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Umm are you sure about that? iOS 16.7.6 just came out as a security update.

If you have a device that supports iOS 17, but didn't upgrade to iOS 17 yet, you don’t get the choice of upgrading to iOS 16.7.6, only to iOS 17.4. IOS 16.7.6 is only available on devices that don't support iOS 17.
 
I recall Steve Jobs in the early 2000s talking about Mac OS being more and more compatible within a Windows environment. Many keynotes he would talk about various features and codecs being cross compatible with Windows. The audience in attendance seemed to respond very positively to that. What happened? Over the years I have considered "switching" to a Windows PC and even an Android phone. But I grew up on Apple pretty much exclusively. So when it came time just recently to buy a new laptop I stuck with Apple and bought an M3 MacBook Pro 14". I just think it would be a lot for me to switch sides.
 
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think if Apple adopted a Microsoft strategy and kept selling their own hardware like the Microsoft surface line but opened up the OS to all OEM's and opened up iOS I think the money Apple could make would be enormous. How many staunch Windows users might try MacOS if they could dual boot?

I hope this never happens. Windows is plagued with a bad reputation because of cheap crappy machines. Let’s not damage apples.

I greatly prefer apple as the sole manufacturer
 
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I recall Steve Jobs in the early 2000s talking about Mac OS being more and more compatible within a Windows environment. Many keynotes he would talk about various features and codecs being cross compatible with Windows. The audience in attendance seemed to respond very positively to that. What happened? Over the years I have considered "switching" to a Windows PC and even an Android phone. But I grew up on Apple pretty much exclusively. So when it came time just recently to buy a new laptop I stuck with Apple and bought an M3 MacBook Pro 14". I just think it would be a lot for me to switch sides.
If it works for you then why switch? If you enjoy your devices and don't have any issues or any issues that bother you then I agree with you. It would only cause you a headache for no gain.

I am all about the end result. People love to argue how you get there but in the end all that matters is that you got there.

I have known many people who are long time Apple users who use their devices as long as possible and enjoy them because of the features and value over time. How can I argue with them? They are right!

And the same is true for Windows fans.

The point is, if you have something you like and works the grass is rarely truly greener on the other side.

That being said if you are tired of the status quo and want to re wire your brain then learn a new OS and use it exclusive for a few months then switch back. It is very good for brain plasticity to constantly relearn or do the same tasks in a different way. So it might be fun and a challenge that might be good for you. But it is only something to do if you are really motivated to do so otherwise it is a fools errand.
 
32GB is fine for base level.. 8 is trolling, end of..
I would say 16gb is really baseline ram any laptop should have since our phones and tablets have 8-12gb standard these days and some up to 24gb!

8gb is like 4gb used to be. You can get by but do anything intensive for any longer period of time and it is going to be a bottleneck.

On a entry level computer starting at $1000 I think at least 12gb should be standard.

16gb really should be but 12gb is a decent compromise. Specially with Apple silicon sharing the ram with the GPU. It would make the entry models last a lot longer. And this is NOT just an Apple thing. A lot of Windows OEMs still sell 8gb configurations at high prices (Surface laptop, and a couple others) but most are starting at 16gb ram now.

So there really is no logical excuse or reason other than forcing an expensive up charge and selling a lower cost product knowing it is handicapped and force people to buy another entry laptop in a few years.
 
4x open slots, allow me to install what I need, look the point is, I have a 12 yr old laptop that would have been so much better but for the lack of upgrades, I would have spent money at the "istore" having Maccy upgraded, from the pathetic 8 to more than 8, 4 times, every 3 years, an upgrade, why not, income for the "istore" reseller, income for Apple Inc, but no we cannot have nice things, cause some lump of coal has no imagination..
 
Mac are so overpriced at MSRP that it negates a ton of the "resale value" argument right out of the gate.

Base model M's just languish on the preowned market .. BTO ones sell, but the original buyer got absolutely GOUGED to buy them to begin with..

And on trade in pricing ... LMFAO -- Apple treats BTO upgrades as though they never happened
To me I just see extortion up and down the Apple "ladder" these days.

Better resale value is much less appealing when you got totally ripped off on the buy side

I've always maintained that you make your great deal on the buy side (on most all products really)

To me the smart Apple money is on buying lightly preowned (sort of like cars) and let the original buyer have their shorts ripped off instead
Oh absolutely, buying lightly used is a fantastic way to go. Best Buy also has fantastic sales at times - I got my 14" MBP M1 Pro for $1,599 a couple of holiday seasons ago.
 
With the Mx processors and the inability to replace a failed battery or SSD, that longevity advantage is quickly evaporating. You have consumable parts on your computer that are not user replaceable, and you have Apple who is restricting the install of newer OS's onto those machines (of course, Microsoft are now doing the same ****, with its TPM requirements for Windows 11).

Conversely, I had a 2013 Dell Precision laptop (M3800 model) that I passed on to one of my son's friends. He is still using it. Only upgrade that had to be made to that laptop was a new battery (aftermarket replacement was less than $100 CAD). It runs Windows 10 quite well. That machine was my absolute favourite laptop of all time.
I've been particularly lucky I think. I've owned many macs over the years, and only one of them (a 2011 MacBook Air) had any components go bad (caps on the logic board). And that was when it was 8-9 years old. Otherwise they've been reliable! I even had the dreaded 2018 15" MPB with the butterfly keyboard and it was fine.
 
You'd legit think it just came out of the box from an Apple Store in 2015 -- wild!
Wow, that looks fantastic. I'm jealous. I still have my 2012 MBP, and it generally clean, but the battery is toast and the performance is lacking, obviously.

I do think that moving away from Intel to ARM was a good call on Apple’s part.
Yes and no. On one hand, it drove a segment of apple users away from Macs, those that wanted/needed windows to run on Mac (natively) - this included myself. On the other hand, you cannot discount the performance that apple had designed in the ARM machines, and its long battery life. I'm amazed at how well my MBP runs on battery, but its not my main machine simply because I need windows
 
If you have a device that supports iOS 17, but didn't upgrade to iOS 17 yet, you don’t get the choice of upgrading to iOS 16.7.6, only to iOS 17.4. IOS 16.7.6 is only available on devices that don't support iOS 17.
Ah, well then that sucks. I wonder if you can manually do it by connecting to a PC/Mac and loading the file from there. Thank you for clarifying...
 
Wow, that looks fantastic. I'm jealous. I still have my 2012 MBP, and it generally clean, but the battery is toast and the performance is lacking, obviously.


Yes and no. On one hand, it drove a segment of apple users away from Macs, those that wanted/needed windows to run on Mac (natively) - this included myself. On the other hand, you cannot discount the performance that apple had designed in the ARM machines, and its long battery life. I'm amazed at how well my MBP runs on battery, but its not my main machine simply because I need windows
I wonder if Snapdragon will allow Hackintoshes again with the ARM compatibility. I could have it all again! Likely not. The have the Mx version of MacOS locked down...
 
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I know people talk fondly about the hardware now, but I gotta tell you when you get one of these and it’s essentially brand new ..these things are freaking nice.

I don’t really think the Apple hardware now is better. It’s just a lot newer.
Completely agree! I think the quality was better in 2015 for sure.
Man, you two in your little echo chamber!!

A couple of years ago, I bought a brand new, still sealed, PowerBook 5300, dated from 1997. It was built for the extended repair program since the 5300 was such a wreck-prone machine, but never used so had been sitting in a corner of a warehouse all these years. It has Mac OS 7.6 on it, runs like a dream, and even has an actual, proper, keyboard, not one of these chiclet things.

I've installed MS Office 5 on it (Word 6, Excel 5, PowerPoint-heaven-only-knows-what) and it only weighs about twice the M1 MBA.
 
Similar frustration with Apple except having to switch from Intel to ARM.
Went thru this back in mid 2000’s with Apple with PowerPC to Intel.
Frustrated having to repurchase software or find equivalent replacements. I’m fine with Rosetta but that’s probably at eol with Sonoma. Not happy about dropping 32bit support, that could have been implemented into Rosetta.
Work flow gets interrupted with all these changes. And don’t get me started with ram and disk storage tax. o_O
 
I hope this never happens. Windows is plagued with a bad reputation because of cheap crappy machines. Let’s not damage apples.
The opposite happened last time Apple opened up the MacOS ecosystem to third party manufacturers. They wound up having to compete with better built machines sold at cheaper prices. Power Computing was just about to steal Apple's PPC G3 thunder when Apple yanked their license.
 
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