Apple Rivals Unite to Promote Open Ecosystems Using EU Law

[Hildy]

If it's a fight they want, then I hope it's a fight Apple gives them.

“Apple positions its customers, not profit, as the guiding light for everything it does.”

Wouldn’t it be nice if more companies focused on why Apple has been so successful and tried to emulate their success? Unfortunately no one has explained to the EU that customer safety/satisfaction should be paramount.

Or is all of this just an attempt to stop Apple from protecting user privacy in an increasingly surveillance saturated world?

 

[Abazigal]

Or is all of this just an attempt to stop Apple from protecting user privacy in an increasingly surveillance saturated world?

I believe they simply want unfettered access to Apple's customers, without Apple standing in between the two parties. This would have ramifications, such as the inability to better protect our privacy via features like ATT and Sign in with Apple, or the use of iTunes to protect my user data, or even steering users to their own App Stores where apps don't have to conform to Apple's App Store rules (which I admit can be for better or for worse).

So to answer your question, all that, and probably more.

 

[displayblock]

a) It is not black and white, it is to various degrees. Lets not pretend all companies are equally as invasive.

b) The goal for privacy is to have as few companies collecting your data as possible. Just because you let Apple or Microsoft or Google collect data on you, doesn’t mean you want 1 or 100 other companies collecting your data as well.

Sorry, I should have said Apple profits significantly from setting Google as the default search engine.

 

[Naraxus]

I am not doing your leg work for you mate.
Google (since you love Android, it seems it should be easy for you to use) is your friend.
Piracy is a huge problem on Android to the fact that the US justice department is actively going after pirates.

A simple google search also brought a subreddit with nearly 2 million active users dedicated to specifically Android piracy. But okay, piracy is not an issue /s

It's no different than Windows. I dont know why you act offended that I said Androdi users pirate apps. Because they do. It's easy to do and not that difficult.

You're the one who made the asinine claim. It's up to you to prove your statement is correct, not for @dk001 to prove it false.

 

[jole]

I like the garden. With walls and all. If you like something else, go somewhere else.

 

[boss.king]

Yes, let’s wield government regulation to force companies to bend to our will, that’ll show those pesky innovators.

You can still innovate while complying with the law.

 

[scorpio vega]

You're the one who made the asinine claim. It's up to you to prove your statement is correct, not for @dk001 to prove it false.

I am not making ''asinine claims'. Nor am I doing their leg work for them. I know you feel the need to rally to defend Androdi but it's not necessary.

i cant link to the articles as I am sure that is against MR rules so yes ANYONE can google (it should be easy, you use android) to find the same results that I do.

You can look at the play store itself. Playstation and Gameboy emulators with well over 1 million downloads, I can wager and bet most of them are using illegally downloaded and obtained roms for the emulators. Prime example.

 

[scorpio vega]

You can still innovate while complying with the law.

And apple is not breaking the law by not bringing iMessage to Android nor not allowing 3rd party stores.

 

[boss.king]

I am not making ''asinine claims'. Nor am I doing their leg work for them. I know you feel the need to rally to defend Androdi but it's not necessary.

i cant link to the articles as I am sure that is against MR rules so yes ANYONE can google (it should be easy, you use android) to find the same results that I do.

You can look at the play store itself. Playstation and Gameboy emulators with well over 1 million downloads, I can wager and bet most of them are using illegally downloaded and obtained roms for the emulators. Prime example.

You definitely can link to articles, I do it all the time.

 

[boss.king]

And apple is not breaking the law by not bringing iMessage to Android nor not allowing 3rd party stores.

Exactly, and if the laws change, Apple should change its practices to comply. I'm glad we agree that there's no issue here.

 

[scorpio vega]

Exactly, and if the laws change, Apple should change its practices to comply. I'm glad we agree that there's no issue here.

If the laws change in a manner that is fair, yes i agree. As it stands, this does not seem fair and it seems like an attempt from competitors to try and stifle apple.

 

[boss.king]

If the laws change in a manner that is fair, yes i agree. As it stands, this does not seem fair and it seems like an attempt from competitors to try and stifle apple.

You realise that those companies would also be subject to these laws, right? Also, those competitors don't make the law — they can advocate for all sorts of things but that doesn't mean they have control over what gets passed.

 

[Technerd108]

Except I don't have any issues sending text messages to anyone. I am at my mom's house and I just sent a bunch of pics from my 15 pro max. No compression.

Recorded a video just now and again, no compression.

I can argue that apple DOES enable basic functions like phone calls and texting via SMS, so that makes your argument incorrect. Apple is adopting RCS.

iMessage does not nor should not be cross platform if Apple is meeting the basic requirements for communication.

I am not blindly defending Apple. I am just stating facts.

Your post makes my points for me but you can't see your own bias.

I am not saying make iMessage on Android. So far, rumors suggest Apple may not use e2e encryption on RCS defeating one of the main purposes of adopting RCS and it is too early to tell what Apple will do.

Why shouldn't iMessage be cross platform in functionality with Google messages. I don't need or care about iMessage. I just want my texts to work, photos and videos to be of high quality.

Maybe you haven't experienced compression but I and many others have. And yes the most basic, old, insecure standard of SMS is what Apple currently renders iMessage users who interact with Android users. It violates the entire idea of security because you want to send a text to a different brand phone. Seems pretty sketchy and illegal to me.

Why is it that Apple is in the right here?

 

[springsup]

If it's a fight they want, then I hope it's a fight Apple gives them.

The problem is that the winners are decided by politicians, not merit.

For instance, the EU’s digital markets act is crafted to target big Silicon Valley Internet businesses while exempting their EU competitors and similar business practices in other markets.

Spotify has a majority of the music streaming market? Doesn’t matter; they’re based in the EU. They’re allowed to make exclusivity deals which ensure devices won’t include other streaming apps, and they don’t get called out for gatekeeping.

Apple wants to make an explicitly closed platform? They’re a gatekeeper. Console manufacturers want to make an explicitly closed platform? They’re exempt.

It’s illogical BS designed to target specific companies. But politicians have the power to do that; they’re not required to be fair or logical.

 

[Abazigal]

Came across this on YouTube as well.

It does help explain the cultural differences between the two when it comes to work, and helps shine some light why so many tech giants originated from the US.

 

[Hildy]

I believe they simply want unfettered access to Apple's customers, without Apple standing in between the two parties.

So to answer your question, all that, and probably more.

I think the sticky point is whether, “they” are the companies lobbying to deconstruct the system, or the governments wanting the same unfettered access? 😳 🤷🏼‍♂️

 

[Abazigal]

I think the sticky point is whether, “they” are the companies lobbying to deconstruct the system, or the governments wanting the same unfettered access?

I would bet my last dollar on “both” being the answer.

 

[Ctrlos]

And again Mac is not iOs. iOs was not designed to be as such

Actually it was. For one it's OSX underneath and Jobs wanted an open market of Web Apps before the hackers got to it.

 

[svish]

Looks like there will be more pressure applied on Apple to change things across EU and the world

 

[downpour]

What I'm talking about is me being able to build a tiny crummy app that does something only I care about, and then run that on my own device without having to pay the piper yearly, I've already paid Apple a ton of money for the device, they are not entitled to a yearly subscription just so that I can have the privilege of running my own code on my own fully purchased device.

It has been a while but I’m pretty sure I never paid Apple for the couple of Apps I created and tested on my iPhone. I thought their charges were for developing apps for sale on the App Store.

 

[downpour]

If Amazon built a city and denied all its citizens access to AliExpress then this would be a fair comparison.

What we're actually talking about is more like forcing Amazon to co-exist with AliExpress, which they already do...

So Apple is forcing people to not buy other phones?

 

[gregmancuso]

Yeah, Google and Meta, everyone's best "friends" lol

"This whole open thing has nothing to do with ads, we promise. Don't be Evil. Cambridge Analytica. Bla-bla-bla."

Apple should have made iMessage with built-in FaceTime feature and cross-platform payments a holistic Android app years ago. They would be the messaging and payments defacto platform outside of China right now, obliterating Square, PayPal, WhatsApp, Revolut and everyone in between, while having to lock nothing down at the same time.

Other than those pesky patents. Making messages and FaceTime open was the original plan.

 

[jido]

Good opportunity for Apple to gain more iPhone buyers knowing they can still use apps they were using « on the other side » or at least not limited to the App Store offerings.

 

[koil]

The companies and devs will utilize the option for sideloading, it won’t be up to us. They’ll create their own app stores and have sideloading for many apps/games to get around paying Apple. Also as another user mentioned, being able to keep tabs on all our subscriptions through our Apple ID is amazing. When they allow third party payments that will be over, and companies won’t be passing the 30% savings on to the consumer, I can tell you that.

Also, big picture: currently Apple makes money mostly by selling hardware, then ~25% from services including the App Store. Google, Meta etc make money through user data and ads. Currently Apple has little need for ads or to sell user data, however, take away their App Store revenue, and disincentivize hardware sales (through things like making iMessage for Android), and Apple will need to look for other avenues to replace that revenue.

I can tell you we aren’t going to like it when they do. We already complain about the little bit of advertising we get now…

So why hasn't this happened on Android? Googles fees on the Play Store are comparative to Apples fees, yet people aren't installing 8 app stores to get access to popular apps there.

Why is that, and why would it be different when Apple does it? Arguably Apple is already better at making a good app store experience than Google, so they should already be less exposed to this problem than Google, which, again, doesn't have this problem today.

I'll give you that it's likely apps will start moving subscriptions away from Apples payment solution if they are allowed to. We don't yet know if all the DMA rules will actually affect App Store rules, the rules just say "developers must have options to use alternative payment solutions", but that could also be achieved by Apple simply allowing developers to distribute apps on their own, while apps distributed through the App Store are still required to use Apples payment solution if they sell subscriptions.

It has been a while but I’m pretty sure I never paid Apple for the couple of Apps I created and tested on my iPhone. I thought their charges were for developing apps for sale on the App Store.

That is technically possible today, but with prohibitively annoying caveats, you have to reinstall the app every 7 days, you can't have more than 3 app bundles, and you can't have more than 10 app IDs (one app bundle can contain multiple app types, like widgets, Safari extensions, etc)...

 

[scorpio vega]

Actually it was. For one it's OSX underneath and Jobs wanted an open market of Web Apps before the hackers got to it.

IOS is not OSX underneath. At least not it is original iteration.