Apple is not going to stop starting at 8GB anytime soon. And that's good.

[Pankeborg]

8GB is a good amount if you're a simple user who doesn't run many apps at the same time, or you don't have 40 tabs open.
...
In the meantime...just buy your damn RAM up to 16GB if you are obsessing over it!

Absolutely, 8gb is plenty for most users. If people could also stop complaining about the minimum disk space offered on iPhones, that would be great. Apple commenters need to realise that most people are not doing video editing with 8k streams, or storing all the movies they ever downloaded. It's not a plot or a scam, it's just that Apple knows how normal people use their devices, and you don't. You think everyone is a power user. The typical mac owner uses safari, word and possibly excel, and that is great.

This is probably the one issue where Apple haters and Apple fanboys can agree. The fanboys are power users and nerds that think everyone else also needs a super computer, the haters just want to find things to hate, so they seize on things like "only" providing 8gb of ram as the baseline.

 

[AlixSPQR]

if you're a simple user

You're on to something there. People need to feel special when they can afford 16 GB RAM. If it suddenly were that in the base models, they would feel simple. We can't have that, can we?

 

[HackMacDaddy]

And another one:
View attachment 2309662
So guys, please don‘t expect you can actually do Pro stuff on your Pro laptop. Also remember to repeat: „8GB is fine, I‘m just using it wrong“

 

[amaze1499]

I won’t buy a MacBook Pro anytime soon. That’s good.

Loose the notch. Make 16gb Ram and 512gb Ssd standard. Clean up the bugs in MacOs, iOS and iCloud and we are in business.

 

[Pankeborg]

You're on to something there. People need to feel special when they can afford 16 GB RAM. If it suddenly were that in the base models, they would feel simple. We can't have that, can we?

Not really sure what your point is, but if you think that Apple sells 8gb machines in order for some people to feel special about upgrading to 16gb then you're off. They sell them because it looks better to have a lower entry price, and because for most people it's enough, and

 

[Pankeborg]

I won’t buy a MacBook Pro anytime soon. That’s good.

Loose the notch. Make 16gb Ram and 512gb Ssd standard. Clean up the bugs in MacOs, iOS and iCloud and we are in business.

So you are going to boycott MacBook Pro until they stop selling 16gb ones? why not just buy a 16gb / 512gb machine if that's what you want, and let people who are happy with 8gb / 256gb buy that. How are you better off by preventing people from buying a more basic configuration?

 

[droidgod]

100% Apple milks RAM upgrades.

However, its also true that 8Gigs is prolly enough for Apples base config as per their User studies.

When I say that, I don't mean the user is not well served with 16Gigs, just that Apple probably has the data that shows that for the folks that buy the base config, they can put in 8Gigs and the user is ok with that (based on telemetry).

Thats not to say that they are not short-changing the users, just that Apple knows their target audience.

 

[Pankeborg]

When I say that, I don't mean the user is not well served with 16Gigs, just that Apple probably has the data that shows that for the folks that buy the base config, they can put in 8Gigs and the user is ok with that (based on telemetry).

For sure. Obviously Apple charges an arm and a leg for RAM upgrades, but as sweet as that high margin income is, if a large proportion of users would suffer using their 8gb machines, that would hurt their brand, it would not be worth it. Apple is very oriented towards long term thinking.

 

[ric22]

For sure. Obviously Apple charges an arm and a leg for RAM upgrades, but as sweet as that high margin income is, if a large proportion of users would suffer using their 8gb machines, that would hurt their brand, it would not be worth it. Apple is very oriented towards long term thinking.

I think the long term thinking involves building machines insufficient to last the long term, that also can't be repaired or upgraded...

 

[Pankeborg]

I think the long term thinking involves building machines insufficient to last the long term, that also can't be repaired or upgraded...

Insufficient? Apple products hold up for a very long time, thanks to extremely good build quality and long support. Everyday I see people using 5 year old macbooks without any issues at all. My wife gave up her 2012 MBA only in 2021, my son still uses my 2016 MBP.

iPhones and MacBooks have much higher second hand value than any other consumer electronics, that alone shows how off the mark your comment is.

 

[Love-hate 🍏 relationship]

Wow, you guys will find out inventive ways to rationalize every crappy Apple practice lol

With this train of thought, you might as well keep all the macs at 128gb/8gb ram because "the average user doesn't need it, everyone uses the cloud". C'mon, just pony up $100 for 256gb, $300 for 512gb, or $500 for 1tb and another $200/$400 for 16/32gb of ram to pay your power user tax.

EDIT: Your only job as a consumer should be to make sure you get the value you deserve for how much you're spending on a product. I'm sure you guys do this for everything else you buy, but turn a blind eye when it comes to Apple.

That's cognitive dissonance resolution to its apogee

 

[AJB1971]

I thought that 8GB of RAM was sufficient for a long time, but if I’m buying a Mac now, especially a Pro one, I do expect more.

The OP says that they don’t expect Apple to increase RAM anytime soon (we know that the M3 Airs will come with 8GB and they’ve not even been released), but when do they expect it?

My view is that the increase to 18GB in the M3 Pro chips is significant. The use of 6GB memory modules does open the door for Apple to offer 12GB in future versions of the standard chip. I expect that to happen with the M4, but I may be wrong.

If Apple were to increase the base RAM to 12GB, it would likely be considered insufficient for those who currently opt for 16GB, and they would still upgrade to the next tier. The impact on sales may not be that great.

While RAM is probably more of a consideration for MacRumors members than the average consumer, I would imagine that a lot of those consumers look at reviews before making such a purchase. The lack of RAM is frequently cited as a negative point. It’s debatable whether that puts people off purchasing or pushes them to upgrade.

Despite the supposed supply constraints on chips, the availability of the standard M3 MacBook Pros seems good, which could indicate that sales haven’t been great. That could be partly due to the significant price increase over the model it’s effectively replaced, but also due to the expectations that higher price brings.

 

[HackMacDaddy]

For sure. Obviously Apple charges an arm and a leg for RAM upgrades, but as sweet as that high margin income is, if a large proportion of users would suffer using their 8gb machines, that would hurt their brand, it would not be worth it. Apple is very oriented towards long term thinking.

It did hurt their brand. They had to come out and comment on the situation in defense which they almost never do. Many people will keep using their M1/M2 devices until Apple fixes this in the M4 generation. They could have avoided this with bumping up to 12 gigs.

 

[Pankeborg]

I thought that 8GB of RAM was sufficient for a long time, but if I’m buying a Mac now, especially a Pro one, I do expect more.

So it's a good thing you can opt for more then. What I don't get is why people are so passionate about removing the cheaper base models? If they are not enough for you, buy extra ram. Some people don't need the extra ram, let them save a few hundred!

 

[gpat]

I suppose that M1 Pro/Max early adopters in 2021 are going to keep their laptops until 2030.

Thank you Apple for offering a pathetic lineup so actual "Pro" products will last longer.

 

[maratus]

16GB was fine in a premium laptop in 2012. Apple plays exclusively in the premium market, so I think 32GB should be the base for all decent MacBook Pro models. And I’d accept the absolute entry level config with 16GB, but not at the current prices.

It’s not just about having barely enough for the Facebook browsing crowd. Modern browsers and websites consume tons of RAM and I’ve seen non-power users having so many tabs open all at once which eat up RAM quickly too.

It’s more about very fundamental future proofing. Premium laptops shouldn’t leave factory being nearly obsolete in key non-upgradable areas. And if I happen to need a used laptop, it’d be nice not to have filter through the useless 8GB configurations.

 

[StellarVixen]

I suppose that M1 Pro/Max early adopters in 2021 are going to keep their laptops until 2030.

Thank you Apple for offering a pathetic lineup so actual "Pro" products will last longer.

I see this easily happening to some extent unless Apple decides it's enough and start killing those Macs by not offering anymore OS updates.

 

[3Rock]

Absolutely, 8gb is plenty for most users. If people could also stop complaining about the minimum disk space offered on iPhones, that would be great. Apple commenters need to realise that most people are not doing video editing with 8k streams, or storing all the movies they ever downloaded. It's not a plot or a scam, it's just that Apple knows how normal people use their devices, and you don't. You think everyone is a power user. The typical mac owner uses safari, word and possibly excel, and that is great.

This is probably the one issue where Apple haters and Apple fanboys can agree. The fanboys are power users and nerds that think everyone else also needs a super computer, the haters just want to find things to hate, so they seize on things like "only" providing 8gb of ram as the baseline.

I am not a power user, and never will be, and would like a system from Apple at the lowest possible cost point with some of the nice bills and whistles included. And I will add one thing to this. Just buy the additional ram for it for goodness sakes, and be done with it. That’s what I did and I won’t rant on and on about it. Only issue I have with apples memory that if you want to upgrade it cost you more than what I think they should charge and that’s about it. 🤪

besides, Apple does tell you how much memory you actually need for different needs.

 

[gpat]

I see this easily happening to some extent unless Apple decides it's enough and start killing those Macs by not offering anymore OS updates.

That would cause a massive backlash considering that they still sell M1 Air and it's actually a wildly popular and praised product.
I'm not really concerned, my laptop pays for itself every day, but they are forcing themselves into a corner in which M1 Pro/Max users have absolutely zero reason to upgrade, much like 2015 owners for 6 years straight.

 

[jclardy]

I think with M4 we'll see base "pro" models bumped to 12GB base. MBA/iMac will still stick with 8GB.

I'm starting to think the major problem here isn't really that the base configuration of Macs start with 8GB RAM, but more so the fact that you aren't able to upgrade your machine after purchase as was possible in the past.

If you think that you might end up needing more memory later down the line, you are faced with the choice of either buying a lesser machine now and potentially needing to purchase a new machine sooner, or paying exorbitantly for upgrades at time of purchase since it's the only chance you have at improving specs/performance for the lifetime of that device.

Granted, all of this is to assume that you are purchasing a machine in the present with the understanding that your needs may change in the future, and whether or not you can justify (read: stomach) the costs of Apple's upgrades.

Yeah - this is the heart of the issue. If I buy most any off the shelf windows laptop, most have commodity RAM/SSD and even Wifi slots. You can buy the base model when it is on sale at Best Buy, and buy the upgrades when they go on sale at Newegg. Or maybe you don't need 16GB of RAM right now, but maybe next year...But then you run into the second issue - when doing the RAM/SSD swaps - you can buy crappy upgrades (Slower, larger SSD, slower RAM.) With Apple - you can only upgrade to the top of the line option, and you are paying for the privilege.

 

[drugdoubles]

Is 8GB of Apple RAM equal to 16GB? I doubt that. But it is definitely more efficient, and with dynamic caching, even more efficient than we've seen it become.

Is it equal to 12GB of PC RAM? 10GB?

Apple isn't going to stop starting at 8GB anytime soon. They know that bumping up the low end will increase costs across the board...and especially since going to Apple Silicon, 8GB is a good amount if you're a simple user who doesn't run many apps at the same time, or you don't have 40 tabs open.

It's actually good they aren't just going to 16GB, because it incentizes them to make the system as efficient as possible, which pays dividends by making all Macs better machines. And if you are reading this, you're a power user—you come to Macrumors, come on—so you already know you want at least 16GB, so pay the tax.

It's not smoke and mirrors—Apple Silicon does use RAM better, and 8GB is increasingly enough depending on what you do with it. Bleating over and over that Apple "needs" to give away double that amount is silly...they will only do that if they look at what their average user is doing with the machines, and seeing that those folks are starting to have real memory pressure at such a level that the floor needs to be raised.

And when they do—count on it being 12 GB, not 16.

In the meantime...just buy your damn RAM up to 16GB if you are obsessing over it!

Actually ram is so cheap now, 32gb desktop ram is just around $80 usd. Apple is just so greedy and they know with 8gb ram only they can easily make the MacOS laggy anytime they want when they want you to buy a new one.

 

[gpat]

Yeah - this is the heart of the issue. If I buy most any off the shelf windows laptop, most have commodity RAM/SSD and even Wifi slots. You can buy the base model when it is on sale at Best Buy, and buy the upgrades when they go on sale at Newegg. Or maybe you don't need 16GB of RAM right now, but maybe next year...But then you run into the second issue - when doing the RAM/SSD swaps - you can buy crappy upgrades (Slower, larger SSD, slower RAM.) With Apple - you can only upgrade to the top of the line option, and you are paying for the privilege.

The "Apple way" of solving this problem is just to resell your Macbook on some marketplace and buy another.

It's not that bad of a solution, considering that Walmart laptops have terrible to no resell value at all, but I understand how it could be irritating to some.

Not advocating for Apple at all, it just is what it is.

 

[AJB1971]

So it's a good thing you can opt for more then. What I don't get is why people are so passionate about removing the cheaper base models? If they are not enough for you, buy extra ram. Some people don't need the extra ram, let them save a few hundred!

I don’t think that people are 'passionate about removing the cheaper base models'. What they do want to see is Apple improve the specs, like they’ve done many times in the past and like they will do in the future. I think that time has come; you obviously don't.

Components improve, but that doesn’t necessarily translate to price increases. Certainly, the difference between 8GB and 12GB is not going to equate to a 'few hundred'.

 

[James Godfrey]

What we have to remember also is that if the base RAM on the Air’s or entry MBP bumped up to 16GB, they would likely get a price hike, and then following that the M Pro/Max machines would also have to bump in RAM essentially meaning price jumps across the board. There is no way they would put 16GB entry in the Air and then have 18GB entry in the pros… if anything I think the Airs/entry pros would bump to 12GB RAM, but we will be waiting quite a while for that, probably early 2025 at earliest when M4 launches, even then though I wouldn’t like to hold my breath for it.

 

[ric22]

What we have to remember also is that if the base RAM on the Air’s or entry MBP bumped up to 16GB, they would likely get a price hike, and then following that the M Pro/Max machines would also have to bump in RAM essentially meaning price jumps across the board. There is no way they would put 16GB entry in the Air and then have 18GB entry in the pros… if anything I think the Airs/entry pros would bump to 12GB RAM, but we will be waiting quite a while for that, probably early 2025 at earliest when M4 launches, even then though I wouldn’t like to hold my breath for it.

They bumped the iPhone Pro's RAM without a price hike this year. The Airs in 2024 could bump to 12GB and the base Pro model would also receive the same bump.