Constant Kernel Panics – userspace watchdog timeout: no successful checkins from com.apple.WindowServer

[kriebe]

Update: crashed after 4 hours with the second monitor disconnected, so Dual Monitors was not my issue. I'm now at 4 hours in my looping video attempt.

Update 2: Looping video also failed.

 

[YsHaNg]

I have now seen/heard of 5 x MacBook Pro 16" that seem to be solved by zapping the PRAM 3x in a row.

Has everyone tried this?

Just come back to report another KP since I reset PRAM like you said. It last about 2 weeks under mix load like VM and browser.

 

[mauruiz]

Hi, star-affinity! Thanks fro the reply.

Yeah, I don't know if the Kernel Panics were similar in Mojave, because at the time it happened so rarely that I didn't took the time to look into them. But the computer behavior was the same.

What I did last night was to install the 10.15.7 combo update (on top of my clean install) to see if that did anything. We'll see. I'll keep you all posted.

Coming back after applying Combo Update of 10.15.7.

I thought I had solved the problem, since it worked two weeks without crashes. I was happy.

BUT, yesterday after lunch, in the period of 3 hours my computer had SEVEN (7!!!) Kernel Panics. I couldn't work. Once, it had a Kernel panic 5 minutes right after re-starting from one, with nothing opened but Safari 14.

I got fed up, formatted it and went back to Mojave.

I'm really hopping this is not a GPU problem that coincidently started after I upgraded to Catalina. I cannot afford a GPU repair right now

Does anyone knows how to test my GPU for issues (it's a Mac Pro 2013). Thanks!

 

[star-affinity]

I'm really hopping this is not a GPU problem that coincidently started after I upgraded to Catalina.

I think that's unlikely. I mean there's so many of us – with various kinds of hardware configurations – that started to get this problem in conjunction with Catalina. I also run Windows 10 on the same hardware and have no similar instability problems there.

Back in Mojave things are OK for you, or?

 

[mauruiz]

I think that's unlikely. I mean there's so many of us – with carious kinds of hardware configurations – that started to get this problem in conjunction with Catalina. I also run Windows 10 on the same hardware and have no similar instability problems there.

Back in Mojave things are OK for you, or?

Thanks for your answer,star-affinity.

It's been only a day, but so far no problems. We'll see.

 

[tommiy]

On a 2017 MBP any idea how to get the SMC and other firmware to be restored to versions that come with Mojave rather than what comes with Catalina? I want to return to Mojave but want to return to Mojave firmware as well.

 

[chrfr]

On a 2017 MBP any idea how to get the SMC and other firmware to be restored to versions that come with Mojave rather than what comes with Catalina? I want to return to Mojave but want to return to Mojave firmware as well.

You cannot downgrade firmware on those computers. Furthermore, Mojave security updates install exactly the same firmware as is found in Catalina.

 

[kriebe]

I had 2 full days of no crashes. It was unbelievable. I did absolutely nothing different. Then sometime during the night it crashed once again. Then now later today I had it crashed 3 times in a half hour. Including one time when the system didn't even completely finish starting everything up.

I finally got an appointment for a Genius Bar for a week from today. We'll see what happens with that...hopes aren't high.

 

[tommiy]

@chrfr each version of Catalina changed the firmware and the resulting ability to work with external monitors. Mojave can only have 1 version of firmware that could be the same as Catalina. And given the last version of Mojave firmware had issues that I worked with Apple upon trying to get fixed I guess it means I can never return to a working version of firmware unless I hack the MBP to downgrade it.Rather sad the complete lack of customer responsiveness and intent to prevent you from managing your device. Just continues the ongoing woes with a Mac these days. My 2017 MBP has kernel paniced 3 times in the last 2 weeks and its no longer being used as a daily driver. I purchased a top of the range Dell XPS 13 for the daily driver and not a single issue in the 2 weeks I have had it. Its getting to be very noticeable the reliability difference between the 2.

 

[invernessreds]

I've been working through the issue with Apple for a period of weeks now, trying to determine whether there was specific software causing a problem, fresh installs etc on my Mac Mini 2018 - and no matter what we did, it still did a kernel panic at shutdown.

That eventually led to Apple saying that they would need to replace the motherboard.

I got my computer back yesterday, and whilst the motherboard has been replaced it came back with 16Gb of RAM instead of 32Gb of RAM which i had previously.

However, whilst I'll deal with that as an issue, I have yet to have a kernel panic since getting it back. I know some others have said they have had motherboard replacements and it hasn't resolved the issue - so will continue to monitor.

Just wanted to provide an update since my last post on 19 September 2020.

Since the motherboard replacement on my Mac Mini 2018, I've had no issues at all - working on two 4K Samsung monitors.

RAM issue also resolved.

I know this doesn't help everyone who is having problems, but if you do have AppleCare or your device is under warranty I'd get it checked out. It took a lot of effort to work through it with Apple, but they accepted there was an issue - what I didn't get from them what EXACTLY the issue was though which is ominous.

 

[chrfr]

Mojave can only have 1 version of firmware that could be the same as Catalina.

That is incorrect unless you never install any security updates. Nearly every 10.14.6 security update includes firmware updates to keep the firmware in sync with what's installed by the Catalina updates.

 

[stonedauwg]

The prev theory abt monitor cables and leaving them connected eventually failed for me too. Seems like none of these workarounds work reliably. Cannot believe Apple hasnt fixed this. This issue is 'the covid' of OS bugs

 

[stonedauwg]

Since the motherboard replacement on my Mac Mini 2018, I've had no issues at all - working on two 4K Samsung monitors.

This backs up what my company IT told me, the only "fixes" for this have been replacements sent to Apple

 

[preetb]

I have not had kernel panics, but I have had something which may be similar: a boot up issue where the startup screen has a circle with a line through it. VERY, VERY ANNOYING as it seems to appear randomly.

Eventually it does bootup but only after 3-7 tries. What appears to fix it temporarily is running First Aid on the disk.

Apple's software, particularly on the Mac, has gone down considerably in quality. The features are silly and cosmetic while simple matters such as boot up or preventing kernel panic go by the wayside.

 

[zakoops]

I have not had kernel panics, but I have had something which may be similar: a boot up issue where the startup screen has a circle with a line through it. VERY, VERY ANNOYING as it seems to appear randomly.

Eventually it does bootup but only after 3-7 tries. What appears to fix it temporarily is running First Aid on the disk.

My Mac (Retina 2017, 21.5") exhibits exactly the same behavior. This morning only, 3 or 4 attempts were necessary. After that, everything is working A1 and the retina display is beautifully clear and works without any glitch.

Yes, I'm on Catalina and hope for better days with Big Sur but I'm probably too naive here…

Following your comment, I will try First Aid in the meantime.

 

[tommiy]

@chrfr each version of Catalina changed the firmware there is a thread here that details the changes in the version numbers of there firmware with each release. So Mojave 10.14.6 does not have the same firmware as Catalina 10.5.7. You can also look at electriv light that provides a list for each version of Catalina and the firmware versions.

@invernessreds already had my logic board replaced by Apple. Only downsides of that process unfortunately. No fix to this specific problem just more issues with the quality of tehir refurbished boards that they use and the fact that they only provide warranty for 3 months on those boards that they replace.

 

[chrfr]

each version of Catalina changed the firmware there is a thread here that details the changes in the version numbers of there firmware with each release. So Mojave 10.14.6 does not have the same firmware as Catalina 10.5.7. You can also look at electriv light that provides a list for each version of Catalina and the firmware versions.

Once again, you are wrong. The Eclectic light website is not perfectly clear on this detail, but I'll repeat myself: if you install a security update for Mojave 10.14.6, you will get a firmware update. The most recent security update will result in the same firmware as is in 10.15.7.
For instance, I have 2 2012 Mac minis. One is running 10.15.7 and one is running 10.14.6 with the most recent security update and has never had Catalina installed on it. Both are on Boot ROM version 286.0.0.0.0 and SMC 2.8f0.

 

[tommiy]

@chrfr
So I believe the question that was asked was to return to an earlier version of firmware rather than the last. I don't want the external monitor issues that are on the apple community forms. Although I already have some of those items from upgrading to Catalina after debugging the Mojave Sup 2 kernel with Apple to find why it tried to change the resolution of the monitors every 10ms. However, Catalina while fixing that issue bought 4 other external monitor issues along with it instead. These unfortunately rendered some of the existing external hardware inoperable with Apple.

 

[SoYoung]

I also have KP on my 2015 iMac since Catalina update one year ago. However in my case its way less frequent and it always happens when its in sleep mode so far. Happens like one time every week or 2 (computer restarted itself because of a problem messagingse)

 

[jpeck]

I would like to share some information in the hopes that someone can see if they see anything similar to my situation. Long story short: Resolved the issue by removing McAfee (don't ask). I was having 2 kernel panics every single day for multiple months, and the panics were happening almost like clockwork every 12 hours. I would wake up to a crashed machine every morning, and after about 12 hours I would get another panic while actively using the machine.

There are two variations of this kernel panic I've seen discussed. While I was experiencing both of them, I was mainly getting hit by the first one below here:

panic(cpu 2 caller 0xffffff7f98d9da8d): watchdog timeout: no checkins from watchdogd in 95 seconds (83 total checkins since monitoring last enabled)

panic(cpu 2 caller 0xffffff7f9cb9dad5): userspace watchdog timeout: no successful checkins from com.apple.WindowServer in 120 seconds

My system log showed that launchd was continuously starting several McAfee processes which were then immediately failing due to some sort of misconfiguration on my system. Every few seconds it would try to launch them again and the cycle would repeat.

I am hoping that others experiencing this issue could see if they see anything similar in their logs. Do you see any sort of services that are starting, immediately failing/exiting, and then restarting on a cycle all day long?

I initially suspected these processes might be slowly leaking memory throughout the day. However, I was able to check my free memory just before a few of the crashes, and I always had several GB RAM free.

 

[CC88]

I'm in the club.

Yesterday I was opening a large .OBJ file from my external Thunderbolt2 raid (tb3->tb2 adapter) and the system freezed after aroun 40% importing. After that a kernel panic appeared.

After machine restart the log talk about watchdog/window server related (I have done a copy of the log on my mac disk).

I own a macmini 2018, i5 with an eGPU and Catalina 10.15.7.

Anyone know how to download Mojave? Is it possibile to install it on my Macmini 2018? (owned a macpro 2013 with mojave and I never had such problems as with catalina).

 

[Zippy3505]

I gave in and took my 2020 MBA 512GB to genius bar for kernel panics. They think hardware issue. Still under warranty, so getting sent for repair. 3-5 business day turnaround, allegedly.

 

[Guy Brush]

I would really like to know if this is a Hardware issue or not.
Some people say no, it‘s the drivers or other flaws; others report that the issues are gone after a logic board replacement, yet there are also reports that a logic board replacement did NOT fix the errors.

I would hate to let them replace may board (MBP late 2018) with probably a refurbished one, just to have the error appear again after shelling out a lot of money and/or the technician potentially do more harm than good to that machine (which I absolutely LOVE, despite of that extremely annoying issue).

Could the ones that already had a board replaced please speak up as to what is their experience?

Thanks!

 

[Guy Brush]

I had 2 full days of no crashes. It was unbelievable. I did absolutely nothing different. Then sometime during the night it crashed once again. Then now later today I had it crashed 3 times in a half hour. Including one time when the system didn't even completely finish starting everything up.

I finally got an appointment for a Genius Bar for a week from today. We'll see what happens with that...hopes aren't high.

That somehow resembles what I‘m experiencing: rock stable for days or even weeks, with no problems when sleeping/waking the machine and automatic display sleep enabled; then, all of a sudden I get back to the machine having KP‘d and shut itself down. After that I most likely get additional KPs shortly after (either the WindowServer one or a CPU CATERR), after which the machine is likely to be stable again for several days.
No clue as to what is really going on here...

 

[kriebe]

Could the ones that already had a board replaced please speak up as to what is their experience?

The funny thing with my situation is that I didn't have the problem UNTIL I had my Logic Board replaced.

I was having crazy issues with constant thermal issues (though it wasn't hot at all) and the fan was going constantly had max speed. (MacPro Late 2013, btw) I brought it in and was first told it was a GPU that needed to be replaced. That was replaced, but I was called about the other one also being bad before I picked it up and was told that would have to be replaced too and they would send it to their offsite in Memphis or Houston or wherever. When I got it back, without my authorization, they also replaced the CPU Riser (along with the attached CPU) and the Logic Board. Most likely, these were refurbished items.

The day I got it back the Kernal Panics started. I never had the issue before I brought it in. I even did a clean Catalina install. So to me, it sounds like a hardware issue, but one that coincides with Catalina software. The only thing I have yet to try is going back to Mojave, but finding the time to do another clean install is difficult.

I have an appointment for tomorrow at my local Apple Store, so we'll see what happens then. Can't wait...