in price pretty soon after launch. You can pick them up sim free now for around £730 and even lower on eBay if you don’t mind second hand. They are also a hell of a lot cheaper on contract already if that’s the path people choose.
 
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Was going to buy the XS Max until they priced it way above $1000. $1100 for a 64GB Max is pathetic. Also unlike what Tim Cook says I only pay full price upfront for my phones. Last years iPhone X was my absolute limit for phone pricing. I am looking into getting a Note 9 next month. Time to check out Android. I am breaking up my ecosystem unfortunately but no choice.
[doublepost=1538321656][/doublepost]
Apple knows very well that once they raise prices Samsung and Google will follow suit and customers will still get an iPhone. Samsung will price the Note 10 next year at the same price as the XS Max.
There isn’t much choice if you want a high end smart phone and for the sake of £100 it wasn’t worth breaking up my ecosystem which is why plumped for the 256GB Max. It costs £100 more than I paid for my x last year. However I do have a limit which isn’t much higher than the price I paid for my max.
[doublepost=1538328187][/doublepost]
Isn't the Galaxy Note 9 a $1,000 phone? Isn't that also ridiculous?

I understand that you're mad at Apple's prices... but how much is their ecosystem worth?

If I were you... I'd find the extra few hundred dollars to stay in Apple's ecosystem. There's no way I'd throw everything away just because of the price tag of the phone you'll use dozens of times a day for the next couple years.

I'm assuming you have some sort of job where you earn regular income. That's how you have $1,000 in the first place.

So can't you wait a couple extra weeks to make more money to buy the Apple phone? The phone you actually want?

Look... I get it. Paying $1,000 for a phone sucks. But paying $1,000 for a phone you don't want is even worse.

Maybe find someone with a Galaxy Note 9 and see if you like it... and realize what you won't have by leaving the Apple ecosystem.

It would be terrible to pay $1,000 for a Samsung phone and regret it for the next couple years.
This is exactly why I got the max. Yes I’m not happy about the pricing but it didn’t make any sense to leave the ecosystem for the sake of £100.
 
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If $100 difference is somehow going to affect your financial happiness over even 1 year before switching, perhaps an even $800+ phone is a bad idea....

There are plenty of good iOS and Android devices in the $400-750 range (iphone 7 or 8, or XR; Oneplus 6, Galaxy s9/s9+, Pocophone etc.)
 
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I think thats a dangerous strategy in the long term when you consider how many demographics buy the iPhone. If they stop producing interesting products for the mainstream and expect them to purchase much older handsets, it’s likely to cause a shift to more affordable options with modern features.

Fortunately for Apple there are a lot of people willing to pay the Apple premium, or upgrade to last years iPhone, for a variety of reasons. Samsung has a similar advantage in the Android world, despite less expensive alternatives. Chalk it up to good marketing from both companies, and the fact that both established themselves in the minds of many customers early in the smartphone game.

Most people I know became either Android or iPhone people many years ago. Some have switched to iPhone because of a bad experience with an Android phone. Some have switched to Android because they were seeking better value. Most people just upgrade to the next version of whatever they have once their current phone starts to feel slow and unreliable. Even though there might be an alternative out there in the Android world that will give them what they want for half the price, people stay with Apple or Samsung because they don't like change. The options on the Android side are overwhelming if you are switching from iOS.

Most consumers just don’t get excited about the latest phone and features. They are fine with older models, but often pay for the latest model because they are worried about old models becoming slow and obsolete in a year. The latest tech has always cost a premium, but then there is also the premium for a brand like Apple. They will probably lose a few more customers who discover good Android alternatives for less than half the price, but again most consumers dislike change. The iPhone has become such a personal part of their life that they will curse the price increase as they pay for it in slightly higher monthly mobile bills... but they will put up with it for the same reason they put up with rising cable TV rates over the years: They don’t feel like they have much choice. Apple probably did the research and figured out they could push the price for a couple of years, and I bet it levels off for a couple of years... but who knows?

Apple has not only been wildly successful with the iPhone... they have only extended that success by getting many of us to buy companion devices like the iPad and Apple Watch (and then there is Apple TV, music streaming, and HomePod). Ten years ago it probably never occurred to Apple execs that they would one day be getting people to drop $2,000 and up every 1 to 3 years on new iOS/watchOS devices. Before we weep for ourselves as consumers too much, it's important to remember that many of us have spent less in recent years on other types of tech. I know people who no longer own desktop or laptop computers at home. They just have an iPad or some other tablet. Many of us who still own computers rarely upgrade and buy inexpensive models when we do. Many of us no longer pay for home phone service and have cut the cord on expensive monthly cable packages as well. Of course now we watch our AT&T and Verizon bills increase the way we watched our cable bills increase for many years. As Apple seeks to capture the streaming music, TV, and homepod markets... they are poised to consume more and more of our paychecks in the future. They have created an appealing ecosystem that continues to delight us as consumers, and now we are right where they want us. At least I feel like they are providing innovations that I appreciate, and products that I get a lot out of. With cable TV I always felt like they were charging us more for a service that was long on quantity and short on quality. I'm not making excuses for Apple raising iPhone prices. I'm just illustrating how we consumers can rationalize this stuff, and Apple knows it. They charge what the market will bear, and their research has told them that it could bear a bit more. I'm sure they are not wrong.
 
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Unlike iPhones the Samsung galaxies drop in price pretty soon after launch. You can pick them up sim free now for around £730 and even lower on eBay if you don’t mind second hand. They are also a hell of a lot cheaper on contract already if that’s the path people choose.

You're correct. But since he mentioned the word "ecosystem" I assumed that it is an important part.

Yes... there is a clear difference between $1,000 and $1,250 if we just look at those raw numbers.

However... I'm not understanding why you'd choose to pay less money for a phone in the wrong ecosystem. That doesn't seem like a good alternative to me.

There have always been phones that are cheaper than the iPhone if you're just looking to save a buck.

But people buy iPhones because of the ecosystem, iMessage, quality apps, accessories, etc. And those things are difficult to assign a direct dollar amount.

I guess you gotta ask yourself how much do you think it's worth to AirDrop files between iPhones, iPads and Macbooks? How much do you think it's worth to share iMessages between all those devices too? Do you enjoy apps from Apple's App Store that might not be the same quality from Google Play or simply not exist on Android at all? Are you considering a smartwatch? Because the Apple Watch is tough to beat. And so on...

Yes... you can usually save money by buying something other than an Apple phone.

But you're also not getting those extra things that the Apple "ecosystem" offers.

So I'm not really seeing the "savings" by going with the cheaper non-iPhone... especially if you are already using Apple products (or multiple Apple products)
 
I say if you’ve are complaining about the prices of iPhone, keep it for 4 yrs them. Don’t upgrade every two years. The difference are pretty subtle.
 
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Fortunately for Apple there are a lot of people willing to pay the Apple premium, or upgrade to last years iPhone, for a variety of reasons. Samsung has a similar advantage in the Android world, despite less expensive alternatives. Chalk it up to good marketing from both companies, and the fact that both established themselves in the minds of many customers early in the smartphone game.

Most people I know became either Android or iPhone people many years ago. Some have switched to iPhone because of a bad experience with an Android phone. Some have switched to Android because they were seeking better value. Most people just upgrade to the next version of whatever they have once their current phone starts to feel slow and unreliable. Even though there might be an alternative out there in the Android world that will give them what they want for half the price, people stay with Apple or Samsung because they don't like change. The options on the Android side are overwhelming if you are switching from iOS.

Most consumers just don’t get excited about the latest phone and features. They are fine with older models, but often pay for the latest model because they are worried about old models becoming slow and obsolete in a year. The latest tech has always cost a premium, but then there is also the premium for a brand like Apple. They will probably lose a few more customers who discover good Android alternatives for less than half the price, but again most consumers dislike change. The iPhone has become such a personal part of their life that they will curse the price increase as they pay for it in slightly higher monthly mobile bills... but they will put up with it for the same reason they put up with rising cable TV rates over the years: They don’t feel like they have much choice. Apple probably did the research and figured out they could push the price for a couple of years, and I bet it levels off for a couple of years... but who knows?

Apple has not only been wildly successful with the iPhone... they have only extended that success by getting many of us to buy companion devices like the iPad and Apple Watch (and then there is Apple TV, music streaming, and HomePod). Ten years ago it probably never occurred to Apple execs that they would one day be getting people to drop $2,000 and up every 1 to 3 years on new iOS/watchOS devices. Before we weep for ourselves as consumers too much, it's important to remember that many of us have spent less in recent years on other types of tech. I know people who no longer own desktop or laptop computers at home. They just have an iPad or some other tablet. Many of us who still own computers rarely upgrade and buy inexpensive models when we do. Many of us no longer pay for home phone service and have cut the cord on expensive monthly cable packages as well. Of course now we watch our AT&T and Verizon bills increase the way we watched our cable bills increase for many years. As Apple seeks to capture the streaming music, TV, and homepod markets... they are poised to consume more and more of our paychecks in the future. They have created an appealing ecosystem that continues to delight us as consumers, and now we are right where they want us. At least I feel like they are providing innovations that I appreciate, and products that I get a lot out of. With cable TV I always felt like they were charging us more for a service that was long on quantity and short on quality. I'm not making excuses for Apple raising iPhone prices. I'm just illustrating how we consumers can rationalize this stuff, and Apple knows it. They charge what the market will bear, and their research has told them that it could bear a bit more. I'm sure they are not wrong.

I agree with much of what you say here and clearly there are enough people happy to pay higher prices etc. In my experience in my small part of the world I have noticed a shift though with people shocked at how high these phones are now priced. I’m seeing a lot of my colleagues and family getting iPhone 8’s and the reports from the UK suggest this is probably a more widespread trend here. It may well be different in countries where the phones are cheaper etc. I’ve also noticed the media are more hot on repeating the price this year than previous years too and one can hope this is the market reaching its peak.
 
You're correct. But since he mentioned the word "ecosystem" I assumed that it is an important part.

Yes... there is a clear difference between $1,000 and $1,250 if we just look at those raw numbers.

However... I'm not understanding why you'd choose to pay less money for a phone in the wrong ecosystem. That doesn't seem like a good alternative to me.

There have always been phones that are cheaper than the iPhone if you're just looking to save a buck.

But people buy iPhones because of the ecosystem, iMessage, quality apps, accessories, etc. And those things are difficult to assign a direct dollar amount.

I guess you gotta ask yourself how much do you think it's worth to AirDrop files between iPhones, iPads and Macbooks? How much do you think it's worth to share iMessages between all those devices too? Do you enjoy apps from Apple's App Store that might not be the same quality from Google Play or simply not exist on Android at all? Are you considering a smartwatch? Because the Apple Watch is tough to beat. And so on...

Yes... you can usually save money by buying something other than an Apple phone.

But you're also not getting those extra things that the Apple "ecosystem" offers.

So I'm not really seeing the "savings" by going with the cheaper non-iPhone... especially if you are already using Apple products (or multiple Apple products)

For me Android isn’t an option. I’d rather buy an older iPhone that is a fraction of a second slower than a current iPhone and save some money than change ecosystem. I do know a few who have switched due to iPhone prices though and been happy. A smartphone pretty much does the same thing regardless of ecosystem but it boils down to personal preference.
 
You're right. The thing is that for most consumers Apple always has been a designer brand. But the shift I'm referring to is that Apple is becoming a designer brand within the consumer base that already could afford it. The MacBook Pro is a good example. Really expensive for a laptop. Now with $1200-$1300 iPhones becoming the norm, Apple is transitioning to designer-level prices even for first-world consumers.
[doublepost=1538321229][/doublepost]
The thing is that Apple is a really smart company. Have they researched what you're proposing? Better believe it. They priced the iPhone where it is after exhaustive study, I'm sure. They know they can get away with it, all while they're boosting prices & services revenue in order to begin compensating for mid-term declines in consumer hardware as we know it. Essentially they're staying one step ahead of the game at all times, and the new iPhone lineup shows it: The XR is is the new medium, yet it is priced like the previous top-end. The X and now XS / Max set the new standard for the $1,000+ market segment. So Apple is taking that, as well as the "old" high-end (now occupied by the XR), and everything else beneath that trickles down to their previous handsets in price. So yes Apple isn't going for the bottom of the barrel like Android and that's precisely where I think Google found their killer angle (similar to Windows vs Mac OS). Apple knows this so they aren't wasting their time competing in those markets. As far as we know the Apple Car is till happening, and better believe that an AR device is in the works. Apple knows what they're doing and have the roadmap for the next 3-5 years pretty darn well figured out it seems.
I think they’re basically testing price elasticity now - it’s how much can we get away with charging without completely putting people off. iPhone sales volumes have pretty much stagnated, but Wall Street still want growing profits so it’s kind of forced their hand. Unfortunately for Apple, given modestly lower sales of iPhone X and XS than was expected, it doesn’t look like they have a lot of headroom to keep that up for much longer. They’ve ‘gotten away’ with it a bit this year as they could upsell those who always want the latest and greatest and will pay whatever it costs from the X to the XS Max, but I think from where on in it’s going to be tougher and tougher to get even the Apple faithful to part with that much money on a regular and consistent basis.
 
For me Android isn’t an option. I’d rather buy an older iPhone that is a fraction of a second slower than a current iPhone and save some money than change ecosystem. I do know a few who have switched due to iPhone prices though and been happy. A smartphone pretty much does the same thing regardless of ecosystem but it boils down to personal preference.
The problem is even though I prefer iOS I might be able to get over that but the ecosystem makes it nearly impossible for me to switch to android.
 
Smartphone craze ia waning. Most of the features are really gimmicks.

New way to unlock your phone
Taller display
Curved display
Bezel-less display
Animoji
Dual lens

You know what are underrated features? Google's computational photography focusing on only one lens and Pixels' 24/7 customer support where you don't need to call or go to your carrier or retail store for answers. Apple's underrated products are AirPods.

Nothing lasts forever. Remember, AOL?
I helped someone that still has aol recently, like last month.

ETA,

I just spent $400 on a hair dryer this year. Another $500 for skincare/hair products that would hopefully last a year but more realistically 6 months.

I have a pair of Chloe boots sitting in my closet that I don’t wear anymore due to my knee and can’t resell for more than $500 so I’m keeping it because I purchased it for $1600. Got a total of 6 wears.

I just brought a few tops, a bottom, and a pair of flats—all on sale eg 30% off, 15% off, etc and I still spent $490.

$1100 for a piece of technology that can hold my ebooks for college to read on the train? Ok, more realistically I play games, read reddit and browse Instagram. Monday’s/thursdays I watch nfl on it during this time of the year. I have my MacBook pro but for the longest time my iPhone acted as my computer.

It’s expensive yes. But I’ve paid more for things like designer handbags, shoes, clothing...
 
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Was going to buy the XS Max until they priced it way above $1000. $1100 for a 64GB Max is pathetic. Also unlike what Tim Cook says I only pay full price upfront for my phones. Last years iPhone X was my absolute limit for phone pricing. I am looking into getting a Note 9 next month. Time to check out Android. I am breaking up my ecosystem unfortunately but no choice.
[doublepost=1538321656][/doublepost]
Apple knows very well that once they raise prices Samsung and Google will follow suit and customers will still get an iPhone. Samsung will price the Note 10 next year at the same price as the XS Max.

I think that’s a great idea.

You should definitely get a note 9.
 
I forgot the original thesis of this thread, but I notice a ton of people that are keeping 6/7 phones and don’t seem to have any desire to upgrade. Apple seems to be failing to convince these people about the value proposition of upgrading
 
I think yearly upgrades took a hit. But that wasn't the core anyway.

It remains to be seen whether people will push their upgrades even longer or what happens really. Unsure we can really track a trend earlier than 3-4 years. Everything took a huge leap in cost, even the Apple Watch.

Another thing to consider thiguh is hardware longevity. We have three year old hardware running iOS 12 very well. Many people don't see a reason to dump their 6s because of how well it runs. And in terms of features, they're missing absolutely nothing unless you're counting faceid.
 
This “X thing costs only $10 more per month”
is the mother of bad financial decisions.

Would people be OK if suddenly everything their bought cost 15% more? And they had to pay 15% more to get what is effectively the same thing?
 
Apple should not update their hardware every year they should focus on their software and cloud services. Don't mention when a new product is released until when is ready as will bring back the excitement. Get away from the yearly iPhone upgrade and change the design every 2-3 years. Apple has the hardware mastered now just concentrate on software and cloud services. They could have just kept the iPhone 8/8 plus design and concentrated on software/cloud services. At some point they are going to run out of ideas.
 
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I forgot the original thesis of this thread, but I notice a ton of people that are keeping 6/7 phones and don’t seem to have any desire to upgrade. Apple seems to be failing to convince these people about the value proposition of upgrading
Maybe they value their dollar and save more, or have more pressing priorities like sending their kids to school or saving for back to school clothes.

I would say most people hold on to their phones for 2-4 yrs. macrumors is a biased sample as we are more likely to buy the latest tech. For Bobbie Joe down the street, my elderly neighbors, people who have young and growing families where there disposable incomes goes towards their family (and aren’t using their free time reading forums) the latest and greatest simply aren’t that important.
 
I forgot the original thesis of this thread, but I notice a ton of people that are keeping 6/7 phones and don’t seem to have any desire to upgrade. Apple seems to be failing to convince these people about the value proposition of upgrading

I don’t think ‘Failing’ is the appropriate word, Which I’m also not sure how you arrived to that conclusion of those are not willing to upgrade. If you have those who are retaining an iPhone 6 or seven, the latest iPhones are simply not Apples target audience. Not every iPhone owner has to want to upgrade to the iPhone XS just because it’s the ‘latest iPhone offered’. Perhaps Others are more than content retaining their iPhone 6/7 for the sake that they _don’t_ care about the latest technology like others do.
 
I don’t think ‘Failing’ is the appropriate word, Which I’m also not sure how you arrived to that conclusion of those are not willing to upgrade. If you have those who are retaining an iPhone 6 or seven, the latest iPhones are simply not Apples target audience. Not every iPhone owner has to want to upgrade to the iPhone XS just because it’s the ‘latest iPhone offered’. Perhaps Others are more than content retaining their iPhone 6/7 for the sake that they _don’t_ care about the latest technology like others do.

There are people who have changed their upgrade patterns though and I’m one of them. I used to be really enthusiastic about having the latest iPhone with no questions asked. I’ve noticed a lot of people I know keep phones longer ‘because there phones are working fine’ or they are not keen on the new prices etc. There’s a definite shift in my country as a whole as new iPhones are selling less than older ones and 3 year contracts are now being promoted.

I don’t think the people like me who now buy older models or keep devices longer are ‘not Apples target audience’. It’s just priorities and preferences have changed that are out of Apples control.
 
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